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GM driven events in MMORPG ?

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  • NineDotsNineDots AuziellePosts: 26Member

    By the way, is there any such events in WoW Cataclysm?

  • Einherjar_LCEinherjar_LC MelfiPosts: 1,055Member

    Originally posted by Amaranthar

    Originally posted by Einherjar_LC


    Originally posted by Amaranthar


    Originally posted by Loktofeit


    Originally posted by Amaranthar

    I'd like to see GM participation go to the next level. GMs playing as characters with a mission.

    Imagine a GM playing an evil demi-god of great power, but if he gets killed by players, he's dead for good. And he has goals, set as layers, and each goal gives him more power in the game, and also has a meaningful impact. And one of his goals is to gather players as worshippers/followers.

    But of course, you need the right kind of game for this.

    You just described our objective and approach when we did the Followers of Armaggedon story arc in UO a decade ago. :)

    I was there. :)

    Honestly, while UO was by far the closest to "the right kind of game", and could have made it work well enough, the game still lacked the social systems for justice and free flowing factions that would allow for this to really be done right. As always, just my opinion, of course.

    Yep, UO and AC1 had these type of events long ago.

     

    They were lag fill messes, but man were they fun as hell.

     

    /puts on rose colored glasses.....

     

    I miss the good ole days of gaming.

     

    Those aren't rose colored glasses, those are glasses of true seeing. image

    Yeah I think so too, but you just know someone will come in here with the rose colored glasses comment so I beat them to it, lol.

     

    Those days way back when are remembered fondly because they were truly good old days of gaming and not the watered down theme park stuff we have today.  Back when  you actually had to talk to the town criers and discern bits of information to figure out or find quests.  No "!" markers or quest trackers.....bah, don't get me started....and get off my lawn, you damn kids!

    Einherjar_LC says: WTB the true successor to UO or Asheron's Call pst!

  • AmarantharAmaranthar OhioPosts: 2,422Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Einherjar_LC

    Originally posted by Amaranthar


    Originally posted by Einherjar_LC


    Originally posted by Amaranthar


    Originally posted by Loktofeit


    Originally posted by Amaranthar

    I'd like to see GM participation go to the next level. GMs playing as characters with a mission.

    Imagine a GM playing an evil demi-god of great power, but if he gets killed by players, he's dead for good. And he has goals, set as layers, and each goal gives him more power in the game, and also has a meaningful impact. And one of his goals is to gather players as worshippers/followers.

    But of course, you need the right kind of game for this.

    You just described our objective and approach when we did the Followers of Armaggedon story arc in UO a decade ago. :)

    I was there. :)

    Honestly, while UO was by far the closest to "the right kind of game", and could have made it work well enough, the game still lacked the social systems for justice and free flowing factions that would allow for this to really be done right. As always, just my opinion, of course.

    Yep, UO and AC1 had these type of events long ago.

     

    They were lag fill messes, but man were they fun as hell.

     

    /puts on rose colored glasses.....

     

    I miss the good ole days of gaming.

     

    Those aren't rose colored glasses, those are glasses of true seeing. image

    Yeah I think so too, but you just know someone will come in here with the rose colored glasses comment so I beat them to it, lol.

     

    Those days way back when are remembered fondly because they were truly good old days of gaming and not the watered down theme park stuff we have today.  Back when  you actually had to talk to the town criers and discern bits of information to figure out or find quests.  No "!" markers or quest trackers.....bah, don't get me started....and get off my lawn, you damn kids!

    I remember back in those days that Loktofeit was talking about.

    One night several guilds gathered together because we'd heard that the Followers of Armageddon were going to have this big meeting at a small house out in the middle of nowhere. These were GMs playing the leaders, and players as a loose "faction".

    When we got there, there were only 3 or 4 people in the house. We had quite a few people, maybe 50 or more, so it was impossible to hide the fact we were there. But someone had hidden a Communication Crystal in or near the house. What this was, for those who don't know, was part of a set of two Communication Crystals that you could link together and turn on. This allowed people to hear what was being said between these Crystals, no matter how far away.

    So we were able to listen in on these FOA Leaders, or players, or whatever they were, as they waited for their fellows to show up. Not much was said, they knew we were outside in numbers. But it was fun and interesting all the same. They did roleplay, making it more fun.

    Eventually, knowing we were there, the rest of the FOA people tried to force their way into the house. In UO you could mark a Runestone anywhere, and then either teleport (single player) or open a gate (any number of players, as long as it lasted, about 30 seconds) to that location. They had one set for right on front of the house, and opened a Gate there. They tried to come through the gate in numbers, because they knew we would be attacking them, so that they could counter assault against us and allow even more to come through the Gate.

    But we lit them up as they came through the Gate with all sorts of attacks; Arrows, Fireballs, Meteor Swarms, Chain Lightnings, Firewalls...talk about a roast! It was quite a bit of fun that night as we fought off other efforts by them to get to the house.

    I believe an FOA Leader (a GM) was captured that night, later to stand trial, after another fun event where we transported him over road to the courthouse under attacks by the FOA, allied with NPC Orc spawns popped by the GMs.

    Once upon a time....

  • Sid_ViciousSid_Vicious Sandpoint, IDPosts: 1,526Member

    Originally posted by Amaranthar

    I'd like to see GM participation go to the next level. GMs playing as characters with a mission.

    Imagine a GM playing an evil demi-god of great power, but if he gets killed by players, he's dead for good. And he has goals, set as layers, and each goal gives him more power in the game, and also has a meaningful impact. And one of his goals is to gather players as worshippers/followers.

    But of course, you need the right kind of game for this.

    Hrmm . .. that sounds like a really good idea! They could totally do that in Darkfall. I am going to post this on their suggestion boards if you dont mind.

     

    ; )

     

    LOL *reading the above post* dang I missed that when I played UO. How often did they do things like that? The story kind of reminds me of a siege last year when my clan was trying to take over the capital city of one of the corner continents and we decided to take our stand on top of this huge pyramid thingy and declared around 3 sieges at once. Unfortunately our enemies were not poor and were able to hire mercanaries to come get us and protect their cities. When looking over the edge there were hundreds of specks which were distant people with cannons unloading missiles at us. One elevator must be taken to reach this pyramid so everytime it came up with a bunch of decked out people, we unloaded AOEs and stuff and they would pretty much die instantly. We held the top of the pyramid well and everything was going smooth (dozens of player tombstones all over the place so everyone was fully loaded with the best of their own and other people's loot) up until the point where we were supposed to somehow destroy the clan stones in these enemy cities but we had no way to get down without being totally outnumbered. I died trying to get over to the city . .. and lost my new full plate armor . ... but when I remember back it was loads of fun! lol this wasn't a GM event, just a regular siege, but reminded me of your story since it was a focus fire AOE deal as the enemies poured in and a truly epic experience.

     

    Now picturing a GM playing a mob that lives as a character does until killed by opposing faction is a great idea! They could have some epic loot drop from him if he is killed and offer something to those who assist him with whatever he is trying to do. That would be sweet!! Hopefully they will read my post. I would also like to see something like our recent racial war but with GM controlled mobs on each side.

    NEWS FLASH! A bank was robbed the other day and a man opened fire on the customers being held hostage. One customer zig-zag sprinted until he found cover. When questioned later he explained that he was a hardcore Darkfall Online player and knew just what to do.

  • wisesquirrelwisesquirrel San Diego, CAPosts: 282Member

    The Brownie video ink in the first page is win ( I enjoyed the video even though I don't play Darkfall ).

    MMOs should be about interesting and unique experiences like these (I will miss Brownie, that was just too cruel, why is the world so?).

    MMOs can be (Not should) designed to revolve around human made events, perhaps an easy to handle event system that can be used through player actions and GM competition.

    Like in the above post, GMs competing for power with the condition of roleplaying, rules can be made later on to make it an exciting and entertaining adventure XD.

  • WarmakerWarmaker San Diego, CAPosts: 2,231Member

    Originally posted by NineDots

    Originally posted by Loktofeit

    http://ihavereturned.com/events.html

    Well, EvE is not really a MMORPG...so that does not really count.

    LOLWUT?!?  EVE isn't an MMORPG?

    Okay...

    As far as GM events, some have 'em, some don't.  And for those that do, a few that do have them sometimes bleed off to zero as the months go on.  Some will go into great lengths into a nice event.  Some merely come in to spawn an NPC(s), say a few copy & pasted remarks, and then leave and never to be seen again for the rest of the "event."

    "I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 13,633Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by Sid_Vicious

     

    LOL *reading the above post* dang I missed that when I played UO. How often did they do things like that?

    For a while. there were 2-3 content people assigned to each server. There were the individual server plots/stories that were driven by the content team (volunteer and staff) and there were the main story arcs that were run through across the servers. As the main story arcs diverged, the team would incorporate the player actions into how everyhing panned out. Using the FOA example, there were 3 FOA members and a leader on each server. Some died (gone completely, some were jailed and even tried in a court run by the players, and others escaped.

    There was also a good degree of help given to roleplay guilds and even guilds that weren't roleplayers but contributed positively (as good guys or bad guys) to the server environment. Areas of the game world were updated, changed or decorated - within the fiction of the game - that not only furthered the GM events but also gave more engaging environments to the players who were creating their own stories.

    The individual server events were a couple times a month for a while and the main story arcs were usually around expansion time.

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • NineDotsNineDots AuziellePosts: 26Member

    Originally posted by wisesquirrel

    The Brownie video ink in the first page is win ( I enjoyed the video even though I don't play Darkfall ).

    MMOs should be about interesting and unique experiences like these (I will miss Brownie, that was just too cruel, why is the world so?).

    MMOs can be (Not should) designed to revolve around human made events, perhaps an easy to handle event system that can be used through player actions and GM competition.

    Like in the above post, GMs competing for power with the condition of roleplaying, rules can be made later on to make it an exciting and entertaining adventure XD.

    Yes, and I have read reports of GM controlled mob attacking a player owned city yesterday on the US server.

    I think they might start doing this on a regular basis in Darkfall !

  • ScotScot UKPosts: 5,751Member Uncommon

    They used to be, other have mentioned UO, I am not sure anyone mentioned AC. They made their MMO's feel dynamic and that you were really doing something to help your in game fellows in arms. But they cost money, money that could be put into pretty graphics..they were binned in new MMO's.

  • just1opinionjust1opinion Kansas City, MOPosts: 4,844Member

    Originally posted by NineDots

    I was wondering if it is frequent to see events directly driven by GMs (Game Masters) in MMORPG?

    What I mean is when GMs would actually take direct control of some of the game mechanics such as monsters to interact with players.

    Here is a recent example where GMs took control of monsters to attack cities:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dd4TcOdO5A

    Do you know of any other MMO with such events?

     

    EQ2 has GM events, BUT....the only people that know about them are the people that read the forums, because that's where they announce them. They're GREAT though.  They often give away rare shinies that are rare collectables, and assorted other rares items.  The events are usually a lot of fun and involve some quest that they give you.

     

    One time I was in Paineel and was suddenly attacked by flying COWS.  Since cows are not plentiful in EQ2 and I have NEVER had one thrown at me.....I knew there was a GM SOMEWHERE.  I got bombarded with cows....like LOTS of them.  So I went looking for the GM, found him/her and got a GM vanity pet!  It was funny and a nice surprise.

     

    I love how EQ2 has these events because it makes the world seem very alive.  They also generally EXPECT you to roleplay with them, and that also makes it loads of fun.

     

    President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club

  • chasemmechasemme Las Vegas, NVPosts: 7Member

    I would just like to throw in my UO nostalgia too. Seeing West Britain Bank attacked by hordes of demons and having to drive them back along complete strangers with all the bank-sitters and blacksmiths contributing what they could to the fight. It is one very vivid memory I have of that game. Or a GM-controlled dragon not letting anyone into one of the dungeons.

    WoW, in a way, DID try this sort of idea, once. Right before WotLK came out, a plague spread over the world and people were turned into zombies and you could kill other players at will. As the week went on the disease became increasingly harder to cure and turned you zombie faster. It was honestly one of the most entertaining weeks I had in that game. If only because I had a choice to go zombie and kill anyone I chose for the scourge, or to put together a group a hunt them down. Weird how much being given an actual decision in that game which would have some small impact made me enjoy the game exponentially more.

    Funny thing is that it received such intense backlash. Huge numbers of people flocked to the forums to complain that it was way too brutal to have to run back to their corpses when they just wanted to do their dailies in peace. It was promptly ended. This was of course followed by a purely theatrical mass attack on Orgrimmar, in which absolutely nothing happened and no players were harmed.

  • NineDotsNineDots AuziellePosts: 26Member

    Originally posted by Scot

    They used to be, other have mentioned UO, I am not sure anyone mentioned AC. They made their MMO's feel dynamic and that you were really doing something to help your in game fellows in arms. But they cost money, money that could be put into pretty graphics..they were binned in new MMO's.

     

    I think that is one of needed piece to make a MMO more dynamic indeed and last longer.

    Well, I guess they were not binned in all the new MMO's since it looks like this will happen more an more in Darkfall Online.

  • ScotScot UKPosts: 5,751Member Uncommon

    Hmm I know you DF fans like to tell us how great a game DF is and I have a lot of time for the game. But I not seen anything to suggest that DF is doing server wide events that alter the game world. :)

  • darkrain5darkrain5 laakdalPosts: 53Member

    1) not every player can do the event ( angry players)

    2) to expensive ( 20 servers = 20 people/day hiring minimum)

     

    aldo I love the idea :)

  • ScotScot UKPosts: 5,751Member Uncommon

    Well some events do not need a GM to monitor them, most AC ones were just a patch applied to all servers. You did need to be top level to really take part. But that is when players have nothing to do so it made sense.

  • Sid_ViciousSid_Vicious Sandpoint, IDPosts: 1,526Member

    Originally posted by just1opinion

    Originally posted by NineDots

    I was wondering if it is frequent to see events directly driven by GMs (Game Masters) in MMORPG?

    What I mean is when GMs would actually take direct control of some of the game mechanics such as monsters to interact with players.

    Here is a recent example where GMs took control of monsters to attack cities:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dd4TcOdO5A

    Do you know of any other MMO with such events?

     

    EQ2 has GM events, BUT....the only people that know about them are the people that read the forums, because that's where they announce them. They're GREAT though.  They often give away rare shinies that are rare collectables, and assorted other rares items.  The events are usually a lot of fun and involve some quest that they give you.

     

    One time I was in Paineel and was suddenly attacked by flying COWS.  Since cows are not plentiful in EQ2 and I have NEVER had one thrown at me.....I knew there was a GM SOMEWHERE.  I got bombarded with cows....like LOTS of them.  So I went looking for the GM, found him/her and got a GM vanity pet!  It was funny and a nice surprise.

     

    I love how EQ2 has these events because it makes the world seem very alive.  They also generally EXPECT you to roleplay with them, and that also makes it loads of fun.

     

    LOL that made me think of something my guild would do in Vanguard's FFA PVP server. We would have an event we called Mad Cow Disease and charm all of the tursh cows (while invisible) and sick them on all the villagers! It was hilarious but we only did it a few times.

    NEWS FLASH! A bank was robbed the other day and a man opened fire on the customers being held hostage. One customer zig-zag sprinted until he found cover. When questioned later he explained that he was a hardcore Darkfall Online player and knew just what to do.

  • Sid_ViciousSid_Vicious Sandpoint, IDPosts: 1,526Member

    Originally posted by Loktofeit

    Areas of the game world were updated, changed or decorated - within the fiction of the game - that not only furthered the GM events but also gave more engaging environments to the players who were creating their own stories.

    Yeah I am hoping that more games do this sort of thing. If Darkfall ever did it, it would probably be more ways to customize player cities with flags or whatever. We havent seen any city fluff but I am hoping that we will within the next couple years.

    NEWS FLASH! A bank was robbed the other day and a man opened fire on the customers being held hostage. One customer zig-zag sprinted until he found cover. When questioned later he explained that he was a hardcore Darkfall Online player and knew just what to do.

  • NineDotsNineDots AuziellePosts: 26Member

    Originally posted by Sid_Vicious

    Originally posted by Loktofeit



    Areas of the game world were updated, changed or decorated - within the fiction of the game - that not only furthered the GM events but also gave more engaging environments to the players who were creating their own stories.

    Yeah I am hoping that more games do this sort of thing. If Darkfall ever did it, it would probably be more ways to customize player cities with flags or whatever. We havent seen any city fluff but I am hoping that we will within the next couple years.

    Well, in Darkfall Online, they are actually planning to change the Capital city just a bit for the Holiday season, not sure how extensive that will be though.

  • ObakiObaki Del Ablo LocoPosts: 27Member

    I know in MojiKan they are planning to introduce GM parties and the such and maybe player VS gm pvp, But has it ever worked successfully?

  • bumfmanbumfman Valrico, FLPosts: 276Member

    Origianal Everquest had sooo many GM events that it would take me hours to write them all down. They ranged from getting hundreds of players to make a new gnome toon, auto lvling them to lvl 9 and having a Gnome war. To a GM simply going to emerald forest and turning himself into a Godzilla sized raptor, finding a popular guild member and killing him to camp his body so that the guild would come in full force to rescue thier guildmate. They would be rewarded for thier efforts with rare type gear and such.

     

    The GMs were creative and though they didnt happen hourly or even weekly, when they did happen they would announce it serverwide and it was always entertaining. I guess it happening unpredictably was part of its fun.

    Work hard Play Harder

  • AmarantharAmaranthar OhioPosts: 2,422Member Uncommon

    Originally posted by bumfman

    Origianal Everquest had sooo many GM events that it would take me hours to write them all down. They ranged from getting hundreds of players to make a new gnome toon, auto lvling them to lvl 9 and having a Gnome war. To a GM simply going to emerald forest and turning himself into a Godzilla sized raptor, finding a popular guild member and killing him to camp his body so that the guild would come in full force to rescue thier guildmate. They would be rewarded for thier efforts with rare type gear and such.

     

    The GMs were creative and though they didnt happen hourly or even weekly, when they did happen they would announce it serverwide and it was always entertaining. I guess it happening unpredictably was part of its fun.

    You call that "creative"? It's cheap and easy throw-outs, and harmful to a game when some "popular" players get special attention, and things, that other players don't get. Sometimes GMs in this industry just blow my mind with their amature ways.

    Once upon a time....

  • DiviciacusDiviciacus CardiffPosts: 30Member

    I myself have never had the pleasure of being a participant in a GM driven event but I can imagine it would be a right laugh.  Its been my view that one of the reasons alot of modern mmos just do not fire my imagination of late is because the gameworlds are about as dynamic as a turd reclining in a petri dish.   Doesn't it say it all that, here we all are , decades after the mmo genre was spawned and we find ourselves having to look back into the past to find truly memorable game experiences, where REAL imagination and innovation on so many levels were part of mmos.  Its heartening to know that there are at least some mmos out there currently that are at least trying to make their subscribers experience as dynamic as possible and more to the point...fun.

     

    Now as I look at my desktop I see the shortcuts to mmo games declining swiftly as I really struggle to see what the point is to logging into yet another gameworld where the graphical lushness masks yet another barren, sterile experience ahead of me, where the only time I might encounter a GM is if my level 69 Half Elf Rogue/ Witchfinder/ Were-Hamster Hybrid is stuck in a graphical glitch or my quest to retrieve the Golden Yorkshire Pudding from the Evil Mage ,Gusset the Unwashed, has not completed when trying to hand it in.  I must admit I'm quite envious of those of you that had, (by the sound of it) some great laughs playing the early mmos ,I myself having come late to the mmo party. I've seen a lot of reasons given as to why we are not knee deep in GM driven experiences / participation and yet if this little forum is anything to go by its something players universallly enjoy, so it baffles me why we dont see more of it. Why are the big players in mmos seemingly resistant to more GM interaction? Surely it can't just be cost issues?

     

    I can't help but think that some unnamed mmos cater to players nowadays who  struggle with the most basic of concepts and who need instant gratification if they are not to push the nearest ornament over in temper.  Those players who need  to be spoon fed their daily dose of watered down gameplay, who like some caged retarded beasts cannot concieve of interaction beyond their eyebrow raising entries on general chat.... comments like " your mutha likes to blow pygmy marmosets"  or w/e.  To introduce the prospect of interacting with spontaneous GM initiated activities, quests etc would cause these types of players  to spill their bowls of Farley's Rusks and fall out of their high-chair in a comedic exhibition of Pamper-filling, eye-watering ADHD shaped malarkey followed by complete system shock and flatlining.

     

     Like others have said, the increased involvement of GM inspired events and such like can only make the game feel more immersive and add to a greater feeling of community in the game something mmo's need really , really bad, coz in the humble opinion of this poster, the mmo as a genre is at the moment treading the most stagnant of water. 

     

    yours sincerely,

     

    A man somewhere in deepest, darkest Wales.

  • Sid_ViciousSid_Vicious Sandpoint, IDPosts: 1,526Member

    Originally posted by Diviciacus                                                                                                  Why are the big players in mmos seemingly resistant to more GM interaction? Surely it can't just be cost issues?

     

    I bet that we will actually be seeing less GM-driven events in the future of the MMORPG genre for a bit while companies try and clone Guildwars' success by making buy to play games that do not need as much DEV maintainence as some of the old-school games did.

     

    The future is heading more toward buy to play and then buy expansions to play more rather than the monthly subscription that we see today. There are many games that I would have played for longer if they did not have a monthly sub.

    NEWS FLASH! A bank was robbed the other day and a man opened fire on the customers being held hostage. One customer zig-zag sprinted until he found cover. When questioned later he explained that he was a hardcore Darkfall Online player and knew just what to do.

  • AethaerynAethaeryn Kitchener, ONPosts: 1,969Member Uncommon

    It doesn't happen often.  I think there are 2 ways to do it that have their ups and downs.

     

    1) GMs create a spawn or event that is enabled started by them where they don't actually run creatures.  This is less personal etc. but safer (see 2)

     

    2) The GM spawns and controls a creature.  The success of this depends on the game world and structure.  The problem with this is that people will suggest that there is the chance for favouritism.  IE.  The GM only attacked players from guild B. 

     

    Take the example of the recent MO siege in which a GM "interfered" and made several players invulnerable etc. because he felt the other side was exploiting.

     

    Having GMs directly impact a player during play is a slippery slope.  I know in UO there were GMs that were fired for selling gold and characters on EBay.

    Having them spawn a creature that AI controlled, while not as cool and fun maybe (players are always better than AI) is certainly a lot "safer"

     

     

    Also,   games like WoW with tonnes of servers makes this an issue unless all things are run the same on each server. . people will cry.  On a one server world. . like Darfall or MO, EVE etc.  everyone has the same chance to participate etc and it would only take 1 GM.

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

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