Let me say this about WoW after playing it for 7 years/
WoW has given me the most epic moments ever in any of the dozens of mmo's i played.
WoW has given me alot of online friends
WoW has set a milestone for any mmo studio that wants to be succesfull
WoW has been and still is King of the Hill since 2005
You may dislike the fantasy theme wow has
You may dislike anything that has to do with WoW
But you must admit that Blizzard has been making epic games in their history, from Rock and Roll racing on the console to Starcraft and the warcraft franchise.
With that said alot of us can agree that since their main developer team left to work on TITAN their whole empire is slowly crumbling down.
They work hard up to WoTLK to grow bigger and bigger but after Arthas died the people seemed to notice how dull and repetitive WoW has become.
We got SWTOR incomming and so far i disliked SWTOR ALOT, but this beta had me turned over 190 degrees.
I did Black Talon with a few American players ( I am from the netherlands) and man what an epic run it was.
That feeling i missed in WoW for many years came back to me in this Beta of SWTOR.
Iam a pessimist <--spelling -_- ? or let me say it this way, you need to be from the best of the best to convince me your worth my money.
Warhammer - Aion - Rift - all failed me and wasnt worth my time.
SWTOR on the other hand can be a new King of the Hill if they play it right and WoW keeps pushing out trash packs.
People are bored to death in WoW, and when you got such a massive playerbase and you come out with the next best thing your going to be HOT
Cataclysm + MoP come at the worst posible time for Blizzard, and SW might harvest the fruit in december.
I cannot wait to play SWTOR again, and if you would have asked me this 4 months ago i would almost laugh you to death when you would say SWTOR is a good mmo.
How things can change in such a short time
WoW died for me when Cata was released and i was lvl 85 in two weeks. Im a terrbibly slow lvler yet i managed to reach 85 in 2 weeks. Im no raider either and the PvP community is immature and don't know how to play battlegrounds anymore like they used to in the first year of the BG's. I have quit since februari and played some Rift but the community there was terrible so i left after a month again. I played on a RP server and damn the people there where mostly ex WoWers..the same people i wanted to avoid cause beside WoW being boring for me i really hated what had become of the WoW community.
SWToR is more story driven so for me thats great. I can do things at my own speed and no group presure. I didn't do enough quests with my short play time in the beta but the quests seemed nice to okay to me. Depends on the class you play i guess and how far you are in. But everything stands and falls with the community for me. If it are nice people who share their love for the game and want to make it great together it will be awesome (like the first 2 years of WoW). If it becomes a egocentric community that lives only for themselfs and being rude to others (like the last 5 years of WoW and the rift community) then its over for me soon.
Most of my friends are moving away from their current MMOs after playing the past few weekends. SWTOR is going to make a shift in the MMO world on who is playing what. It might take some time but eventually SWTOR will be the MMO king.
Don't worry about most people around here, they are more machine than human, twisted and evil.
"I don't give a sh*t what other people say. I play what I like and I'll pay to do it too!" - SerialMMOist
i cant take anyone seriously who says 'the best ultimate'
Yeah because you never called a movie, book or music best / ultimate ever in your life which others thought were below average or even garbage.
My wife loves Crouching Tiger , hidden dragon and thinks it is ultimate, i believe it is overrated and average but i still take whatever she says seriously because it is her taste.
Do i really have to say anymore,oh i will say one is from 2005 and the other is 2011,nope just joking they are both from 2011.
You might want to say more, because you really have said nothing. I won't watch vids just because some anon. posts it in here in some vein attempt to say "look at me, I am cool, and I am right".
The only thing SWTOR is at this point as far as ultimate goes, is ultimate example of a mediocre mmo that fanboi's will buy just because of the star wars label on it. The players need to stick it to BW to put some actual effort into SWTOR like they normally do with their past games.
The character customization in SWTOR is a joke compared to not only every other mmo out there, but BW's own games they have done. That's just one example, but not going to go on a rant because only time will tell if BW actually reads their feedback and bug reports.
i cant take anyone seriously who says 'the best ultimate'
Why do you feel it matters to others, as to whether or not you take them seriously?
I couldn't care less if it matters to others.
Originally posted by Supersoups
Originally posted by Lashley
i cant take anyone seriously who says 'the best ultimate'
Yeah because you never called a movie, book or music best / ultimate ever in your life which others thought were below average or even garbage.
My wife loves Crouching Tiger , hidden dragon and thinks it is ultimate, i believe it is overrated and average but i still take whatever she says seriously because it is her taste.
Perhaps I have. My point was, that the best ultimate in the same sentence just shows how unintelligent the TC is. It's like saying this bad not good game, makes no sense.
This thread is so much fun I just have to throw my thoughts on things into it.
First of I dont play WoW.. I played the first few years back in 2004-2005...
I played linage2 back in 2003-2004 before I played WoW, that is how old that game is, It was a fun pvp game though..
I have played EvE since 2006-2011 and Im still playing it....
I have tested countless MMORPG games since I got into the genre, AoC, WAR, Champions online, city of heroes, Guild wars, LOTRO and many more
I think the MAYOR PROBLEM is that you can even compare WoW to SWTOR... You cant compare WoW to EvE or Linage2, they are so diffrent there is no comparison, accept that they are Multiplayer games.. You cant compare WoW to League of legends or world of tanks, those to arnt exacly MMOs but they are total diffrent. Point Im trying to make Why do developers constantly trying to make WoW 2.0? Havent we played the Quest, zone, Raid, tank and spank Mechanics enough by now? Cant they come up with something new and thrilling?
I have personaly given up in the last few years even trying new games, because they play exacly like the old games Iv played before, it gets repetative and boring. And after a few hours you feel like you have done it all before, nothing New nothing exciting just move along... This has been reason that so many mmos have failed, They fail do keep people Interested for more then a few months. Because we have all played the mechanics so many times now we dont want to play it again. And voice overs arnt enough to change the basic mechanics of a game.
This is to all developers in the future, please make something NEW... We are tired of the same old bullshit...
Yeh me to but i spent 56 of my 74 hrs up watching the dancing holo girls in the canteina
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Originally posted by Z3R01How much do I need to play to get an accurate opinion of a game mechanic? I had two level 20+ characters one on each side.
Dialog is nice but when all you're doing is running to a map cord clicking an item, killing ten of these or waiting for a certain number of items to drop it gets a tad underwhelming even if the NPCs are voiced.
Name a game you aren't doing that? Almost every RPG game boils down to kill x or collect x.
Not really. While there is combat and loot in almost all RPGs, most quests are not "get X drops from mob A" or "kill Y of mob B" or "Interact with Z of world item C".
Let's go waaaay back to Baldur's Gate (the following is as best as I remember it). You come across a farm. You are asked to kill the Ankegs that have invaded it. Once you kill them they are DEAD and the farm is clear. You don't have to "kill X" because they don't respawn. Instead you are asked to permanently change the game world and so you do that. That's one difference between traditional RPGs and MMOS.
Another would be that the combat systems are vastly different and imho, vastly more rewarding and deep in normal RPGs. There's also a heck of a lot less grind even in the oldest of RPGs, because there's no need to artificially inflate playtime to encourage monthly fees (since there are no monthly fees).
I suppose Z3R01 didn't touch on all this, but I think that's what he was getting at and probably a bit more besides.
The only thing SWTOR is at this point as far as ultimate goes, is ultimate example of a mediocre mmo that fanboi's will buy just because of the star wars label on it.
^^^^
This
Tried: EQ2 - AC - EU - HZ - TR - MxO - TTO - WURM - SL - VG:SoH - PotBS - PS - AoC - WAR - DDO - SWTOR Played: UO - EQ1 - AO - DAoC - NC - CoH/CoV - SWG - WoW - EVE - AA - LotRO - DFO - STO - FE - MO - RIFT Playing: Skyrim Following: The Repopulation I want a Virtual World, not just a Game. ITS TOO HARD! - Matt Firor (ZeniMax)
I'll have to agree, TOR is the best mmo I have ever played. I will retire my Eve accounts, rush through Skyrim and wait in joy for TOR. It adresses the single largest gripe I've had with all mmogs; From SWG to EQ2 and even AoC, they all failed to deliver the kind of immersion *I* want in a game, a strong immersive story delivered in an enhoyable manner. A text box just can't deliver it, I hate the text boxes filled with standard poor backstory for grinding XP and I've tried to like it many times.
SWG was the only SW mmo so I stuck by it, AoC tried to enhance the story but fell short, the graphics can only go so far, but the combat was the best I've yet encountered. Eve is like watching paint try and consist of gate rapes and/or slide show fleets no quality content what so ever except making your own content, I lasted a while in it due to beeing the only real space ship mmo.
I for one will not waste a second more on the current crop of mmos. Sure I'd wish there were more detailed textures and less hotbar combat, but so be it. TOR's the kind of fun I want in a mmom, despite it's flaws.
Is SWTOR a good game? Yea, mostly. However, strip away the voiced over cinematics and all you have left is just another MMO.
Having played the Beta this past weekend... I won't be playing SWTOR, and will be waiting for Secret World instead.
BioWare is fortunate that so many people are bored with WoW, and that there is "Star Wars" in the title. Otherwise, I don't really think this would be a successful MMO at all.
I do think that, at least initially, BioWare will have a hit on their hands. Will it have any longevity at all? Only time will tell.
On a side note, while watching a friend of mine play (who enjoyed Beta but is also not interested in playing SWTOR) I saw a few names that gave me a chuckle... Darthgiggles, Abbywan, Hawnsolo, Boobafett, and no less than 20 variations of either Revan or Malek. Yep, have fun with that "Star Wars immersion" some of you keep applauding.
On a side note, while watching a friend of mine play (who enjoyed Beta but is also not interested in playing SWTOR) I saw a few names that gave me a chuckle... Darthgiggles, Abbywan, Hawnsolo, Boobafett, and no less than 20 variations of either Revan or Malek. Yep, have fun with that "Star Wars immersion" some of you keep applauding.
Explain how its any different from the 90,000 Legolawls and Gimlis in Lotro? Or the 10,000 Captain Jack Sparrows or barbosas in PoTBS?
or the 15,000 Conan variations in Age of Conan? People who think they're clever usually arent... its going to be everywhere..
Dont even get me started on the names ive seen in Everquest1 and 2, WoW.. etc
On a side note, while watching a friend of mine play (who enjoyed Beta but is also not interested in playing SWTOR) I saw a few names that gave me a chuckle... Darthgiggles, Abbywan, Hawnsolo, Boobafett, and no less than 20 variations of either Revan or Malek. Yep, have fun with that "Star Wars immersion" some of you keep applauding.
Explain how its any different from the 90,000 Legolawls and Gimlis in Lotro? Or the 10,000 Captain Jack Sparrows or barbosas in PoTBS?
or the 15,000 Conan variations in Age of Conan? People who think they're clever usually arent... its going to be everywhere..
Dont even get me started on the names ive seen in Everquest1 and 2, WoW.. etc
No, it's not different at all, and really is to be completely expected these in MMOs these days.
I was trying to point out that people that scream about how "immersive" SWTOR is will likely end up being greatly disappointed.
Unoriginal names like that just make me point and laugh, and in a way help me determine right off the bat what sort of player is behind the character. If I walk up to Homersimpson the Jedi then it's a fair bet a certain type of person is behind the character. I've yet to meet an exception to that.
On a side note, while watching a friend of mine play (who enjoyed Beta but is also not interested in playing SWTOR) I saw a few names that gave me a chuckle... Darthgiggles, Abbywan, Hawnsolo, Boobafett, and no less than 20 variations of either Revan or Malek. Yep, have fun with that "Star Wars immersion" some of you keep applauding.
Explain how its any different from the 90,000 Legolawls and Gimlis in Lotro? Or the 10,000 Captain Jack Sparrows or barbosas in PoTBS?
or the 15,000 Conan variations in Age of Conan? People who think they're clever usually arent... its going to be everywhere..
Dont even get me started on the names ive seen in Everquest1 and 2, WoW.. etc
No, it's not different at all, and really is to be completely expected these in MMOs these days.
I was trying to point out that people that scream about how "immersive" SWTOR is will likely end up being greatly disappointed.
Unoriginal names like that just make me point and laugh, and in a way help me determine right off the bat what sort of player is behind the character. If I walk up to Homersimpson the Jedi then it's a fair bet a certain type of person is behind the character. I've yet to meet an exception to that.
The sort that just wants to enjoy and doesn't take things seriously or uptight about whole immersion thing? but no gaming should be a serious business for everyone. I don't know how you can judge people on basis of names unless you got a chance to meet the real person.
One looks like it was made in 2001 the other looks like it was made in 2011.
Everything about the buttom vid shouts today,from the animation to the boss script.
The other is so static it's a crying shame but everyone has their own opinion i guess.
I know which boss i would enjoy confronting,that's for sure.
Yeah but that is a very limited way to decide because MMORPGS are huge with many many interesting features than a boss fight. Aion boss fights also looked very cool and heavily advertised by Ncsoft. The actual game well turned to be completely different and boring for me.
My wife loves Crouching Tiger , hidden dragon and thinks it is ultimate, i believe it is overrated and average but i still take whatever she says seriously because it is her taste.
You have a smart wife. I suggest looking up the history of Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon. It is basically like the King Artur of china, a very old story, with a lot of hidden philisophical meaning to it. Most of it wouldn't be understood by the western market, as Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism aren't part of our culture.
Comments
WoW died for me when Cata was released and i was lvl 85 in two weeks. Im a terrbibly slow lvler yet i managed to reach 85 in 2 weeks. Im no raider either and the PvP community is immature and don't know how to play battlegrounds anymore like they used to in the first year of the BG's. I have quit since februari and played some Rift but the community there was terrible so i left after a month again. I played on a RP server and damn the people there where mostly ex WoWers..the same people i wanted to avoid cause beside WoW being boring for me i really hated what had become of the WoW community.
SWToR is more story driven so for me thats great. I can do things at my own speed and no group presure. I didn't do enough quests with my short play time in the beta but the quests seemed nice to okay to me. Depends on the class you play i guess and how far you are in. But everything stands and falls with the community for me. If it are nice people who share their love for the game and want to make it great together it will be awesome (like the first 2 years of WoW). If it becomes a egocentric community that lives only for themselfs and being rude to others (like the last 5 years of WoW and the rift community) then its over for me soon.
Well gosh tough crowd, as i said i entered the weekend beta with a wow menality.
Of course it blew me away literally, it was totally unexpected.
I think it was the story, and character development, quests that glued me to my monitor.
It was really hard to force myself to log off and get some rest.
My guild leader of 400 wow members is moving to swtor alone with the members, this shoudl tell you somewthing.
They all played the weekend beta and loved it.
Starwars001,
Most of my friends are moving away from their current MMOs after playing the past few weekends. SWTOR is going to make a shift in the MMO world on who is playing what. It might take some time but eventually SWTOR will be the MMO king.
Don't worry about most people around here, they are more machine than human, twisted and evil.
"I don't give a sh*t what other people say. I play what I like and I'll pay to do it too!" - SerialMMOist
i cant take anyone seriously who says 'the best ultimate'
I found it really hard to put down as well. I can't remember the last time I felt that way about a game.
Cheers.
Yeah because you never called a movie, book or music best / ultimate ever in your life which others thought were below average or even garbage.
My wife loves Crouching Tiger , hidden dragon and thinks it is ultimate, i believe it is overrated and average but i still take whatever she says seriously because it is her taste.
Ever played with Seventh Sanctum's Sentai Team name generator?
http://www.seventhsanctum.com/generate.php?Genname=sentainame
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
There is lot more to both games than just one boss fight. I have no idea how one can judge entire game on basis of a boss video.
You might want to say more, because you really have said nothing. I won't watch vids just because some anon. posts it in here in some vein attempt to say "look at me, I am cool, and I am right".
The only thing SWTOR is at this point as far as ultimate goes, is ultimate example of a mediocre mmo that fanboi's will buy just because of the star wars label on it. The players need to stick it to BW to put some actual effort into SWTOR like they normally do with their past games.
The character customization in SWTOR is a joke compared to not only every other mmo out there, but BW's own games they have done. That's just one example, but not going to go on a rant because only time will tell if BW actually reads their feedback and bug reports.
I couldn't care less if it matters to others.
Originally posted by Supersoups
Yeah because you never called a movie, book or music best / ultimate ever in your life which others thought were below average or even garbage.
My wife loves Crouching Tiger , hidden dragon and thinks it is ultimate, i believe it is overrated and average but i still take whatever she says seriously because it is her taste.
Perhaps I have. My point was, that the best ultimate in the same sentence just shows how unintelligent the TC is. It's like saying this bad not good game, makes no sense.
Well then, surely you should take your own advice and stop trying to be the internet hard man? It's quite sad.
This thread is so much fun I just have to throw my thoughts on things into it.
First of I dont play WoW.. I played the first few years back in 2004-2005...
I played linage2 back in 2003-2004 before I played WoW, that is how old that game is, It was a fun pvp game though..
I have played EvE since 2006-2011 and Im still playing it....
I have tested countless MMORPG games since I got into the genre, AoC, WAR, Champions online, city of heroes, Guild wars, LOTRO and many more
I think the MAYOR PROBLEM is that you can even compare WoW to SWTOR... You cant compare WoW to EvE or Linage2, they are so diffrent there is no comparison, accept that they are Multiplayer games.. You cant compare WoW to League of legends or world of tanks, those to arnt exacly MMOs but they are total diffrent. Point Im trying to make Why do developers constantly trying to make WoW 2.0? Havent we played the Quest, zone, Raid, tank and spank Mechanics enough by now? Cant they come up with something new and thrilling?
I have personaly given up in the last few years even trying new games, because they play exacly like the old games Iv played before, it gets repetative and boring. And after a few hours you feel like you have done it all before, nothing New nothing exciting just move along... This has been reason that so many mmos have failed, They fail do keep people Interested for more then a few months. Because we have all played the mechanics so many times now we dont want to play it again. And voice overs arnt enough to change the basic mechanics of a game.
This is to all developers in the future, please make something NEW... We are tired of the same old bullshit...
Yeh me to but i spent 56 of my 74 hrs up watching the dancing holo girls in the canteina
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Thats still kill x amount.
^^^^
This
Tried: EQ2 - AC - EU - HZ - TR - MxO - TTO - WURM - SL - VG:SoH - PotBS - PS - AoC - WAR - DDO - SWTOR
Played: UO - EQ1 - AO - DAoC - NC - CoH/CoV - SWG - WoW - EVE - AA - LotRO - DFO - STO - FE - MO - RIFT
Playing: Skyrim
Following: The Repopulation
I want a Virtual World, not just a Game.
ITS TOO HARD! - Matt Firor (ZeniMax)
I'll have to agree, TOR is the best mmo I have ever played. I will retire my Eve accounts, rush through Skyrim and wait in joy for TOR. It adresses the single largest gripe I've had with all mmogs; From SWG to EQ2 and even AoC, they all failed to deliver the kind of immersion *I* want in a game, a strong immersive story delivered in an enhoyable manner. A text box just can't deliver it, I hate the text boxes filled with standard poor backstory for grinding XP and I've tried to like it many times.
SWG was the only SW mmo so I stuck by it, AoC tried to enhance the story but fell short, the graphics can only go so far, but the combat was the best I've yet encountered. Eve is like watching paint try and consist of gate rapes and/or slide show fleets no quality content what so ever except making your own content, I lasted a while in it due to beeing the only real space ship mmo.
I for one will not waste a second more on the current crop of mmos. Sure I'd wish there were more detailed textures and less hotbar combat, but so be it. TOR's the kind of fun I want in a mmom, despite it's flaws.
Is SWTOR a good game? Yea, mostly. However, strip away the voiced over cinematics and all you have left is just another MMO.
Having played the Beta this past weekend... I won't be playing SWTOR, and will be waiting for Secret World instead.
BioWare is fortunate that so many people are bored with WoW, and that there is "Star Wars" in the title. Otherwise, I don't really think this would be a successful MMO at all.
I do think that, at least initially, BioWare will have a hit on their hands. Will it have any longevity at all? Only time will tell.
On a side note, while watching a friend of mine play (who enjoyed Beta but is also not interested in playing SWTOR) I saw a few names that gave me a chuckle... Darthgiggles, Abbywan, Hawnsolo, Boobafett, and no less than 20 variations of either Revan or Malek. Yep, have fun with that "Star Wars immersion" some of you keep applauding.
Explain how its any different from the 90,000 Legolawls and Gimlis in Lotro? Or the 10,000 Captain Jack Sparrows or barbosas in PoTBS?
or the 15,000 Conan variations in Age of Conan? People who think they're clever usually arent... its going to be everywhere..
Dont even get me started on the names ive seen in Everquest1 and 2, WoW.. etc
No, it's not different at all, and really is to be completely expected these in MMOs these days.
I was trying to point out that people that scream about how "immersive" SWTOR is will likely end up being greatly disappointed.
Unoriginal names like that just make me point and laugh, and in a way help me determine right off the bat what sort of player is behind the character. If I walk up to Homersimpson the Jedi then it's a fair bet a certain type of person is behind the character. I've yet to meet an exception to that.
The sort that just wants to enjoy and doesn't take things seriously or uptight about whole immersion thing? but no gaming should be a serious business for everyone. I don't know how you can judge people on basis of names unless you got a chance to meet the real person.
Yeah but that is a very limited way to decide because MMORPGS are huge with many many interesting features than a boss fight. Aion boss fights also looked very cool and heavily advertised by Ncsoft. The actual game well turned to be completely different and boring for me.
this exactly if this game was call "Space Conflict" and made by some other company people would be crapping all over this game.
but because its star wars and bioware ... and has voiceovers, its EPIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You have a smart wife. I suggest looking up the history of Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon. It is basically like the King Artur of china, a very old story, with a lot of hidden philisophical meaning to it. Most of it wouldn't be understood by the western market, as Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism aren't part of our culture.
Notice that the GW2 boss fight is done without a group? Totally pugged, and no one is helping each other?