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Who wants the old school to come back?

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  • ZorgoZorgo Deepintheheartof, TXPosts: 2,226Member

    Which old school game is gone?

    Why do they need to 'come back' if they are still here and playable? Re-sub to UO or DAoC or EQ or whatever you think the 'old school' is.

    Don't want to? It's just not the same anymore? If you don't want to sub to UO or EQ or whatever, than obviously you too have a reason why the 'old' school isn't worth it anymore.

    This argument is silly to me.

  • SirAoSSirAoS Chicago, ILPosts: 203Member

    Originally posted by Zorgo

    Which old school game is gone?

    Why do they need to 'come back' if they are still here and playable? Re-sub to UO or DAoC or EQ or whatever you think the 'old school' is.

    Don't want to? It's just not the same anymore? If you don't want to sub to UO or EQ or whatever, than obviously you too have a reason why the 'old' school isn't worth it anymore.

    This argument is silly to me.

     You calling this an argument is silly.

    This isn't about missing older titles but not wanting to re-sub to one. Most people, like myself, i think just miss some of the qualitys older titles offered but would like to see those values (ideas or w/e) Implamented into a newer, more up to date game.

  • flydowntomeflydowntome Norwich, CTPosts: 106Member

    Old school FFXI was very much like old school EQ. Problem was the old school aspects were such a tremendous time burden as well as a pain in the ass that over time, they greatly reduced and changed them.

    -world bosses sound like a cool idea, but both players and RMT botted them, and some took up to 3-7 days to respawn. Even those that had a 4-6 hour repop could take days or months just to even claim legit.

    -all party play was more boring than KTR questing, because a lot of it was downtime due to LFP or making parties, and a few classes couldn't get parties at all.

    -hardcore play was fine for the minority, but the hardcore missions a good chunk of people just didn't do because of the difficulty. Chains of Promathia missions people lost friendships over cause of that.

    -no instances sound fine, except when you have 4 parties packed in one of the few viable camps for level 20-24.

    What people don't realize is that a lot of "old school" features were old school in the sense passwords for console games were old school. We put up with them because there wasn't anything else. Once there was we didn't miss them. Considering that the current attempts to remake old school have pitiful population (darkfall, fallen earth) and that FFXI is making way for the casual friendly FFXIV, well.

  • ZorgoZorgo Deepintheheartof, TXPosts: 2,226Member

    Originally posted by JthX

    Originally posted by Zorgo

    Which old school game is gone?

    Why do they need to 'come back' if they are still here and playable? Re-sub to UO or DAoC or EQ or whatever you think the 'old school' is.

    Don't want to? It's just not the same anymore? If you don't want to sub to UO or EQ or whatever, than obviously you too have a reason why the 'old' school isn't worth it anymore.

    This argument is silly to me.

     You calling this an argument is silly.

    This isn't about missing older titles but not wanting to re-sub to one. Most people, like myself, i think just miss some of the qualitys older titles offered but would like to see those values (ideas or w/e) Implamented into a newer, more up to date game.

    Why don't you want to re-sub to one? If it has the qualities and ideas you like.......what features about those games do you feel need updating?

    List which 'old school' features made you quit those games, and then list which 'old school' features you want to see implemented in future games. Now if everyone did that, and compared the lists, I believe we would see some cross over, but for the majority we would see that all of our opinions wildly differ.

    Just as an example, if a new game came out with a similar death penalty to EQ - I wouldn't play it. Although I know from these forums, many would define a harsh death penalty as 'a must'. Both of us lament the passing of EQ, but we wouldn't agree on the features which should be carried on.

    I think it can be cathardic to lament about the passing of an era, but to think 'the good ol' days' can come back....well I just don't feel like it will pan out.

    That's why I recommend, if you want that 'old school' feeling, play an old school game. You simply cannot gaurentee that you will get that 'feeling' just because a game has included those features. A games entertainment value and the 'feel' you get from a game come from how well features are implemented, not what the feature is, in my opinion.

    Devs could gaurentee you old school features, they cannot gaurentee that implementing them will give you the same feeling you got in your first year of UO. In reality, they may just make you realize why you don't sub to UO ever again.

    But while I called the 'argument' silly (which probably wasn't the best word choice), I appreciate that you personalized it to insult me directly.

  • ThedrizzleThedrizzle Palm Coast, FLPosts: 322Member

    Bring back cartography and treasure hunting!

    Good times.

    If you're gonna bring back that, you can also bring back....

    1. Death Penalties

    2. Slllowwwwwweeeerrr levleing

    3. Player driven shops through housing not auction houses. Let the players travel the world to find their wares.

    4. Take all this instant gratification and welll instances.... out of games. Instances have helped take some of the social aspect out of MMO's.  In open world dungeons in older games i formed some of my closest in game relationships through PUGs(an accronym that is shunned these days because of the "new school" elite gamers)

    5. Bring back world pvp not all this battle ground crap

     

  • TerranahTerranah Stockton, CAPosts: 3,605Member

    I'd love to see precu swg come back, or some game based around similar mechanics.  It was just a very interesting game that drew me in.  You had scavenging and mining to acquire resources that varied in quality, crafting that allowed experimentation and uniqueness, marketing in the form of having your own shops and vendors, a really fun combat system that unfortunately was detracted by some over powered dots, a rich social component that involved guilds, towns, factions, several beautiful large and different worlds to explore, space combat, a skill based system that allowed you to mix and match, etc.  I would love to see this game come back, or see a new one that is similar come to fruition.

     

    I'm tired off small worlds with little corridors of terrain, multitudes of instances, load screens galore, etc.  Knock graphics down a notch and make gameplay central to the experience.  Give us one massive world and the ability to explore it on land, sea and air.  Include intersting quests, but make that secondary to creating your own stories and adventures.  Get rid of levels.  Focus on fun and depth.  Make the journey so amazing you don't care about the destination.

  • MurashuMurashu Ft Rucker, ALPosts: 1,394Member

    Originally posted by Zorgo

    Originally posted by JthX

    Originally posted by Zorgo

    Which old school game is gone?

    Why do they need to 'come back' if they are still here and playable? Re-sub to UO or DAoC or EQ or whatever you think the 'old school' is.

    Don't want to? It's just not the same anymore? If you don't want to sub to UO or EQ or whatever, than obviously you too have a reason why the 'old' school isn't worth it anymore.

    This argument is silly to me.

     You calling this an argument is silly.

    This isn't about missing older titles but not wanting to re-sub to one. Most people, like myself, i think just miss some of the qualitys older titles offered but would like to see those values (ideas or w/e) Implamented into a newer, more up to date game.

    Why don't you want to re-sub to one? If it has the qualities and ideas you like.......what features about those games do you feel need updating?

    List which 'old school' features made you quit those games, and then list which 'old school' features you want to see implemented in future games. Now if everyone did that, and compared the lists, I believe we would see some cross over, but for the majority we would see that all of our opinions wildly differ.

    Just as an example, if a new game came out with a similar death penalty to EQ - I wouldn't play it. Although I know from these forums, many would define a harsh death penalty as 'a must'. Both of us lament the passing of EQ, but we wouldn't agree on the features which should be carried on.

    I think it can be cathardic to lament about the passing of an era, but to think 'the good ol' days' can come back....well I just don't feel like it will pan out.

    That's why I recommend, if you want that 'old school' feeling, play an old school game. You simply cannot gaurentee that you will get that 'feeling' just because a game has included those features. A games entertainment value and the 'feel' you get from a game come from how well features are implemented, not what the feature is, in my opinion.

    Devs could gaurentee you old school features, they cannot gaurentee that implementing them will give you the same feeling you got in your first year of UO. In reality, they may just make you realize why you don't sub to UO ever again.

    But while I called the 'argument' silly (which probably wasn't the best word choice), I appreciate that you personalized it to insult me directly.

     If you had read this thread from the beginning you would answer most of your own questions. No one here is looking for an exact replica of games that were released 10-15 years ago with zero improvement. We are talking about taking great features that were in those older games and putting them in a quality made product with todays standard of polish.

    Things I would love to see brought forward from EQ would be challenging, non-instanced group/raid content. an actual death penalty, longer, more meaningful quest lines, classes that specialize in a role instead of filling every roll, raids that support more than 25 players and that are not reserved only for end game, alternate advancement that allows for continued progression of my main instead of making me play alts for progression.

    Reasons I do not enjoy playing EQ anymore are the lack of upgrades to graphics, the increased use of instancing, reduced raid sizes, and the lack of player housing/cities.

    Now it's always easy to dismiss everyone who enjoyed older games by telling us to just go play those old games, but the games we all enjoyed may be around in name, but they are no longer the same. Features that I loved in EQ and SWG were cut from the game. As much as we would love to go play our old favorites, it is impossible to do now other than playing on someone elses privately own emulator.

    www.agonysend.org

  • oakthornnoakthornn Browns Mills, NJPosts: 862Member

    Originally posted by JthX

    Who would like to see some of the old school MMO features come back to MMOs today? Does anyone even care?

    I mean features like Ultima Online offered. I think nowadays MMOs are to instaned and not enough World play. Does anyone know, miss, or want to see a MMO make a livley world where you are free to do w/e and create your own story?

    How does everyone else feel about MMOs today and how the used to be? Are you happy with how they are or would you like to see them good ol' features come back to life?

     

         Honestly, I for one would love this. I miss the features of the original Everquest and even miss playing Ultima Online. Both games were very addicting for different reasons.. EQ was the greatest Sandbox PvE themed MMORPG ever created and Ultima Online was the greatest PvP do whatever you want when you want type of MMORPG ever created..

    But unfortunately, ever since WoW revolutionized the MMO genre, more and more companies tried copying their dumbed down features like instanced zones, eeezzz mode leveling system, and more of a casual gameplay experience to make more money instead of taking notes from the greatest MMORPG's ever made like EQ, UO, and DAOC...

    These companies choose to copy WoW instead of the real hardcore MMO's and all of them have failed miserably at doing this... There is only one WoW, stop trying to copy their game mechanics, UI, and dumbed down game features.. You will be more respected by the true hardcore fans of this genre if you create a difficult, challenging, awesome virtual reality MMORPG for intelligent  hardcore gamers...

    Rallithon Oakthornn
    (Retired Heirophant of the 60th season)

  • Goatgod76Goatgod76 Stow, OHPosts: 1,214Member

    Originally posted by Thedrizzle

    Bring back cartography and treasure hunting!

    Good times.

    If you're gonna bring back that, you can also bring back....

    1. Death Penalties

    2. Slllowwwwwweeeerrr levleing

    3. Player driven shops through housing not auction houses. Let the players travel the world to find their wares.

    4. Take all this instant gratification and welll instances.... out of games. Instances have helped take some of the social aspect out of MMO's.  In open world dungeons in older games i formed some of my closest in game relationships through PUGs(an accronym that is shunned these days because of the "new school" elite gamers)

    5. Bring back world pvp not all this battle ground crap

     

    I endorse this message.

    As well as less emphasis on gear in order to progress in comparison to gear there for looks. It's much more fun (To me, as well as I am sure many others) to get gear that looks nice (But also may have some beneficial stats too, just not overdone) that very few players have in comparison to having to raid to get gear everyone else has in order to get invited to tier of raids, etc.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member

    Originally posted by Thedrizzle

    Bring back cartography and treasure hunting!

    Good times.

    If you're gonna bring back that, you can also bring back....

    1. Death Penalties

    2. Slllowwwwwweeeerrr levleing

    3. Player driven shops through housing not auction houses. Let the players travel the world to find their wares.

    4. Take all this instant gratification and welll instances.... out of games. Instances have helped take some of the social aspect out of MMO's.  In open world dungeons in older games i formed some of my closest in game relationships through PUGs(an accronym that is shunned these days because of the "new school" elite gamers)

    5. Bring back world pvp not all this battle ground crap

     

     

    1) So that everyone will instant rage-quit from the first wipe of a raid?

    2) I don't want to play a GAME for a decade. Years are already too much.

    3) Yeah right .. it is not like travelling the same route over and over again is boring enough, now i have to talk to 10 NPCs to look for ONE item?

    4) Bringin back taking-a-number and wait 3 hours to kill the boss once which lasted one min? No thanks.

    There are reasons why these things are not in modern MMOs anymore. If you can't move on .. i guess the only thing left to do is QQ.

  • pierthpierth San Antonio, TXPosts: 1,503Member

    Originally posted by nariusseldon

    Originally posted by Thedrizzle

    Bring back cartography and treasure hunting!

    Good times.

    If you're gonna bring back that, you can also bring back....

    1. Death Penalties

    2. Slllowwwwwweeeerrr levleing

    3. Player driven shops through housing not auction houses. Let the players travel the world to find their wares.

    4. Take all this instant gratification and welll instances.... out of games. Instances have helped take some of the social aspect out of MMO's.  In open world dungeons in older games i formed some of my closest in game relationships through PUGs(an accronym that is shunned these days because of the "new school" elite gamers)

    5. Bring back world pvp not all this battle ground crap

     

     

    1) So that everyone will instant rage-quit from the first wipe of a raid?

    2) I don't want to play a GAME for a decade. Years are already too much.

    3) Yeah right .. it is not like travelling the same route over and over again is boring enough, now i have to talk to 10 NPCs to look for ONE item?

    4) Bringin back taking-a-number and wait 3 hours to kill the boss once which lasted one min? No thanks.

    There are reasons why these things are not in modern MMOs anymore. If you can't move on .. i guess the only thing left to do is QQ.

    Not every game appeals to every player.  While some of what Thedrizzle posted may be a bit harsh without more detail, I would still certainly be interested in a game with those attributes.  Apparently you would not, and that would also make the game better.  People playing (and subsequently complaining) about games where their playstyle isn't included instead of just moving on tend to ruin those games for people that do enjoy them.

  • DaywolfDaywolf Winchester, CAPosts: 749Member

    Originally posted by JthX

    Who would like to see some of the old school MMO features come back to MMOs today? Does anyone even care?

    I mean features like Ultima Online offered. I think nowadays MMOs are to instaned and not enough World play. Does anyone know, miss, or want to see a MMO make a livley world where you are free to do w/e and create your own story?

    How does everyone else feel about MMOs today and how the used to be? Are you happy with how they are or would you like to see them good ol' features come back to life?

    Old school all the way buddy, straight up. They can keep their instances :P lol hated it when they added it to EQ even, when instancing really started to catch on (not to mention AO). But here we are, and investors want "cutting edge" even though it's not. So the studios give what the investors want, the "safe" thing. The only instanced game I have really liked is Guild Wars, but then I don't really think of it as an mmorpg, not really. But yeah, old school all the way.

    M59, UO, EQ1, WWIIOL, PS, EnB, SL, SWG. MoM, EQ2, AO, SB, CoH, LOTRO, WoW, DDO+ f2p's, Demo’s & indie alpha's.

  • ScotScot UKPosts: 5,758Member Uncommon

    The ides that old school games are all still perfectly viable so we should be playing them if that’s what we want is nonsense. Their graphics are sub par, if I told you to go and play a theme park game that was 10 years old, I think you might bring that issue up! All of us eventually want something new, to expect us to keep playing in the same old world for ten years, well would you? Theme park addicts don’t last three months before they have dropped a new MMO and moved on, but we can stick it out for ten years…right! Finally it is only new MMO’s that can bring in all the latest innovation, you can’t just tack all of that on to old MMO’s.

  • BannneBannne LondonPosts: 244Member

    Originally posted by Murashu

    I'd love to see a game with graphics on par with Aion, a crafting/harvesting system like original SWG, faction system like DAoC, Non-instanced dungeons for group and raid encounters like EQ1, player housing/cities like SWG, a death penalty that would make the game seem like more than a game of quake with die, respawn, die, a questing system like EQ where a quest actually meant something and didnt just feel like errand boy tasks. It would also allow you to group at lvl 1 and run dungeons that are just as enjoyable as the end game dungeons. Raids wouldn't be reserved for only the max level players, they would be available to different range of players throughout the game. They would also be designed to support more than 10/25 players and actually be challenging again. Whether its class based or skill based does not matter to me as long as one character cannot master every role. I dont want to see anymore Paladins DPSing, tanking and healing well.

     

    I'm not looking to go back to playing in 800x600 resolution, 8bit colors, no /tells, or spending 2 minutes meditating between fights by staring at my spell book, but it would be very nice to see some of the old popular game features built into a quality game.

    Their is a game That offers everything you and some of the poster want now, it's called VANGUARD SAGA OF HEROES, it's alive and kicking and is not the same buggy mess it was three years ago.

    The game had a bad start like AOC but it's now how it should of been at release. The problem is it still lacks a lower level population so people who do actually give it a go end up leaving because they have no one to group with at lower levels unless they join a guild.

    They are now going to merge 3 of the 4 servers so this will mean we have one big PVE server and one PVP FFA server.

    It's a vast beautiful game with no instances and vast amounts of content.

    ALL THE VIDS IN THIS POST WERE MADE ON 5 YEAR OLD PC

    It's a 5 year old system, with a AMD Athlon X2 4800, 2GB RAM, and NVIDIA 7900GTX 512MB Video Card.

    Before you read on look at this vid, as far as the eye can see you can fly to,nothing will block your way.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JFrW_dQRPM

    Kojan http://vanguardvault.ign.com/wiki/index.php/Kojan

    Qalia http://vanguardvault.ign.com/wiki/index.php/Qalia

    Thestra http://vanguardvault.ign.com/wiki/index.php/Thestra

    Death In Vanguard. http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/59631 Corpse runs and xp lost.

    Crafted Ships /Galleons/Housing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5lXH4PIxww&feature=related

    Flying Mounts http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_XxCdth7nw&feature=related

    Great Crafting System (just as good as SWG IMO http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vg5f-IXSmCs&feature=related

    Diplomacy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dsdm8jHrM30&feature=related

    Forty Land Mounts (these are just racial mounts) http://www.kayoss.net/vgmounts.htm

    Vast Dungeons http://www.vanguardmmorpg.com/vanguard_dungeon_finder.php (this is an old list ,the game has many more now)

    Nineteen Races http://vanguardvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Game.Detail&id=155

    Vanguard 15 Classes http://www.vanguardmmorpg.com/vanguard_classes.php

    Vanguard Attribute Points System  http://vanguardvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Guides.Detail&id=2  http://vanguard.wikia.com/wiki/Attributes

    The Game.

    Druid Class and Rukuur(wolf) Shamen( Unlike EQ1 the Shamen is the healer in Vanguard not the Druid)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GE3MZf6q7Bk

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuB1Yt4KUaU

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ji-9y2iVYQ

    Hopefully the merge and letting players of the trail island will bring in the population.

    Game Guilde.

    Off The Isle. Watch In HD.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xABMi4pUnlg&feature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apdDXkOgRUI&feature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xABMi4pUnlg&feature=related

    Free Trail http://vanguard.station.sony.com/isleofdawn/

    If you have not played it because of what you heard then give the trail ago and make your own mind up. If you played it even a year ago then come back and check it out. Vanguard has a vast amount of content that even playing for three years you wont see it all. U dates are slow but they do come.

    The population is the only thing letting this game down but if people actually start playing then it will rise. Yeah i know we are going to get the SOE blah blah i hate them,well i can't convince those people anyway so this is for the players ho have no personel vendetta against soe.

  • DaywolfDaywolf Winchester, CAPosts: 749Member

    Originally posted by Scot

    The ides that old school games are all still perfectly viable so we should be playing them if that’s what we want is nonsense. Their graphics are sub par, if I told you to go and play a theme park game that was 10 years old, I think you might bring that issue up! All of us eventually want something new, to expect us to keep playing in the same old world for ten years, well would you? Theme park addicts don’t last three months before they have dropped a new MMO and moved on, but we can stick it out for ten years…right! Finally it is only new MMO’s that can bring in all the latest innovation, you can’t just tack all of that on to old MMO’s.

    Unless I missed something, or the topic went OT, the op was talking about features (he said features), not playing old games with old graphics engines :) Though some of them are quite playable since they are loaded with content.



    Like... most games now are heavily instanced, but old school games are not. Old school games you are not moved from one area to the next as you level, but are designed to be complete consistent worlds. Old school games are mmorpg's, not soloist play grounds (not that you always must have a group). Old school games are not about instant gratification, but takes time and effort (don't mean grind) to do anything or get anywhere. Few examples.

    M59, UO, EQ1, WWIIOL, PS, EnB, SL, SWG. MoM, EQ2, AO, SB, CoH, LOTRO, WoW, DDO+ f2p's, Demo’s & indie alpha's.

  • BannneBannne LondonPosts: 244Member

    Originally posted by Daywolf

    Originally posted by Scot

    The ides that old school games are all still perfectly viable so we should be playing them if that’s what we want is nonsense. Their graphics are sub par, if I told you to go and play a theme park game that was 10 years old, I think you might bring that issue up! All of us eventually want something new, to expect us to keep playing in the same old world for ten years, well would you? Theme park addicts don’t last three months before they have dropped a new MMO and moved on, but we can stick it out for ten years…right! Finally it is only new MMO’s that can bring in all the latest innovation, you can’t just tack all of that on to old MMO’s.

    Unless I missed something, or the topic went OT, the op was talking about features (he said features), not playing old games with old graphics engines :) Though some of them are quite playable since they are loaded with content.



    Like... most games now are heavily instanced, but old school games are not. Old school games you are not moved from one area to the next as you level, but are designed to be complete consistent worlds. Old school games are mmorpg's, not soloist play grounds (not that you always must have a group). Few examples.

    Yes like the game in my above post, Vanguard is an old school mmorpg with no instances and old school features.

  • qombiqombi Unknown, LAPosts: 1,180Member

    Originally posted by Torak

    Originally posted by JthX

    Who would like to see some of the old school MMO features come back to MMOs today? Does anyone even care?

    I mean features like Ultima Online offered. I think nowadays MMOs are to instaned and not enough World play. Does anyone know, miss, or want to see a MMO make a livley world where you are free to do w/e and create your own story?

    How does everyone else feel about MMOs today and how the used to be? Are you happy with how they are or would you like to see them good ol' features come back to life?

    Dark blue on Black....image Unwise choice.

     

    What most people overlook is many of the "old school" games are still running and have refined and corrected many of the negitive aspects of the games.

    All MMOs ruin what made them a hit with time. I have never seen a great MMO stay a great MMO.

  • DaywolfDaywolf Winchester, CAPosts: 749Member

    Originally posted by qombi

    All MMOs ruin what made them a hit with time. I have never seen a great MMO stay a great MMO.

    Too true. It's like "here is what we did when we were a poor start-up" to "And here is what we wanted to do ALLL along!"   :(

    Something like that.

    M59, UO, EQ1, WWIIOL, PS, EnB, SL, SWG. MoM, EQ2, AO, SB, CoH, LOTRO, WoW, DDO+ f2p's, Demo’s & indie alpha's.

  • DerWotanDerWotan NorrathPosts: 1,012Member

    I want oldschool back bad not only the game also the community. Back in the days it has been so much better no dumb fanboys, game bashing and non socializers at all. In order to get a good community going again you need:

    - forced grouping, raiding

    - challenging combat system where people are becoming rewarded for grouping up -> more experience, better loot and faster advance

    - allow soloing to a small degree so you have something to do till you#re waiting for a group

    - NON linear design, open world

    - tough quests as a highlight and not the main factor

    - stinging death penalty: ep loss, corpse runs and trains!

    - UI modification yes helpers like Bossmods NO

    - no instances at all

     

    AION did lots of things right, tough it doesn't offer enough PvE high end content :(

    My PvE hope lasts heavily on FFXI

    We need a MMORPG Cataclysm asap, finish the dark age of MMORPGS now!

    "Everything you're bitching about is wrong. People don't have the time to invest in corpse runs, impossible zones, or long winded quests. Sometimes, they just want to pop on and play."
    "Then maybe MMORPGs aren't for you."

  • Jairoe03Jairoe03 Winthrop Harbor, ILPosts: 732Member


    Originally posted by DerWotan
    I want oldschool back bad not only the game also the community. Back in the days it has been so much better no dumb fanboys, game bashing and non socializers at all. In order to get a good community going again you need:
    - forced grouping, raiding
    - challenging combat system where people are becoming rewarded for grouping up -> more experience, better loot and faster advance
    - allow soloing to a small degree so you have something to do till you#re waiting for a group
    - NON linear design, open world
    - tough quests as a highlight and not the main factor
    - stinging death penalty: ep loss, corpse runs and trains!
    - UI modification yes helpers like Bossmods NO
    - no instances at all
     
    AION did lots of things right, tough it doesn't offer enough PvE high end content :(
    My PvE hope lasts heavily on FFXI

    Personally, I wouldn't even count community as a feature of old school. This is something that is only controllable by the game company to a very limited extent. I just think you are not used to allowing a bigger population to play these games where now these type of people are more inherent. I cannot personally say the community has gone bad, I just think allowing more people creates more instances of fan boi-ism, hatering, et. etc.

    In regards to your missed features, its interesting to point out many things that many average MMO players today will probably hate hence why Darkfall and EVE Online are considered niche games. The responses here does point out to a market that is still out there and waiting however. So, its hard to neglect people that do want this, I just don't think its in a big market or big majority of things.

  • MurashuMurashu Ft Rucker, ALPosts: 1,394Member

    Originally posted by Bannne

    Originally posted by Murashu

    I'd love to see a game with graphics on par with Aion, a crafting/harvesting system like original SWG, faction system like DAoC, Non-instanced dungeons for group and raid encounters like EQ1, player housing/cities like SWG, a death penalty that would make the game seem like more than a game of quake with die, respawn, die, a questing system like EQ where a quest actually meant something and didnt just feel like errand boy tasks. It would also allow you to group at lvl 1 and run dungeons that are just as enjoyable as the end game dungeons. Raids wouldn't be reserved for only the max level players, they would be available to different range of players throughout the game. They would also be designed to support more than 10/25 players and actually be challenging again. Whether its class based or skill based does not matter to me as long as one character cannot master every role. I dont want to see anymore Paladins DPSing, tanking and healing well.

     

    I'm not looking to go back to playing in 800x600 resolution, 8bit colors, no /tells, or spending 2 minutes meditating between fights by staring at my spell book, but it would be very nice to see some of the old popular game features built into a quality game.

    Their is a game That offers everything you and some of the poster want now, it's called VANGUARD SAGA OF HEROES, it's alive and kicking and is not the same buggy mess it was three years ago.

    The game had a bad start like AOC but it's now how it should of been at release. The problem is it still lacks a lower level population so people who do actually give it a go end up leaving because they have no one to group with at lower levels unless they join a guild.

    It is funny that you mention VG since that is the current game I am subscribed to and I was just having a conversation about it last night with a friend. Although it does have some of the features I mentioned, and it is in better shape than it was at launch, it is still a buggy mess and lacks some of the features mentioned.

    VG player housing is probably the best we've seen since SWG, but you have zero customization of player cities. The leveling system in VG is just like every other new MMO, you are rewarded more for solo quest running than just getting in a group and having fun in a dungeon. It is closer to the EQ style than most but not quite there. Raiding in VG is very small scale, even WoW allows more people on raids than VG and the raids are not spread out across all levels, they are the end game.

    I've introduced 5 friends to VG in the last 2 weeks, all of them love the concept, they love the game world and classes, the diplomacy, the player housing and non instancing. They do NOT love running into and bouncing off invisible walls, swimming under water then being stuck under the land, frequently being stuck in rocks, resource nodes that cannot be harvested, and UI issues like targeting one person, clicking on the defensive target window to invite them to a group and end up inviting some random person on the other side of the zone.

    Now I understand every MMO has bugs, but the ones I mentioned above, are all bugs I witnessed last night helping a friend on the Isle of Dawn. That is what new players to the game see the very first time they log into VG. As I mentioned in the first post, I would love to see older game features built into a quality game.

    I spent 14 months beta testing VG, I saw how it changed from targeting 'the core gamer' to attempting to draw the masses away from WoW. Although the target audience of VG changed over time, one thing always remained the same, it is riddled with bugs and if that hasnt changed over 3 years after launch, I dont see if being fixed any time soon.

    www.agonysend.org

  • SwampRobSwampRob Halifax, NSPosts: 1,008Member

    Originally posted by DerWotan

    I want oldschool back bad not only the game also the community. Back in the days it has been so much better no dumb fanboys, game bashing and non socializers at all. In order to get a good community going again you need:

    - forced grouping, raiding

    - challenging combat system where people are becoming rewarded for grouping up -> more experience, better loot and faster advance

    - allow soloing to a small degree so you have something to do till you#re waiting for a group

    - NON linear design, open world

    - tough quests as a highlight and not the main factor

    - stinging death penalty: ep loss, corpse runs and trains!

    - UI modification yes helpers like Bossmods NO

    - no instances at all

     

    AION did lots of things right, tough it doesn't offer enough PvE high end content :(

    My PvE hope lasts heavily on FFXI

     Another example of how one person's delight is another's frustration.

    Forced grouping?   That alone would keep me from playing.   Options, choices, freedom!

    Grouping should get better exp and faster levelling, but in no way should the best loot be group-exclusive.   This is a tired rule of MMOs that needs to go away.

    Stinging death penalty?   Why?   I don't need to lose a bunch of stuff to dislike and want to avoid dying.

    Oh God yes please give me instances.    Spawn-camping, kill-stealing, etc.   Haven't we moved past that yet?

    High end PvE content for groups AND soloers, not one or the other.

    And I'm plenty old enough to be old school.

  • chriselchrisel HuttiheitaPosts: 995Member

    Originally posted by JthX

    Who would like to see some of the old school MMO features come back to MMOs today? Does anyone even care?

    I mean features like Ultima Online offered. I think nowadays MMOs are to instaned and not enough World play. Does anyone know, miss, or want to see a MMO make a livley world where you are free to do w/e and create your own story?

    How does everyone else feel about MMOs today and how the used to be? Are you happy with how they are or would you like to see them good ol' features come back to life?

    Sorry if I sound harsh; but your post is without meaning. You better explain what you mean about 'old school' before you post something like this. I really do not understand at all what you mean with this nonsense you have posted. Let me also add, that the color you are using is hard to read.

    Make us care MORE about our faction & world pvp!

  • JimmydeanJimmydean Ypsilanti, MIPosts: 1,270Member

    Originally posted by SwampRob

    Originally posted by DerWotan

    I want oldschool back bad not only the game also the community. Back in the days it has been so much better no dumb fanboys, game bashing and non socializers at all. In order to get a good community going again you need:

    - forced grouping, raiding

    - challenging combat system where people are becoming rewarded for grouping up -> more experience, better loot and faster advance

    - allow soloing to a small degree so you have something to do till you#re waiting for a group

    - NON linear design, open world

    - tough quests as a highlight and not the main factor

    - stinging death penalty: ep loss, corpse runs and trains!

    - UI modification yes helpers like Bossmods NO

    - no instances at all

     

    AION did lots of things right, tough it doesn't offer enough PvE high end content :(

    My PvE hope lasts heavily on FFXI

     Another example of how one person's delight is another's frustration.

    Forced grouping?   That alone would keep me from playing.   Options, choices, freedom!

    Grouping should get better exp and faster levelling, but in no way should the best loot be group-exclusive.   This is a tired rule of MMOs that needs to go away.

    Stinging death penalty?   Why?   I don't need to lose a bunch of stuff to dislike and want to avoid dying.

    Oh God yes please give me instances.    Spawn-camping, kill-stealing, etc.   Haven't we moved past that yet?

    High end PvE content for groups AND soloers, not one or the other.

    And I'm plenty old enough to be old school.

     

    You are exactly right, one person's delight is another's frustration. The problem is that every single MMO that has released since WoW caters to individuals such as yourself and in turn falls flat on it's face because WoW has already cornered the casual-want-it-now market. The market that is still out there and eagerly awaiting something to draw us in are the players who started in EQ1/AC/UO and still like the forced grouping, stinging death penalty, and non-instanced worlds.

    If a developer wants to be successful with a new MMO, they need to realize that WoW already has their subscriber based locked down, so focusing on an untapped market would be many times more successful.

  • SwampRobSwampRob Halifax, NSPosts: 1,008Member

    Originally posted by Jimmydean

    You are exactly right, one person's delight is another's frustration. The problem is that every single MMO that has released since WoW caters to individuals such as yourself and in turn falls flat on it's face because WoW has already cornered the casual-want-it-now market. The market that is still out there and eagerly awaiting something to draw us in are the players who started in EQ1/AC/UO and still like the forced grouping, stinging death penalty, and non-instanced worlds.

    If a developer wants to be successful with a new MMO, they need to realize that WoW already has their subscriber based locked down, so focusing on an untapped market would be many times more successful.

     I said nothing about being casual, nor want-it-now.   I know of exactly ONE MMO, out of all the MMOs out there that has soloable endgame content with a chance to get the best loot.

    What I want are options that allows my playstyle to be just as rewarding and lucrative as grouping.   FWIW, I found Wow bland, unimaginative, and same old forced grouping for the end game.

    Keep in mind that one style is not better than the other.   It's fair to say that today many many players like to solo, and yet these MMOs you reference like Wow still have the tired old endgame of group up or give up.

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