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Originally posted by SanzenSekai Leveling up in Aion was quite painful for me, never have I completed such boring, mindless quests, I think I enjoyed leveling in WoW more TBH, the feeling of grind and repetition was so apparent in Aion and the theme park style walls killed it for me.
how is it any different to wow, in the end you have to kill stuff repeditively to level. same for all mmo's.
Speaking of cutting the grind -LINK-
March on! - Lets Invade Pekopon
Originally posted by ronan32 Originally posted by SanzenSekai Leveling up in Aion was quite painful for me, never have I completed such boring, mindless quests, I think I enjoyed leveling in WoW more TBH, the feeling of grind and repetition was so apparent in Aion and the theme park style walls killed it for me.
NO, you are wrong here. considering the 18 pages of this thread there is definitely an annyoing grind. i do not se 18 pages of a grind related thread in any other game so far.
Originally posted by thanith Originally posted by ronan32 Originally posted by SanzenSekai Leveling up in Aion was quite painful for me, never have I completed such boring, mindless quests, I think I enjoyed leveling in WoW more TBH, the feeling of grind and repetition was so apparent in Aion and the theme park style walls killed it for me.
Hah, and how many users are complaining in those 18 pages?
Reporter: What's behind Blizzard success, and how do you make your gamers happy?Blizzard Boss: Making gamers happy is not my concern, making money.. yes!
Don't think he's wrong at all.
I do the same gameplay in WoW that I do In Aion.
exactly 2 weeks after launch and I'm lvl 31, more than halfway to level cap. Playing semi-hardcore but not all out sitting on the toilet while playing, and never leaving the house to enjoy life gaming.
I keep getting spammed by this power leveling service, why dont most of you bitches note down the website and pay them to level your character since you are all obviously big wow babies, actually just quit the game so i dont have to tell you morons how to do another fucking quest.
Originally posted by Jackio81 Now maybe this formula is working well in the Asian market considering how much those gamers love to grind....but I'm sorry it's just not going to work here and here's my explanation. (Oh and I'm not an absolutist so I believe in reasonable arguments that could change my outlook...0o) If you haven't noticed, Aion is a game without a PvE server so and so called "normal" server, so whether you hate PvP or not you will have to deal with it one shape or form to get anywhere in this game. Right there you're already cutting out a big chunk of gamers here on the west. Now let's talk about players that enjoy PvP, the problem I see with this game right now is grind just doesn't work for this crowd. Up until level 20 this game is actually enjoyable, but once that level comes and goes that's when the XP bar just about doubles in size and the quests begin to give just as much as a single mob encounter. If you want to make a game that caters to PvP don't force them to grind much, this is a lesson that was well learned in WAR that is once again showing up here in the different way. In WAR players found PvE the best means of leveling and gearing up for RvR, and since the RvR system in itself was flawed and badly thought out the game failed to impress PvPers. In Aion players have to PvE if they want to compete with other players, there is no choice like what you'd see in WAR, and the grind is so enduring that the game is turning into a gankfest where players try to grind while in fear of being attacked by other players at all times. Aion simply forces PvPers to PvE, and PvEers to PvP.....this is not a well thought out scheme to satisfy players. If you want to make a PvP game you're focus needs to stay away from grind as much as possible, and this game doesn't allow you to do it, it forces you not just to PvE but grind...and I don't see any bigger turn off for a PvPer than this! Either cut the grind or alow players to gain xp from other players...either than this I don't see this game doing so well...0o
I know i'm not the first one to say this. Go back to WoW.
When you consider that on quite a few boards, the "Aion is a grindfest" thread occurs quite often, I guess that Aion IS a grind.
Then again, so is every other MMORPG. The difference between them of course is that some games tend to hide their grinds better than others even to the point where people say their is no grind at all. These tend to be some of your better games. I guess from all the posts, on many different boards, Aion doesn't fare to well in this area.
Well I don't think it is a grind, every MMO game has a grind so if your not used to it quit playing MMOs. Ok before I get slammed by the EVE crowd, even the almighty EVE has a grind. Yes it may be to mine, Yes it may be to manufacture goods, yes it may be to do missions, but in the end all of these things are a grind, so it is included.
If you don't want a grind go play counter strike or COD X, stay away from MMO's.
Originally posted by Malkosha When you consider that on quite a few boards, the "Aion is a grindfest" thread occurs quite often, I guess that Aion IS a grind.Then again, so is every other MMORPG. The difference between them of course is that some games tend to hide their grinds better than others even to the point where people say their is no grind at all. These tend to be some of your better games. I guess from all the posts, on many different boards, Aion doesn't fare to well in this area.Shame really.
My thought is that the people making these threads come from games with faster leveling. They are probably putting in the same hours and not seeing that they are going to cap at lvl in a week or two and are complaining.
I'm not going to even bother reading your post....Don't play Aion if you don't like it. Do us all a favor and cancel rather then whining and biatching about it. I know I dont wanna hear as Im sure many others don't as well. Personally I'm sick of MMOs leading me around by the hand to max level. In Aion is not easy to level up and love it. /wave
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
I'm enjoying the hell outta the game and I'm not seeing any more of the grind then any other game I've played, including Warcraft. Others have made the point, but we're two or so weeks after release and I've seen people in the 40's. I myself am 21 and I'm a VERY casual player, less then or about 1 hour a night.
I'm really not sure where all of this bitching is coming from, or what the gain will be. I agree with previous posters, if you don't like the grind, quit. I'll be able to log in sooner...lol
Originally posted by Sovrath Originally posted by Malkosha When you consider that on quite a few boards, the "Aion is a grindfest" thread occurs quite often, I guess that Aion IS a grind.Then again, so is every other MMORPG. The difference between them of course is that some games tend to hide their grinds better than others even to the point where people say their is no grind at all. These tend to be some of your better games. I guess from all the posts, on many different boards, Aion doesn't fare to well in this area.Shame really.
Actually I wouldn't mind how slow the process was as long I enjoyed playing it....I'm not interested in capping level I'm just interested in having a good time.
The PvE element in this game also reminds me of WAR, both these games have some of the worst AI and PvE content I've seen.
If Aion was planing to make the PvE such a major hurdle towards leveling your way to the Abyss they should have added better content to keep players from going numb from grind and boredom. WAR at least never even planned for the PvE to be such a major factor in the gameplay, the players made it so because it was just more rewarding.
Anyways, I can see a couple of you are crying over these arguments not willing to except whether or not it might be an issue...If you feel gong ho enough to put up with the bore factor the grind has to offer go right ahead. But don't get angry if it does lead towards another mass exodus of players because I seen it all before many many times.
Anyways on a positive note, from the little I had a chance to actually PvP, will say it was pretty fun....then right after I logged off because I just didn't feel like going from a moment of fun back to the god awful grind...>>
Originally posted by Praetalus I'm enjoying the hell outta the game and I'm not seeing any more of the grind then any other game I've played, including Warcraft. Others have made the point, but we're two or so weeks after release and I've seen people in the 40's. I myself am 21 and I'm a VERY casual player, less then or about 1 hour a night.I'm really not sure where all of this bitching is coming from, or what the gain will be. I agree with previous posters, if you don't like the grind, quit. I'll be able to log in sooner...lol
Hmmm....denial truly is an awful habit...=/
Originally posted by teco221 Originally posted by Cammy Originally posted by drklunk Originally posted by teco221 How about NCsoft just gives everyone to lvl 50 when they create the toon?? IF YOU DON'T WANT TO GRIND IN ANY FORM, DO NOT PLAY MMO. Every MMO gives you some kind of grind, 1. level 2 gears 3 some kind of level i.e. RR in War 4. Grind money Without grinding, what do you want in a game?? Everyone level to top level in 3 days? Everything is free in game? Every mob drops epic gears? Stop complaining and whining, JUST DON'T BUY THE GAME AND DON'T PLAY IT.
THAT is the dumbest argument ever. People will bring that up in game and its just one of the dumbest things Ive ever seen. In a GOOD and WELL POLISHED MMO grinding isnt something you HAVE to do, its something you choose to do in order to get a certain drop, money, etc. People dont consider leveling grinding if there are an abundance of quests available.
In Aion, you dont have a choice, your a slave of your own time and money. Theres people that are already level 42 or so. These people are the ones that have no life, probably go to college and spend the rest of their hours in their dorm clicking mindlessly away. These are the people that will tell you Aion is the best MMO ever. A hashly bias opinion since they find ecstasy in clicking their lives into oblivion.
I came from Tabula Rasa, only reason Ive played this game is cos it was free. Tabula Rasa was, without a doubt, a great game. It just lacked content leaking from it's ass and well constructed PvP. However, leveling in that game was a LOT of fun, the community was absolutely awesome, and there was still enough content to keep you going. It was, regardless of what people say (because 90% of those who bash it never even did a trial), a well put together game; simply great. Aion: grind. Thats all I see in this game.
People want good gameplay, something fresh that doesnt feel like a second job. Something they want to do rather than deal with the frustrations of grinding their brains out and investing hours upon hours into a single level. I heard, that when one gets to level 45, there are absolutely no quests and that person will have to grind for 38 hours (I think) just to get to level 46. That my friend is bull shit.
Another thing is that Ive found people dont call it grinding unless they dont enjoy it. Which, Ive yet to find someone who actually enjoys grinding. Not only that but the community of Aion is mostly people with their heads up their ass. Now I said mostly because not nearly everyone is like that, there are few players who are acutally helpful without being a douche about it.
Im a level 23 Asmo Ranger and wish I didnt spend $15 on this game
I enjoy grinding... and there's really no difference from questing and grinding
but Im not going to get into ANY of this with you because its pointless.. you don't like the game, that's fine... but don't make Aion out to be something that it's not. You guys make me laugh... if you can't level cap in a month as a CASUAL player, then its a grind. Please... I remember vanilla WoW took me months to level up and no one said a thing... why? Because people LIKED the game. The same way people LIKE Aion.
In short, you don't really know what your talking about - but your entitled to your opinion. If you don't like Aion, dont' play... its really that simple
NOT ENOUGH QUESTS? usually I find people who can't find quest to do are:
1. Too lazy to look around
2. Die too many times and lost too much xp, so they can't level up. (Yes, you can fix your XP but part of XP is lost forever)
3. Decide to skip all "Group quests"
There are 1000+ quests for each faction.
Pandaemounium - 88
Ishalgen - 46
Altgard - 114
Mortheim - 211
Brusthonin - 102
Belusion - 211
Abyss - 413
So how many quests have you done totally?
Personally, Aion is an OK game like WOW. I don't think it's that great but it's better then all those big games which failed in the market. Will I still play Aion when FFXIV or SW: TOR coming out? Not sure, because I love FF more then Aion and SW:TOR looks interesting.
i call BS on those Abyss quests unless in the next 20 levels, i suddenly get 385 Abyss quests. I call BS on Belusion ones as well... the others i agree with.
How many of them are repeatable? (about half those Mord, ones i'd bet) and how many are actually hidden like the 4 quests from the asmodian which are "hidden"... from the bones, to the gold, siver and rusty pick axe are a rare drop. Elyos has those too mind you, but i only remember the nymph one.
"nothing actually matters, we're just slightly evolved monkeys clinging to a dying piece of rock hurtling through space waiting for our eventual death." - Frankie Boyle, Mock The Week
A lot of people on this thread have brought up some very valid criticisms of the game. Last time I checked, that is what these forums are for. How else can we bring suggestions and/or criticism to light than on forums?
I see potential in Aion. I have been playing it since beta and I really want to enjoy it. Aside from the times where I have found no available quests for my level and have been forced to do nothing but grind mobs for several hours, I have enjoyed it. I only brought up my individual issues with the game in the hopes that there might be others who feel the same way. With enough people being vocal about something, you can often influence the future direction of a game. But I see that the majority are not interested in having a logical discussion or admitting that there might be minor flaws in the game.
I am glad that so many of you are enjoying Aion and I wish you nothing but the best. And I fear you will get your wish (highlighted above) as I doubt that ANY of the game's servers will have any wait time issues very soon...
EDIT: If the thread about them increasing the XP reward for quests is correct, NCSoft may already be working to resolve this issue. If so, I am very pleased that they are addressing this so quickly.
Originally posted by Aznmask Originally posted by gorillaz95
The West is beyond spoiled. WoW has absoultely destroyed everyone's common sense of "pride" in MMO's. Anything that looks like WoW is stealing Blizzard's idea for the top game. Anything that isn't WoW is an Asian grind fest. No acceptance whatsoever. At least there are SOME that can enjoy WoW and another game *Applause*
Totally agree, it is hard to change ppl's mmo behavior. Everything asian make is grinder, or wow clone lol
That is an amusing post, because Aion is both, a wow clone and a grinder.
Originally posted by Hrothmund Originally posted by Aznmask Originally posted by gorillaz95
hahaha - play past level 10
Jesus I swear some people should be made to permanently wear a helmet. See... exhibit A
Rings of course is because that game rocks :P
As for EQ2, never could get into that game. Tried when it launched and tried a while back when they offered a ton of free time for past players to give the game another run. So no EQ2 is not okay...shame on you!
The kicker is I loved EQ so getting EQ2 was a no brainer for me. Really was dissappointeed with that game. They have made a lot of changes to it though.
All kidding aside to each their own I say. Wish that happened more on forums in general but then I suppose they would be rather boring.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
doesn't mention grinding once while level... oh yeah he does often
although, i wish he'd add more instances... the actual XP given for getting attuned to the fire temple (through water, wind) is just incredible (you will go up 2 levels from 28). But the training camp itself (if 3 manned) is just fantastic to do for the rewards and XP (lets not forget 50 abyss points a trash mob).
Originally posted by Kordesh No, YOU just need to play a different game and stop trying to change a game because you disagree with how something is, regardless of how thousands of others who are also playing the game might feel, you egotistical toolbag. Personally, I find the leveling curve to be just right, if not a bit fast.
But do you honestly enjoy just killing mob after mob to level up?
I don't care if a game takes 5 years to reach max level as long as the process of leveling is fun and engaging. If i find myself having to watch a movie or read a book while grinding away just to progress, I might as well not be playing the game at all.
Slow leveling speed does not equal grind. Grind = boring repetitive leveling method, almost exclusively involving killing mobs of a similar level.
Slow leveling speed does not make the game a challenge. Game difficulty is determined by how much strategy and skill it requires to succeed. A game can be hard and quick; a game can be easy and very long.
I stopped playing aion about 10 days ago, retiring a level 34 spiritmaster. I ditch an MMO when i find the only reason I am still playing is because I desire to reach that next level and get that next skill. EVERY mmo has that much (over-simplification, i know).
Originally posted by Sunrider Originally posted by CammyOriginally posted by Sunrider Originally posted by CammyOriginally posted by Sunrider Originally posted by Cammy Originally posted by Sunrider I don't know if its just me, but as I find myself getting older with more responsibilities, I just don't have the time to sit at the computer for 10+hours a day like all of those who are reaching cap already. I'm not asking for an easy to reach level cap, but it'd be fun if the game actually had some content to make it fun.As I said in a previous post, there will always be people that cap out in the first week or so, and if you're going to make the leveling curve a significant one, then don't start off with the first 15-20 levels being all sunshine and happiness to invite you in to a game and 25+ to rip you apart. Its just unfair to those who think they've bought a game that is fun and relaxed and turns out to be something like everything else under the heading of "Eastern MMO".Sure I can see those people who say "Suck it up and grind it out", or the post about the rep grind in WoW; however, in WoW you weren't forced to do the rep grinds and I rarely did unless there was something I had really wanted, you weren't forced to do it like leveling. Also, grinding out those last levels in WoW from 57-60ish, yeah, it's not so bad when its 3 levels compared to 25 levels and you're at the peak of your game.Sorry if I want to have fun while leveling and playing a game. Grinding shit out just doesn't cut it.
It's not that I have a huge problem with grinding, its just that there is no fun in it. I loved grinding in FFXI, SWG, and so on and so forth, but with AION, there is no comradery, like I spoke of earlier. Unfortunately, far too many of the current players have the mindset that its all about the solo action, and I, personally, have found it hard to find a good grind group. Personally, I've found mostly idiots that have one objective, and they usually end up taking agro from the plate, running away and agro'ing other creatures, wiping the whole group.Furthermore, the amount of kill stealing is absurd. Why did NCSoft, in all their gaming experience, decide that it was a good idea to let someone grab agro off of you and whoever does the most damage gets the kill? Where was this a good idea? I've played second fiddle to spirit masters and sorcerers more times then I'd like to admit, and its not only rude and goes back to show the WoW mentality of many of the players, but makes the game less enjoyable knowing you have more of that to look forward to.
Theres a difference between tagging a mob and having it stolen while you're in the middle of killing it. I don't mean when I'm running up to some shit, I mean when I'm in the middle of killing it and they come up and blast the hell out of it.
Also, once again, the issue of the lack of people willing to work together in this game has been avoided like the plague. Am I the only one who has had an issue finding a decent group that know how to grind out levels?
Yippee! This is fun. I noticed people get so into it that they miss how ridiculous the quote boxes look. I scrolled down and this thing popped out of my screen and nearly poked me in the eye.
If you hate grinding...why are you on an MMO site? When are you idiots going to learn that EVERY MMO EVER is a grind. Whether it's grinding mobs, or doing quests where you grind and then get exp at the end. Whether it's grinding reputation or grinding crafting or farming abyss points. THAT'S the whole FREAKIN concept of what is most commonly called a Theme-Park style MMO. All it is is grind to max level to experience the "meat" or "end-game content" of the game. In WoW it was Raids and BG's. In Aion it'll be fortress caps and dungeons and AP. I have not PLAYED a game that isn't like this, except for Runescape. If you don't like it, you're looking for a game in the wrong genre.
Originally posted by gordunk If you hate grinding...why are you on an MMO site? When are you idiots going to learn that EVERY MMO EVER is a grind. Whether it's grinding mobs, or doing quests where you grind and then get exp at the end. Whether it's grinding reputation or grinding crafting or farming abyss points. THAT'S the whole FREAKIN concept of what is most commonly called a Theme-Park style MMO. All it is is grind to max level to experience the "meat" or "end-game content" of the game. In WoW it was Raids and BG's. In Aion it'll be fortress caps and dungeons and AP. I have not PLAYED a game that isn't like this, except for Runescape. If you don't like it, you're looking for a game in the wrong genre.
It doesn't matter how many different ways you try to explain it, they STILL won't get it.
P.S Good post
It is true every game is a grind however the truly good ones hide in the way of quests/storylines and give rewards in terms of monetary boost, items and or a xp boost. A staright kill after kill after kill way died out a long time ago and should be condemed to mmo history.