If you look at that splash screen as you say, NO where on there does it say that if you don't set up a sub you can NOT play the 30 days you've already paid for.
Actually it did.
First day of launch and a few days on pre-release it had the welcome letter and a clear comment on the need to register your game. It seems to have been pushed off by that new code redemption notice.
EDIT: It still says it bluntly on your user profile page on their site too until you have a sub.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
I don't understand these posts today. It's like everyone thinks we humans don't make mistakes. OR repeat them. /sigh
It is human to make mistakes, but that doesn't mean that there are not consequences for them.
While this is a 'human' mistake, it is one that should not have happened in a professional setting. The feeling -- which I agree with -- is that a business should have better advised their subscribers about this.
Is it the end of the world? No. Is it an example of poor customer service? Yes - imo.
So by better advertise you mean putting it on the friggin splash screen that comes up when logging into the game? You mean like PUT IT RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR FACE? Oh wait, they did that. Learn to pay attention and not blame your idiocy on someone else.
If you look at that splash screen as you say, NO where on there does it say that if you don't set up a sub you can NOT play the 30 days you've already paid for.
Last night it was up there. That the grace period ended and you needed to sub. So yes they did not technically say you need to sub to continue with your 30 days, just as your doctor never technically told you to breathe, they made the poor assumption that you are actually fluent in the language that you ordered the game in and hence believed that telling people that they need to sub would not be translated as you dont need to sub.
Also you make the arugment you PAID for 30 days free. Really? Did you think about this before you typed? You paid for something free. That alone should disqualify you from posting. It CAME with 30 days free, you did not PAY for them. You're also the type that if they didn't make you sub after 2 days would forget to and then complain about their business practices when they terminated your account because you never subbed.
Lets not forget the reason why it was the second day is because it was the end of the grace period of early access and they wanted to make sure people actually bought the game who were playing it and not simply using pre order codes they had cancelled.
Also you make the arugment you PAID for 30 days free. Really? Did you think about this before you typed? You paid for something free. That alone should disqualify you from posting. It CAME with 30 days free, you did not PAY for them.
Yes It came with 30 days free, Maybe you shouldn't be posting, Just because your car "Comes" with A/C and HD radio does NOT mean you didn't pay for it. When you bought the game the price of the game was including the 30 days free.
Everyone got the surprise of their life this 12/22/2011 AM when they tried to log on without having a subscription plan in place. You NO longer had an account even though you already paid for 30 days when you bought the game. Guess you just forfeit those 30 days unless you agree to subscribe!!!!
Way to keep customers.
I seriously doubt this MMO will last very long with these type of practices
Lets see...on the box it says..
"Valid credit card or paid game card (if available), internet connection and PAID subscription required to play game."
case closed.
Thats still not really userfriendly. Think about it, if you dont want to give CC payment details when you subscribe, the only other option is a gamecard. Which makes no sense. Because you already have 30 days. Adding a gamecard means you waste it if you decide not to continue after the free 30 days.
Payment details shouldnt be mandatory at all when a box gives 30 free days imo. Not untill you decide to stay after those free days.
Everyone got the surprise of their life this 12/22/2011 AM when they tried to log on without having a subscription plan in place. You NO longer had an account even though you already paid for 30 days when you bought the game. Guess you just forfeit those 30 days unless you agree to subscribe!!!!
Way to keep customers.
I seriously doubt this MMO will last very long with these type of practices
Lets see...on the box it says..
"Valid credit card or paid game card (if available), internet connection and PAID subscription required to play game."
case closed.
Thats still not really userfriendly. Think about it, if you dont want to give CC payment details when you subscribe, the only other option is a gamecard. Which makes no sense. Because you already have 30 days. Adding a gamecard means you waste it if you decide not to continue after the free 30 days.
Payment details shouldnt be mandatory at all when a box gives 30 free days imo. Not untill you decide to stay after those free days.
If they did not print that on the box, then you are right. However, it is CLEARLY printed on the box. It is up to the customer to decide if they accept the term or not before buying it.
Everyone got the surprise of their life this 12/22/2011 AM when they tried to log on without having a subscription plan in place. You NO longer had an account even though you already paid for 30 days when you bought the game. Guess you just forfeit those 30 days unless you agree to subscribe!!!!
Way to keep customers.
I seriously doubt this MMO will last very long with these type of practices
Lets see...on the box it says..
"Valid credit card or paid game card (if available), internet connection and PAID subscription required to play game."
case closed.
Thats still not really userfriendly. Think about it, if you dont want to give CC payment details when you subscribe, the only other option is a gamecard. Which makes no sense. Because you already have 30 days. Adding a gamecard means you waste it if you decide not to continue after the free 30 days.
Payment details shouldnt be mandatory at all when a box gives 30 free days imo. Not untill you decide to stay after those free days.
If they did not print that on the box, then you are right. However, it is CLEARLY printed on the box. It is up to the customer to decide if they accept the term or not before buying it.
Yeah I know that the OP didnt realise this was put on the box. But still its odd that it is required. I just think its funny that other ppl dont realise this. Especially with all those hacks lately I became quite carefull with giving out payment information.
This used to be required for a lot of MMO trials too. This has changed for most MMO's. Nowadays most trials dont require you to enter payment details anymore. It also never made sense that you had to enter it before even deciding if you wanted to be subscribed.
If you're allowed to play by entering a GTC code, then why all these restrictions about having to select a sub plan before you can access your free 30 days ?
Every purchased game copy includes 30 days free, so a game activation code is the equivalent of a 30-day GTC.
Yet the system doesn't accept that, it demands that you either buy a NEW GTC or agree to auto-billing of your cc in future.
The major reason why companies insist on you agreeing in advance to allow them to auto-bill your credit card, is that they know people are lazy and sloppy. So a fair percentage of those who may have intended to cancel, will probably forget to do so in time, and will therefore get billed automatically. Once billed, they can't claim the money back, because the account was still active at billing time. It's a great trick, and is almost universally used. Money for nothing, because humans are so predictable
The price for the box is an entry fee. You don't buy a game with a MMO box, you just buy access. So those 30 days are not really free, they are just part of the entry free. Its a month sub+entry fee package.
I've played LOTS of MMOs, bought many boxes and played the game at release. Never seen it botched this bad. How cocky are they with this beloved IP? Signs of things to come. Even though a dwindling few MMOs think they can get $15/month from players, SWTOR wants it even BEFORE my first 30 STARTS! THEN they don't provide server capacity to let me do THAT so I can't play AT ALL. I waited for 20 minutes to get to login ontheir website then got put BACK in the queue when I pressed LOGIN!
I won't even START on the queueing to play the game.
Massively popular means massively profitable. Why isn't there server capacity when we've ALREADY PAID for it!? I have a BAD feeling about this.
The tune "Take the money and run" is playing in my head.
The tune "Take the money and run" is playing in my head.
What in the world does EA have in common with Billy Joe and Bobby Sue? Or Texas?
Or were you a Run DMC fan?
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Yes... you have to buy the game, enter you key and choose you sub. You don't get charged until after the 30 day free time - like every other P2P MMO on the face the the planet. If you don't like it in the 30 days, cancel and you still get the remaining time... again... like every other P2P game on the planet.
I will say this only once so you can wrap it around your head. It's printed on the box, It was laid out in the terms and EVERY Pay to Play mmo has had the same Scheme at time of pruchase with out fail.
Games I have played that required me to sub with CC or GC before getting my 30 free days include but are not limited to.
EQ, EQ2, WOW, SWG, AION, WAR, AOC, SWTOR, Tabula Rasa and more that I cant think of atm im sure.
So what Pay to Play MMO did you play that didnt require a sub at launch ?
Guarantee of payment for all service-before-payment businesses.
Hotels won't let you check in without a credit card on file (or big wad of cash up front) either. Not exactly non-standard for MMOs either.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
I don't understand these posts today. It's like everyone thinks we humans don't make mistakes. OR repeat them. /sigh
It is human to make mistakes, but that doesn't mean that there are not consequences for them.
While this is a 'human' mistake, it is one that should not have happened in a professional setting. The feeling -- which I agree with -- is that a business should have better advised their subscribers about this.
Is it the end of the world? No. Is it an example of poor customer service? Yes - imo.
So by better advertise you mean putting it on the friggin splash screen that comes up when logging into the game? You mean like PUT IT RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR FACE? Oh wait, they did that. Learn to pay attention and not blame your idiocy on someone else.
If you look at that splash screen as you say, NO where on there does it say that if you don't set up a sub you can NOT play the 30 days you've already paid for.
Must suck to live in your world where everything you cant do needs to be pointed out.
When you left your house last, were you told not to kill anyone? no? how about being told not to eat your own foot?
This is almost as bad as the steam holiday gift pile rules written in plain english clear as day people couldnt understand.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling" Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
Looking at the TOR facebook page it looks like a lot of folks dont understand that a sub is needed to play the free month. And people say WOW brought in the ignorant masses.
This is a sign that this game may be HUGE, in that its not only hitting WoW subs and other MMOs, but bringing in a whole new set of players to the genre.
Whether or not this is a good thing will be has been heavily debated since WoW's success. /Shrug
Either way, there is NO shame in being new to something and not understanding how it works. However, there is a great deal of shame for the ridicule of those new players. Can we make an app store that sells self-esteem, i expect this would elimitate a lot of this behavior.
Frank 'Spankybus' Mignone www.spankybus.com -3d Artist & Compositor -Writer -Professional Amature
Guarantee of payment for all service-before-payment businesses.
Hotels won't let you check in without a credit card on file (or big wad of cash up front) either. Not exactly non-standard for MMOs either.
Another example of a bad real life anology. You pay for a deposit as insurance in a hotel. This is because a hotel takes a risk with taking on an unknown customer.
With a MMO you already paid in advance for the 30 days that they give you 'for free'. There is no real need for payment information untill you decide to stay subscribed after that. There is also nothing you can break as customer for which a deposit or insurance (CC info) is needed.
when you buy a new mmorpg you need to set-up a subscription, with a CC. then you can hit cancel.
unless what your saying is that they are making you pay for the next month befor they give you the frist free one. then yah. thats some shady stuff. but they all make you set-up a sub befor you can play.
Not with credit card. Then you probably can cancel right away and your sub ends after the 30 days, before your get charged on your CC. But if your only option is a game time card, you have to add that key before you are able to use your 30 days from purchasing the box. Which is odd. The box key should already work as GTC imo.
Ah... do we have another "how dare BW do something exactly the same way every other MMO(including my favorite) does!!!" thread?
I wouldn't say the OP fails miserably. I'd say it fails spectacularly.
Just because everyone else does it wrong, still doesn't make it right
It's just sloppy business practice at best, or has a hidden agenda (at worst).
You have already paid a certain fee, which includes the right to 30 days of free play (the same as 30 days of subscription).
But to take up that right, you have to choose a subscription plan.
To activate the subscription plan, you have to either:
agree to have your cc auto-billed at a future date
enter a valid GTC code
Notice the subtle difference ?
To use GTC as your billing option, you have to buy one first (catch-22). So no access to your already paid-for 30 days until you pay for at least another 30...
While I agree that I shouldn't have to provide CC info until after my first 30 days are up, Origin/Bioware clearly printed it on the box and the agreement I digitally check boxed that I would need an active sub to play.
This is pretty much a standard no matter how delusional you are, most games require you to sub with a credit card before they let you login period much less give you a couple days. I can think of Aion, EQ, EQ2 off the top of my head where I had to setup a sub even though the first 30 days come included with my purchase.
Also, posters here stressing over identity or credit theft, welcome to the internet I suggest you get credit protection.
Ah... do we have another "how dare BW do something exactly the same way every other MMO(including my favorite) does!!!" thread?
I wouldn't say the OP fails miserably. I'd say it fails spectacularly.
Just because everyone else does it wrong, still doesn't make it right
It's just sloppy business practice at best, or has a hidden agenda (at worst).
You have already paid a certain fee, which includes the right to 30 days of free play (the same as 30 days of subscription).
But to take up that right, you have to choose a subscription plan.
To activate the subscription plan, you have to either:
agree to have your cc auto-billed at a future date
enter a valid GTC code
Notice the subtle difference ?
To use GTC as your billing option, you have to buy one first (catch-22). So no access to your already paid-for 30 days until you pay for at least another 30...
It's not sloppy, but you could argue it has a hidden agenda. Just like any business that provides something free initially and then has a subscription that automatically kicks in, they know one thing very clearly.. people are lazy.
They know that a certain percentage will simply forget to cancel that auto subscription at the end of the freebie. They know that only a fraction of those that get charged will ask for a refund.
Is it right? I guess not if you're a lazy tard, but people like myself get tons of free stuff so I'm fine with it. Free gift certificates, free services, free sammich, just don't forget to cancel the day before you get charged.
Pls owner of the site start deleting this utter crap from the board, im tired of reading 500 topic x day, full of bullshit, lies, trolls,retarded complaints etc
can someone pls clean up this mess?
for jesus christ sake, why ppl need to spread so hard their misconception of the game on a forum board?
we understand a lot of haters don't like the game, just pls, stop whining and start doing something constructive.
Comments
Actually it did.
First day of launch and a few days on pre-release it had the welcome letter and a clear comment on the need to register your game. It seems to have been pushed off by that new code redemption notice.
EDIT: It still says it bluntly on your user profile page on their site too until you have a sub.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
Also you make the arugment you PAID for 30 days free. Really? Did you think about this before you typed? You paid for something free. That alone should disqualify you from posting. It CAME with 30 days free, you did not PAY for them.
Yes It came with 30 days free, Maybe you shouldn't be posting, Just because your car "Comes" with A/C and HD radio does NOT mean you didn't pay for it. When you bought the game the price of the game was including the 30 days free.
Thats still not really userfriendly. Think about it, if you dont want to give CC payment details when you subscribe, the only other option is a gamecard. Which makes no sense. Because you already have 30 days. Adding a gamecard means you waste it if you decide not to continue after the free 30 days.
Payment details shouldnt be mandatory at all when a box gives 30 free days imo. Not untill you decide to stay after those free days.
If they did not print that on the box, then you are right. However, it is CLEARLY printed on the box. It is up to the customer to decide if they accept the term or not before buying it.
Must just be you bet, i still havnt gave them any credit card info..
Yeah I know that the OP didnt realise this was put on the box. But still its odd that it is required. I just think its funny that other ppl dont realise this. Especially with all those hacks lately I became quite carefull with giving out payment information.
This used to be required for a lot of MMO trials too. This has changed for most MMO's. Nowadays most trials dont require you to enter payment details anymore. It also never made sense that you had to enter it before even deciding if you wanted to be subscribed.
If you're allowed to play by entering a GTC code, then why all these restrictions about having to select a sub plan before you can access your free 30 days ?
Every purchased game copy includes 30 days free, so a game activation code is the equivalent of a 30-day GTC.
Yet the system doesn't accept that, it demands that you either buy a NEW GTC or agree to auto-billing of your cc in future.
The major reason why companies insist on you agreeing in advance to allow them to auto-bill your credit card, is that they know people are lazy and sloppy. So a fair percentage of those who may have intended to cancel, will probably forget to do so in time, and will therefore get billed automatically. Once billed, they can't claim the money back, because the account was still active at billing time. It's a great trick, and is almost universally used. Money for nothing, because humans are so predictable
The price for the box is an entry fee. You don't buy a game with a MMO box, you just buy access. So those 30 days are not really free, they are just part of the entry free. Its a month sub+entry fee package.
I've played LOTS of MMOs, bought many boxes and played the game at release. Never seen it botched this bad. How cocky are they with this beloved IP? Signs of things to come. Even though a dwindling few MMOs think they can get $15/month from players, SWTOR wants it even BEFORE my first 30 STARTS! THEN they don't provide server capacity to let me do THAT so I can't play AT ALL. I waited for 20 minutes to get to login ontheir website then got put BACK in the queue when I pressed LOGIN!
I won't even START on the queueing to play the game.
Massively popular means massively profitable. Why isn't there server capacity when we've ALREADY PAID for it!? I have a BAD feeling about this.
The tune "Take the money and run" is playing in my head.
What in the world does EA have in common with Billy Joe and Bobby Sue? Or Texas?
Or were you a Run DMC fan?
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Are people really this clueless?
Yes... you have to buy the game, enter you key and choose you sub. You don't get charged until after the 30 day free time - like every other P2P MMO on the face the the planet. If you don't like it in the 30 days, cancel and you still get the remaining time... again... like every other P2P game on the planet.
"Take the money and run to fetch a bigger bag" ?
I will say this only once so you can wrap it around your head. It's printed on the box, It was laid out in the terms and EVERY Pay to Play mmo has had the same Scheme at time of pruchase with out fail.
Games I have played that required me to sub with CC or GC before getting my 30 free days include but are not limited to.
EQ, EQ2, WOW, SWG, AION, WAR, AOC, SWTOR, Tabula Rasa and more that I cant think of atm im sure.
So what Pay to Play MMO did you play that didnt require a sub at launch ?
Guarantee of payment for all service-before-payment businesses.
Hotels won't let you check in without a credit card on file (or big wad of cash up front) either. Not exactly non-standard for MMOs either.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Must suck to live in your world where everything you cant do needs to be pointed out.
When you left your house last, were you told not to kill anyone? no? how about being told not to eat your own foot?
This is almost as bad as the steam holiday gift pile rules written in plain english clear as day people couldnt understand.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling"
Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
This is a sign that this game may be HUGE, in that its not only hitting WoW subs and other MMOs, but bringing in a whole new set of players to the genre.
Whether or not this is a good thing will be has been heavily debated since WoW's success. /Shrug
Either way, there is NO shame in being new to something and not understanding how it works. However, there is a great deal of shame for the ridicule of those new players. Can we make an app store that sells self-esteem, i expect this would elimitate a lot of this behavior.
Frank 'Spankybus' Mignone
www.spankybus.com
-3d Artist & Compositor
-Writer
-Professional Amature
Another example of a bad real life anology. You pay for a deposit as insurance in a hotel. This is because a hotel takes a risk with taking on an unknown customer.
With a MMO you already paid in advance for the 30 days that they give you 'for free'. There is no real need for payment information untill you decide to stay subscribed after that. There is also nothing you can break as customer for which a deposit or insurance (CC info) is needed.
Not with credit card. Then you probably can cancel right away and your sub ends after the 30 days, before your get charged on your CC. But if your only option is a game time card, you have to add that key before you are able to use your 30 days from purchasing the box. Which is odd. The box key should already work as GTC imo.
That would not be logical.
Retail keys and GTC are 2 different products thus it is not surprising they work differently.
Retail key determines the purchase, subscription plan determines active subscriber.
The point with GTC as only option is valid though.
Ah... do we have another "how dare BW do something exactly the same way every other MMO(including my favorite) does!!!" thread?
I wouldn't say the OP fails miserably. I'd say it fails spectacularly.
Just because everyone else does it wrong, still doesn't make it right
It's just sloppy business practice at best, or has a hidden agenda (at worst).
You have already paid a certain fee, which includes the right to 30 days of free play (the same as 30 days of subscription).
But to take up that right, you have to choose a subscription plan.
To activate the subscription plan, you have to either:
agree to have your cc auto-billed at a future date
enter a valid GTC code
Notice the subtle difference ?
To use GTC as your billing option, you have to buy one first (catch-22). So no access to your already paid-for 30 days until you pay for at least another 30...
While I agree that I shouldn't have to provide CC info until after my first 30 days are up, Origin/Bioware clearly printed it on the box and the agreement I digitally check boxed that I would need an active sub to play.
This is pretty much a standard no matter how delusional you are, most games require you to sub with a credit card before they let you login period much less give you a couple days. I can think of Aion, EQ, EQ2 off the top of my head where I had to setup a sub even though the first 30 days come included with my purchase.
Also, posters here stressing over identity or credit theft, welcome to the internet I suggest you get credit protection.
It's not sloppy, but you could argue it has a hidden agenda. Just like any business that provides something free initially and then has a subscription that automatically kicks in, they know one thing very clearly.. people are lazy.
They know that a certain percentage will simply forget to cancel that auto subscription at the end of the freebie. They know that only a fraction of those that get charged will ask for a refund.
Is it right? I guess not if you're a lazy tard, but people like myself get tons of free stuff so I'm fine with it. Free gift certificates, free services, free sammich, just don't forget to cancel the day before you get charged.
we need a storm of mods on this board.
Pls owner of the site start deleting this utter crap from the board, im tired of reading 500 topic x day, full of bullshit, lies, trolls,retarded complaints etc
can someone pls clean up this mess?
for jesus christ sake, why ppl need to spread so hard their misconception of the game on a forum board?
we understand a lot of haters don't like the game, just pls, stop whining and start doing something constructive.