Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Fuzzy Avatars Solved! Please re-upload your avatar if it was fuzzy!

Why the term WoW clone is not a myth

YamotaYamota LondonPosts: 6,620Member

Some people on this forum seems to think that the term WoW clone is over-used and some kind of myth but in fact this is what publishers want.

I found this interesting tidbit on the upcoming Zombie MMORG in their FAQ.

"Over the past year we were approached by numerous publishers expressing an interest in partnering with Undead Labs. Not surprisingly, many of them were MMO industry publishers who were drawn to the team’s track record in that industry, and while they were excited to work with our team, most of them wanted us to work on yet another World of Warcraft clone."

So it is not just in our heads, most publishers only want World of Warcraft clones and hence why most MMORPGs are as such and called out as such. It is a fact of the industry.

«1345

Comments

  • VesaviusVesavius BristolPosts: 7,643Member Uncommon

    IMO, the only people that object to the term are those that have it applied to their games while they crow on about how awful WoW is.

    They like the illusion that their choice of game is superior to WoW and they are better then those that choose WoW, but really, in truth, it is (and they are) the same.

    I think 'WoW clone' is a legitimate description of a game that shares a lot of the same core play systems and philosophies (and yes...I know WoW copied EQ etc  etc etc).

  • jpaprockijpaprocki Davisville, WVPosts: 271Member Uncommon

    You could say portions of WoW are clones of MMO's that came before it.  So technically, you could say almost every MMO made since the first one's are clones of those before it.  Yeah, the term is over used.

    I'm not an IT Specialist, Game Developer, or Clairvoyant in real life, but like others on here, I play one on the internet.

  • KabaalKabaal Edinburgh, ScotlandPosts: 3,012Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Yamota

    So it is not just in our heads, most publishers only want World of Warcraft clones and hence why most MMORPGs are as such and called out as such. It is a fact of the industry.

    Correction, most of the publishers that approached Undead Labs asked for a WoW clone, not just "most publishers". For all we know it could have been publishers like Frogster Entertainment who deal with cheap wow knock off games like runes of magic who were approaching them.

     

    Without details you cannot claim such a sweeping statement.

  • RobokappRobokapp Dublin, OHPosts: 5,205Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by jpaprocki

    You could say portions of WoW are clones of MMO's that came before it.  So technically, you could say almost every MMO made since the first one's are clones of those before it.  Yeah, the term is over used.

     aaaaand how many people in the industry today have experienced both and see this comparison? Not a lot. how many played wow, now play their 100th guy with sword killing spiders and get reminded of WoW ? many.

    image

  • ormstungaormstunga sthlmPosts: 736Member

    The term is used, ppl know what is referred to. Its still wrong. SImple.

  • Creslin321Creslin321 Baltimore, MDPosts: 5,359Member

    I use the term because it's descriptive and everyone knows what I'm talking about when I say it.  It's less than a mouthful than saying "A game that emulates many of the features found in World of Warcraft with a few minor changes."  Still, just because a developer said the word doesn't make it law.  They are just people like you and me.

    I think that the problem most people have with "WoW clone" is that it implies that WoW was the game that originated most modern MMORPG concepts.  This simply isn't true.  WoW was heavily influenced by Everquest and it also took ideas from other games like FFXI (auction house).  WoW's major innovation was the quest-leveling paradigm, which helped make the game accessible and give it mass appeal, most other things were borrowed from other games though.

    Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,905Member Uncommon

    Whether it's in our heads or not I couldn't care less. I've been around long enough to know WOW has for the most part done nothing new. Even a lot of their newer additions were aspects they picked up from newer games in development. They put the blizzard coat of paint on it and added it to their game.

    I don't use the term simply because of this, I'm still more attune to what WOW was called, an EQ clone. What was EQ? a M59 clone. What were SWG and EVE? 3D UO clones. The one game that really hasn't been cloned is more or less DAOC.

    What I don't like the idea of is that the MMO has become a bad design, which is more or less the message with "WOW clone" usage. Then again I haven't burnt myself out by attempting to play each and every one that gets released, even though I really didn't like playing it to begin with.

     

     

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • Creslin321Creslin321 Baltimore, MDPosts: 5,359Member

    Originally posted by Malickie

    Whether it's in our heads or not I couldn't care less. I've been around long enough to know WOW has for the most part done nothing new. Even a lot of their newer additions were aspects they picked up from newer games in development. They put the blizzard coat of paint on it and added it to their game.

    I don't use the term simply because of this, I'm still more attune to what WOW was called, an EQ clone. What was EQ? a M59 clone. What were SWG and EVE? 3D UO clones. The one game that really hasn't been cloned is more or less DAOC.

    What I don't like the idea of is that the MMO has become a bad design, which is more or less the message with "WOW clone" usage. Then again I haven't burnt myself out by attempting to play each and every one that gets released, even though I really didn't like playing it to begin with.

     

     

    I think you use the word "clone" a bit too liberally.  Almost every game is influenced by games that came before it, but this does not mean it's a "clone."  IMHO a "clone" is a game that heavily emulates another game AND brings nothing significantly new to the table.

    I would not call EQ an M59 clone because EQ brought enough new innovations and experiences to the table to be an individual experience.

    Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?

  • mastersomratmastersomrat Saint Charles, MOPosts: 368Member

    The issue with useing the phrase "WoW close" is that WoW its' self is a Clone.

  • GerethGereth Allen, TXPosts: 20Member

    The problem with terming everything WoW clone is it isnt a correct term ... Wow it self is a clone of several games that came out befor it.

     

    I think the issue everyone has is the enormus group of people that think wow is the begining of the MMO Genre. When it just isnt. Besides the fact most people are tired of hearing about the game. Yes yes we know there are 10million people playing it but its at the end of its life. I was a long time WoW player and stopped one i relized Cata was a joke of an expansion.

     

    just 2 more cents put in there.

    Honor, Valor, Truth are in the heart of the true and the one.

    - Gereth Deepdale

  • ElidienElidien Atlanta, GAPosts: 1,058Member

    The only people who use the term "WOW clone" are the ones who are too lazy and do not want to think logically about the similarities between games. No, they rather throw out this over-used term to voice their frustration/anger/displeasure.etc.... without knowing what it really means.

    Besides, the only association with the term WOW clone is a neagtive one and it is only used in a negative way. That is why when I see the term used, it immediately discredits the post/article/etc.... to me.

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,905Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Creslin321

    Originally posted by Malickie

    Whether it's in our heads or not I couldn't care less. I've been around long enough to know WOW has for the most part done nothing new. Even a lot of their newer additions were aspects they picked up from newer games in development. They put the blizzard coat of paint on it and added it to their game.

    I don't use the term simply because of this, I'm still more attune to what WOW was called, an EQ clone. What was EQ? a M59 clone. What were SWG and EVE? 3D UO clones. The one game that really hasn't been cloned is more or less DAOC.

    What I don't like the idea of is that the MMO has become a bad design, which is more or less the message with "WOW clone" usage. Then again I haven't burnt myself out by attempting to play each and every one that gets released, even though I really didn't like playing it to begin with.

     

     

    I would not call EQ an M59 clone because EQ brought enough new innovations and experiences to the table to be an individual experience.

    Couldn't this argument be made for most MMO's though? I mean does a person playing WAR have the same experience in game as a person playing WOW? I didn't. 

    What about AOC or LOTRO? Didn't again.

    People frequently referred to SWG as a UO clone, yet the experience was hardly identical. WHat I experienced in AOC was hardly Identical to what I experienced in WOW. Yet the term is applied. IMO it's just tunnel vision, burnout or a combination of the two.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • Marcus-Marcus- Posts: 970Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by mastersomrat

    The issue with useing the phrase "WoW close" is that WoW its' self is a Clone.

     Sure, but when the developers are making the 50th "WoW clone", they don't want "EQ Clone" money that went with EQ, they want WoW again, and everything that came with it.

     

    Which in my opinion, isn't going to happen.

     

    but they keep trying thos rascals!

     

    So, maybe he's right, its just not gamers calling them WoW clones, but developers too... Its a conspiracy!!1!!1!!!!!

  • VonatarVonatar PraguePosts: 672Member Uncommon

    "WoW clone" is just a lazy form of expression, mainly because WoW is the current point of reference for the industry. But essentially almost every game that comes out is a "clone" of some other game - that's evolution for you.

    WoW, as well all know and are tired of hearing, is the evolutionary heir of the generation of MMOs that preceeded it, and now we are looking at the next generation of evolutionary heirs.

    The only problem is that WoW became such a sensation that most publishers/developers are scared to stray too far from what they think made WoW so popular and profitable, and in turn games which try to move far from the WoW core seem to fail. All the mainstream MMO makers want to achieve what Blizzard achieved. So I think this next generation is somewhat stunted in development as a result of the behemoth that precedes them.

    In my view people should stop using the term because it's meaningless. Raging that games are WoW clones is not really the publisher/developers fault, but rather our fault as consumers for making WoW into such a beast that companies want to emulate. We have to accept that this is the way things will be for a while, until the MMO market diversifies and WoW fades into the past so that new ideas and approaches have a genuine chance to succeed.

  • BillyJimBobBillyJimBob London, ONPosts: 35Member

    I do not think this phrase means what you think it means.

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,905Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by BillyJimBob

    I do not think this phrase means what you think it means.

    Well to be honest if this is Jeff Strain speaking, I think it's just more of his pandering to the choir. Because lets be honest he's a game dev, what better way to sell your product but carry the popular gamer line? Studio asks for certain elements, he says studio's asked for a WOW clone. Devs can view forums as easy as we can...

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • AcidDKAcidDK AalborgPosts: 82Member

    Whether a game is a WoW clone or not depends on how you define it. There are two ways to define a WoW clone:

     



    1. A game made to achieve the success of WoW by being similar to WoW regarding game design, gameplay, game world, and/or graphics.


    2. A game made to be as similar to (or exactly like) WoW as possible, but is not WoW.


     


    Now, as I recall no games are made to be as similar to WoW as possible. A lot of games match the first definition though, so on the one hand we have a definition that matches a lot of games and on the other hand we have a definition that matches no game. This is why people get confused when people use the term 'WoW clone' about a game, since some people refer to the first definition and other people refer to the second definition.


     


    Now, who are right? I would say both are, but regardless of who is right people should come to terms with what a certain term means before starting a flame war. So instead of starting a flame war when the term 'WoW clone' appears in a thread, simply figure out what definition one is referring to in the giving context of the topic, and if it is ambiguous then simply ask. A lot of arguments start because one of the involved parts made an assumption.

  • Daffid011Daffid011 Posts: 7,824Member Uncommon

    While wow is something of an EQ clone (and other games) it plays very different from those games.  The gameplay experience between the two games is so different most don't feel that they are a clone of each other. 

    On the flip side most new games have such similar mechanics and gameplay that it almost immediately feels like playing WoW.  There is almost nothing new that needs to be learned or explained.   In that respect these games do feel like wow clones.  At the same time they feel nothing like EQ, so they are appropriately not called EQ clones (or whatever other game clone).

     

    I don't think using the term WoW clone means to imply that WoW was somehow the first to do something or didn't steal inspiration from previous games.   Just that certain games almost completely emulate the gameplay of WoW and not EQ (or some other game). 

     

    It is just to bad that there are not some true EQ, UO, DAOC clones to offset topics like this. 

  • Marcus-Marcus- Posts: 970Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Daffid011

    While wow is something of an EQ clone (and other games) it plays very different from those games.  The gameplay experience between the two games is so different most don't feel that they are a clone of each other. 

    On the flip side most new games have such similar mechanics and gameplay that it almost immediately feels like playing WoW.  There is almost nothing new that needs to be learned or explained.   In that respect these games do feel like wow clones.  At the same time they feel nothing like EQ, so they are appropriately not called EQ clones (or whatever other game clone).

     

    I don't think using the term WoW clone means to imply that WoW was somehow the first to do something or didn't steal inspiration from previous games.   Just that certain games almost completely emulate the gameplay of WoW and not EQ (or some other game). 

     

    It is just to bad that there are not some true EQ, UO, DAOC clones to offset topics like this. 

     I would love for gamers to be able to "insult" my current MMO by calling it a DAOC or UO clone.

  • RobsolfRobsolf Grand Rapids, MIPosts: 4,247Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Yamota

    Some people on this forum seems to think that the term WoW clone is over-used and some kind of myth but in fact this is what publishers want.

    I found this interesting tidbit on the upcoming Zombie MMORG in their FAQ.

    "Over the past year we were approached by numerous publishers expressing an interest in partnering with Undead Labs. Not surprisingly, many of them were MMO industry publishers who were drawn to the team’s track record in that industry, and while they were excited to work with our team, most of them wanted us to work on yet another World of Warcraft clone."

    So it is not just in our heads, most publishers only want World of Warcraft clones and hence why most MMORPGs are as such and called out as such. It is a fact of the industry.

    So Undead Labs uses the term, and suddenly anyone who uses it gets some kind of credibility boost?

    It'll be interesting when this game comes out.  Cuz I'll betcha there will be no shortage of people calling it a "WoW clone" no matter what it is.

  • heh, publishers just like making money, so they always want to copy the previous successess. Just look at all the shooters these days :( Bleh, somedays I wish the mass market had more of an appetite for interesting and unique games.

  • YamotaYamota LondonPosts: 6,620Member

    Originally posted by Robsolf

    Originally posted by Yamota

    Some people on this forum seems to think that the term WoW clone is over-used and some kind of myth but in fact this is what publishers want.

    I found this interesting tidbit on the upcoming Zombie MMORG in their FAQ.

    "Over the past year we were approached by numerous publishers expressing an interest in partnering with Undead Labs. Not surprisingly, many of them were MMO industry publishers who were drawn to the team’s track record in that industry, and while they were excited to work with our team, most of them wanted us to work on yet another World of Warcraft clone."

    So it is not just in our heads, most publishers only want World of Warcraft clones and hence why most MMORPGs are as such and called out as such. It is a fact of the industry.

    So Undead Labs uses the term, and suddenly anyone who uses it gets some kind of credibility boost?

    It'll be interesting when this game comes out.  Cuz I'll betcha there will be no shortage of people calling it a "WoW clone" no matter what it is.

    It was just an example to demonstrate my point. I know I have read in the past that both StarVault and Aventurine had problems finding publishers because they wanted their game to be more like WoW, i.e. a WoW clone. However I do not remember where exactly I read those and hence why I did not reference them.

    Obviously games that are WoW clones wont be using the term as it is somewhat derogatory so they instead use the euphemysm ThemePark instead and I am more and more starting to believe that a ThemePark is basically an MMORPG which is heavily influenced by WoW.

    And whoever thinks that WoW is an EQ clone, you are terribly wrong. EQ was not quest based nor was it targetted towards casual players with is relatively hard leveling with downtimes, death penalties and what not. WoW simply based their game on EQ but changed it in a way that it was unrecognizable to EQ.

    However current WoW clones (Rift, WAR etc) are very recognizable compared to WoW.

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,994Member Uncommon

    No, the term is not a myth and is well understood by almost everyone including it's negative connotation.

    And no doubt there is a number of publishers/investors who want to "emulate" WOW's success so it's understandable why they'd ask that a new title try to be as much like WOW as possible. (in terms of what made it a success)

    Rift took this approach, and by all accounts is turning out to be pretty successful (and profitable).  Sure, some previous games that tried this path didn't do well, but that was in many cases due to releasing largely broken which never bodes well for any title these days.

    Now, if I could only find the "mythical" holy grail of MMO's, the DAOC clone I'd be golden.  I wouldn't mind if people insulted it all day by calling it a clone either.

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • dageezadageeza london, KYPosts: 578Member

    The Wow clone most certainly is no myth i would say 70% or better of the mmo games available are wow wannabes to some degree..

    I remember folks asking blizz if Wow was going to be just an EQ clone and blizz would boldly proclaim, no its going to be more like EQ done right..hehehehe

    Playing GW2..

  • SukiyakiSukiyaki GreenwichPosts: 1,398Member Uncommon

    Jeff Strain on the web claimed that a certain unspecified and unnamed number of publisher  would want his studio to produce  what Jeff Strain would describe as a WoW clone...

    =

     ALL publisher WANT to produce WoW clones and thats NOW PROVEN FACT? And the wrong term is suddenly correct and prefectly fine to be applied arbitrary against every gametitle, whenever you want to troll another games forum, advertise WoW offtopic without getting banned or pretend the game actually is a copy of specificaly WoW because WoW happens to bear similarities to the game in question on some as usual few superficial aspect like "online gameplay" and ""character progression", "quests" which WoW didnt even invent nor created any popular gameconcept with that hasnt been there before, if for any similarities at all?



    Common sense, must've skipped classes.



    But expectable since the same failed logic is used to find any excuse to defend it in first place, just because the term promotes the own game of favor. Why would the apologist excuses be any different. And promoting the game of favor happens to be the same reason why it has been artificially popularized in first place, by some months of borderline spam of some few rabid WoW fanboys with ulterior reasons.



    I have seen better failed attempts to excuse this obvious and intentional missplaced term, created in ignorance and bias purely for the sake to promote WoW in general and as some sort of "true originial" while degrading other games as inferior and solely popularized by some few rabid WoW fanboys repeating it thousands of times in every of their thousands of posts for their rants and slander about other games. This is actually cheaper  than the usual "its okay to call all these games clones because I called them clones thus they clearly are clones thus its okay to call them clones" circular reasoning excuse some apologist keep repeating.

     

    Well ignorance is bliss they say.

«1345
Sign In or Register to comment.