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Why are so many people disappointed with a game that was designed well?

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Comments

  • IAmMMOIAmMMO LondonPosts: 1,332Member Uncommon

    Would be less iissues if TOR took the guild wars IP approach of Buy and free to play with paid for story expansions. To make it and wrap it up as a full blown MMO is what's causing the issues, compared to the MMO of old, this there is no MASS, it's been replaced by COop Multi player online RPG.

  • DannyGloverDannyGlover Portland, ORPosts: 1,277Member


    Originally posted by Quizzical

    Originally posted by Cthulhu23
    All I can say is, aside from the lagginess of PvP warzones, which definitely needs to be addressed, I love the combat in this game.  LOVE it.  
    But that's my question:  why?  What makes combat in SWTOR different from--and better than--combat in a stereotypical WoW-clone?  Or do you like the generic WoW-clone combat?  If so, then it's good that you've found a game you like, and just a difference of opinion.

    It feels right. The best way I can explain it is how Capcom 2D fighting games feel different. Some feel better than others. But the moves are the same. Its like how Marvel Super Heroes felt better than X-Men vs Street Fighter. If you play enough of these things, you start to get a feel for the subtleties.

    I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means - except by getting off his back.

  • UsualSuspectUsualSuspect CardiffPosts: 1,243Member

    Originally posted by IAmMMO

    Would be less iissues if TOR took the guild wars IP approach of Buy and free to play with paid for story expansions. To make it and wrap it up as a full blown MMO is what's causing the issues, compared to the MMO of old, this there is no MASS, it's been replaced by COop Multi player online RPG.

    I agree with you on this. While I'm enjoying the game, it's purely because it makes a good single player game. The amount of times I've grouped with other players through the game so far can be counted on the fingers of one hand. If I end up having to pay for an extra month to reach 50 and see the end of the class quest, I'm going to be very disappointed as I'm effectively paying to play a single player game. Not something I'm happy doing.

  • DannyGloverDannyGlover Portland, ORPosts: 1,277Member


    Originally posted by UsualSuspect

    Originally posted by IAmMMO
    Would be less iissues if TOR took the guild wars IP approach of Buy and free to play with paid for story expansions. To make it and wrap it up as a full blown MMO is what's causing the issues, compared to the MMO of old, this there is no MASS, it's been replaced by COop Multi player online RPG.
    I agree with you on this. While I'm enjoying the game, it's purely because it makes a good single player game. The amount of times I've grouped with other players through the game so far can be counted on the fingers of one hand. If I end up having to pay for an extra month to reach 50 and see the end of the class quest, I'm going to be very disappointed as I'm effectively paying to play a single player game. Not something I'm happy doing.

    Do what you gotta do I guess. I've played solo for when I gather crafting mats and do space missions. Everything else, including all questing I have done in a group. I've participated in two RP events that were well over 30 not including spectators. And not to mention all warzones and flashpoints have been full.

    I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means - except by getting off his back.

  • UsualSuspectUsualSuspect CardiffPosts: 1,243Member

    Originally posted by DannyGlover

    Do what you gotta do I guess. I've played solo for when I gather crafting mats and do space missions. Everything else, including all questing I have done in a group. I've participated in two RP events that were well over 30 not including spectators. And not to mention all warzones and flashpoints have been full.

    I've tried getting people involved in questing, but everyones happy to do things solo. The only success I've had with it is during the starter planet missions. I joined up with a guy to do the Heroic 2's on the island (Smuggler / Trooper area) and we ended up sticking together through to the end of the final base mission. The only time I've grouped since then has been the Heroic 4's and Flashpoints.

    Maybe you're on a more sociable server. Sounds like a RP server to me?

  • DannyGloverDannyGlover Portland, ORPosts: 1,277Member


    Originally posted by UsualSuspect

    Originally posted by DannyGlover
    Do what you gotta do I guess. I've played solo for when I gather crafting mats and do space missions. Everything else, including all questing I have done in a group. I've participated in two RP events that were well over 30 not including spectators. And not to mention all warzones and flashpoints have been full.
    I've tried getting people involved in questing, but everyones happy to do things solo. The only success I've had with it is during the starter planet missions. I joined up with a guy to do the Heroic 2's on the island (Smuggler / Trooper area) and we ended up sticking together through to the end of the final base mission. The only time I've grouped since then has been the Heroic 4's and Flashpoints.
    Maybe you're on a more sociable server. Sounds like a RP server to me?


    Absolutely RP server! Its where nice adults go to socialize and do group content. :)

    I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means - except by getting off his back.

  • caremuchlesscaremuchless Crestline, CAPosts: 603Member

    Originally posted by Linkofpower

    Originally posted by caremuchless


    Originally posted by Linkofpower

    Honestly? I had this conversation with someone on IRC the other night, we were both in beta, and we both agreed.

    The game was billed as the second coming, a revolution, unlike anyhting we've ever seen.

     

    It wasn't. It was the familiar wrapped in a new package -- as my friend put it "WoW in Space"

    For those of us who were honestly just looking to get out o the swords n' sorcery rut -- the game is great, minor issues here and there, but hey, I remember the 371 hour queues in WoW, and the MASSIVE class unbalance in vanilla, no game is perfect at launch.

     

    For the people hwo were expecting this to be the NEXT GREATEST THING THAT ALL THINGS WILL BE BENCHMARKED UPON, are dissapointed, as will the be when GW 2 comes out (.. it's not even ut and I can point out the issues.. i.e. your combat being based on 5, unchangable abilties tied to weapon type, so combat is completely static because the only changable skills are utility skills)

     

    So yea, it's more dashed expectations than anthing.

     

    Please come on over to the GW2 forums. Cause that was a cheap shot, and relatively unfounded. But hey 9 posts in 5 years, I wont hold my breath.

    Ad hominem is always nice, 9 posts because I primarily lurk, but hey. if you think that was a cheapshot, those are my feelings. Are they wrong? probably. Anyhow.

    It wasn't so much that it was completely wrong, as that isn't the whole story. From what I understand, your weapon can be switched out mid combat giving you more skills to work with and changeable skills are not only utility skills.  

    image

  • RavingRabbidRavingRabbid Virginia beach, VAPosts: 1,128Member Uncommon

    OP the disappointment varies form person to person and no game is made perfect. You will always have critics from any game. I play a game to have FUN! I dont play games to study level design vs other games, graphics vs other games, innovative vs another games, etc etc. Does the game lack in certian areas? Sure. Is thers things I would like to see changed? Sure. I believe too many people had thier own vision of what this game should be instead of accepting it for what it is.

    I play games to have fun. Everyone else should to.

    Wait til GW2 comes out and see the massive critism it will recieve.....

    ***Raises plunger in salute to Huttball teams The frogdogs and Rotworms!!!***

    All my opinions are just that..opinions. If you like my opinions..coolness.If you dont like my opinion....I really dont care.
    Playing: SWTOR, ESO, WOT, and Marvel Heroes

  • miconamicona montreal, QCPosts: 661Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by RavingRabbid

    OP the disappointment varies form person to person and no game is made perfect. You will always have critics from any game. I play a game to have FUN! I dont play games to study level design vs other games, graphics vs other games, innovative vs another games, etc etc. Does the game lack in certian areas? Sure. Is thers things I would like to see changed? Sure. I believe too many people had thier own vision of what this game should be instead of accepting it for what it is.

    I play games to have fun. Everyone else should to.

    Wait til GW2 comes out and see the massive critism it will recieve.....

    ***Raises plunger in salute to Huttball teams The frogdogs and Rotworms!!!***

    Indeed i also play SWTOR because of it's fun factor and great combat , i play smuggler and imperial agent and love it , IA story is so awesome , but all this is my opinion.

    Not everyone ganna agree on  SWTOR  being good or not for me it turn out to be beyond my expections and i've playing mmo's since 1999 and tried alot of them .

    As i always say if you dont like it move on simple as that .

     

  • fiontarfiontar Dana, MAPosts: 3,719Member

    I couldn't bring myself to log in yesterday and am having trouble today.

    The "run here, run there, run back here, return back there, woops, go back there again" style of quest design is sapping the energy right out of me. It seems they were so focused on maximizing time sinks that they blew past the threshold of acceptable and went straight to drudgery.

    The game zones are huge and could have benefited greatly from a more free form method of quest aquisition and turn ins. They already have a mechanism to have some stages of quests updated in the field, via holoprojector and little drones that update you on bonus quests. They probably could have handled most quests that way, including turning quests in to little messanger drones. They would have lost some time sink, but the game would have flowed much better and encouraged more free form zone exploration.

    Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
    image

  • miconamicona montreal, QCPosts: 661Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by fiontar

    I couldn't bring myself to log in yesterday and am having trouble today.

    The "run here, run there, run back here, return back there, woops, go back there again" style of quest design is sapping the energy right out of me. It seems they were so focused on maximizing time sinks that they blew past the threshold of acceptable and went straight to drudgery.

    The game zones are huge and could have benefited greatly from a more free form method of quest aquisition and turn ins. They already have a mechanism to have some stages of quests updated in the field, via holoprojector and little drones that update you on bonus quests. They probably could have handled most quests that way, including turning quests in to little messanger drones. They would have lost some time sink, but the game would have flowed much better and encouraged more free form zone exploration.

       Using the shuttle which everyone has makes turning in quests much easier that said i know it's on a 30 min timer but in most games you get a static bind point in Tor you can shuttle to anyone you unlock .

     

  • cukimungacukimunga Dacono, COPosts: 2,259Member

    Originally posted by Ranyr

    Who are these "so many people?"

    I'd argue that SW:TOR is the first real MMORPG ever released.

    This!!!!    I agree, I enjoy having dialog with NPC's. I also like the ability to gain Dark and Light points.. 

  • AdamaiAdamai derbyPosts: 469Member
    Toilet paper was a good design but at some stage everyone will pop a finger through the paper !


    A good design doesn't always mean a good product lol and that's what we have with swtor ! Looks fab on paper! Not so fab in the flesh. Wow clone indeed and blame EA not the players
  • alexminoalexmino davenport, IAPosts: 132Member

    Because you are on MMORPG.com, a site where the vast majority swear up and down that a game that isn't in Beta yet will be the best and most successfull mmorpg of all time.

     

  • sanosukexsanosukex Los Angeles, CAPosts: 1,836Member

    Originally posted by alexmino

    Because you are on MMORPG.com, a site where the vast majority swear up and down that a game that isn't in Beta yet will be the best and most successfull mmorpg of all time.

     

    but just look at those initial reviews.. best game ever!

  • AfterlifeAfterlife Dover, DEPosts: 256Member

    Originally posted by sanosukex

    Originally posted by alexmino

    Because you are on MMORPG.com, a site where the vast majority swear up and down that a game that isn't in Beta yet will be the best and most successfull mmorpg of all time.

     

    but just look at those initial reviews.. best game ever!

    Hehe! I always come to MMORPG.com for the latest, completely non-biased and highly reliable reviews on MMOs :D

  • Happyguy83Happyguy83 Phoenix, AZPosts: 264Member

    Because its not GW2 and/or a sandbox.

    /thread

  • sanosukexsanosukex Los Angeles, CAPosts: 1,836Member

    Originally posted by Afterlife

    Originally posted by sanosukex


    Originally posted by alexmino

    Because you are on MMORPG.com, a site where the vast majority swear up and down that a game that isn't in Beta yet will be the best and most successfull mmorpg of all time.

     

    but just look at those initial reviews.. best game ever!

    Hehe! I always come to MMORPG.com for the latest, completely non-biased and highly reliable reviews on MMOs :D

    :P

    "completely non-biased and highly reliable reviews on MMOs"

    no such place anywhere, period..

  • sanosukexsanosukex Los Angeles, CAPosts: 1,836Member

    Originally posted by Happyguy83

    Because its not GW2 and/or a sandbox.

    /thread

    not even close but thanks for trying

  • Happyguy83Happyguy83 Phoenix, AZPosts: 264Member

    Originally posted by sanosukex

    Originally posted by Afterlife


    Originally posted by sanosukex


    Originally posted by alexmino

    Because you are on MMORPG.com, a site where the vast majority swear up and down that a game that isn't in Beta yet will be the best and most successfull mmorpg of all time.

     

    but just look at those initial reviews.. best game ever!

    Hehe! I always come to MMORPG.com for the latest, completely non-biased and highly reliable reviews on MMOs :D

    :P

    "completely non-biased and highly reliable reviews on MMOs"

    no such place anywhere, period..

    Depends on the complaints of the reviewer and how much of a hater/fanboi s/he is.

     

  • Happyguy83Happyguy83 Phoenix, AZPosts: 264Member

    Originally posted by sanosukex

    Originally posted by Happyguy83

    Because its not GW2 and/or a sandbox.

    /thread

    not even close but thanks for trying

    Sorry but that really is it.

     

    And because mobs don't walk around, that too thanks for reminding me.

  • Creslin321Creslin321 Baltimore, MDPosts: 5,359Member

    Originally posted by Happyguy83

    Originally posted by sanosukex

    Originally posted by Happyguy83

    Because its not GW2 and/or a sandbox.

    /thread

    not even close but thanks for trying

    Sorry but that really is it.

     

    And because mobs don't walk around, that too thanks for reminding me.

     Have you even read some of the complaints people have?

    Uncustomizable UI, game progression too linear, lackluster PvP, lackluster combat responsiveness, too much walking, etc.

    Do they sound like "I want a sanbox" complaints?  No.

    As I've said 100 times before.  The game is not bad, but there are legitimate criticisms of it.

    Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?

  • sanosukexsanosukex Los Angeles, CAPosts: 1,836Member

    Originally posted by Creslin321

    Originally posted by Happyguy83


    Originally posted by sanosukex


    Originally posted by Happyguy83

    Because its not GW2 and/or a sandbox.

    /thread

    not even close but thanks for trying

    Sorry but that really is it.

     

    And because mobs don't walk around, that too thanks for reminding me.

     Have you even read some of the complaints people have?

    Uncustomizable UI, game progression too linear, lackluster PvP, lackluster combat responsiveness, too much walking, etc.

    Do they sound like "I want a sanbox" complaints?  No.

    As I've said 100 times before.  The game is not bad, but there are legitimate criticisms of it.

    I know seriously I can't beleive how many peope still can't fathom people don't find this to be the best game ever and have legitimate concerns that effect there gameplay and have NOTHING to do with it not being a sandbox type game

  • Darkfalz89Darkfalz89 Surprise, AZPosts: 362Member Uncommon
    I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet but I think I just have one major concern with the game: The Story. I want to say that from the viewing the official forums of the game I find two general responses on why they play the game: they like star wars or they like KOTOR. My fear as a star wars fan but also a casual/hardcore mmo gamer is the generic formula of a wow coming out. Everyone enjoys the voiced over quests but when you've done them once the only thing that stands different is some of the choices you make with the exception of class story. This alone greatly hinders replay value. However what happens when the story ends? The raiding and pvp progression begins and the major innovation of this game falls to the tried and true wow formula. In order to remedy this tor needs to add more chapters to every class while making raid/pvp/rvr content all with VO. I think at that point the poison of their "innovation" will set in. All this while players wonder if the game will be worth 15 bucks to wait for more story. Speculation but this is my concern.
  • garrygarry Birmingham, ALPosts: 263Member

    Well OP - Whether a design is 'Good' or 'Great' is entirely subjective. Look it up and you will see that it means that what we percieve and think produces our output, not at all a certain fact. We ordinary folks call it an opinion. You have stated your subjective opinion and now I will state mine. You are wrong. I bought, subbed and play SWTOR. I am having a 'great' time and it is fun, to me. Sorry you do not feel the same but that is life.

     

    Simply go find one more to your liking, as the rest of us do. I am also looking forward to GW2 and TSW. Hope one of those can meet your personal specifications of 'Great'. Good luck and have a nicer day.

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