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What makes ganking newbs fun?

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  • bunnyhopperbunnyhopper LondonPosts: 2,751Member

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    Originally posted by bunnyhopper


    Originally posted by Ceridith


    Originally posted by PukeBucket

     

    It's happening on a wide scale, it's just not so noticeable these days.

    Back during Ultima Online, it was very noticeable. Prior to the addition of Trammel (non-PvP lands), the subscriberbase started to shrink, quickly. The majority of those quitting cited that they were fed up with being PKd all the time when they just wanted to go about their business in the game. Which was why Trammel was added, and it was by far a hit. The vast majority of the player base, literally in less than a day, shifted from the old FFA PvP lands, to the non-PvP lands the day they were released.

    The only reason why it was like this back then was that there were no other options in MMOs. Either you played UO and put up with FFA PvP, or you didn't play an MMO. These days, there's plenty of choice, and hell even most PvP ruleset servers are vastly toned down PvP compared to FFA PvP. So the driving away of new players does still happen, but it's mostly a repelling force keeping players from even trying said games, rather than it is direct occurances of people trying those games, getting ganked, then quitting -- though that does still happen.

    Just look at how "popular" the FFA PvP MMOs are... not very, and there's a good reason why.

    Citing crying from gankers in an event that happened years ago is looking pretty hard for it I would argue.

     

    Yes, there is a good reason why ffa pvp mmos these days are not very 'popular', low quality products with inane grinds and little to no working content.

     

    Sure full on ffa/looting is much less popular than other forms of pvp but if you think ffa pvp is the major issue with a game like Darkfall or Mortal Online then you really need to think again. One would assume that if you had to spend over9000 months to level up in WoW and/or you spent 99% of your time filling in bug reports to a totally inept developer that game would also have zero subs, or would it's lack of popularity be down to it's causal pvp in your mind?

    "Come and have a look at what you could have won."

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by bunnyhopper

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    Originally posted by bunnyhopper


    Originally posted by Ceridith


    Originally posted by PukeBucket
     




    It's happening on a wide scale, it's just not so noticeable these days.
    Back during Ultima Online, it was very noticeable. Prior to the addition of Trammel (non-PvP lands), the subscriberbase started to shrink, quickly. The majority of those quitting cited that they were fed up with being PKd all the time when they just wanted to go about their business in the game. Which was why Trammel was added, and it was by far a hit. The vast majority of the player base, literally in less than a day, shifted from the old FFA PvP lands, to the non-PvP lands the day they were released.
    The only reason why it was like this back then was that there were no other options in MMOs. Either you played UO and put up with FFA PvP, or you didn't play an MMO. These days, there's plenty of choice, and hell even most PvP ruleset servers are vastly toned down PvP compared to FFA PvP. So the driving away of new players does still happen, but it's mostly a repelling force keeping players from even trying said games, rather than it is direct occurances of people trying those games, getting ganked, then quitting -- though that does still happen.
    Just look at how "popular" the FFA PvP MMOs are... not very, and there's a good reason why.


    Citing crying from gankers in an event that happened years ago is looking pretty hard for it I would argue.
     
    Yes, there is a good reason why ffa pvp mmos these days are not very 'popular', low quality products with inane grinds and little to no working content.
     
    Sure full on ffa/looting is much less popular than other forms of pvp but if you think ffa pvp is the major issue with a game like Darkfall or Mortal Online then you really need to think again. One would assume that if you had to spend over9000 months to level up in WoW and/or you spent 99% of your time filling in bug reports to a totally inept developer that game would also have zero subs, or would it's lack of popularity be down to it's causal pvp in your mind?



    I've got to agree with bunnyhopper here. The problems with DF and MO are not the ffa pvp mechanics. Those games could have a LOT more subs than they do now.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • ScrogdogScrogdog Woburn, MAPosts: 380Member

    The type of game or server being played on has little relevence to the issue in my mind.

    Maintaining a sense of honer does not mean that you can't kill the enemy!  So then, it's a matter of style, right?

    So, let's say you are playing in a FFA open world faction model and you see a player that is somewhere that he should not be.

    What's your goal here?  Teach him a lesson?

    Great.

    Then flex in front of that person if you want lol and say; "you don't belong here.  You need another 10 to 15 levels before you have a chance of surviving.  You may go.  HOWEVER, I make this warning only once.  If I see you here again I will kill you swiftly and without dishoner because you have been warned".

    If that person is smart, he'll go away.  Now he's out of the zone just as if you'd killed him!

  • CeridithCeridith Toronto, ONPosts: 2,980Member

    Originally posted by lizardbones

     




    ...






    I've got to agree with bunnyhopper here. The problems with DF and MO are not the ffa pvp mechanics. Those games could have a LOT more subs than they do now.

     

    Speculation is all well and good, and trying to place blame on DF and MO's low subscriber numbers on bugginess is plausible, it still doesn't change that history has shown trends where FFA PvP is largely avoided like a plague by most gamers.

    Honestly, I highly doubt that even were DF and MO flawless with regards to bugs and polish and content that they would be significantly more popular than they currently are. FFA PvP in general is simply just an undesirable game mechanics for most gamers. And before you cite Eve as an example of otherwise, realize that the majority of players in Eve spend most of their time in high sec space to avoid the FFA PvP aspect of the game.

  • bunnyhopperbunnyhopper LondonPosts: 2,751Member

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    Originally posted by lizardbones

     




    ...






    I've got to agree with bunnyhopper here. The problems with DF and MO are not the ffa pvp mechanics. Those games could have a LOT more subs than they do now.

     

    Speculation is all well and good, and trying to place blame on DF and MO's low subscriber numbers on bugginess is plausible, it still doesn't change that history has shown trends where FFA PvP is largely avoided like a plague by most gamers.

    Honestly, I highly doubt that even were DF and MO flawless with regards to bugs and polish and content that they would be significantly more popular than they currently are. FFA PvP in general is simply just an undesirable game mechanics for most gamers. And before you cite Eve as an example of otherwise, realize that the majority of players in Eve spend most of their time in high sec space to avoid the FFA PvP aspect of the game.

    Nice speculation...

     

    And which quality, non bug ridden ffa mmos have shown how ffa is avoided like the plague? Darkfall, MO, Earthrise, you can't mean any of those as they are a mess. So are you just harking back to UO again? One would "speculate" that the market is ripe for a quality ffa product and whilst it would not gain anywhere near the number of subs a AAA casual game may (no one is arguing that though are they) it would still be popular.

     

    Oh and you don't avoid the ffa aspect in hi sec, you reduce your chances of being killed that is all.

     

    Nevermind, I'll leave you to the crusade.

    "Come and have a look at what you could have won."

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by bunnyhopper

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    Originally posted by lizardbones
     

    ...
    I've got to agree with bunnyhopper here. The problems with DF and MO are not the ffa pvp mechanics. Those games could have a LOT more subs than they do now.



    Speculation is all well and good, and trying to place blame on DF and MO's low subscriber numbers on bugginess is plausible, it still doesn't change that history has shown trends where FFA PvP is largely avoided like a plague by most gamers.
    Honestly, I highly doubt that even were DF and MO flawless with regards to bugs and polish and content that they would be significantly more popular than they currently are. FFA PvP in general is simply just an undesirable game mechanics for most gamers. And before you cite Eve as an example of otherwise, realize that the majority of players in Eve spend most of their time in high sec space to avoid the FFA PvP aspect of the game.


    Nice speculation...
     
    And which quality, non bug ridden ffa mmos have shown how ffa is avoided like the plague? Darkfall, MO, Earthrise, you can't mean any of those as they are a mess. So are you just harking back to UO again? One would "speculate" that the market is ripe for a quality ffa product and whilst it would not gain anywhere near the number of subs a AAA casual game may (no one is arguing that though are they) it would still be popular.
     
    Oh and you don't avoid the ffa aspect in hi sec, you reduce your chances of being killed that is all.
     
    Nevermind, I'll leave you to the crusade.



    You can add Earthrise to the list of games that would be doing a lot better if they weren't programmed by sadistic monkeys. If Darkfall didn't implement their limitless skill grind they way they did and if Mortal Online actually ran, they would have more players. Yes, that's speculation, but I'm willing to stand behind that speculation and I bet there are a bunch of people who would agree.

    It's also true that FFA PvP is not as popular as other types of mmorpg games. However, if Mortal Online ran as well as Call of Duty or Modern Warfare you could market it to that crowd and you'd get people playing the game.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • PukeBucketPukeBucket Beaverton, ORPosts: 867Member

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    Nothing.

    But taking a group of players and flanking a position with magic and arrows flying while they scramble into the shields and blades of the melee; that's priceless.

    It's worth every complaint a care bear cares to spill.

    What's truly priceless, is when the so called "hard core PvPers" whine and complain that no one wants to play with them after they've driven away all of the "carebears", aka the vast majority of gamers.

    image

    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo

    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.

    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 

    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.

    I used to play MMOs like you, but then I took an arrow to the knee.

  • QuesaQuesa Sacramento, CAPosts: 1,246Member

    I would certanly be ok with the ability to do so if it had consequences which affected that higher players end game.  Nobody thinks games should mirror every day life, it's part of the reason we play games - to escape to another reality.  

    With that being said, there needs to be some type of dynamic stopgap which will force the accumulation of a "bad rap" to said person who continuously ganks lowbies.  I would presume some type of loyalty loss or something along those lines.  Your main faction could get pissed off enough to stop allowing you to enter the city without, say, bribing the guards and maybe lose acess to "teleportation devices" or some such.

    I think you might find that if there were actual consequences to actions in games (whether good or bad) people would use judement before proceeding rather than using the standard internet-anonymous conscience.

  • QuesaQuesa Sacramento, CAPosts: 1,246Member

    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    Originally posted by Ceridith


    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    Nothing.

    But taking a group of players and flanking a position with magic and arrows flying while they scramble into the shields and blades of the melee; that's priceless.

    It's worth every complaint a care bear cares to spill.

    What's truly priceless, is when the so called "hard core PvPers" whine and complain that no one wants to play with them after they've driven away all of the "carebears", aka the vast majority of gamers.

    image

    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo

    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.

    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 

    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.

    Are you guys even talking about the same context?


  • Originally posted by Quesa

    I would certanly be ok with the ability to do so if it had consequences which affected that higher players end game.  Nobody thinks games should mirror every day life, it's part of the reason we play games - to escape to another reality.  

    With that being said, there needs to be some type of dynamic stopgap which will force the accumulation of a "bad rap" to said person who continuously ganks lowbies.  I would presume some type of loyalty loss or something along those lines.  Your main faction could get pissed off enough to stop allowing you to enter the city without, say, bribing the guards and maybe lose acess to "teleportation devices" or some such.

    I think you might find that if there were actual consequences to actions in games (whether good or bad) people would use judement before proceeding rather than using the standard internet-anonymous conscience.

    I really like your post, Quesa, and agree w/you entirely. I've been thinking of some potential consequences, for ganking, myself. They may work and offer a more level playing field, or they might fail miserably.

    Let's say we're playing Douchebag Empire Kingdoms Online. I'm a level 85 Douchebag Rogue and you're a level 5 Knight of the Entry Level. As it stands, my rogue has 60,000 physical attack power, 40,000 physical defense, and another 40,000 magic defense power. Your knight has a physical attack power of 200, a physical defense of 400, and a magic defense of 400. So...I'm stealthing into the starter zone, lookin' for some fresh noob meat to pwn. I see you, in the middle of doing your daily quests and think, "Lol, ima pwn this fail noob. Lol, noobs are so fail." So...I sneak up, right behind you, and BAM! Backstab you for 60k damage, although you only had 1k hp. "Lol, you just got PWNED, noob! /teabag".

    So...I already know where you're gonna respawn at, so I cast "haste/swiftness/run faster" or what the hell ever. I make it there just as you're about to step out of the "safety ring" and BAM! I PK'ed you again...but something is different this time. Last time, I hit you for a full 60k of damage, but this time...I hit you for 30,100 damage. FTW?!? I open up my character sheet and notice that my physical attack power HAS INDEED been dropped to just 30,100, my pdef and mdef are now just 20,200 each. Again...FTW?!? This is somehow YOUR fault, so ima just PK you again. HA! 1-shotted you again, but this time...only 10,300 damage?!?!? What's happening to me?!?!?

    Every time I PK'ed you...my own stats for physical attack, magical attack, physical defense, and magical defense were added to yours, then DIVIDED BY TWO by the server. So...I can still gank lowbies for awhile, but eventually, I'm going to be a level 85 with the stats of a level 15 (or less), pretty soon. How can I raise my stats again? Two ways. I can defeat (not just fight) people with higher stats than me, or...I can wait for the server cooldown/reset that will put me back to normal, but it'll take two to four weeks (I haven't decided yet). Basically, I'd like the penalty to be cumulative and take its toll, whether through time (not playing) or forcing gankers to pick fights with people who can actually defend themselves. I'd thought about dropping their stats like this and then having the servers kick them back into a high-level zone, though with their "balls" cut off. On the flip side of this, if I defeat someone more powerful than me, I get a substantial buff to my stats for x-amount of time. Again...this whole thing could curb a lot of the crap, or it may not work at all. Who knows.


  • Originally posted by PukeBucket

    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo

    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.

    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 

    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.

    What exactly are you smoking?  The biggest mmo by FAR is clearly a PVE-focused game (WOW).  Name one PVP-focused game that has more than 1% of the market.

     

    Don't get me wrong.  I like PVP in the right forms.  I'm just pointing out that your statement is really off the mark.

  • SpandexDroidSpandexDroid Towson, MDPosts: 277Member

    One shot killz FTW. I admit I did it a couple of times for the lulz, I used to go to the auction house in Stormwind and kill the NPCs and maybe 2 or 3 players if I had the time before the guards or players sent me back to the nearest graveyard. The challenge was to stay alive as much time as possible :D

     

    edit: for the Horde!

  • ruonimruonim DGPosts: 251Member

    Originally posted by zaxxon23

    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo

    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.

    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 

    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.

    What exactly are you smoking?  The biggest mmo by FAR is clearly a PVE-focused game (WOW).  Name one PVP-focused game that has more than 1% of the market.

     

    Don't get me wrong.  I like PVP in the right forms.  I'm just pointing out that your statement is really off the mark.

    Eve? Even matket is pvp there.

  • Nerf09Nerf09 Phoenix, AZPosts: 2,953Member

    Originally posted by robert4818

    SWTOR announced that you would not be able to make your way to the opponents starting world and gank starting players.  It did not say that they removed PVP, that it would only be instanced PVP, or that once someone left the starter planets (around lvl 20 or so) that you couldn't attack them.  ONLY that you you couldn't go and gank brand new toons.

    Nerd rage followed from the PK community.

    My question is WHY?

    Why is the ability to kill brand new players so integral to the playstyle?  Why does the temporary ability to avoid ganking cause so much hate and discontent?

    SWTOR has a PK community?

  • PukeBucketPukeBucket Beaverton, ORPosts: 867Member

    Originally posted by zaxxon23

    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo

    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.

    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 

    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.

    What exactly are you smoking?  The biggest mmo by FAR is clearly a PVE-focused game (WOW).  Name one PVP-focused game that has more than 1% of the market.

     

    Don't get me wrong.  I like PVP in the right forms.  I'm just pointing out that your statement is really off the mark.

    Biggest increase of player base post launch came with xp in pvp and holding arena tournies. Each expansion since then introduced a larger portion of open world pvp involvement.

    What are you denying?

    I used to play MMOs like you, but then I took an arrow to the knee.

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    Originally posted by zaxxon23

    Originally posted by PukeBucket
    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo
    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.
    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 
    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.
    What exactly are you smoking?  The biggest mmo by FAR is clearly a PVE-focused game (WOW).  Name one PVP-focused game that has more than 1% of the market.
     
    Don't get me wrong.  I like PVP in the right forms.  I'm just pointing out that your statement is really off the mark.


    Biggest increase of player base post launch came with xp in pvp and holding arena tournies. Each expansion since then introduced a larger portion of open world pvp involvement.
    What are you denying?



    It's kind of pointless to argue about which type of content pulls in the most people. The games with the biggest draw combine PvE content and PvP content. Games that focus on either one are going to pull in fewer people. This is why 'ganking newbies' is an issue. You have PvE people who end up in PvP content whether they want it or not.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • PukeBucketPukeBucket Beaverton, ORPosts: 867Member

    Originally posted by lizardbones

     




    Originally posted by PukeBucket





    Originally posted by zaxxon23






    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo

    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.

    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 

    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.






    What exactly are you smoking?  The biggest mmo by FAR is clearly a PVE-focused game (WOW).  Name one PVP-focused game that has more than 1% of the market.

     

    Don't get me wrong.  I like PVP in the right forms.  I'm just pointing out that your statement is really off the mark.






    Biggest increase of player base post launch came with xp in pvp and holding arena tournies. Each expansion since then introduced a larger portion of open world pvp involvement.

    What are you denying?








    It's kind of pointless to argue about which type of content pulls in the most people. The games with the biggest draw combine PvE content and PvP content. Games that focus on either one are going to pull in fewer people. This is why 'ganking newbies' is an issue. You have PvE people who end up in PvP content whether they want it or not.

     

    That's probably true, but it's hard to deny the "coincidence" and the further progress of "something tacked on".

    If whiner carebear propaganda runs too rampant it's 10x worse than in-game ganking. Because only good sense gets murdered.

    I used to play MMOs like you, but then I took an arrow to the knee.

  • bunnyhopperbunnyhopper LondonPosts: 2,751Member

    Originally posted by Nerf09

    Originally posted by robert4818

    SWTOR announced that you would not be able to make your way to the opponents starting world and gank starting players.  It did not say that they removed PVP, that it would only be instanced PVP, or that once someone left the starter planets (around lvl 20 or so) that you couldn't attack them.  ONLY that you you couldn't go and gank brand new toons.

    Nerd rage followed from the PK community.

    My question is WHY?

    Why is the ability to kill brand new players so integral to the playstyle?  Why does the temporary ability to avoid ganking cause so much hate and discontent?

    SWTOR has a PK community?

    Seems somewhat odd to me as well.

    "Come and have a look at what you could have won."

  • CeridithCeridith Toronto, ONPosts: 2,980Member

    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    Originally posted by Ceridith


    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    Nothing.

    But taking a group of players and flanking a position with magic and arrows flying while they scramble into the shields and blades of the melee; that's priceless.

    It's worth every complaint a care bear cares to spill.

    What's truly priceless, is when the so called "hard core PvPers" whine and complain that no one wants to play with them after they've driven away all of the "carebears", aka the vast majority of gamers.

    image

    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo

    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.

    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 

    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.

    Where did I say that PvP wasn't a popular feature? I didn't.

    I did however, say that FFA PvP isn't popular, because it's not. The most popular PvP in gaming is the kind that you can instantly jump in and out of, that's contained, and has zero consequence if you lose. So yeah, it doesn't matter so much if you get "ganked", because it doesn't really matter since there's no real consequence and you can easily remove yourself from the situation.

    And actually the most popular MMOs are PvE centric with a PvP sideshow. Arenas in WoW are a sideshow, PvE is the main attraction.

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    Originally posted by lizardbones

    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    Originally posted by zaxxon23

    Originally posted by PukeBucket
    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo
    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.
    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 
    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.

    What exactly are you smoking?  The biggest mmo by FAR is clearly a PVE-focused game (WOW).  Name one PVP-focused game that has more than 1% of the market.
     
    Don't get me wrong.  I like PVP in the right forms.  I'm just pointing out that your statement is really off the mark.




    Biggest increase of player base post launch came with xp in pvp and holding arena tournies. Each expansion since then introduced a larger portion of open world pvp involvement.
    What are you denying?




    It's kind of pointless to argue about which type of content pulls in the most people. The games with the biggest draw combine PvE content and PvP content. Games that focus on either one are going to pull in fewer people. This is why 'ganking newbies' is an issue. You have PvE people who end up in PvP content whether they want it or not.
     


    That's probably true, but it's hard to deny the "coincidence" and the further progress of "something tacked on".
    If whiner carebear propaganda runs too rampant it's 10x worse than in-game ganking. Because only good sense gets murdered.



    I'm not sure where you're going with that. In games like Rift, the PvP ends up just as they intended for it to end up. It's not a primary focus of the game and never was. I imagine it's the same with SW:ToR. The PvP in that game is going to be as intended. Instanced battleground style PvP with some open PvP areas. On PvP servers, the open world pvp will be largely pointless in the larger context of the game. The PvP isn't an afterthought, it's just not the main focus of the game. People shouldn't expect it to be; they'll only be disappointed.

    I'll be honest, I've seen a LOT more whining from PvP players about the 'sorry state of PvP' than I have whining from PvE players getting ganked. For what it's worth, PvE players whine a LOT more about the 'sorry state of PvE' than they whine about getting ganked too.

    Low level/new players getting killed just isn't that big a deal in most games. On the 'WoW'* side you just can't do it. On the Eve side, you should realize it's probably going to happen, or find a safe zone if they exist.

    Killing a low level/new player in any game is pretty much a d-bag move and hurts the game a lot more than it hurts the new player.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • WSIMikeWSIMike Catskill, NYPosts: 5,564Member

    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    Originally posted by zaxxon23


    Originally posted by PukeBucket

    A smiley? Should've ended with /nohomo

    Regardless, top PC games are all player vs player games. All MMOs that make it tout it as a major feature.

    PvE only MMOs fizzle out pretty quick. 

    So, you're wrong. No smiley needed.

    What exactly are you smoking?  The biggest mmo by FAR is clearly a PVE-focused game (WOW).  Name one PVP-focused game that has more than 1% of the market.

     

    Don't get me wrong.  I like PVP in the right forms.  I'm just pointing out that your statement is really off the mark.

    Biggest increase of player base post launch came with xp in pvp and holding arena tournies. Each expansion since then introduced a larger portion of open world pvp involvement.

    What are you denying?

    Do you mean open world PvP involvement in terms of the PvP specific zones in WoW, like Wintergrasp?

    If you do, then that's not exactly "world PvP". That's "a section of the world sectioned off and dedicated to PvP". It would be just like saying LoTRO has world PvP because the Ettenmoors is a PvP specific zone.

    True world PvP is in a MMO like Lineage 2, Darkfall, etc.. where players can attack or be attacked just about anywhere.

    WoW is not a true open world PvP MMO. Not by a long shot.

    "If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road,
    and the cash shop selling asphalt..."
    - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops

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  • mrxennonmrxennon JarrowPosts: 209Member

    Ganking is nothing short of harrassment, no excuse for it  full stop.  I'v never ganked nor been ganked, I dont see how a lvl 60, 70, 80 or whatever,  going to a low level area and start killing lvl 5's 10's etc is fun, its no more fun than killing low level npc's, all your doing is stopping new players or new characters from learning or achieving any advancement into the game,  those players will just give up and find something else.   I believe ganking had a negative effect on Darkfall where players got together and started ganking low levels where it had that much negative effect the devs had to step in to stop it.  Unfortunately some gamers need to grow up.  a lot.

  • IAmMMOIAmMMO LondonPosts: 1,332Member Uncommon

    People quickly forget that you have established online grief guilds whose only aim to to ruin the experience of players enough for it to have a knock on effect to sub numbers, using any means from hacks to exploits as well. No griefing of newbies is needed, legit PK will just have to move to the middle game and up to do their thing. Such is the reality. Even DF caved to having newbie protection for a time as the realization of grief guilds able to affect new player subs set in. Some people cater to their more primitive tribal instinct, and these tribes are just out right hostile in temperament, genetics I guess. 

  • kitaradkitarad RomePosts: 1,739Member Uncommon

    It makes little sense to me though why they sabotage their own prey base. Why do they scare away the new players thereby making it less likely for them to stay and provide them with targets. 

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  • ZylaxxZylaxx Erlanger, KYPosts: 2,574Member

    Nothing.  Only idiots gank newbs.  It also ruins the spirit of the atmosphere of a game and turns players off. 

    Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online

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