I play Rift, I like the game, and I like the content updates, they always do a good job for the most part (bugs aside).
That being said, the way the community team is managing the situation is shameless. They is virtually ZERO interation with their customers on this, it was sprung upon us with no post, and if you question it, or point out issues, they lock the threads down, or give infractions, or delete them outright. And we''re talking just regular posts, not ragequit posts, not troll posts.
The damage their community team is causing, to me, seems far worse than these actual merges (call them what you will, but they're merges).
Hartsman should have been right out there initially with a Producer's letter, prior to this, explaining the new year goals, and this could have been included.
Yes, I smell f2p too. I have no intention of quitting at this time, but the community team's actions are definitely pushing me out the door. F2P would seal it.
We'll ignore the huge server message that they put up a week ahead of time.
We'll also ignore the posts that they made in each of the forums for the servers that are effected.
We'll ignore the multiple threads, that were made the day the server message and forum messages were posted, in the general discussion forums; many of which were the same exact thing you wrote. Which is interesting seeing as they're COMPLAINING A WEEK BEFORE THE REQUESTED TRANSFER DATE.
If we just ignore all that, then yes, they never told anyone, and they're closing or licking threads made about the issue.
If we just ignore all the truths and common sense, then everything you said would actually be sensible.
We'll even ignore the fact that if you aren't following the game, and happen to return after the 18th, that your characters will be sitting on the server they recomended.
We can even ignore the fact that if you're in a guild, on one of the effected servers, and the guild leader transfers, you get a message that pops up in guild chat and in the middle of the screen telling you what server the guild leader moved to. We'll ignore that everyone in poorly run guilds, with guild leaders who don't discuss things with their members, have no trouble at all following thier guild.
I'll even go a little further and ignore the fact that they aren't restricting transfers to one per account, and that I moved all my characters off one server to another the same night.
I'll just ignore how easy it was to transfer.
Becuase if we can ignore all the facts, truths, logic, and common sense, we can start to pretend that Trion is behaiving like a bunch of douches, giving us a weeks notice about the transfers via the forums and server message.
How dare they make me change my name, and then delete my thread because there are already a half dozen threads exactly like the one I made, and give me an infaction because I kept on making post after post about the topic after they locked 3 other duplicate threads I made! How dare they!!!
We'll ignore that the server message was not huge, but a single line upon log in.
We'll ignore the fact that the messages on the server forums were posted the day AFTER a crapstorm hit the forums, and it wasn't a discussion, it was a statement, and any valid questions by people affected were summarily ignored (ie, all char names are taken, not enough slots on destination, etc).
We'll ignore the fact that you don't know what you are talking about, that if you return to the game after the 18th, your character will be sitting on the trial shard, not the recommended shard, no move happens without you initiating it.
So how about cutting the fanboi crap, or should we just ignore that too.
Sorry I hurt your feelings, but maybe you should do a little research before you spout off ignorant fanboism, huh?
I don't think that F2P is imminent. Rift has a healthy server population and a good subscriber base (my own edit). That's very good news for Trion.
Given that the game is coming up on its first anniversary, it's pretty much a given that Trion will be making a big promotional push. Having the servers ready to roll is smart.
I mean copying that free up to lvl 20 thing WoW does.
I think Rift was offering that free trial to level 15 before WoW, since the only reason why I got into Rift was because of their initial free trials back in May.
Well I was going to buy the years sub it sounded like a reallly good deal .
The thing is even though I'm a big fan of Rift I seriously think it may be a cash grab before free to play gets introduced . As it stands I think I'm going to stick to the months sub as theres a few mmos that should be released this year that I have interest in .
I personally give it a 50-50 chance of going free to play in a year . I love the game but I don't like those odds at all .
I play Rift, I like the game, and I like the content updates, they always do a good job for the most part (bugs aside).
That being said, the way the community team is managing the situation is shameless. They is virtually ZERO interation with their customers on this, it was sprung upon us with no post, and if you question it, or point out issues, they lock the threads down, or give infractions, or delete them outright. And we''re talking just regular posts, not ragequit posts, not troll posts.
The damage their community team is causing, to me, seems far worse than these actual merges (call them what you will, but they're merges).
Hartsman should have been right out there initially with a Producer's letter, prior to this, explaining the new year goals, and this could have been included.
Yes, I smell f2p too. I have no intention of quitting at this time, but the community team's actions are definitely pushing me out the door. F2P would seal it.
We'll ignore the huge server message that they put up a week ahead of time.
We'll also ignore the posts that they made in each of the forums for the servers that are effected.
We'll ignore the multiple threads, that were made the day the server message and forum messages were posted, in the general discussion forums; many of which were the same exact thing you wrote. Which is interesting seeing as they're COMPLAINING A WEEK BEFORE THE REQUESTED TRANSFER DATE.
If we just ignore all that, then yes, they never told anyone, and they're closing or licking threads made about the issue.
If we just ignore all the truths and common sense, then everything you said would actually be sensible.
We'll even ignore the fact that if you aren't following the game, and happen to return after the 18th, that your characters will be sitting on the server they recomended.
We can even ignore the fact that if you're in a guild, on one of the effected servers, and the guild leader transfers, you get a message that pops up in guild chat and in the middle of the screen telling you what server the guild leader moved to. We'll ignore that everyone in poorly run guilds, with guild leaders who don't discuss things with their members, have no trouble at all following thier guild.
I'll even go a little further and ignore the fact that they aren't restricting transfers to one per account, and that I moved all my characters off one server to another the same night.
I'll just ignore how easy it was to transfer.
Becuase if we can ignore all the facts, truths, logic, and common sense, we can start to pretend that Trion is behaiving like a bunch of douches, giving us a weeks notice about the transfers via the forums and server message.
How dare they make me change my name, and then delete my thread because there are already a half dozen threads exactly like the one I made, and give me an infaction because I kept on making post after post about the topic after they locked 3 other duplicate threads I made! How dare they!!!
We'll ignore that the server message was not huge, but a single line upon log in.
You're doing it again. Nowhere in my post did I say anything about a "huge" server message. It was the MoTD.
We'll ignore the fact that the messages on the server forums were posted the day AFTER a crapstorm hit the forums, and it wasn't a discussion, it was a statement, and any valid questions by people affected were summarily ignored (ie, all char names are taken, not enough slots on destination, etc).
How far in advance is that from the 18th? So the developers can't leave sticky messages on the forums that are announcements that aren't up for discussion.
We'll ignore the fact that you don't know what you are talking about, that if you return to the game after the 18th, your character will be sitting on the trial shard, not the recommended shard, no move happens without you initiating it.
Are you telling me you don't have to move? Are you telling me that if you wish to you could just stay on the server you're already on? Are you saying that you don't have to worry about your name, or not enough space on a single server because you can stay on the server you're currently on?
So how about cutting the fanboi crap, or should we just ignore that too.
How about not overeacting?
Sorry I hurt your feelings, but maybe you should do a little research before you spout off ignorant fanboism, huh?
I don't think trion is being dishonest about anything.
So you think that Trion intends to announce a promotion so amazing it will attract almost 3 times as many people currently playing the game? Because that is what Trion said they are doing. They now have 16 NA servers and 42 NA trial servers.
Anyone who has been paying attention should have expected this. With free transfers to other servers, many shards ended up as ghost towns. I know I transfered my two 50s (warrior and rogue) to one of the high population shards. I'm just surprised that its taken them this long. But thats likely because of the hysterical reaction many of the Haters would have. Lets be real. 250 to 300K players is not small potatoes. Even 150 to 200K is still pretty damn healthy, especially for a first game. I've been playing The Old Republic for the last month or so, but if they have some interesting content, I may go back to Rift for awhile.
I wonder how many servers will be left after GW2 release...
Pretty much think the age of MMOs is over. I throughly enjoy Co-op now more than I do my MMOs. There's just something to be said about sitting down with friends and blugeoning the crap outta things
Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall.
"When people don't know much about something, they tend to fill in the blanks the way they want them to be filled in. They are almost always disappointed." - Will Wright
Eve....still has a huge subscriber base, at any given time they see between 30-45k people logged in. People are jumping to conclusions here. People want to talk about servers? Everquest, the first everquest is still pay to play, still has content released(albeit very slowly now) and still has a handful of servers with a descent population. Now, if in the 15 or so years since everquest launched it's still around, can we assume the same for any current mmo? it's just overreacting.
I wonder how many servers will be left after GW2 release...
Pretty much think the age of MMOs is over. I throughly enjoy Co-op now more than I do my MMOs. There's just something to be said about sitting down with friends and blugeoning the crap outta things
So because you enjoy co-op play over MMOs the whole genre is finished? Like to make any more global predictions based on your likes and dislikes?
I don't think Rift players have too much to worry about as far as the future of the game is concerned - whether it does go F2P or not. It'll be around a long time yet and F2P may even give it a boost if that ever did happen.
The more worrying aspect is the creative use of words used by Trion, but then I suppose that's what businesses do whether private or shareholder owned. Whatever it takes to keep confidence in its products high.
The MMO market is a very, very competitive one and it is natural that they will see their user base ebb and flow. As long as they are still holding a fair share of the overall user base then the end is not nigh, even if a swap to a different business model to keep it competitive is.
Relax, breathe deeply and keep on playing. What was it those posters said during WW2? Keep Calm And Carry On.
I know everyone's going to blow past this post and I'm wasting my time, but I'll say this again for about the billionth time..........
These Trion is failing claims are getting so old. I don't even play Rift, but Massively recently had an article not too long ago (srry to lazy to link) stating Trion is continuing to hire employees and are currently sitting at 532. They have 2 potentially major games in development one of which is linked with SyFy channel. Both of which are potentially big moves in business spaces with few if any competitors. One space being MMORTS the other being an MMO fully integrated with television. Performing business using this idea is how tons of businesses have found success and is the same idea Nintendo was operating off of that yielded the Wii. The same article also suggested that they have made their money back on Rift and are raking in about 70% profit on subs.
So yeah they have basically given the game away for free through sales, etc. At this point it doesn't matter. The logic behind that wasn't "we're going to go out of business unless we move more units!" It was the exact opposite. They don't need any more box sales or sub numbers except to keep the servers running. Anything above and beyond can go to further development of Rift, other titles, and Trion itself.
Let's also not forget that Trion's big selling point wasn't Rift. In fact they developed their main product prior to ever starting work on Rift. It was the server technology powering Rift. This is what they've always wanted to be their big money maker. Rift is simply a demonstration of the power of that server technology in action.
I know it's scary to think that there might actually be a financially successful themepark MMO out there made in the last year or so, but it's true. Rift isn't a game suited to my taste, but I'll be damned if I want to see a quality company like Trion fail. They're far from perfect, but they appear to have a solid work ethic and are dedicated to delivering a finished and polished product. Instead of clamoring for these companies to fail we should be seeking to support companies like this one even if it's not through financial support, but simply by not tearing them down on forums for no reason except for the fact that we don't enjoy their game.
It's not dishonest it's a PR spin. Dishonesty is removing a feature that was in a game and renaming a medium setting to high and not telling your paying customers. You know what I'm talking about.....
It is indeed dishonest.
They are saying they need these 11 servers for a trial promotion. If they run a trial promotion with 44 NA servers I will eat my words, but they have 33 perfectly good trial servers so its pretty ludicrous to assume they need more.
Here is a way to spin it while being honest:
In order to create a better experience for players we are aanicng the population across the servers.
Doesnt use words 'merge' or 'close', but still contains truth.
So it is dishonest if they don't use the term merge when you want them to? it is dishonest if they call these old server trial servers instead of shutting them down completely? Welcome to the center of the universe, population one.
All they are doing is instead of actually shutting down servers and forcing people to move and loose their names on a preset schedule they are simply declaring servers to be old no longer recommended without going so far as actually calling them dead servers since they might use them some day in the future.
This is smart for several reasons. Some people are simply subborn and would rather play on a dying server than move somewhere else and loose a name or have to join a new guild or what ever. In this case, Trion is saying, ok your server is now flagged for people to go from rather than to and we really really recommend that you move somewhere else but we are not going to force you to move or force you to move in any particular time frame or even to force you to move to a particular server. you get to choose all the terms of your move. We are just recommending that you do move. And for those who absolutely never want to move, "I will play on this server 'til the day I die and you brats can't make me move", no matter what come hell or high water. Well, that is actually a workable choice. If thats what they want.
Second, If they do a super big promotion that does pull in enough new players to say fill 15 servers then they can direct those people to 15 of the trial servers. This way new people will be running with new people and enjoying all the low level areas and events just like we did in the first weeks of the game. Further, they don't have to worry as much with people filling up existing high pop servers and creating queues on them.
So is calling these old, semi-defunct servers trial servers dishonest? That is at least to strong a word for it. Sure it is putting a positive spin on an otherwise disappointing reality but they have not told anybody anything to purposely mislead. But it is also a reasonable terminology give they way that they chose to handle "server mergers."
This whole trial server PR spin is starting to get annoying.
"Bottom line is that we’re not merging any servers" -bottom line is your game is down from almost 1mio to about 150-200k within like 4 month.
Bottom line is that "we're not in Azeroth anymore" is now "there's not anyone in Telara anymore".
I still like the game, but Trion is getting on my nerves with their false pretends.
First, it's been well over 6 months (not 4 months). Second, please provide a source for your numbers - I don't think Trion has ever published them. I would certainly believe near 1m at launch. I would not believe 80%+ loss of subs - there was a noticable drop when SWTOR released but I'd be willing to bet at least some of those people are still paying for Rift - even then, it was nowhere near an 80% decrease (and that's as a Guardian on Byriel which has always had a lower Guardian population so some of the losses have just been people transfering to higher-pop shards).
Active: D&D Online (alpha,beta,&unlimited)
Retired: Anarchy Online, Archlord (beta), Auto Assault (beta), CoH/CoV, Dark Age of Camelot, Dungeon Runners, Elder Scrolls Online, Everquest, EVE, Guild Wars, Lord of the Rings Online (beta,live), Pathfinder Online (beta), Rift (beta,live), Secret World (beta,live), Star Wars Old Republic, Vanguard (beta), Warhammer (beta,live), World of Warcraft
worst suport ever seen. on all mails only bot answering call us via phone call us via phone! damn have problems to call it (wrong number) and always this damn bot answering! Just wanted to change my password and i forgot 2 security quetion(all other details i remember correct) Damn fkn trion support make me to forget about my account i think cause really dunno how to call the nu,mber they have on a site:(
I haven't believed Blizzard's 10 mill subs claim EVER, I believe it is the total number of subscribers EVER more likely.
I tried the trial after having left WoW 3.5 months after release, and I couldn't play it more than 10 mins, after all the downloads, deleted, it is now that pathetic to me vs games I have played since.
I would go back to Age of Conan, EQ2, Rift, and even Vanguard before WoW.
I am still ticked off at their being no DAOC 2, Mythic really BLEW THAT op.
MMO wise I am only looking forward to Guild Wars 2 and Diablo 3, different styles though, I know.
Comments
We'll ignore that the server message was not huge, but a single line upon log in.
We'll ignore the fact that the messages on the server forums were posted the day AFTER a crapstorm hit the forums, and it wasn't a discussion, it was a statement, and any valid questions by people affected were summarily ignored (ie, all char names are taken, not enough slots on destination, etc).
We'll ignore the fact that you don't know what you are talking about, that if you return to the game after the 18th, your character will be sitting on the trial shard, not the recommended shard, no move happens without you initiating it.
So how about cutting the fanboi crap, or should we just ignore that too.
Sorry I hurt your feelings, but maybe you should do a little research before you spout off ignorant fanboism, huh?
^
This
Well I was going to buy the years sub it sounded like a reallly good deal .
The thing is even though I'm a big fan of Rift I seriously think it may be a cash grab before free to play gets introduced . As it stands I think I'm going to stick to the months sub as theres a few mmos that should be released this year that I have interest in .
I personally give it a 50-50 chance of going free to play in a year . I love the game but I don't like those odds at all .
So you think that Trion intends to announce a promotion so amazing it will attract almost 3 times as many people currently playing the game? Because that is what Trion said they are doing. They now have 16 NA servers and 42 NA trial servers.
Your words Uhwop:
What you're saying:
You're doing it again. Nowhere in my post did I say anything about a "huge" server message. It was the MoTD.
And what you posted before:
We'll ignore the huge server message that they put up a week ahead of time.
Can't even quote yourself and get it right, sheesh.
Anyone who has been paying attention should have expected this. With free transfers to other servers, many shards ended up as ghost towns. I know I transfered my two 50s (warrior and rogue) to one of the high population shards. I'm just surprised that its taken them this long. But thats likely because of the hysterical reaction many of the Haters would have. Lets be real. 250 to 300K players is not small potatoes. Even 150 to 200K is still pretty damn healthy, especially for a first game. I've been playing The Old Republic for the last month or so, but if they have some interesting content, I may go back to Rift for awhile.
Pretty much think the age of MMOs is over. I throughly enjoy Co-op now more than I do my MMOs. There's just something to be said about sitting down with friends and blugeoning the crap outta things
Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall.
"When people don't know much about something, they tend to fill in the blanks the way they want them to be filled in. They are almost always disappointed." - Will Wright
Eve....still has a huge subscriber base, at any given time they see between 30-45k people logged in. People are jumping to conclusions here. People want to talk about servers? Everquest, the first everquest is still pay to play, still has content released(albeit very slowly now) and still has a handful of servers with a descent population. Now, if in the 15 or so years since everquest launched it's still around, can we assume the same for any current mmo? it's just overreacting.
So because you enjoy co-op play over MMOs the whole genre is finished? Like to make any more global predictions based on your likes and dislikes?
The game is suffering from "same-itis".The patients symptoms are now obvious even to laymen.
I don't think Rift players have too much to worry about as far as the future of the game is concerned - whether it does go F2P or not. It'll be around a long time yet and F2P may even give it a boost if that ever did happen.
The more worrying aspect is the creative use of words used by Trion, but then I suppose that's what businesses do whether private or shareholder owned. Whatever it takes to keep confidence in its products high.
The MMO market is a very, very competitive one and it is natural that they will see their user base ebb and flow. As long as they are still holding a fair share of the overall user base then the end is not nigh, even if a swap to a different business model to keep it competitive is.
Relax, breathe deeply and keep on playing. What was it those posters said during WW2? Keep Calm And Carry On.
This made me LOL.
So because you enjoy co-op play over MMOs the whole genre is finished? Like to make any more global predictions based on your likes and dislikes?
Baked Beans will be a thing of the past because I'm SooOOoo into alphabetti Spaghetti.
I know everyone's going to blow past this post and I'm wasting my time, but I'll say this again for about the billionth time..........
These Trion is failing claims are getting so old. I don't even play Rift, but Massively recently had an article not too long ago (srry to lazy to link) stating Trion is continuing to hire employees and are currently sitting at 532. They have 2 potentially major games in development one of which is linked with SyFy channel. Both of which are potentially big moves in business spaces with few if any competitors. One space being MMORTS the other being an MMO fully integrated with television. Performing business using this idea is how tons of businesses have found success and is the same idea Nintendo was operating off of that yielded the Wii. The same article also suggested that they have made their money back on Rift and are raking in about 70% profit on subs.
So yeah they have basically given the game away for free through sales, etc. At this point it doesn't matter. The logic behind that wasn't "we're going to go out of business unless we move more units!" It was the exact opposite. They don't need any more box sales or sub numbers except to keep the servers running. Anything above and beyond can go to further development of Rift, other titles, and Trion itself.
Let's also not forget that Trion's big selling point wasn't Rift. In fact they developed their main product prior to ever starting work on Rift. It was the server technology powering Rift. This is what they've always wanted to be their big money maker. Rift is simply a demonstration of the power of that server technology in action.
I know it's scary to think that there might actually be a financially successful themepark MMO out there made in the last year or so, but it's true. Rift isn't a game suited to my taste, but I'll be damned if I want to see a quality company like Trion fail. They're far from perfect, but they appear to have a solid work ethic and are dedicated to delivering a finished and polished product. Instead of clamoring for these companies to fail we should be seeking to support companies like this one even if it's not through financial support, but simply by not tearing them down on forums for no reason except for the fact that we don't enjoy their game.
Steam: Neph
So it is dishonest if they don't use the term merge when you want them to? it is dishonest if they call these old server trial servers instead of shutting them down completely? Welcome to the center of the universe, population one.
All they are doing is instead of actually shutting down servers and forcing people to move and loose their names on a preset schedule they are simply declaring servers to be old no longer recommended without going so far as actually calling them dead servers since they might use them some day in the future.
This is smart for several reasons. Some people are simply subborn and would rather play on a dying server than move somewhere else and loose a name or have to join a new guild or what ever. In this case, Trion is saying, ok your server is now flagged for people to go from rather than to and we really really recommend that you move somewhere else but we are not going to force you to move or force you to move in any particular time frame or even to force you to move to a particular server. you get to choose all the terms of your move. We are just recommending that you do move. And for those who absolutely never want to move, "I will play on this server 'til the day I die and you brats can't make me move", no matter what come hell or high water. Well, that is actually a workable choice. If thats what they want.
Second, If they do a super big promotion that does pull in enough new players to say fill 15 servers then they can direct those people to 15 of the trial servers. This way new people will be running with new people and enjoying all the low level areas and events just like we did in the first weeks of the game. Further, they don't have to worry as much with people filling up existing high pop servers and creating queues on them.
So is calling these old, semi-defunct servers trial servers dishonest? That is at least to strong a word for it. Sure it is putting a positive spin on an otherwise disappointing reality but they have not told anybody anything to purposely mislead. But it is also a reasonable terminology give they way that they chose to handle "server mergers."
All die, so die well.
First, it's been well over 6 months (not 4 months). Second, please provide a source for your numbers - I don't think Trion has ever published them. I would certainly believe near 1m at launch. I would not believe 80%+ loss of subs - there was a noticable drop when SWTOR released but I'd be willing to bet at least some of those people are still paying for Rift - even then, it was nowhere near an 80% decrease (and that's as a Guardian on Byriel which has always had a lower Guardian population so some of the losses have just been people transfering to higher-pop shards).
Active: D&D Online (alpha,beta,&unlimited)
Retired: Anarchy Online, Archlord (beta), Auto Assault (beta), CoH/CoV, Dark Age of Camelot, Dungeon Runners, Elder Scrolls Online, Everquest, EVE, Guild Wars, Lord of the Rings Online (beta,live), Pathfinder Online (beta), Rift (beta,live), Secret World (beta,live), Star Wars Old Republic, Vanguard (beta), Warhammer (beta,live), World of Warcraft
worst suport ever seen. on all mails only bot answering call us via phone call us via phone! damn have problems to call it (wrong number) and always this damn bot answering! Just wanted to change my password and i forgot 2 security quetion(all other details i remember correct) Damn fkn trion support make me to forget about my account i think cause really dunno how to call the nu,mber they have on a site:(
I haven't believed Blizzard's 10 mill subs claim EVER, I believe it is the total number of subscribers EVER more likely.
I tried the trial after having left WoW 3.5 months after release, and I couldn't play it more than 10 mins, after all the downloads, deleted, it is now that pathetic to me vs games I have played since.
I would go back to Age of Conan, EQ2, Rift, and even Vanguard before WoW.
I am still ticked off at their being no DAOC 2, Mythic really BLEW THAT op.
MMO wise I am only looking forward to Guild Wars 2 and Diablo 3, different styles though, I know.
I am skipper of that Star Wars thing.