I like the game alot, but I have to agree that the CC is pretty sub-par. Below average.
You would think if you were a developer with great resources your thinking would be "I'm going to kick butt in EVERY aspect of this game!". But some aspects are only average.
I look at it this way, if I can't make a character I like and can be happy with...then there is a problem. I managed to create 3 characters that I really like and am satisfied with, so all in all I really don't care about something that I use for maybe 15 minutes tops and may never use again.
I really don't see why they need to spend anymore time on something you will use only in the beginning and then won't even matter when you are wearing full armor and can't see those individual features anyway.
Sure, there could have been more options and variety, but once I make my characters thats it. I'm not going to start over just so I can wear a different hair style or because I want a less skinny guy. If there are no options to change your face, hair etc. on already made characters then it will have no effect on me since by the time it comes out most of my characters will already be made and lvl 50.
There are so many other things that just have a much greater priority, guild options and UI customization come first to mind. We can give feedback all day until our fingers are numb and bleeding but in the end if the developer doesn't want to follow it, then you will have to do what you can with what you got.
I don't care much for the character creation... but this is NOT how we gamers should be thinking. We shouldn't absolutely accept something just because the developers built it that way. That is how the MMO genre became so stale, gamers just accepting everything and thinking there is nothing better. Take a look at COD. I could get a non COD-player and have them play MW1 and MW3 and they wouldn't know the difference. People kept accepting the same thing, and so, the developers capitalize in it.
Now it obviously shouldn't be top priority, but it should be pretty high up. Simply take a look at the forums... there are a lot of people wanting a better (not new) character creation. Are a lot of them complaining and irritating? Of course. But there is a good reason for them complaining.
Originally posted by MindTrigger People like their character to be unique.
Then they should stop playing games, because, newsflash, your character will NEVER be unique, there will always be someone who looks exactly the same as you, to think your character is unique is denial pure and simple.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling" Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
Maybe the same thing will happen with SWTOR down the line, but are you seriously going to give up a maxed out character so you can make a more "personally appealing" character?
Didn't have to "give up" anything with CoX, I see not particular reason why you should have to in TOR. They've added proportion sliders, capes and auras, and thousands of costume pieces since launch, and overhauled the CC at least twice.
I think the primary difference is that TOR is rather strictly limited by its own IP. Iconic "looks" that its forced to follow in order to match the movies (and keep LA happy). Even a greatly enhanced CC buys faces and hair, more body types--but the costuming/gearing is not going to change substantially.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Originally posted by MindTrigger People like their character to be unique.
Then they should stop playing games, because, newsflash, your character will NEVER be unique, there will always be someone who looks exactly the same as you, think your character is unique is denial pure and simple.
All games that have appearance tab can be unique and if you can customize your character enough at character creation you will be unique.
have you ever seen a major char-gen revamp in a game post-beta-release (except EvE where it was a necessity because they introduced actual avatar models)? - No, because to 95% of the devs this is a feature you don't waste a huge lot of energy on because it doesn't stretch playtime like new factions
Maybe the same thing will happen with SWTOR down the line, but are you seriously going to give up a maxed out character so you can make a more "personally appealing" character?
Who said anything about rerolling?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Originally posted by MindTrigger People like their character to be unique.
Then they should stop playing games, because, newsflash, your character will NEVER be unique, there will always be someone who looks exactly the same as you, think your character is unique is denial pure and simple.
All games that have appearance tab can be unique and if you can customize your character enough at character creation you will be unique.
No, you wont, it doesnt matter how many sliders they add, someone IS going to look teh same as you, your not special or unique.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling" Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
Originally posted by MindTrigger People like their character to be unique.
Then they should stop playing games, because, newsflash, your character will NEVER be unique, there will always be someone who looks exactly the same as you, think your character is unique is denial pure and simple.
All games that have appearance tab can be unique and if you can customize your character enough at character creation you will be unique.
Aion CC is one of the best, even perfect world have a better CC
Take a look at COD. I could get a non COD-player and have them play MW1 and MW3 and they wouldn't know the difference.
You shouldnt grab a blind person then, anyone who plays games, wether they play cod or not, and cant tell the difference, needs new eyes, fact.
My point still stands. MW4 could be ran on the same engine, with a new story, and a different multiplayer mode and it would still sell well. What does that mean to the developers? They can rehash a lot of things and sell it for a brand new price. MW3 and MW2 are both ran on the same engine. There is only so many subtle improvements inbetween the sequals. I personally think a sequal should improve the game, not push it sideways.
Stories should be extra content, not new games.
Also... putting fact at the end of a statement doesn't make it a fact...
edit: Understand that feedback and critique have good intentions. SWTOR doesn't have a perfect character creation, far from it... therefore, there must be plenty of room for improvements.
I look at it this way, if I can't make a character I like and can be happy with...then there is a problem. I managed to create 3 characters that I really like and am satisfied with, so all in all I really don't care about something that I use for maybe 15 minutes tops and may never use again.
I really don't see why they need to spend anymore time on something you will use only in the beginning and then won't even matter when you are wearing full armor and can't see those individual features anyway.
Sure, there could have been more options and variety, but once I make my characters thats it. I'm not going to start over just so I can wear a different hair style or because I want a less skinny guy. If there are no options to change your face, hair etc. on already made characters then it will have no effect on me since by the time it comes out most of my characters will already be made and lvl 50.
There are so many other things that just have a much greater priority, guild options and UI customization come first to mind. We can give feedback all day until our fingers are numb and bleeding but in the end if the developer doesn't want to follow it, then you will have to do what you can with what you got.
I don't care much for the character creation... but this is NOT how we gamers should be thinking. We shouldn't absolutely accept something just because the developers built it that way. That is how the MMO genre became so stale, gamers just accepting everything and thinking there is nothing better. Take a look at COD. I could get a non COD-player and have them play MW1 and MW3 and they wouldn't know the difference. People kept accepting the same thing, and so, the developers capitalize in it.
Now it obviously shouldn't be top priority, but it should be pretty high up. Simply take a look at the forums... there are a lot of people wanting a better (not new) character creation. Are a lot of them complaining and irritating? Of course. But there is a good reason for them complaining.
I'm sorry, but that is ridiculous...so because you don't like the options available means that I or others can't possibly like the options that are there and I am just accepting it like some blind sheep? Wow...
Originally posted by MindTrigger People like their character to be unique.
Then they should stop playing games, because, newsflash, your character will NEVER be unique, there will always be someone who looks exactly the same as you, to think your character is unique is denial pure and simple.
They were in SWG and are in CoX.
So youve gone through every single character in teh game to see if they look the same? No?
Everyone thinks there unique, your not, someone made the same lookming character as you somewhere, and no you having a few wrinkles doesnt make you unique.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling" Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
Take a look at COD. I could get a non COD-player and have them play MW1 and MW3 and they wouldn't know the difference.
You shouldnt grab a blind person then, anyone who plays games, wether they play cod or not, and cant tell the difference, needs new eyes, fact.
My point still stands. MW4 could be ran on the same engine, with a new story, and a different multiplayer mode and it would still sell well. What does that mean to the developers? They can rehash a lot of things and sell it for a brand new price. MW3 and MW2 are both ran on the same engine. There is only so many subtle improvements inbetween the sequals. I personally think a sequal should improve the game, not push it sideways.
Stories should be extra content, not new games.
Also... putting fact at the end of a statement doesn't make it a fact...
It does when its a fact.
Its also funny I never see anyone complaing about the old days of pc gaming, when doom 2 was doom with an extra weapon or so and some new levels, but now suddenly if you make a game thats actually reliable suddenly its horrible and crap.
And if you dont think MW3 is imporved over MW, you havnt played them, clearly, as they are not teh same AT ALL, comong from someone whos actually played them.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling" Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
I'm sorry, but that is ridiculous...so because you don't like the options available means that I or others can't possibly like the options that are there and I am just accepting it like some blind sheep? Wow...
You misunderstand. This is not an attack. I didn't say you should like what I like. I said we shouldn't accept something simply because that is how the developers made the game. Did you read my whole post?
There is room for improvements in the character creation. Do you agree or do you believe it is the best character creation system yet. Now... if you do believe that it can be improved, then you and I are on the same page. I think it's safe to assume that the system could be better.
What I was trying to convey, was that if there is room for improvement, we should nudge the developers into making a better game. If however, making a better creation system will crash all the servers and make the game a complete loss, then I will gladly admit fault and wrongs. However, through testing (beta) there are many of us who gave feedback that the system SHOULD be better. It does not NEED to be better.
Seriously though... you pretty much phraised me out of thin air...
Its also funny I never see anyone complaing about the old days of pc gaming, when doom 2 was doom with an extra weapon or so and some new levels, but now suddenly if you make a game thats actually reliable suddenly its horrible and crap.
And if you dont think MW3 is imporved over MW, you havnt played them, clearly, as they are not teh same AT ALL, comong from someone whos actually played them.
Here we go again... no one is saying SWTOR is crap. Far from it. Is it that insulting to you that players want the game to be improved. Would it be better if we all sat here and said the game should never be improved? That it is the best it will ever be? People tested the game and gave/ are giving feedback... does that angry you so much? People aren't here saying the creation system is the worst system ever, they are here trying to improve the game.
Do you believe the game should be left alone with no additional fixes? A few things listed on the "new things to come for SWTOR" are just extra stuff that help make the game more complete. I believe character creation should be somewhere on that list or at least grow from here on out. Have you seen what GW2 did in a matter of months with their character creation system? It isn't impossible.
I'm not saying SWTOR is crap, I'm saying if they plan on improving the game, character creation should be on that list.
Its also funny I never see anyone complaing about the old days of pc gaming, when doom 2 was doom with an extra weapon or so and some new levels, but now suddenly if you make a game thats actually reliable suddenly its horrible and crap.
And if you dont think MW3 is imporved over MW, you havnt played them, clearly, as they are not teh same AT ALL, comong from someone whos actually played them.
Here we go again... no one is saying SWTOR is crap. Far from it. Is it that insulting to you that players want the game to be improved. Would it be better if we all sat here and said the game should never be improved? That it is the best it will ever be? People tested the game and gave/ are giving feedback... does that angry you so much? People aren't here saying the creation system is the worst system ever, they are here trying to improve the game.
Do you believe the game should be left alone with no additional fixes? A few things listed on the "new things to come for SWTOR" are just extra stuff that help make the game more complete. I believe character creation should be somewhere on that list or at least grow from here on out. Have you seen what GW2 did in a matter of months with their character creation system? It isn't impossible.
I'm not saying SWTOR is crap, I'm saying if they plan on improving the game, character creation should be on that list.
Character creation should be on the bottom of that list. Content updates should be top priority. All I see is my characters ass, and I must say that my BH has a nice little caboose
Character creation should be on the bottom of that list. Content updates should be top priority. All I see is my characters ass, and I must say that my BH has a nice little caboose
All I see is my character's ass too, except for the one or two cutscenes...
There isn't a single one thing being worked on, clearly, as JAmes Ohlen commented on. They have an entire team working on the game. Let the majority of the team work on content updates, I prefer that too. The whole team isn't writing quests and stories.
Its also funny I never see anyone complaing about the old days of pc gaming, when doom 2 was doom with an extra weapon or so and some new levels, but now suddenly if you make a game thats actually reliable suddenly its horrible and crap.
And if you dont think MW3 is imporved over MW, you havnt played them, clearly, as they are not teh same AT ALL, comong from someone whos actually played them.
Here we go again... no one is saying SWTOR is crap. Far from it. Is it that insulting to you that players want the game to be improved. Would it be better if we all sat here and said the game should never be improved? That it is the best it will ever be? People tested the game and gave/ are giving feedback... does that angry you so much? People aren't here saying the creation system is the worst system ever, they are here trying to improve the game.
Do you believe the game should be left alone with no additional fixes? A few things listed on the "new things to come for SWTOR" are just extra stuff that help make the game more complete. I believe character creation should be somewhere on that list or at least grow from here on out. Have you seen what GW2 did in a matter of months with their character creation system? It isn't impossible.
I'm not saying SWTOR is crap, I'm saying if they plan on improving the game, character creation should be on that list.
Character creation should be on the bottom of that list. Content updates should be top priority. All I see is my characters ass, and I must say that my BH has a nice little caboose
I guess you spacebar through all the hours worth of cutscene's where you are looking directly at your character and other models ingame. In a normal MMO your argument would stand up but the hours of cutscenes in SWTOR make character appearance matter much more and yet still as stated there seems to be no intention of improving it.
Also, old games could not be improved. When you bought Doom you got the game and it would be Doom for as long as you played it no matter what you say or do. When you by newer games not only MMO's they now have the ability to change (SWG -> NGE, or WoW - > WoW: Cata) so player feedback suddenly matters and therefore communities became much more vocal about their issues with games.
People that don't complain and just take games as is are not helping to improve the game at all and arguably the least valuable customer to a gaming studio. The people who report bugs and give constructive feedback about systems that could be improved to better the game are of the highest value.
If you want an example of what happens when constructive feedback is ignored and player complaints are rendered meaningless, go back and look at FFXIV a game that had many people complaining about it's systems and they were ignored. The result was the biggest MMO failure from a major studio ever. So bad that the game remained free of subs (buy to play beta basically) for over a year inorder to start over again and this time paying attention to player feedback.
I'm sorry, but that is ridiculous...so because you don't like the options available means that I or others can't possibly like the options that are there and I am just accepting it like some blind sheep? Wow...
You misunderstand. This is not an attack. I didn't say you should like what I like. I said we shouldn't accept something simply because that is how the developers made the game. Did you read my whole post?
There is room for improvements in the character creation. Do you agree or do you believe it is the best character creation system yet. Now... if you do believe that it can be improved, then you and I are on the same page. I think it's safe to assume that the system could be better.
What I was trying to convey, was that if there is room for improvement, we should nudge the developers into making a better game. If however, making a better creation system will crash all the servers and make the game a complete loss, then I will gladly admit fault and wrongs. However, through testing (beta) there are many of us who gave feedback that the system SHOULD be better. It does not NEED to be better.
Seriously though... you pretty much phraised me out of thin air...
I do believe that it can be improved....but what I want may not be what the developers want.
Sure there is always room for improvement...always. Where does it stop though? when is enough....enough? You say "we should nudge the developers into making a better game", whose idea of what is better? yours? What if the developers think your idea is not better? You gave your feedback, I gave mine....if they don't want to implement more options then that is their choice.
"We shouldn't accept something simply because that is how the developers made the game".....seriously dude...it is their game, they can do whatever the hell they want with it. Sure there are many things that I would like to see differently but I don't expect them to cater to everything I want. If it is as serious a problem as this thread makes it out to be then don't pay...the best way to show companies your dislike for something is to not give them money.
"There are many of us who gave feedback that the system SHOULD be better. It does not NEED to be better." If it was as dire as people claim then they would have made changes to it. They didn't make changes to it so they obviously feel "It does not NEED to be better".
Character creation should be on the bottom of that list. Content updates should be top priority. All I see is my characters ass, and I must say that my BH has a nice little caboose
All I see is my character's ass too, except for the one or two cutscenes...
There isn't a single one thing being worked on, clearly, as JAmes Ohlen commented on. They have an entire team working on the game. Let the majority of the team work on content updates, I prefer that too. The whole team isn't writing quests and stories.
Case in point TORs target audience doesn't care about character creation. They care about Raiding and getting gear. I am sure there are plenty of shiny helmets for you to choose from. From any number of instances.
No, you wont, it doesnt matter how many sliders they add, someone IS going to look teh same as you, your not special or unique.
Combination math says otherwise. Once you pass something on the order of 1E9 possible combinations, the odds of non-intentional duplication are in fact very small.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Its also funny I never see anyone complaing about the old days of pc gaming, when doom 2 was doom with an extra weapon or so and some new levels, but now suddenly if you make a game thats actually reliable suddenly its horrible and crap.
And if you dont think MW3 is imporved over MW, you havnt played them, clearly, as they are not teh same AT ALL, comong from someone whos actually played them.
Here we go again... no one is saying SWTOR is crap. Far from it. Is it that insulting to you that players want the game to be improved. Would it be better if we all sat here and said the game should never be improved? That it is the best it will ever be? People tested the game and gave/ are giving feedback... does that angry you so much? People aren't here saying the creation system is the worst system ever, they are here trying to improve the game.
Do you believe the game should be left alone with no additional fixes? A few things listed on the "new things to come for SWTOR" are just extra stuff that help make the game more complete. I believe character creation should be somewhere on that list or at least grow from here on out. Have you seen what GW2 did in a matter of months with their character creation system? It isn't impossible.
I'm not saying SWTOR is crap, I'm saying if they plan on improving the game, character creation should be on that list.
Character creation should be on the bottom of that list. Content updates should be top priority. All I see is my characters ass, and I must say that my BH has a nice little caboose
I guess you spacebar through all the hours worth of cutscene's where you are looking directly at your character and other models ingame. In a normal MMO your argument would stand up but the hours of cutscenes in SWTOR make character appearance matter much more and yet still as stated there seems to be no intention of improving it.
Also, old games could not be improved. When you bought Doom you got the game and it would be Doom for as long as you played it no matter what you say or do. When you by newer games not only MMO's they now have the ability to change (SWG -> NGE, or WoW - > WoW: Cata) so player feedback suddenly matters and therefore communities became much more vocal about their issues with games.
People that don't complain and just take games as is are not helping to improve the game at all and arguably the least valuable customer to a gaming studio. The people who report bugs and give constructive feedback about systems that could be improved to better the game are of the highest value.
If you want an example of what happens when constructive feedback is ignored and player complaints are rendered meaningless, go back and look at FFXIV a game that had many people complaining about it's systems and they were ignored. The result was the biggest MMO failure from a major studio ever. So bad that the game remained free of subs (buy to play beta basically) for over a year inorder to start over again and this time paying attention to player feedback.
Following player feedback can be just as bad as not following it. Just look at World of Warcraft, they listened to the feedback that the players gave and look what happened to that game. The game is almost a joke, a ghost of what it was in vanilla, it has been dumb downed and made so casual that you can queue for an endgame raid in a dungeon finder and kill the boss in a pug for crying out loud.
I'd argue that players only think they know what is best for a game. Are you developer? what games have you made? what gives your feedback any kind of game design validity outside of just wanting something different or just wanting more? I'm not a game developer...I'm not an animator or even a level designer what do I know about what is best for a game? I have been playing games since I was a kid...that does not make me an expert in game development.
Psst, guys--work on the CC is not interfering with work on raids etc. Different teams of people.
Every individual player stacks their "what they should work on" list differently from other player, hence message boards are born.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Comments
I like the game alot, but I have to agree that the CC is pretty sub-par. Below average.
You would think if you were a developer with great resources your thinking would be "I'm going to kick butt in EVERY aspect of this game!". But some aspects are only average.
I don't care much for the character creation... but this is NOT how we gamers should be thinking. We shouldn't absolutely accept something just because the developers built it that way. That is how the MMO genre became so stale, gamers just accepting everything and thinking there is nothing better. Take a look at COD. I could get a non COD-player and have them play MW1 and MW3 and they wouldn't know the difference. People kept accepting the same thing, and so, the developers capitalize in it.
Now it obviously shouldn't be top priority, but it should be pretty high up. Simply take a look at the forums... there are a lot of people wanting a better (not new) character creation. Are a lot of them complaining and irritating? Of course. But there is a good reason for them complaining.
You shouldnt grab a blind person then, anyone who plays games, wether they play cod or not, and cant tell the difference, needs new eyes, fact.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling"
Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
Then they should stop playing games, because, newsflash, your character will NEVER be unique, there will always be someone who looks exactly the same as you, to think your character is unique is denial pure and simple.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling"
Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
Didn't have to "give up" anything with CoX, I see not particular reason why you should have to in TOR. They've added proportion sliders, capes and auras, and thousands of costume pieces since launch, and overhauled the CC at least twice.
I think the primary difference is that TOR is rather strictly limited by its own IP. Iconic "looks" that its forced to follow in order to match the movies (and keep LA happy). Even a greatly enhanced CC buys faces and hair, more body types--but the costuming/gearing is not going to change substantially.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
All games that have appearance tab can be unique and if you can customize your character enough at character creation you will be unique.
Who said anything about rerolling?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
No, you wont, it doesnt matter how many sliders they add, someone IS going to look teh same as you, your not special or unique.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling"
Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
Aion CC is one of the best, even perfect world have a better CC
My point still stands. MW4 could be ran on the same engine, with a new story, and a different multiplayer mode and it would still sell well. What does that mean to the developers? They can rehash a lot of things and sell it for a brand new price. MW3 and MW2 are both ran on the same engine. There is only so many subtle improvements inbetween the sequals. I personally think a sequal should improve the game, not push it sideways.
Stories should be extra content, not new games.
Also... putting fact at the end of a statement doesn't make it a fact...
edit: Understand that feedback and critique have good intentions. SWTOR doesn't have a perfect character creation, far from it... therefore, there must be plenty of room for improvements.
I think the point he is trying to make is that he will be different from the masses. You don't need to be 1 in 5 million.
It's even more important that characters are diverse in SWTOR, since the cut scenes often frame the character's faces so close.
I'm sorry, but that is ridiculous...so because you don't like the options available means that I or others can't possibly like the options that are there and I am just accepting it like some blind sheep? Wow...
HEAVEN OR HELL
Duel 1
Lets ROCK!
So youve gone through every single character in teh game to see if they look the same? No?
Everyone thinks there unique, your not, someone made the same lookming character as you somewhere, and no you having a few wrinkles doesnt make you unique.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling"
Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
It does when its a fact.
Its also funny I never see anyone complaing about the old days of pc gaming, when doom 2 was doom with an extra weapon or so and some new levels, but now suddenly if you make a game thats actually reliable suddenly its horrible and crap.
And if you dont think MW3 is imporved over MW, you havnt played them, clearly, as they are not teh same AT ALL, comong from someone whos actually played them.
Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling"
Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.
You misunderstand. This is not an attack. I didn't say you should like what I like. I said we shouldn't accept something simply because that is how the developers made the game. Did you read my whole post?
There is room for improvements in the character creation. Do you agree or do you believe it is the best character creation system yet. Now... if you do believe that it can be improved, then you and I are on the same page. I think it's safe to assume that the system could be better.
What I was trying to convey, was that if there is room for improvement, we should nudge the developers into making a better game. If however, making a better creation system will crash all the servers and make the game a complete loss, then I will gladly admit fault and wrongs. However, through testing (beta) there are many of us who gave feedback that the system SHOULD be better. It does not NEED to be better.
Seriously though... you pretty much phraised me out of thin air...
Here we go again... no one is saying SWTOR is crap. Far from it. Is it that insulting to you that players want the game to be improved. Would it be better if we all sat here and said the game should never be improved? That it is the best it will ever be? People tested the game and gave/ are giving feedback... does that angry you so much? People aren't here saying the creation system is the worst system ever, they are here trying to improve the game.
Do you believe the game should be left alone with no additional fixes? A few things listed on the "new things to come for SWTOR" are just extra stuff that help make the game more complete. I believe character creation should be somewhere on that list or at least grow from here on out. Have you seen what GW2 did in a matter of months with their character creation system? It isn't impossible.
I'm not saying SWTOR is crap, I'm saying if they plan on improving the game, character creation should be on that list.
Character creation should be on the bottom of that list. Content updates should be top priority. All I see is my characters ass, and I must say that my BH has a nice little caboose
All I see is my character's ass too, except for the one or two cutscenes...
There isn't a single one thing being worked on, clearly, as JAmes Ohlen commented on. They have an entire team working on the game. Let the majority of the team work on content updates, I prefer that too. The whole team isn't writing quests and stories.
I guess you spacebar through all the hours worth of cutscene's where you are looking directly at your character and other models ingame. In a normal MMO your argument would stand up but the hours of cutscenes in SWTOR make character appearance matter much more and yet still as stated there seems to be no intention of improving it.
Also, old games could not be improved. When you bought Doom you got the game and it would be Doom for as long as you played it no matter what you say or do. When you by newer games not only MMO's they now have the ability to change (SWG -> NGE, or WoW - > WoW: Cata) so player feedback suddenly matters and therefore communities became much more vocal about their issues with games.
People that don't complain and just take games as is are not helping to improve the game at all and arguably the least valuable customer to a gaming studio. The people who report bugs and give constructive feedback about systems that could be improved to better the game are of the highest value.
If you want an example of what happens when constructive feedback is ignored and player complaints are rendered meaningless, go back and look at FFXIV a game that had many people complaining about it's systems and they were ignored. The result was the biggest MMO failure from a major studio ever. So bad that the game remained free of subs (buy to play beta basically) for over a year inorder to start over again and this time paying attention to player feedback.
I do believe that it can be improved....but what I want may not be what the developers want.
Sure there is always room for improvement...always. Where does it stop though? when is enough....enough? You say "we should nudge the developers into making a better game", whose idea of what is better? yours? What if the developers think your idea is not better? You gave your feedback, I gave mine....if they don't want to implement more options then that is their choice.
"We shouldn't accept something simply because that is how the developers made the game".....seriously dude...it is their game, they can do whatever the hell they want with it. Sure there are many things that I would like to see differently but I don't expect them to cater to everything I want. If it is as serious a problem as this thread makes it out to be then don't pay...the best way to show companies your dislike for something is to not give them money.
"There are many of us who gave feedback that the system SHOULD be better. It does not NEED to be better." If it was as dire as people claim then they would have made changes to it. They didn't make changes to it so they obviously feel "It does not NEED to be better".
HEAVEN OR HELL
Duel 1
Lets ROCK!
Case in point TORs target audience doesn't care about character creation. They care about Raiding and getting gear. I am sure there are plenty of shiny helmets for you to choose from. From any number of instances.
Yeah the options are pretty lame.
Combination math says otherwise. Once you pass something on the order of 1E9 possible combinations, the odds of non-intentional duplication are in fact very small.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Following player feedback can be just as bad as not following it. Just look at World of Warcraft, they listened to the feedback that the players gave and look what happened to that game. The game is almost a joke, a ghost of what it was in vanilla, it has been dumb downed and made so casual that you can queue for an endgame raid in a dungeon finder and kill the boss in a pug for crying out loud.
I'd argue that players only think they know what is best for a game. Are you developer? what games have you made? what gives your feedback any kind of game design validity outside of just wanting something different or just wanting more? I'm not a game developer...I'm not an animator or even a level designer what do I know about what is best for a game? I have been playing games since I was a kid...that does not make me an expert in game development.
HEAVEN OR HELL
Duel 1
Lets ROCK!
Psst, guys--work on the CC is not interfering with work on raids etc. Different teams of people.
Every individual player stacks their "what they should work on" list differently from other player, hence message boards are born.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.