Are you serious?

24

Comments

  • Azure77Azure77 Groves, TXMember Posts: 355

    WASD was introduce into MMORPGs to give the feel the of Action-RPGs. In some games like CoH and CoV  it added to fast pace combat element.

        Is it needed in MMORPG , the average gamer is use to WASD, so getting them to get use to Point and Click is another factor in the game ability for mass appeal.

       The problem with Korean games , and WASD is geodata (map data or terrian data) isnt in most Korean games, Lineage 2 in C2 added basic geodata. With mixed results , and at the time NCsoft Korea , said too much cost for too little results.

        Most US games ship with geodata , because normally US games lavish in wasted money anyhow. Korean games are made to cost less , and make money quickly. US games are most over budgeted and bloated projects that get revamped during the course of Alpha to Beta.

        When a company attempts to Westernize an Eastern game , they do barebones fixes , and updates to WASD movement system. Most times the reason why it feels sluggish is because of the lack of real terian or geodata in the game.

        Is WASD outdated for MMORPGs? It needs to be included no matter how you feel about it , because it brings mass appeal and some that gamers are use to. Most US gamers want the "thier way or the highway" most want some control over thier character , even if it is a disadvantage in PVP (because of Korean/Asian design).

        Its just normally a long road , to make it work decent in Korean MMORPGs.

  • SylvariusSylvarius Henderson, NVMember Posts: 69

    ok so after reading some of this, i just had to reply, how about instead of yelling and saying "no im right" "NO your wrong im right".  why dont you try explaining your position on the matter at hand.

    i personally feel WASD is an improvement, because it completely frees up your mouse to click about and not accidently disengage you from combat.  i have serious issues using the point-click movement style.  WASD is far far better. because ^^^^^^^^^^^^^



  • IdesofMarchIdesofMarch Columbus, OHMember Posts: 1,164


    Originally posted by Sylvarius
    ok so after reading some of this, i just had to reply, how about instead of yelling and saying "no im right" "NO your wrong im right".  why dont you try explaining your position on the matter at hand.



    And obviously you didn't read any of it because if you did you'd see that everyone has been explaining their position and/or opinions on the matter. It's called discussion. It's what we do here.

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  • DrowNobleDrowNoble Trenton, MIMember Posts: 1,296

    I will not say whether WASD is good or bad, but I will say that the movement in Archlord is "quirky".  It doesn't feel as smooth or intuitive as say WoW or CoX.  A lot of frantic clicking and button mashing sometimes to get my knight to move from Point A to Point B.

    They really need to fix this, movement is a basic thing in any MMOG and it just isn't that good in Archlord right now.

  • BladinBladin Seattle, WAMember UncommonPosts: 1,089
    i honestly can not stand point and click games.

    1.  It always has horrible pathing, its bad in l2, its bad in al, its bad in alot of games.  See that cliff? well im sorry but your characters too dumb to jump off it....time to run around!

    2.  It makes pvp pretty boring, i remember playing L2 alot as a melee character and most of the time i just started attacking a enemy, while i auto followed them, using my skills and whatnot.  Lots of fun there.

    3. It makes movement feel too fake.  Instead of controlling your character, you are just telling him where to go.  This is a big one for me here.  In a wasd movement game it gives you the feeling of hey im moving forward, hey im moving backwards, gotta turn.  Point and click leads you to the feeling of dragging your character along by a leash untill he finally gets to the spot he wanted.  Let alone its alot easier to judge distances in wasd during combat.

    4. It's easier to move, target, and control the camera while using skills with wasd.  Its DREADFULLY easy to use your active skills with wasd, at the same time moving.  But with point and click, its harder to do positionals, and generally most fights which aren't just chasing someone have 2 people standing face to face smacking each other.  FUN!  honestly wows game mechanics blow out ANY P&C dominated game on the market(not talking about the entire game, just its mechanics)...because it allows free flow combat.

    5. Picking up "dropped" loot with your mouse.  It sucks sometimes moving your character instead of just picking up. or as in ALs case sometimes some items are actually unable to be picked up without hovering your mouse over the item untill you find the one spot in its graphic that allows you to pick it up. 

    Point and click is outdated.

    Sure saying wasd is only for twitch games... well thats because twitch games are generally more fun, more stable, and are just more playable.  Archlord tho is one of the best that ive played, but its just not good enough to be worth paying for/buying imho. 


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  • GameloadingGameloading NAMember UncommonPosts: 14,182

    You can pick up loot with the space bar in AL, and most point & click games have a shortcut to pick up loot.

    also, how exactly is it more easy to target? You both use the mouse in WASD movement and Point & click. skills with wasd? sure, try holding "A" and hit the 9 or 0 key while holding your right hand on the mouse to change the camera.



  • GableGable Vancouver, BCMember UncommonPosts: 43

    GAMELOADING?!  Are you crazy?  Do you realize what a tiny, tiny minority you're by thinking that WASD is oudated?  Point and click is awful!  Ludicrously awful!  Why would I want to run straightforward everywhere instead of sidestepping, strafing, walking backwards, and most importantly, JUMPING!  I can't believe my ears.  I honestly would have said that no one on earth would choose point and click over WASD.  It blows my mind.  In fact, I think your lying!  You must be!  I...I....did I mention I can't believe my ears?  I think they're bleeding...yep, yep, they're bleeding.

    Wow.....just wow.     


  • ShineryuuShineryuu New York, NYMember Posts: 5

    point and clicks are almost 100% harcore grinds. Thus a point and click system. It has its benefits to hardcores, when I was hardcoreing in SRO or L2 a WSAD system would have been kind of dumb. As grinds require constant camera adjustments thus ur right hand and spamming skills require ur left hand. WSAD would make it kind of annoying... since you would need a third hand.

    point-click = grinding

    WSAD = smoother moving

    I'd like to see a game that has both able to be used inter-changeably and with enough benefits that players would have to use both in order to be efficient. SRO has a arrow system but too laggy for any use.

    of course, I haven't played this game yet, so whether or not the system/physics is 15 years out-of-date I've yet to see. All movements are technically boxes, but if it's boxy as you said eadu then the game makers definately did a sloppy job.

  • GameloadingGameloading NAMember UncommonPosts: 14,182


    Originally posted by Gable

    GAMELOADING?!  Are you crazy?  Do you realize what a tiny, tiny minority you're by thinking that WASD is oudated?  Point and click is awful!  Ludicrously awful!  Why would I want to run straightforward everywhere instead of sidestepping, strafing, walking backwards, and most importantly, JUMPING!  I can't believe my ears.  I honestly would have said that no one on earth would choose point and click over WASD.  It blows my mind.  In fact, I think your lying!  You must be!  I...I....did I mention I can't believe my ears?  I think they're bleeding...yep, yep, they're bleeding.

    Wow.....just wow.     



    really? shall we look at the facts?

    Lineage 2: Point & click game, 1,5 million subscribers
    Lineage: Point & click game, 1,5 million subscribers

    and then I don't even include hundreds of other MMO's in Korea. the majority of mmo players prefer point & click over WASD. (this is a wild geuss, but most likely is true. it is impossible to count the free to play MMO players)

    Why would I want to strafe, move backwards (when you can just turn around instantly in Point & click) and jump, when it is NOT necisary?
  • ShineryuuShineryuu New York, NYMember Posts: 5

    WSAD prolly will never be outdated.

    However, being Korean and a harcore mmorpg not mmo player. I have to say point and click is a grinder's preferred movement.

    If you disagree with me in that it's not for grinding, then I won't say ur a noob at mmorpgs cuz who knows maybe you're amazing but you're being too stubborn and bent up on WSAD.

    Btw, i frequent korean forums and I've seen topics similar to this but it usually divides itself into FPS or MMOmelee and MMORPG players. And finally they realize they like playing different types of games.

    Like I've said before WSAD is melee centered, or melee-like centered.

    and point and click games are grind-centered, usually theres no such thing as grind-like but just in case there is, grind-like centered.

  • Duncan.SCADuncan.SCA SeelscheidMember Posts: 7

    I also had to play it for some hours to get a little used to the movement...
    and I still think it's far away from being smooth. It happens quite a lot that I hang on rocks or fences.

    On any other MMO I like to play WASD. The point-and-klick is really useful sometimes (when you see where aou want to go and just click) but I think players should decide what style they play.

    If you waht to point-and-click, do so. But WASD should at least be possible.

  • havocthefirshavocthefirs bernville, PAMember Posts: 229
    Point and click and wasd both suck for movement. Hold down the right mouse button and wherever you move the mouse is your direction. It aint rocket science and it make movement a breeze.
  • ThekandyThekandy Henne stationsbyMember Posts: 621

    While we're at this "i'd prefer" discussion, why not make all mmoRPG's into exactly what they're implying, a role playing game in all aspects.
    To me, it's too fps-like.

    Oh and GAMELOADING, the only place where i'd see PnC as a real strength is in a adventure game (you know, monkey island) and a RPG, but since most console and online RPGs are a fusion of action and RPG, it may just be wishful thinking.
    You know GAMELOADING, im totally with you there, AL seems to be less action, more adventure, so a PnC only system might actually fit with succes.

    To Bladin.
    Sure, it does make lotta sense to just off the cliff, "Im kinda lazy today, i dont wanna walk around the cliff" he jumps, and a few seconds later he's a pile of mush. In a RPG it doesn't make the least to jump off a cliff, anyone who do should get ready to take the consequenses. But meh.... im apparently one of the few wanting RPG to be a genre for itself, instead of gradually being merged with the action genre.

  • JelloB2000JelloB2000 NAMember CommonPosts: 1,848


    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Gable
    GAMELOADING?! Are you crazy? Do you realize what a tiny, tiny minority you're by thinking that WASD is oudated? Point and click is awful! Ludicrously awful! Why would I want to run straightforward everywhere instead of sidestepping, strafing, walking backwards, and most importantly, JUMPING! I can't believe my ears. I honestly would have said that no one on earth would choose point and click over WASD. It blows my mind. In fact, I think your lying! You must be! I...I....did I mention I can't believe my ears? I think they're bleeding...yep, yep, they're bleeding.Wow.....just wow.
    really? shall we look at the facts?Lineage 2: Point & click game, 1,5 million subscribersLineage: Point & click game, 1,5 million subscribersand then I don't even include hundreds of other MMO's in Korea. the majority of mmo players prefer point & click over WASD. (this is a wild geuss, but most likely is true. it is impossible to count the free to play MMO players)Why would I want to strafe, move backwards (when you can just turn around instantly in Point & click) and jump, when it is NOT necisary?
    ....Why can it no be WASD & click movement Mr Archlord?

    Movement has nothing to do with financial success of a mmorpg except where it is lacking, like for example only WASD or only click-based. Technically one doesnt exclude the other but I guess you can come with an excuse for that aswell.

  • ShinyJonShinyJon Manassas, VAMember Posts: 1

    Have any of you ever read the Dr. Seuss book where there's a war going on between those who think butter should be on top of the toast and those who think butter should be on the bottom?


  • IdesofMarchIdesofMarch Columbus, OHMember Posts: 1,164


    Originally posted by ShinyJon
    Have any of you ever read the Dr. Seuss book where there's a war going on between those who think butter should be on top of the toast and those who think butter should be on the bottom?

    The Butter Battle Book. Are you saying this thread is about mutually assured destruction and nuclear weapons? I missed that part.

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  • bigoberlybigoberly spring field, MOMember Posts: 14


    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by xIMPx
    I'm not 100 percent sure but I think the WASD controls your characters movement. 
    NO! Really? :P

    No what I meant is that WASD adds some more "Twitch" to movement. this is important in games like shooters, but MMORPG´s don´t have any twitch in them.


           Any game that has pvp in it needs WASD to work well. I know 1 big problem with the  click to move controls if you cannt click on the ground you cant move, after all ther are going to be big wars in this game write.

    I know what your going to say well click on the person you want to kill and you will move to them well what if you are trying to move away, with the click movement you have less control over your guy it take longer to get around an obstical like a tree if you are write on top of it you have to move in strate lines.

    Anuther thing is WASD lest you straef this lest you look around you and still see whats in frunt of you.

    My point is if the game was all pve the click to move would be fine but for pvp its not a good movement system.

  • IIRLIIRL ABoatMember Posts: 876
    Face of Mankind is an MMORPG with FPS combat or you can switch to third... The game empathies on roleplaying to it's truest.

    I remember executing an assassination in brooklyn mall and comeplete lockdown was iniated. :DD


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    I CREATED MYSELF!
    <3 "<Claus|Dev> i r pk"

    SW:TOR|War40K:DMO|GW2

  • LostGraceLostGrace Douglassville, PAMember Posts: 380

    WASD sucks.


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  • IdesofMarchIdesofMarch Columbus, OHMember Posts: 1,164


    Originally posted by LostGrace
    WASD sucks IMO, which differs from millions of other people.  =]

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  • eadueadu phx, AZMember Posts: 7

    All of you have completely misunderstood this thread....I didn't start it to be a WASD vs. Point/Click.

    I started the thread because the movement is so blocky, choppy, unsmooth, and extremely unpleasant. It feels like you move in sqaures e.g. - the sqaures in a game like Civilization.

    It doesn't feel like a 2006 game....it feels like a 1992 game.

  • IdesofMarchIdesofMarch Columbus, OHMember Posts: 1,164


    Originally posted by eadu

    All of you have completely misunderstood this thread....I didn't start it to be a WASD vs. Point/Click.
    I started the thread because the movement is so blocky, choppy, unsmooth, and extremely unpleasant. It feels like you move in sqaures e.g. - the sqaures in a game like Civilization.

    It doesn't feel like a 2006 game....it feels like a 1992 game.


    No, we understood it. It's just that the conversation changed and people got into it. This happens when a  subject such as WASD vs. point-and-click is brought up.

    As for blocky and choppy...I don't know about that. It isn't perfect but it's far from horrible in my gaming experiences.

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  • KuzamaKuzama san diego, CAMember Posts: 3


    Originally posted by Gameloading
    awful!  Why would I want to run straightforward everywhere instead of sidestepping, strafing, walking backwards, and most importantly, JUMPING!  I can't believe my ears.  I honestly would have said that no one on earth would choose point and click over WASD.  It blows my mind.  In fact, I think your lying!  You must be!  I...I....did I mention I can't believe my ears?  I think they're bleeding...yep, yep, they're bleeding.

    Wow.....just wow.     

    Originally posted by Gable
    GAMELOADING?!  Are you crazy?  Do you realize what a tiny, tiny minority you're by thinking that WASD is oudated?  Point and click is awful!  Ludicrously
    really? shall we look at the facts?

    Lineage 2: Point & click game, 1,5 million subscribers
    Lineage: Point & click game, 1,5 million subscribers

    and then I don't even include hundreds of other MMO's in Korea. the majority of mmo players prefer point & click over WASD. (this is a wild geuss, but most likely is true. it is impossible to count the free to play MMO players)

    Why would I want to strafe, move backwards (when you can just turn around instantly in Point & click) and jump, when it is NOT necisary?



    *cough* WoW is WASD and sold over 6 MILLION copies *cough*

    Also the same 1.5 mil that played L1 bought L2... oh wait *cough*

  • obscuredobscured RaMember UncommonPosts: 62
    i dont think WASD or point & click make somenoe buy a game or not.. GET SERIUS

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  • IdesofMarchIdesofMarch Columbus, OHMember Posts: 1,164


    Originally posted by obscured
    i dont think WASD or point & click make somenoe buy a game or not.. GET SERIUS
    Actually, there probably are those out there that one-sided on the issue. It wouldn't surprise me anyways.

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