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Every MMORPG out or in development has been ruined for me by Skyrim.

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Comments

  • meilirsmeilirs Artesia, CAPosts: 32Member

    Skyrim is that good? I have been hearing about this game everywhere. Maybe it's time to give it a go even though I need to watch my budget.

    I hope it doesn't ruin my enjoyment of MMOs though.

  • DubhlaithDubhlaith EnnisPosts: 1,012Member


    Originally posted by meilirs
    Skyrim is that good? I have been hearing about this game everywhere. Maybe it's time to give it a go even though I need to watch my budget.
    I hope it doesn't ruin my enjoyment of MMOs though.

    It will forever change your standard for what makes a good game. So there's that.

    "Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true — you know it, and they know it." —Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007

    WTF? No subscription fee?

  • MadnessRealmMadnessRealm Montreal, QCPosts: 2,716Member Uncommon

    Skyrim has apparently become the first Western Game to receive a perfect score from a Japanese Magazine. Which is quite surprising and quite telling at the same time. http://www.computerandvideogames.com/327750/skyrim-is-first-western-game-to-get-famitsu-4040/

     

    As for whether  or not the game has ruined MMORPG's for me, no. It only serves as a reminder of why I can't stand today's MMOs anymore. I still play online games but they aren't quite MMOs, I "quit" looking for an MMO with a "world" and rather just play some action-y title to pass time (Dragon Nest, Dungeon Fighter, etc). Nothing has really captured my attention, and Skyrim just destroyed every competition. The game is just...so great. The feeling of getting lost or simply adventuring and finding an interesting item, hearing the stories NPCs have to say or the small comments they'll say when they pass near you, the awesome graphics set at Ultra with a few graphic mods on top of it (Water, Night Sky, FXAA mod). Finding your way onto the top of a mountain to admire the view, etc. It's just great.

    ------
    Your daily dose of common sense since 2009!

  • Happyguy83Happyguy83 Phoenix, AZPosts: 264Member

    Originally posted by meilirs

    Skyrim is that good? I have been hearing about this game everywhere. Maybe it's time to give it a go even though I need to watch my budget.

    I hope it doesn't ruin my enjoyment of MMOs though.

    No, its just the game Sandbox fans cream their pants over.

     

    To people like me its an 8 at best.

     

    Its oblivion with dual wield and wondering dragons, Little more.

  • carpatiancarpatian edmonton, ABPosts: 46Member

    I instaled skyrim 2 days ago. today at lvl 17 i finished the main quest killing that last dragon---> end game (indeed breathtaking graphic but  the fail of main story ...blah)

  • DarkPonyDarkPony RotterdamPosts: 5,566Member

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

  • 8BitAvatar8BitAvatar Frozen Tundra, WIPosts: 196Member

    Originally posted by carpatian

    I instaled skyrim 2 days ago. today at lvl 17 i finished the main quest killing that last dragon---> end game (indeed breathtaking graphic but  the fail of main story ...blah)

    You don't play an Elder Scrolls game for the main quest.

    I've put hundreds and hundreds of hours into Morrowind and Oblivion, and never finished the main quest for either game.

    You're missing out on so much of the game if you stop at level 17 just because you beat the main quest line.

    You owe it to yourself to explore the rest of the world and really try to experience it. Trust me.

  • 8BitAvatar8BitAvatar Frozen Tundra, WIPosts: 196Member

    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

    Please explain how it is more complex.

    I'm trying to be nicer around here, but that's hogwash. Themepark MMO combat is complex?!?!

  • carpatiancarpatian edmonton, ABPosts: 46Member

    well i dont see the point to lvl and gear up my char, just to one hit every creature on that world . if i dont have the chalenge ,is just boring to run around and admire the beautifull world. for me..

  • 8BitAvatar8BitAvatar Frozen Tundra, WIPosts: 196Member

    Originally posted by carpatian

    well i dont see the point to lvl and gear up my char, just to one hit every creature on that world . if i dont have the chalenge ,is just boring to run around and admire the beautifull world. for me..

    Turn up the difficulty level to Master, and stay away from Smithing and Enchanting. :)

  • AusareAusare adamstown, MDPosts: 850Member

    How can a combat system that involves a pause be ever acceptable for a MMO?

  • headphonesheadphones melbournePosts: 611Member

    Originally posted by 8BitAvatar

    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

    Please explain how it is more complex.

    I'm trying to be nicer around here, but that's hogwash. Themepark MMO combat is complex?!?!

    i can faceroll through skyrim now, i think that's what he might mean. i mean, with skyrim, you click once and done. with most mmos you may pop a few clicks before you're done.

    i mean, i got to level 26 in skyrim and i'm a little bored with the combat. why? because i'm a stealth nut. i play rogues in every game. i can't help it. i love it. imagine my joy then to play skyrim. the cut-throating animations are second to none and there's nothing more fun than sneaking up behind something and giving it a 1-shot kill. it's fantastic.

    the first 20 times.

    the fact i can now kill pretty much anything is empowering, but a little boring. i dual-wield daggers and everything dies so fast under those, too, that pushing forward and clicking once isn't exactly the most challenging of combat. as a rogue-player, i'm used to strafing and zigzagging while stabbing, but i find i do less of that in skyrim because there's no need. i switched to bows for a bit of sniper practice and while that was mildly entertaining, that's worn thin. i ended up rerolling and trying a mage style. i died a few times, but it's a clunky system in my opinion and skyrim could have done with a more interesting ui to make it work. maybe i'm missing something, but tabbing out to switch spells is irritating me.

    i have to say, i find even wow combat to be more involving. sorry for that, but i do.

    as for the story and whatnot - hmmm. i'm with the other guy on that, too. it's bland and one dimensional. if there are three possible options in dialogue, you will ALWAYS end up being forced to take the one the devs wanted you to take because taking the second will only loop you back onto the question, leaving two options. waste of time, really. there's no significant consequence for doing anything different in that regard.

    i completed the rebellion quests and at the end felt like, meh? that was it?

    having said that, skyrim IS a gorgeous looking game. it's got a nice atmosphere. i don't find it as much fun as oblivion in some ways (especially the lack of speechcraft and mercantile fun - unless again i'm missing an option which turns it bacvk on), but it kept me interested for 50 or so hours and that's pretty good.

  • TealaTeala SomewherePosts: 7,430Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Ausare

    How can a combat system that involves a pause be ever acceptable for a MMO?

    That is why there are hotkeys to switch weapons and change spells.   That means switching weapons on the fly and changing spells without pausing.   

    image
  • Lester_CreechLester_Creech nelson, BCPosts: 515Member Common

    Originally posted by Ausare

    How can a combat system that involves a pause be ever acceptable for a MMO?

    um, every option you use when you use can just as easily be used in a drop down menu during live play. this is hardly the defining feature of skyrim.

     

  • TealaTeala SomewherePosts: 7,430Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by carpatian

    I instaled skyrim 2 days ago. today at lvl 17 i finished the main quest killing that last dragon---> end game (indeed breathtaking graphic but  the fail of main story ...blah)

    You mean you completed the main quest at level 17 using the easiest setting, and cheat codes, because there is no way in hell you completed the main story at 17 on master setting.

    image
  • TealaTeala SomewherePosts: 7,430Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

    I think maybe you are correct, accept I hate tab targetting in games.   That is the one thing that really annoys me in games like SW:ToR and WoW and most other MMO's is this click on target, lock target and then spam skills - even if they are not in your LOS you still hit - its all based on RNG.    That is why I am liking the looks of combat in games like TERA, Age of Wulin, and Blade and Soul...there is no tab targetting...if you are not aiming at your target - you will not hit it.   I wouldn't mind hotbar combat if it means a person still has to at least be facing you and able to see you...that is not the case in most MMO's these days.    

    image
  • DarkPonyDarkPony RotterdamPosts: 5,566Member

    Originally posted by 8BitAvatar

    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

    Please explain how it is more complex.

    I'm trying to be nicer around here, but that's hogwash. Themepark MMO combat is complex?!?!

    It's very simple really. Let's take an example: An archer character in Skyrim versus a hunter/archer/ranged character in a typical mmorpg.

    In Skyrim or (Oblivion, Morowind, *insert game with realistic combat system here*) the combat gameplay consists of mainly aiming and shooting. Of course there is sneaking up to your foe, poisons and enchants you can use, but ability wise it's mainly aiming and shooting. That's all there is to it. Aiming and shooting.

    In a typical mmorpg you lose the aiming part but the shooting gets replaced by a whole range of damaging abilities with your ranged weapon, some with prerequisites to use; build up adrenalin / momentum, first, etc. But you also get snares, stuns, debuffs, distracts, etc.

    Of course you could reason that "Skyrim has all that if you use magic and special abilities" but a mmorpg has a wide range of such abilities tailormade for each and every class and you need to be able to use them right away. Having to pause the game to access some of your less used abilities does take away from the flow and "real-timeness" of things.

    The amount of hotkeys you need says it all, really. In Skyrim you might use all your 1-10 keys. Personally I only use 5 or so on my archer after 200+ hours. In a typical mmorpg you use 20+

    I'm not much of a defender of WOW but I honestly think that a combat system like that allows for much more "skill" and "mastering" than a realistic one like in the TES games.

  • TealaTeala SomewherePosts: 7,430Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by indrct

    Originally posted by Teala


    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

    I think maybe you are correct, accept I hate tab targetting in games.   That is the one thing that really annoys me in games like SW:ToR and WoW and most other MMO's is this click on target, lock target and then spam skills - even if they are not in your LOS you still hit - its all based on RNG.    That is why I am liking the looks of combat in games like TERA, Age of Wulin, and Blade and Soul...there is no tab targetting...if you are not aiming at your target - you will not hit it.   I wouldn't mind hotbar combat if it means a person still has to at least be facing you and able to see you...that is not the case in most MMO's these days.    

    Find me one MMO in the past 5 years that ignores LOS mechanics.

     

    I'll be waiting.



    WoW - once you have someone targetted you can spam through trees, buildings, walls...same goes for any game Aion, Warhammer, Rift, you name the game and it is possible.   

    image
  • headphonesheadphones melbournePosts: 611Member

    Originally posted by Teala

    Originally posted by carpatian

    I instaled skyrim 2 days ago. today at lvl 17 i finished the main quest killing that last dragon---> end game (indeed breathtaking graphic but  the fail of main story ...blah)

    You mean you completed the main quest at level 17 using the easiest setting, and cheat codes, because there is no way in hell you completed the main story at 17 on master setting.

    i dunno. bethesda says it can be done in 2 hours.

  • AusareAusare adamstown, MDPosts: 850Member

    Originally posted by Teala

    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

    I think maybe you are correct, accept I hate tab targetting in games.   That is the one thing that really annoys me in games like SW:ToR and WoW and most other MMO's is this click on target, lock target and then spam skills - even if they are not in your LOS you still hit - its all based on RNG.    That is why I am liking the looks of combat in games like TERA, Age of Wulin, and Blade and Soul...there is no tab targetting...if you are not aiming at your target - you will not hit it.   I wouldn't mind hotbar combat if it means a person still has to at least be facing you and able to see you...that is not the case in most MMO's these days.    

    Wow started off with having to face your target to target them, but then the problem became lag and casters got screwed by the fact that someone just ran circles around you all day and you could not get a spell off on them...how will you solve lag and the issue of pvp combat is now just stupidly running circles around each other all day trying to get behind each other constantly.  Tactics becomes who has the fastest connections and the only ability people will use is something to stun the other.

  • carpatiancarpatian edmonton, ABPosts: 46Member

     Indeed i played low dificulty .but even so in my opinion they should make the frakin main quest very hard to complete, with crazy nuts dragons to kill or other boses etc etc. i think they should cut a lot of side quests and make a nice huge main quest like fk to take forever for someone to finish that. because indeed the world is unbelieveble nice and beautifull but i dont feel like playing just for that i beter play one mmo at least to interact with real ppls(sory for my inglish)

  • indrctindrct SeoulPosts: 83Member

    Originally posted by Teala

    Originally posted by indrct


    Originally posted by Teala


    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

    I think maybe you are correct, accept I hate tab targetting in games.   That is the one thing that really annoys me in games like SW:ToR and WoW and most other MMO's is this click on target, lock target and then spam skills - even if they are not in your LOS you still hit - its all based on RNG.    That is why I am liking the looks of combat in games like TERA, Age of Wulin, and Blade and Soul...there is no tab targetting...if you are not aiming at your target - you will not hit it.   I wouldn't mind hotbar combat if it means a person still has to at least be facing you and able to see you...that is not the case in most MMO's these days.    

    Find me one MMO in the past 5 years that ignores LOS mechanics.

     

    I'll be waiting.



    WoW - once you have someone targetted you can spam through trees, buildings, walls...same goes for any game Aion, Warhammer, Rift, you name the game and it is possible.   

    Completely and utterly wrong.  It actually has (IN BIG ASS RED LETTERS) an error pop up on your screen that says TARGET IS NOT IN LINE OF SIGHT.  Same goes for WAR and Rift.

     

    Why make things like that up when you clearly don't have the slightest clue what you're talking about?

  • TealaTeala SomewherePosts: 7,430Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Originally posted by 8BitAvatar


    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

    Please explain how it is more complex.

    I'm trying to be nicer around here, but that's hogwash. Themepark MMO combat is complex?!?!

    It's very simple really. Let's take an example: An archer character in Skyrim versus a hunter/archer/ranged character in a typical mmorpg.

    In Skyrim or (Oblivion, Morowind, *insert game with realistic combat system here*) the combat gameplay consists of mainly aiming and shooting. Of course there is sneaking up to your foe, poisons and enchants you can use, but ability wise it's mainly aiming and shooting. That's all there is to it. Aiming and shooting.

    In a typical mmorpg you lose the aiming part but the shooting gets replaced by a whole range of damaging abilities with your ranged weapon, some with prerequisites to use; build up adrenalin / momentum, first, etc. But you also get snares, stuns, debuffs, distracts, etc.

    Of course you could reason that "Skyrim has all that if you use magic and special abilities" but a mmorpg has a wide range of such abilities tailormade for each and every class and you need to be able to use them right away. Having to pause the game to access some of your less used abilities does take away from the flow and "real-timeness" of things.

    The amount of hotkeys you need says it all, really. In Skyrim you might use all your 1-10 keys. Personally I only use 5 or so on my archer after 200+ hours. In a typical mmorpg you use 20+

    I'm not much of a defender of WOW but I honestly think that a combat system like that allows for much more "skill" and "mastering" than a realistic one like in the TES games.



    I disagree because in "my opinion" it takes more skill to down an opponent in a game like Skyrim or better yet, play Mount and Blade:Warband and play as a Khergit Archer...try shooting a bow while riding at a full gallop and the guy is behind the parapet of a castle wall...that takes skill.

    image
  • TealaTeala SomewherePosts: 7,430Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by indrct

    Originally posted by Teala


    Originally posted by indrct


    Originally posted by Teala


    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Look and feel, and the sense of awe simply by wandering the world; yes. Mmorpg's will pale in comparison for me too.

    Character progression wise, social-wise and combat gameplay wise*: no.

    Also I expect Swtor's stories / dialogues to be better. Because Skyrim is in fact a bit bland in that department in my opinion. (Apart from the side quests).

     

    *in regards to combat gameplay: I think that manual aiming, real time blocking and an altogether realistic combat system, isn't more fun than tab targetted, cooldown based combat with skill cycles and abilities for every occasion. Because, as a matter of fact; typical mmorpg combat gameplay can be much more complex, diverse and challenging than simply shooting your bow, hacking away with a sword / mace / axe or nuking with your best spel, even if it feels more real.

    Skyrim as a gameworld to sandbox in, is simply a work of art. But that's not all that makes a great and compelling game for a long time.

    I think maybe you are correct, accept I hate tab targetting in games.   That is the one thing that really annoys me in games like SW:ToR and WoW and most other MMO's is this click on target, lock target and then spam skills - even if they are not in your LOS you still hit - its all based on RNG.    That is why I am liking the looks of combat in games like TERA, Age of Wulin, and Blade and Soul...there is no tab targetting...if you are not aiming at your target - you will not hit it.   I wouldn't mind hotbar combat if it means a person still has to at least be facing you and able to see you...that is not the case in most MMO's these days.    

    Find me one MMO in the past 5 years that ignores LOS mechanics.

     

    I'll be waiting.



    WoW - once you have someone targetted you can spam through trees, buildings, walls...same goes for any game Aion, Warhammer, Rift, you name the game and it is possible.   

    Completely and utterly wrong.  It actually has (IN BIG ASS RED LETTERS) an error pop up on your screen that says TARGET IS NOT IN LINE OF SIGHT.  Same goes for WAR and Rift.

     

    Why make things like that up when you clearly don't have the slightest clue what you're talking about?



    I play WoW...come join me in Altrec Valley and I'll show you how wrong you are.

    image
  • AusareAusare adamstown, MDPosts: 850Member

    How many people you going to get that want to pvp at that level of skill that is going to support a AAA quality game that you would demand.

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