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TOR is NGE2 for SWG. and Titan is WOW2 for Lucas Arts

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  • NergleNergle Okemos, MIPosts: 253Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by heerobya

    Originally posted by bigsmiff


    Originally posted by Swanea

    Sandboxes are never casual.  That's plain and simple.  They skimp on content and raise the grind to a level that is unheard if western mmos.  Basically, you grind an asian themepark sort of grind.

    The grind in a sandbox MMO is no worse than any themepark that I have played. And...the immersion in a sandbox beats a themepark anyday.

     There has only been one "sandbox" MMO to EVER get the "grind" aspect correct - that was UO.

    Why?

    They allowed macro-ing for Pete's sake, you could 3-4x GM overnight while you slept.

    They created a game where there was no "leveling curve" you just.. played... and did stuff... it was the only "true" sandbox experience the MMO genre has ever seen.

    Now? All the sandbox games have levels and skill grinding and money grinding and faction/reputation grinding etc. etc. and as such are terribly linear grind fests. EvE, SWG, FFXI, EQ, AA, FE, DF, etc. most/all even have huge gear grinds and crafting grinds.

    Only way to do a true sandbox MMO is to remove the RPG "leveling up your toon" aspects from it - which includes gear AND skills/levels.

     I would have to say Second life is a sand box MMORPG (some times too much of one) SWG was a true sand box in the beginning or as close to it as can be ( there were no levels pre CU and NGE).

     

    I don't know, if they pull it off where TOR is 25% of  what Star Wars galaxies was in aspect of worlds immersion, I will be a happy camper (we will see though).

    I'm hoping they stick to what they are putting out as their biggest marketing strategy "player choices" that will really be innovative (but SWG had those to "Imperial, Rebel or straight up neutral;P").

  • superniceguysuperniceguy AnchorheadPosts: 2,278Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Nobadeeftw

    I'm really glad they are shutting down SWG.  You don't see everyone whining about Tabula Rasa lately do you?  My point exactly.

    Nobody really cared for Tabula Rasa that is is why. SWG was unique, and more people are playing SWG now today than there was tabula rasa. SWG was just ruined by bad decisions (the NGE being the biggest), but with the right decisions, it could have been truly awesome.

    The whining will continue, and you will see threads asking to bring in stuff from SWG including things like the Ewok Love Festival into SWTOR

    If SWG stayed active SWG players would still be able to enjoy it for what it is, and then enjoy SWTOR for it is. If LA wants to shut down SWG and wants us to play SWTOR then it had better have the stuff from SWG in it.

    I do not give a crap about SWTOR as have not invested any time into it yet, and if (hypothetical sitaution) EA/LA/Bioware went bankrupt and had no money left to operate SWTOR, and it got canned, then I would not be so disappointed as compared to SWG shutting down.

    However, If SWTOR is truly awesome and makes SWG look crap then would have moved to SWTOR and not cared that SWG gets shut down, and then there would be no whining.

    But as they are pulling SWG before giving SWG a chance to run side by side with SWTOR, it now starts SWTOR off with a bitter taste in my mouth, and my excitement for SWTOR has been shot to hell.

    If SWTOR fails, then it will not last as long as SWG did. EA are quite known to shutting down servers, they shut down the Japanese servers in SWG, and shut down servers for other PC and console games, a lot more easier than SOE does. Also rumour has it that EA are behind SWGs closure

  • ericlatrelleericlatrelle Sullivan BarracksPosts: 176Member

    Originally posted by ktanner3

    Originally posted by wrekognize

    LA is giving all SWG players the middle finger and saying, play TOR if you want a Star Wars MMO. In turn, we are losing one of the last standing sandbox games. And yes SWG is still a sandbox game as it is now.

     

    Sorry, but you lost all credibility with that statement. SWG ceased being a sandbox the moment the NGE hit. Unless of course you think world of warcraft is a sandbox because the NGE is nothing more than a poor attempt at copying WOW. You should be happy that it lasted as long as it did because if it hadn't have been named Star Wars it would have closed down a LONG time ago. Many people only stuck around because of the fact it was Star Wars and they would have all left as soon as TOR came out anyways. You might not have, but SOE and LA didn't think that a few thousand players was enough to justify the expense. The only people that were giving a middle finger was the thousands of players who left after SOE screwed them with the NGE. The rest were those that left the game later because it was just so bad. If you really care so much about the game, you should have been fighting to get players to actually play it. 

    And by the way, Star Wars Clone Adventures is still online, so your little conspiracy theory just fails completely. 

     TOR could have been innovative and made a stand in the MMO industry.  Instead, they are taking the easy "safe" route.  It will be RTS games and Chess for me in this day and age of MMOs.  Enjoy your storybook grind in the meantime..

    Don't worry, I will be. I'd rather play an interesting story in the Star Wars universe than play house in it. Enjoy your Chess. 

    Q to the F to the motherfreaking E!!!

  • ErstokErstok LOL wut, NYPosts: 523Member

    ToR will be essentially what SOE tried pumping out when they did NGE years ago. This is now chance to see whether or not NGE can actually stand on it's own two feet, which it should of been in the first place. It's own seperate game/version of SWG instead of completely alienating it's already healthy customer base. It's equivalent to 32x for Genesis. Should of been it's own game system instead of feeding off another game system.

    Wait till game comes out and more people have chance to test and relay their experiences with the game. Senselessly complaining about something that most people have yet to truly play is like calling a restaurant you've never eaten at bad.

    ToR is not nore even promised to be SWG2, deal with it. Bioware is an always will be a major RPG developer and it's no surprise they are trying to incorporate that into one of their pieces of work.

    image
    When did you start playing "old school" MMO's. World Of Warcraft?

  • superniceguysuperniceguy AnchorheadPosts: 2,278Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by ktanner3

    And by the way, Star Wars Clone Adventures is still online, so your little conspiracy theory just fails completely. 

    The reason Star Wars Clone Wars Adventures is still online is because they do not see it as a MMO, and poses no threat. It is just a collection of mini games

  • knapuknapu GifhornPosts: 131Member

    nice full of crap topic gj raging kiddys next time u start a topic  get some info before that .

    License with LA had signed for 8 years or so dont know how old is swg , renewing this licens would cost to much same as f2po model.S

    Sony wrote a freaking post with excuse and yet i see a dumb kiddo post with tons of silly answers omg ...

    Next thing is TOR is from Bioware published by EA and with license from LA.

    I dont freaking understand how u people write that LA made the game they just helping with the story go get some info firswt morons .

    I broke my arm 3 days ago, butafter seeing crap like this i had to put my 3 words in it omg .

    Stop tslking crap if u got no idea and just wait to see thx and bye

    I am the punishment of God...
    If you had not committed great sins,
    God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you
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  • hipiaphipiap Chicago, ILPosts: 439Member

    Originally posted by Xondar123

    A) Lucas Arts isn't shutting down SWG, SOE is. B) How can TOR be NGE2 if it is an entirely different game from SWG?

    Ho hum, more "I wanted SWG2!" complaints.

    It was confirmed by an LA rep...on the LucasArts forums...that the Fired former Head of the LA MMO department didn't want SW:G and TOR to compete and was able to get a 'No Compete Clause" added to the TOR contract between LA and EA (owners of Bioware).

    LA bought out the remainder of the SW:G contract so that it would not be around after the End of this year....the Rumor I'm hearing from CS at SOE is that LA originally wanted SW:G shut down by November 1st...but SOE pushed for New Years Eve and was able to secure the 15th of December.

    Comments from Smedley point out that the SW:G population was Stable and had been for some time.

    MMO History: 2528 days in SW:G
    image

  • ktanner3ktanner3 lakeland, FLPosts: 4,074Member Common

    Originally posted by superniceguy

    Originally posted by ktanner3



    And by the way, Star Wars Clone Adventures is still online, so your little conspiracy theory just fails completely. 

    The reason Star Wars Clone Wars Adventures is still online is because they do not see it as a MMO, and poses no threat. It is just a collection of mini games

    And a game like SWG that very few played was? 

    Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

  • ObeeObee Somewhere, MIPosts: 1,550Member

    Originally posted by hipiap

    Originally posted by Xondar123

    A) Lucas Arts isn't shutting down SWG, SOE is. B) How can TOR be NGE2 if it is an entirely different game from SWG?

    Ho hum, more "I wanted SWG2!" complaints.

    It was confirmed by an LA rep...on the LucasArts forums...that the Fired former Head of the LA MMO department didn't want SW:G and TOR to compete and was able to get a 'No Compete Clause" added to the TOR contract between LA and EA (owners of Bioware).

    LA bought out the remainder of the SW:G contract so that it would not be around after the End of this year....the Rumor I'm hearing from CS at SOE is that LA originally wanted SW:G shut down by November 1st...but SOE pushed for New Years Eve and was able to secure the 15th of December.

    Comments from Smedley point out that the SW:G population was Stable and had been for some time.

    I find a LucasArts rep making such a post on the LucasArts forum to be highly unlikely, give no one from LucasArts reads or posts to the LucasArts forums.  I don't suppose you have a link to the post, do you?

    As for the Smed's statement, he has also said that he could have renegotiated with LucasArts to continue running SWG, but choose no to.  Hell, given the game's history, shutting it down was the first good decision the folks at SOE have made since the game went live.

     

  • TardcoreTardcore MinskPosts: 2,325Member

    Originally posted by Obee

    Originally posted by hipiap


    Originally posted by Xondar123

    A) Lucas Arts isn't shutting down SWG, SOE is. B) How can TOR be NGE2 if it is an entirely different game from SWG?

    Ho hum, more "I wanted SWG2!" complaints.

    It was confirmed by an LA rep...on the LucasArts forums...that the Fired former Head of the LA MMO department didn't want SW:G and TOR to compete and was able to get a 'No Compete Clause" added to the TOR contract between LA and EA (owners of Bioware).

    LA bought out the remainder of the SW:G contract so that it would not be around after the End of this year....the Rumor I'm hearing from CS at SOE is that LA originally wanted SW:G shut down by November 1st...but SOE pushed for New Years Eve and was able to secure the 15th of December.

    Comments from Smedley point out that the SW:G population was Stable and had been for some time.

    I find a LucasArts rep making such a post on the LucasArts forum to be highly unlikely, give no one from LucasArts reads or posts to the LucasArts forums.  I don't suppose you have a link to the post, do you?

    As for the Smed's statement, he has also said that he could have renegotiated with LucasArts to continue running SWG, but choose no to.  Hell, given the game's history, shutting it down was the first good decision the folks at SOE have made since the game went live.

     

    There are also a few interviews from the day of the SWG shut down announcement where Smed states he hopes SWTOR does well and is looking forward to playing it. Those don't sound like the words of a man who feels LA killed his favorite puppy.

    image

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  • ZinzanZinzan NorthPosts: 1,351Member

    Originally posted by Tardcore

    Originally posted by Obee

    Originally posted by hipiap

    Originally posted by Xondar123

    A) Lucas Arts isn't shutting down SWG, SOE is. B) How can TOR be NGE2 if it is an entirely different game from SWG?

    Ho hum, more "I wanted SWG2!" complaints.

    It was confirmed by an LA rep...on the LucasArts forums...that the Fired former Head of the LA MMO department didn't want SW:G and TOR to compete and was able to get a 'No Compete Clause" added to the TOR contract between LA and EA (owners of Bioware).

    LA bought out the remainder of the SW:G contract so that it would not be around after the End of this year....the Rumor I'm hearing from CS at SOE is that LA originally wanted SW:G shut down by November 1st...but SOE pushed for New Years Eve and was able to secure the 15th of December.

    Comments from Smedley point out that the SW:G population was Stable and had been for some time.

    I find a LucasArts rep making such a post on the LucasArts forum to be highly unlikely, give no one from LucasArts reads or posts to the LucasArts forums.  I don't suppose you have a link to the post, do you?

    As for the Smed's statement, he has also said that he could have renegotiated with LucasArts to continue running SWG, but choose no to.  Hell, given the game's history, shutting it down was the first good decision the folks at SOE have made since the game went live.

     

    There are also a few interviews from the day of the SWG shut down announcement where Smed states he hopes SWTOR does well and is looking forward to playing it. Those don't sound like the words of a man who feels LA killed his favorite puppy.

     He's not an idiot, posting dumb comments on a forum when your on a huge salary in an extremly fickle industry is career suicide. Very few people are that stupid, not these days.

    It's business, wish them well and keep your opinions to yourself.

    Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy :)

  • fionanshrekfionanshrek madison, WIPosts: 104Member

    Originally posted by Zinzan

    Originally posted by Tardcore

    Originally posted by Obee

    Originally posted by hipiap

    Originally posted by Xondar123

    A) Lucas Arts isn't shutting down SWG, SOE is. B) How can TOR be NGE2 if it is an entirely different game from SWG?

    Ho hum, more "I wanted SWG2!" complaints.

    It was confirmed by an LA rep...on the LucasArts forums...that the Fired former Head of the LA MMO department didn't want SW:G and TOR to compete and was able to get a 'No Compete Clause" added to the TOR contract between LA and EA (owners of Bioware).

    LA bought out the remainder of the SW:G contract so that it would not be around after the End of this year....the Rumor I'm hearing from CS at SOE is that LA originally wanted SW:G shut down by November 1st...but SOE pushed for New Years Eve and was able to secure the 15th of December.

    Comments from Smedley point out that the SW:G population was Stable and had been for some time.

    I find a LucasArts rep making such a post on the LucasArts forum to be highly unlikely, give no one from LucasArts reads or posts to the LucasArts forums.  I don't suppose you have a link to the post, do you?

    As for the Smed's statement, he has also said that he could have renegotiated with LucasArts to continue running SWG, but choose no to.  Hell, given the game's history, shutting it down was the first good decision the folks at SOE have made since the game went live.

     

    There are also a few interviews from the day of the SWG shut down announcement where Smed states he hopes SWTOR does well and is looking forward to playing it. Those don't sound like the words of a man who feels LA killed his favorite puppy.

     He's not an idiot, posting dumb comments on a forum when your on a huge salary in an extremly fickle industry is career suicide. Very few people are that stupid, not these days.

    It's business, wish them well and keep your opinions to yourself.

     So basically you are saying rgardless of what he said with his own mouth we should believe because someone on these forums said he was mad that he is in fact angry about it?????

    Let's not forget that the salary he is on isn't Lucas Arts either.  I guess I could see him not throwing them under the bus but going out of his way to say nice things??

  • RevivialRevivial Clawson, MIPosts: 194Member

    Originally posted by Robokapp

    Originally posted by WhySoShort


    Originally posted by Dalgor

    Regardless of what I think of the rest of the post, I think its funny that you think Blizzard is ever going to release a sandbox game.

    image Because it's totally reasonable to assume that because we know nothing about Titan, it will be exactly what we want it to be. 

     the makers of WoW said Titan will be a 'casual mmo'. the maers of WoW...said it will be a ...casual MMO.

     

    it's not a sandbox it's going to be the biggest hand-holding, facebook-linking thing you've ever seen.

     

    of course facebook will probably fade away like myspace by then so that'll be unfortunate but...yeah. dont expect a blizzard sandbox. expect a casul/social "pvp / pve optional" type of game.

    I'm reading lots of stuff about titan, but the only quote i could find that says its casual was from an Analyst that is not a part of the Blizzard Development team.

    So, the makers of WoW did not say it is, will be, or will not be a casual MMO, and i challenge you to find a credible resource that says otherwise.

    For now we can dream i guess. 

    Here is a quote i found that seems to indicate its casual.  I say that cause it refers to the game as being a ball to play, and that is not the way most describe sandboxes.

    "Turning back to Titan, Sams revealed the yet-to-be-officially-named project was already in playable form, and early indications have Blizzard excited for its future prospects, noting, “It is a total ball to play. We think that the reach of that product is greater than anything that we've done before. We're very excited about that. I believe that it's the type of game that will have a very long life, much like World of Warcraft has.""

     

    http://www.gamesradar.com/pc/world-of-warcraft-wrath-of-the-lich-king/news/blizzard-titan-mmo-will-eclipse-world-of-warcraft/a-201103091264278077/g-20070803141059985087/c-1#10374492282520439452329775876670628

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  • gt4980bgt4980b Doraville, GAPosts: 112Member

    Originally posted by Tardcore

    Originally posted by Obee


    Originally posted by hipiap


    Originally posted by Xondar123

    A) Lucas Arts isn't shutting down SWG, SOE is. B) How can TOR be NGE2 if it is an entirely different game from SWG?

    Ho hum, more "I wanted SWG2!" complaints.

    It was confirmed by an LA rep...on the LucasArts forums...that the Fired former Head of the LA MMO department didn't want SW:G and TOR to compete and was able to get a 'No Compete Clause" added to the TOR contract between LA and EA (owners of Bioware).

    LA bought out the remainder of the SW:G contract so that it would not be around after the End of this year....the Rumor I'm hearing from CS at SOE is that LA originally wanted SW:G shut down by November 1st...but SOE pushed for New Years Eve and was able to secure the 15th of December.

    Comments from Smedley point out that the SW:G population was Stable and had been for some time.

    I find a LucasArts rep making such a post on the LucasArts forum to be highly unlikely, give no one from LucasArts reads or posts to the LucasArts forums.  I don't suppose you have a link to the post, do you?

    As for the Smed's statement, he has also said that he could have renegotiated with LucasArts to continue running SWG, but choose no to.  Hell, given the game's history, shutting it down was the first good decision the folks at SOE have made since the game went live.

     

    There are also a few interviews from the day of the SWG shut down announcement where Smed states he hopes SWTOR does well and is looking forward to playing it. Those don't sound like the words of a man who feels LA killed his favorite puppy.

    Well, SOE has clone wars which turned from an experiment to a oil well.  So...Smed is not going to rock that boat even if George Lucas himself cut his arm off with a lightsaber.

  • TeknoBugTeknoBug Calgary, ABPosts: 2,156Member

    Jeff Freeman and Julio Torres were mostly responsible for the NGE, and they were both for SOE, not LA.

    image
    image

  • CasualMakerCasualMaker Somerset, NJPosts: 870Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by sookster54

    Jeff Freeman and Julio Torres were mostly responsible for the NGE, and they were both for SOE, not LA.

    You're half right: Julio Torres was LucasArts' producer for SWG, Freeman was a SOE dev.

  • blueshadowblueshadow svPosts: 146Member

    Interesting viewpoints, and probably some truth in it.. but I sincerely doubt that Titan is a sandbox game. No matter how much some of us MMORPG veterans love sandbox, that kind of game seems dead.

    No developers that aims for high numbers of subscripotions seems to settle for sandbox as that kind of game is very attractive for a minority of gamers.

    Blizzard has always done things simple and one of their mantras are: is this fun? when they are making games.. and sandbox is not the traditional fun in its pure form, more a "job like" type of thing.. so I highly doubt we will ever see a sandbox from Blizzard.

    An awesome game, a titan yes.. but a sandbox.. I do not belive it.

     

  • kobie173kobie173 Rochester, NYPosts: 2,075Member

    Originally posted by sookster54

    Jeff Freeman and Julio Torres were mostly responsible for the NGE, and they were both for SOE, not LA.

    Wrong. Torres was LA.

    So I started to walk into the water. I won't lie to you boys...I was terrified. But I pressed on, and as I made my way past the breakers, a strange calm came over me. I don't know if it was divine intervention or the kinship of all living things, but I tell you, Jerry, at that moment ... I was a marine biologist.

  • Markn1Markn1 St. Paul, MNPosts: 40Member

    Just like pvp sandbox is a niche it doesnt attract the sub numbers a AAA title wants or needs to make money and believe me all they care about is making money blizzard or LA or SOE its all about money.

     

    Oh and wth has blizzard ever done that was new and ratical ?  WOW was hardly new nothing in the game is new or unique.

  • ZolgarZolgar Glouster, OHPosts: 533Member

    Originally posted by twodayslate

    Another post crying about TOR not being SWG2?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWb3cxA4g_U

    Wow... I don't... I don't even know what to say to that. I can understand being bummed out about a game you really enjoy being closed down, but that girl is all 6's and 7's.

    0118 999 881 999 119 725... 3

  • ZolgarZolgar Glouster, OHPosts: 533Member

    Originally posted by Scambug

    Originally posted by wrekognize

    LA is giving all SWG players the middle finger and saying, play TOR if you want a Star Wars MMO. In turn, we are losing one of the last standing sandbox games. And yes SWG is still a sandbox game as it is now.  Much more so than 98% of the games out there.  There is no other reason why LA is shutting down SWG than to say, play TOR or else.  The sub numbers of SWG were far greater than many other MMOs i've tried.  Three highly active servers, a handful of medium servers and the rest low.  and Lucas Arts will get theirs. Quote me on this.  Blizzard will come out with a polished sandbox game that will set a new standard.  The project is called Titan (google it).  And Titan will do to TOR what WOW did to SWG.  In the end, Blizzard will have owned Lucas Arts twice.  First by using a themepark game (WOW) to destroy the sandbox (SWG), then by using a sandbox game (Titan) to destroy the themepark (TOR).  At least I will have a freaking game to play this time around.  TOR could have been innovative and made a stand in the MMO industry.  Instead, they are taking the easy "safe" route.  It will be RTS games and Chess for me in this day and age of MMOs.  Enjoy your storybook grind in the meantime..

    I think it's time to learn Chinese and Korean...

    Only if we get to do this stuff here.

    0118 999 881 999 119 725... 3

  • jerlot65jerlot65 Lake Mary, FLPosts: 788Member

    Originally posted by gotha

    Originally posted by kasta

    Oh, I think people are overestimating Blizzard's originality.  Warcraft I, II, III.  Starcraft I, II.  Diablo I, II, III.  Ummm, yeah. a paragon of originality.

     

    Blizzard makes the avatar and titanics of the video game world.  And they do it well.  No they are not the most original but they are good at what they do,  and that is no reason to knock em.

    You're proving his point.  He saying is Blizzard DID make great games that weren't really original.  Yet for some reason when other companys now make MMO's they some how need to be completely original...

    I think Bioware has a good chance to just what Blizzard did many times.  Built a standard game of teh genre, add so small innovations, and have a smooth relatively bug free game.

     

    image
  • jerlot65jerlot65 Lake Mary, FLPosts: 788Member

    Originally posted by Scambug

    Originally posted by wrekognize

    LA is giving all SWG players the middle finger and saying, play TOR if you want a Star Wars MMO. In turn, we are losing one of the last standing sandbox games. And yes SWG is still a sandbox game as it is now.  Much more so than 98% of the games out there.  There is no other reason why LA is shutting down SWG than to say, play TOR or else.  The sub numbers of SWG were far greater than many other MMOs i've tried.  Three highly active servers, a handful of medium servers and the rest low.  and Lucas Arts will get theirs. Quote me on this.  Blizzard will come out with a polished sandbox game that will set a new standard.  The project is called Titan (google it).  And Titan will do to TOR what WOW did to SWG.  In the end, Blizzard will have owned Lucas Arts twice.  First by using a themepark game (WOW) to destroy the sandbox (SWG), then by using a sandbox game (Titan) to destroy the themepark (TOR).  At least I will have a freaking game to play this time around.  TOR could have been innovative and made a stand in the MMO industry.  Instead, they are taking the easy "safe" route.  It will be RTS games and Chess for me in this day and age of MMOs.  Enjoy your storybook grind in the meantime..

    SWTOR isn't an MMORPG so I don't see it being a long term success.

    Really?  Why isn;t the game a MMORPG?

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  • TUX426TUX426 Madison, WIPosts: 1,907Member

    Originally posted by superniceguy

    TOR is the NGE NGEd, but written from the ground up

    In TOR,

    Crafting looks to be dumbed down further from NGE

    Space is more dumbed down from NGE

    Professions have been reduced further from NGE

    Vehicles look to be dumbed down too, as have seen no 8 player vehicles, and the Stap with the CE is ridiculous, as should not appear for another 1000s of years!

    Curious...

    When SWG released, how many vehicles were in-game? How "in-depth" was space upon SWG's release? I assume you were a beta tester for TOR to make that claim about crafting?

  • TroneasTroneas Buenos AiresPosts: 851Member

    Originally posted by TUX426

    Originally posted by superniceguy

    TOR is the NGE NGEd, but written from the ground up

    In TOR,

    Crafting looks to be dumbed down further from NGE

    Space is more dumbed down from NGE

    Professions have been reduced further from NGE

    Vehicles look to be dumbed down too, as have seen no 8 player vehicles, and the Stap with the CE is ridiculous, as should not appear for another 1000s of years!

    Curious...

    When SWG released, how many vehicles were in-game? How "in-depth" was space upon SWG's release? I assume you were a beta tester for TOR to make that claim about crafting?

    this is a bit unfair tux.

     

    vehicles and housing was promised to be included after release in swg.

    space was included in the expansion and it was as "in-depth" as the rest of the game: ie very much in-depth. it already included the ability to customise and upgrade ships, customise components used in ships, ammunitions, multi-player ships and so on....

     

    as for crafting.... its a mystery what SWTOR holds in this respect but an educated guess would lead anyone to beleive it wont be as complex as SWG. its just not in the game's nature. 

    image

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