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Eurogamer | How to make MMOs better

romanator0romanator0 Glendora, CAPosts: 2,382Member

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-04-14-guild-wars-2-how-to-make-mmos-better-interview

An interview with Colin Johanson. Yes, he really is that smiley.

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Comments

  • ArckenArcken Chicago, ILPosts: 2,431Member

    Originally posted by romanator0

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-04-14-guild-wars-2-how-to-make-mmos-better-interview

    An interview with Colin Johanson. Yes, he really is that smiley.

     I was hoping the answer would be :Build a time machine, go back and stop WoW from ever being made.:

  • KaynokKaynok Jacksonville, NCPosts: 111Member

    Originally posted by Arcken

    Originally posted by romanator0

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-04-14-guild-wars-2-how-to-make-mmos-better-interview

    An interview with Colin Johanson. Yes, he really is that smiley.

     I was hoping the answer would be :Build a time machine, go back and stop WoW from ever being made.:

    You'd have to go stop Everquest from being made then considering WoW just copied it.

  • Garvon3Garvon3 Worcester, MAPosts: 2,898Member

    Originally posted by Kaynok

    Originally posted by Arcken


    Originally posted by romanator0

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-04-14-guild-wars-2-how-to-make-mmos-better-interview

    An interview with Colin Johanson. Yes, he really is that smiley.

     I was hoping the answer would be :Build a time machine, go back and stop WoW from ever being made.:

    You'd have to go stop Everquest from being made then considering WoW just copied it.

    Except EQ was a much deeper/more social/more rewarding game, and it wasn't being copied by everyone like WoW is, sooo. Games back then were original.

     

    But who actually takes Eurogamer seriously, especially about MMOs, after their whole Darkfall screw up?

  • ArckenArcken Chicago, ILPosts: 2,431Member

    Originally posted by Garvon3

    Originally posted by Kaynok


    Originally posted by Arcken


    Originally posted by romanator0

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-04-14-guild-wars-2-how-to-make-mmos-better-interview

    An interview with Colin Johanson. Yes, he really is that smiley.

     I was hoping the answer would be :Build a time machine, go back and stop WoW from ever being made.:

    You'd have to go stop Everquest from being made then considering WoW just copied it.

    Except EQ was a much deeper/more social/more rewarding game, and it wasn't being copied by everyone like WoW is, sooo. Games back then were original.

     

    But who actually takes Eurogamer seriously, especially about MMOs, after their whole Darkfall screw up?

     Given how upopular Darkfall is and how low its population is, I believe those numbers coincide with the score they gave it.

    And as far as EQ, to this day its still my favorite game of all time. WoW was the one that whored out the genre and sqaus hed any chance we had of ever had of seeing them develop in whole different directions.

    Imo WoW turned art into big macs.

    The article had some interesting points though.

  • Garvon3Garvon3 Worcester, MAPosts: 2,898Member

    Originally posted by Arcken

    Originally posted by Garvon3


    Originally posted by Kaynok


    Originally posted by Arcken


    Originally posted by romanator0

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-04-14-guild-wars-2-how-to-make-mmos-better-interview

    An interview with Colin Johanson. Yes, he really is that smiley.

     I was hoping the answer would be :Build a time machine, go back and stop WoW from ever being made.:

    You'd have to go stop Everquest from being made then considering WoW just copied it.

    Except EQ was a much deeper/more social/more rewarding game, and it wasn't being copied by everyone like WoW is, sooo. Games back then were original.

     

    But who actually takes Eurogamer seriously, especially about MMOs, after their whole Darkfall screw up?

     Given how upopular Darkfall is and how low its population is, I believe those numbers coincide with the score they gave it.

    And as far as EQ, to this day its still my favorite game of all time. WoW was the one that whored out the genre and sqaus hed any chance we had of ever had of seeing them develop in whole different directions.

    Imo WoW turned art into big macs.

    The article had some interesting points though.

    The issue with their Darkfall review wasn't the score they gave it (though that was laughably inaccurate). The reviewer made the most jaded hate filled "objective" review I've ever seen. What's more, almost every fact he cited was wrong, it was like he never even played the game much less read about it. And then AV looked at his review account and he'd only logged 2 hours of play time. Eurogamer tried to deny it, but everyone who read the review knew it was true.

  • ExilorExilor Las Palmas de Gran CanariaPosts: 391Member

    This article should be called "Guild Wars 2: How to Tempt Fate". 

  • EvilGeekEvilGeek londonPosts: 1,225Member Uncommon

    Nice article, love the way they work and how they aren't afraid to take risks in both the game and the way they work together. Seems everyone has a voice at Anet, I'd love to work for a company like theirs.

    image
  • Dream_ChaserDream_Chaser BGPosts: 1,043Member

    They really have a unique atmosphere there, it's like few other developers, and like no other mainstream developers, really. I once talked with someone who'd visited their headquarters and they said that it was about 60% art college, that they had classes there and everything. Essentially they were educating their new artists, showing them the ropes, and it definitely had the feel of an art college to it.

    My favourite part of the interview was where he described grouping people by theme, into 'strike teams', as it were. That sounds a lot like what I just described, right there. It makes a lot of sense if you think about it, and it allows for greater degrees of unbridled creativity. Most development houses have the artist over there, the programmers over there, and liasons that just talk between them. But with ArenaNet, everything sort of melts into one massively creative whole.

    It's definitely an approach that other developers could benefit from adopting.

  • AKASlaphappyAKASlaphappy Boise, IDPosts: 800Member

    Originally posted by Arcken

    Originally posted by romanator0

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-04-14-guild-wars-2-how-to-make-mmos-better-interview

    An interview with Colin Johanson. Yes, he really is that smiley.

     I was hoping the answer would be :Build a time machine, go back and stop WoW from ever being made.:

     


    Thank you for that, I cannot stop laughing now. Although I would have to add that the idea did not work too good for the terminators, who knows maybe Blizzard has Sarah Connor employed there. :)

  • ZeroxinZeroxin LondonPosts: 2,521Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Exilor

    This article should be called "Guild Wars 2: How to Tempt Fate". 

    Read the article and I don't feel this comes into play anywhere.

    This is not a game.

  • ExilorExilor Las Palmas de Gran CanariaPosts: 391Member

    Originally posted by Zeroxin

    Originally posted by Exilor

    This article should be called "Guild Wars 2: How to Tempt Fate". 

    Read the article and I don't feel this comes into play anywhere.

    "we certainly have our sights set on number one"    "we can make the highest quality MMO ever released."

     

    To exalt an MMORPG that hasn't been released, in this day and age, is to tempt fate.

    As a fan of Guild Wars and having been waiting Guild Wars 2 with enthusiasm, such claims make me say "Oh please, don't say that. It never ends well."

  • bunnyhopperbunnyhopper LondonPosts: 2,751Member

    Originally posted by Arcken

    Originally posted by Garvon3


    Originally posted by Kaynok


    Originally posted by Arcken


    Originally posted by romanator0

     

     

     

     Given how upopular Darkfall is and how low its population is, I believe those numbers coincide with the score they gave it.

    You mean the review by the guy who spent around 20 minutes in the actual game? Cool.

    "Come and have a look at what you could have won."

  • UnlightUnlight Ottawa, ONPosts: 2,540Member

    Originally posted by Exilor

    Originally posted by Zeroxin


    Originally posted by Exilor

    This article should be called "Guild Wars 2: How to Tempt Fate". 

    Read the article and I don't feel this comes into play anywhere.

    "we certainly have our sights set on number one"    "we can make the highest quality MMO ever released."

     

    To exalt an MMORPG that hasn't been released, in this day and age, is to tempt fate.

    As a fan of Guild Wars and having been waiting Guild Wars 2 with enthusiasm, such claims make me say "Oh please, don't say that. It never ends well."

    The jinx-effect is something that always concerns me too.  But in this case, they seem to be speaking in terms of objectives and possibilities, rather than certainties.  This gives me confidence.  I want them to be shooting for the top, not somewhere halfway up.  If they make it, pure win.  If they come close, it's better than almost everyone else.  Besides, ArenaNet *can* make the highest quality MMO ever released.  One day we'll find out if they succeed.  The omens are favorable at this point though.

  • CecropiaCecropia Posts: 3,472Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Garvon3

    Originally posted by Arcken

     Given how upopular Darkfall is and how low its population is, I believe those numbers coincide with the score they gave it.

    And as far as EQ, to this day its still my favorite game of all time. WoW was the one that whored out the genre and sqaus hed any chance we had of ever had of seeing them develop in whole different directions.

    Imo WoW turned art into big macs.

    The article had some interesting points though.

    The issue with their Darkfall review wasn't the score they gave it (though that was laughably inaccurate). The reviewer made the most jaded hate filled "objective" review I've ever seen. What's more, almost every fact he cited was wrong, it was like he never even played the game much less read about it. And then AV looked at his review account and he'd only logged 2 hours of play time. Eurogamer tried to deny it, but everyone who read the review knew it was true.

    Don't mind him, he takes a dump on Darkfall every chance he gets. It's a little strange after so much time has gone by since it launched, but it is what it is. Also, I have to agree with you on Eurogamer. They lost all credibility with that Ed Zitron "review". What a humiliation. 

    "Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb

  • onehunerdperonehunerdper corpus christi, TXPosts: 837Member

    This might be wishful thinking...but I found this interesting.

    "We're not just doing PVP, we're doing competitive PVP and we're doing an open-world, world-versus-world PVP system as well."

     

    I know they're probably talking about the mists only, but it sounds like there may be a little hope to introducing actual world pvp.  Unlikely but maybe, maybe, maybe?

    image
    image

  • onehunerdperonehunerdper corpus christi, TXPosts: 837Member

    Originally posted by Exilor

    Originally posted by Zeroxin


    Originally posted by Exilor

    This article should be called "Guild Wars 2: How to Tempt Fate". 

    Read the article and I don't feel this comes into play anywhere.

    "we certainly have our sights set on number one"    "we can make the highest quality MMO ever released."

     

    To exalt an MMORPG that hasn't been released, in this day and age, is to tempt fate.

    As a fan of Guild Wars and having been waiting Guild Wars 2 with enthusiasm, such claims make me say "Oh please, don't say that. It never ends well."

    I don't think that was what he meant at all.  He was just repeating their goals.  I don't think they are claiming anything with those statements. 

    image
    image

  • StydusStydus Port Charlotte, FLPosts: 50Member

    Originally posted by Cecropia

    Originally posted by Garvon3


    Originally posted by Arcken

     Given how upopular Darkfall is and how low its population is, I believe those numbers coincide with the score they gave it.

    And as far as EQ, to this day its still my favorite game of all time. WoW was the one that whored out the genre and sqaus hed any chance we had of ever had of seeing them develop in whole different directions.

    Imo WoW turned art into big macs.

    The article had some interesting points though.

    The issue with their Darkfall review wasn't the score they gave it (though that was laughably inaccurate). The reviewer made the most jaded hate filled "objective" review I've ever seen. What's more, almost every fact he cited was wrong, it was like he never even played the game much less read about it. And then AV looked at his review account and he'd only logged 2 hours of play time. Eurogamer tried to deny it, but everyone who read the review knew it was true.

    Don't mind him, he takes a dump on Darkfall every chance he gets. It's a little strange after so much time has gone by since it launched, but it is what it is. Also, I have to agree with you on Eurogamer. They lost all credibility with that Ed Zitron "review". What a humiliation. 

    While I do remember reading this prior to its launch..(or was it during that week after launch that they didn't let but a few hundred people buy their game because of their shortcomings) after finally playing the game for a month, I can say that the experience given to me was exactly the same and that the review is actually pretty accurate, darkfall definitely didn't deliver most of what it was claiming thats for sure. I'd say that the review while at the time uncredible.. ended up telling the truth, also pretty sure eurogamer wasn't the only reviewer to call it crap, plus this is an interview not a review so I don't see why people are so hung up about the credibility.. of an interview?

  • CecropiaCecropia Posts: 3,472Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Stydus

    Originally posted by Cecropia

    Don't mind him, he takes a dump on Darkfall every chance he gets. It's a little strange after so much time has gone by since it launched, but it is what it is. Also, I have to agree with you on Eurogamer. They lost all credibility with that Ed Zitron "review". What a humiliation. 

    While I do remember reading this prior to its launch..(or was it during that week after launch that they didn't let but a few hundred people buy their game because of their shortcomings) after finally playing the game for a month, I can say that the experience given to me was exactly the same and that the review is actually pretty accurate, darkfall definitely didn't deliver most of what it was claiming thats for sure. I'd say that the review while at the time uncredible.. ended up telling the truth, also pretty sure eurogamer wasn't the only reviewer to call it crap, plus this is an interview not a review so I don't see why people are so hung up about the credibility.. of an interview?

    Here is the review, if you're interested.

    "Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb

  • UnlightUnlight Ottawa, ONPosts: 2,540Member

    Originally posted by onehunerdper

    This might be wishful thinking...but I found this interesting.

    "We're not just doing PVP, we're doing competitive PVP and we're doing an open-world, world-versus-world PVP system as well."

     

    I know they're probably talking about the mists only, but it sounds like there may be a little hope to introducing actual world pvp.  Unlikely but maybe, maybe, maybe?

    No, there won't be any actual open-world PvP that takes place in the same zones as PvE.  That would completely run counter to their philosophy of a cooperative, non-griefing PvE environment.  The Mists will be the open-world PvP area.  And a case can certainly be made that making PvP restricted to the Mists effectively precludes it being "open-world".  I think that would be a fair conclusion.  However, it's not one I share. 

    The Mists sound to be an enormous area encompassing multiple zones, with actual dynamic events taking place that tie in with PvP objectives.  I take that as meaning that the Mists will be very much like a set of open-world zones where PvP restrictions are lifted.  There will be things to do and participate in that may not involve actually going head-to-head with other players by default.  It will depend on whether or not your opponents choose to oppose you there, or if their attention is focused elsewhere.  And with a big enough area to run around in, there will be little difference between PvP in the Mists and open-world PvP in the rest of the world.  Except of course that all PvP in the Mists will be consensual. 

    And that is where I believe many of the naysayers have a problem.  There are no freebies and there will be no opportunity to grief someone who doesn't want to play their game.  Everyone will be on close to equal footing and there will be no one they can easily victimize.  That works for me.

    So is it really "open-world" PvP?  Meh, maybe not.  But it sounds big enough for the question to become irrelevant to me since I have no interest in griefing 'civilians'.  The Mists will be more than enough open-world for me to play in and enjoy.

  • StydusStydus Port Charlotte, FLPosts: 50Member

    No I have read the review, and the re-review, honestly after playing darkfall I have a feeling their developers may be lying, it could be the reviewer.. but logs are definitely able to be edited, plus aventurine changes the time from anywhere from 2-3 hours depending on what makes them look better,  I don't know I read the review after forgetting that is was that "infamous" review, and honestly it seemed spot on.

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