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Warhammer Online : Age of Reckoning: Mark Jacobs Interview Part Two

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Comments

  • KenageruKenageru OdensePosts: 8Member

    I agree that some of the classes might not have been as iconic as some of the others (althoug I dare say that Hammerers are very iconic!), but they were still there to make sure that all aspects of combat were represented with each race.



    I've hear time and time again how the developers of WAR have been talking about wanting a great launch of the game; how many potential players will be lost after this announcement? I fear it will be a lot, as a large amount of those players are die-hard fans of the warhammer universe and when you make such important parts of the universe unavailable to them, they won't come. Having everyone fighting for control of Altdorf and the Inevitable City will kill the race pride, which so many of the fans love. Not all dwarves and elves wants to fight to save the empire and not their own capital cities, same goes for the greenskins and the dark elves.



    If we assume that all 750.000+ beta applicants are going to buy the game when it comes out, then we won't be lacking players at all... "focused" does not equal "better". Having too many players concentrated in one place will most likely create lag-spike upon lag-spike and also make it all the more confusing.



    I just can't see why this is suddenly being announced?! It goes against everything Mythic has been preaching all the time! Take your time and get the thing right from the start, not go all EA on us and release a game which isn't done. (I'm not saying it's EA making Mythic get the game out before it's finished, as Mark said EA didn't know anything about it before the announcement was made.)



    Lastly, I'll end this post with a citation of our very own Mark Jacobs (from the autumn-delay-announcement, I believe. :

     

    "One of the lessons from developers like BioWare and Blizzard is that you can’t rush a great game to market. By taking the necessary time to make WAR a great game, we feel it will be able to stand out in any season. We would rather release a great game in the fall then a good one any other time."
  • mechermecher Dennisport, MAPosts: 71Member
    Originally posted by wjrasmussen

    Originally posted by ShrubHead


     
    It's amazing that as gamers for the last decade we've been fed nothing but low quality games with a few gems mixed in with the slop. And as soon as someone starts doing something for quality control some of us start to cry fowl.
    If anything this interview makes me respect Mythic -and- EA.
    Mythic for having standards and realizing that some content wasn't ready or up to said bar.
    EA for what seems to be a genuine attempt at pulling their heads out of their collective arse, though that could quickly change.
    For now I'll stick with their words and wait patiently for the NDA to be lifted; If they don't pull a Funcom that is.



     

    Did they say not to long ago that they just needed to polish things up a bit and the game state was amazing and awesome?



     

    And? They could of noticed during the polishing that those classes are were they want them to be. Deh deh deh.

  • svzurichsvzurich Las Vegas, NVPosts: 21Member

    Mythic, thank you for your honesty in letting us know this before we have commited our dollars.  Unlike Funcom with Age of Conan, you have given us the facts and ample time to decide if we will cancel or keep our pre-orders.  Your candor has made me very glad that I have the CE on pre-order, and I for one look forward to adventuring in your lands.

    Based on what I have read about WAR and seeing DAoC mentioned, I have recently purchased DAoC and am enjoying it.  Seeing y'all learn from your mistakes and successes gives me a positive feeling.  Thank you.

    I was very much looking forward to playing a Hammerer first; I will be making a White Lion instead.  My Blackguard character will be replaced with a Chosen.  I look forward to playing the missing classes when and if you can fix them and add them back to the game.  I prefer melee over casting, but can adapt.  I will view this as having something to look forward to.

    It was not easy for you to admit you will have to leave promised content out of this game, but you found the courage to do just that.  Thank you.  I for one prefer to have a more polished exerience on release for I prefer Quality over Quantity.  Age of Conan's broken quests, lack of promised DX10, stealth removal of mature content (DX10, nudity, and sexual themes are on the box), major class "rebalancing", lack of endgame content, and female melee attack speed bugs have all left a sour taste in my mouth.  Your honesty and preference for quality ensure you will get my money instead of Funcom.

    Someday my Hammerer will make those greenskins pay.  I trust you to make that happen in time.  I can wait.

  • brostynbrostyn Louisville, KYPosts: 3,092Member

    Its better to have a great game, then a game that could have been great. I think AoC and VG has proven that. I'm glad they are taking things out that they just couldn't fix instead of just throwing in broken classes and ideas like every other game.

    DAoC has so many classes, but most of them are pretty worthless. There are constant complaints about classes being gimp, but they are ignored. I think they learned a valuable lesson from that. I hope they did, anyways. There is no sense in having classes that are going to be a drain on everyone.

  • butters88butters88 Toronto, ONPosts: 379Member

    I actually think I would have rather seen them delay the game once more than remove all that they have. However, as long as I have the satisfaction of knowing that these things will see further treatment and will reappear in the game is good enough I guess. I'm still bummed out though.

  • AlienovrlordAlienovrlord San Antonio, TXPosts: 1,525Member

    This was very surprising and I'd be lying if I didn't say also disappointing news.   I have to think Mythic did not make this decision without a great deal of struggle to avoid it.  

    But as others have pointed out, Mythic is sticking to what they said they wouild do.  They have been making a game the way they want, even if that means losing players.    They've said they're not trying to "Kill WoW", they're trying to make a solid game.     The rationale for their decisions is logical, even they are disappointing.

    On the other hand, it's practically a tradition in MMORPGs to release garbage content before it's ready then patching the bugs.   I wonder if we should really be that upset at a company that is trying not to that even though they know it might cost them some sales.   Maybe MMORPGs might be better off if this was this business model was used more often.

    And now that I think about it, it would take a lot worse news than this to make me pre-order WotLK and go back to WoW. 

  • captainamazing57captainamazing57 sydneyPosts: 91Member Uncommon

    With all EA's money and resources and years under development, Mythic should have more than 2 capital cities in WAR. That is just BORING !! I dont care how good the cities are (I am side A and you are side B, yeah right).

    In addition, Mythic had plenty of time to balance those 4 cut classes. What a cop out.

    I can't see WAR ending up as anything but a simplistic cookie cutter WOW clone.

    I was sitting on the fence about this game, but probably would have bought it. Certainly won't now.

  • SortranSortran Kansas City, MOPosts: 148Member
    Originally posted by Draccan

    Originally posted by Sortran


    Though this news is sad, I tend to think that they cities were not up to what they wanted, and may be same way for the players. As for the class cuts these will hurt as alot of people wanted to play those 4 classes. One thing for certain that i am glad to see, is Mythic dumping EA. EA has done very little in terms of being a good publisher and their methods tend to annoy alot of gamers due to the fact they force companies to put products out for a quick buck.
    I think that mythic will add the cities and lost classes down the road when they believe they have them ready, and I know most of the players will miss both cities and classes until that time. Maybe, just maybe we will get a quality product instead of a shoddy crappy MMO which seems to be the main drive these days.

     

    Where have we heard all this before... "oh it will not make launch, but will be added later"

    I am so sick off mmos today!

     



    Unfortunately that is all too true Draccan, I myself would like to see them add the removed content but only time will tell on that.

    Playing: Not much actively.
    Games played: to many to list, been playing MMO's since 2001
    --------------------------

  • SortranSortran Kansas City, MOPosts: 148Member
    Originally posted by kikinchaz


    Cities doesnt bother me.
     
    Classes I'm abit pissed off about - mainly because its 2 tank and 2 dps ones, meaning the 2 forms of melee classes. Yet casters are happy as larry, which is abit of a pissabout considering I'm not a caster person at all. Therefore giving less choice to melee fans. But if its a decision that will help the overall game
     
    But Punkbuster is the main issue. I cannot stand that "software", it does nothing but hinder those who genuinly want to play the game. I mean the damn thing now decides it wants to run in the background 24/7 whether your on a game or not.



     

    Actually, dealing with punkbuster doing this is easy to get rid of. Just use admin tools on your PC and Disable it. from there if you need it to run a game say battlefield 2, do a manual start. sure is minorly tedious, but yes it does the trick and I hate punkbuster for running the way it does, but with the wide range of MMO hackers out there these days, anything to get rid of the pieces of crap works for me.

    Playing: Not much actively.
    Games played: to many to list, been playing MMO's since 2001
    --------------------------

  • DraccanDraccan CopenhagenPosts: 1,050Member
    Originally posted by Dirty_Fish


    With all EA's money and resources and years under development, Mythic should have more than 2 capital cities in WAR. That is just BORING !! I dont care how good the cities are (I am side A and you are side B, yeah right).
    In addition, Mythic had plenty of time to balance those 4 cut classes. What a cop out.
    I can't see WAR ending up as anything but a simplistic cookie cutter WOW clone.
    I was sitting on the fence about this game, but probably would have bought it. Certainly wuon't now.

     

    I am a big WARHAMMER fan... have played the tabletops for 20 years and tons of their side games... name one I played it when I was younger..

    I also have been a staunch defender online for WAR... but I am sick and tired of large corporations like EA Mythic copping out on their mmo.. I cant tell you how frustrated I am. WAR was the last hope for 2008 for a decent mmo to come out.

    This cut is pretty big. First of all two capitols is like nothing content wise. Secondly the cutting of classes just shows how Mythic with EA backing is not using EA money to make an even larger, more impressive mmo but take the easy way out to cash in on the WARHAMMER IP. Really they could have built and built on this for a year and then released. Instead they just go greedy today.

    the cut of classes is killing the game lore wise. I mean no orcs, no knights of the empire, but include "classes" like witch hunters?!??!?!

    Fanboys of WAR can turn this around in any way they want, but this is making me sick to my stomach. They have no desire for a making a good game obviously.

    blah blah blah...

    mmo business = fail

    ____________________________
    CASUAL CONFESSIONS - Draccan's blog
    ____________________________

  • T1000T1000 EsbjergPosts: 15Member

    The fact that they will bring the other cityes into game later on, Give it good replay value. So im ok with.

    Im not that ok with cutting away 4 classes. that was bad =( they have to bring them back later after lunche

  • DraccanDraccan CopenhagenPosts: 1,050Member
    Originally posted by T1000


    The fact that they will bring the other cityes into game later on, Give it good replay value. So im ok with.
    Im not that ok with cutting away 4 classes. that was bad =( they have to bring them back later after lunche

     

    warhammer without ORCS??????

     

    hahahahhahahaa

     

    FAIL

     

    ____________________________
    CASUAL CONFESSIONS - Draccan's blog
    ____________________________

  • abbabaabbaba Monroe, WIPosts: 1,143Member

    Extremely disappointing. First they say crafting is basically limited to potions, and now half the game goes up in a poof of smoke. I'll keep watching but my hype for WAR is dropping rapidly.

  • mechermecher Dennisport, MAPosts: 71Member

    Wow there is a bunch of retards here. Yea half the content is cut... ok. How so? The realms for them are STILL THERE. The only thing is is the captial cities. There were what 2 dunegons connected to each. Whoope doo.

  • CenthanCenthan Toms River, NJPosts: 483Member
    Originally posted by Puuk


    Good article all around. I'm glad they are more concerned with polish and making the game "fabulously" fun, rather than try to shoehorn in as much as possible and then fix it post launch. Good for Mythic. I'm even more glad I sprung for the CE.



     

    These were my thoughts exactly after reading the article.  I like the honesty.  Great job Mythic. 

    The MMO community always seems to explode when developers aren't truthful and forthcoming with their information (I won't mention any names, but we all know who they are).  Mythic seems to be the total opposite and tells us everything, and people still explode.  Is it such a mystery why others other developers are so close-mouthed?  They are damned if they do and damned if they don't when up against the whining.

    Again, good job Mythic.  You are on the right course.  This is one I'll be trying at release.

  • Daedalus732Daedalus732 Lawrence, KSPosts: 589Member

    Everyone should be thankful that this announcement was made MONTHS in advance of the game's launch and not weeks or even days, as some MMO companies have done in the past.

    Two large and well done cities will aways outshine 6 average ones any day, and losing 4 classes is hardly the end of the world. Sounds to me like Mythic is quite aware of the state of their game and are setting realistic launch goals.

    Sounds like all the tiers and zones are intact, with a few cities and classes put on the back burner until they can be perfected.

    Again, you can't say that Mythic isn't being upfront and responding to their own product. Far better to do that than put out a half finished game and make people pay for it for six months while they work out the kinks.

    Remember that this is not a game that has been launched, so no one is out any money or time.

  • Corpus47Corpus47 Aurora, COPosts: 13Member

    How the hell can you have Greenskins with no Orcs Boyz?

     

    Seriously makes no sense at all. Whatever.

  • mechermecher Dennisport, MAPosts: 71Member
    Originally posted by Corpus47


    How the hell can you have Greenskins with no Orcs Boyz?
     
    Seriously makes no sense at all. Whatever.



     

    Easy, Choppa wasn't up to the quailty the devs wanted.  There is still the black orc.

  • ZorgoZorgo Deepintheheartof, TXPosts: 2,226Member
    Originally posted by Draccan

    Originally posted by T1000


    The fact that they will bring the other cityes into game later on, Give it good replay value. So im ok with.
    Im not that ok with cutting away 4 classes. that was bad =( they have to bring them back later after lunche

     

    warhammer without ORCS??????

     

    hahahahhahahaa

     

    FAIL

     

    Ummm.....Black Orcs are still in the game.....not just you, but somehow a few people came away with the idea that orcs were eliminated. Not orcs, one of the orc careers. Read folks.

     

     

  • ZorgoZorgo Deepintheheartof, TXPosts: 2,226Member
    Originally posted by Sortran

    Originally posted by Draccan

    Originally posted by Sortran


    Though this news is sad, I tend to think that they cities were not up to what they wanted, and may be same way for the players. As for the class cuts these will hurt as alot of people wanted to play those 4 classes. One thing for certain that i am glad to see, is Mythic dumping EA. EA has done very little in terms of being a good publisher and their methods tend to annoy alot of gamers due to the fact they force companies to put products out for a quick buck.
    I think that mythic will add the cities and lost classes down the road when they believe they have them ready, and I know most of the players will miss both cities and classes until that time. Maybe, just maybe we will get a quality product instead of a shoddy crappy MMO which seems to be the main drive these days.

     

    Where have we heard all this before... "oh it will not make launch, but will be added later"

    I am so sick off mmos today!

     



    Unfortunately that is all too true Draccan, I myself would like to see them add the removed content but only time will tell on that.



     

    I think MMO devs need to stop letting us in on the creative process of game development. Of course ideas are going to be ammended, augmented or eliminated in this type of a massive project. If they just kept their big mouths shut, we would never have even known these classes and cities would have even existed.

    We've been conditioned to believe that when a business puts something out there for the public, it has already gone thru the creative process and has been set in stone. Until mmo's, this was pretty true. But mmo's have developed a new marketing tactic that gives us a window into the process from A to Z.

    I think that marketing strategy has failed epically. Considering VG, AoC and now Warhammer, they  have and will all feel the huge negative impacts from this innovative, yet disfunctional advertising plan.

    I say the development period should practice silence. Then 1 week or maybe 2 before launch, tell us about the game features. We would have no clue about ideas that ended up on the cutting room floor and be a lot happier with our lollipop.

    In this way, you wouldn't create a population of people attached to a feature that for whatever reason, doesn't make it into the game.

    The only other option would be to educate the entire mmo game population about the nature of give and take on a huge multimillion dollar project spanning years. But somehow, I doubt a certain segment would ever understand.

  • ErolisErolis Mission Viejo, CAPosts: 54Member

    Unfortunately this seems to be the norm in today's network centric software delivery system. Write incomplete code today for an update on Tuesday. While none of us will REALLY know what went on behind the scenes. EA/Mythic announced this today knowing full well they will loose a percentage of their potential customer base to WoW or Lotro. While I personally would not have played this game ever. It's par for the course on most online game development these days to over promise and under deliver. AoC has really made alot of people hesitant to put down any money for a new mmo. They have single handedly damaged any launch with a hint of not delivering on what was promised, and Mythic just said they would cut a large section of the core game out. I would not want to be in that office today.

    The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity. - Harlan Ellison
    image

  • mechermecher Dennisport, MAPosts: 71Member
    Originally posted by Zorgo


     
    I think MMO devs need to stop letting us in on the creative process of game development. Of course ideas are going to be ammended, augmented or eliminated in this type of a massive project. If they just kept their big mouths shut, we would never have even known these classes and cities would have even existed.
    I say the development period should practice silence. Then 1 week or maybe 2 before launch, tell us about the game features. We would have no clue about ideas that ended up on the cutting room floor and be a lot happier with our lollipop.
    In this way, you wouldn't create a population of people attached to a feature that for whatever reason, doesn't make it into the game.
    The only other option would be to educate the entire mmo game population about the nature of give and take on a huge multimillion dollar project spanning years. But somehow, I doubt a certain segment would ever understand.



     

    Lol....... That would never work. It's not just the mmo game populations that needs some educations it's all of modern society. Whinning has become the complete norm. So pretty much being a wuss is promated and being a real man is hugely frown on. I take being a actual MAN then to fitting with the fags I mean cool people.

    I say this is good. Less whiners at launch to deal with.

     

  • OzmodanOzmodan Hilliard, OHPosts: 7,181Member Uncommon

    18 classes, really how many games start with 18 classes?  You are extremely lucky you are getting that many. 

    I am just amazed at all the thoughtless whiners on this thread.  If you can't find a class you like in one of those 18 you have issues, namely you should not be playing a MMO.

  • URMAKERURMAKER slidell, LAPosts: 632Member Uncommon

    gah i had my heart set on being an orc choppa

    image

  • keolienkeolien watertown, TNPosts: 198Member

    I cant believe this lol, I have waited so long for this game.

    Set back after set back, year after year.

    And now they are going to do something like this? This is just terrible, sorry mythic but im cancelling my pre-order.

    But on the otherhand I could buy the game and play my most wanted class "chosen" but im sorry, im not going to buy Warhammer online until the game comes with all the features/classes/towns. Next thing we know, right before release. "we are sorry but we had to take tradeskills out because they just wasn't good enough". bla bla bla.

    I remember mark jacobs saying "we are not going to release the game until we think its ready" umm ok Im not seeing this here anywhere.... obivously if they are leaving out 4 classes and 4 out of the 6! towns. THE GAME IS NOT FINISHED.

    I just wouldn't ever believe mythic would do something like this! I could have seen it before EA bought them out but now that they have one of the biggest gaming companies backing them up, this is rediculous.

     

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