I agree , great review really did open up a bunch more quetsion, but it also answered more. to some of the comments on it being a class based system. I think were looking at more of a template system then anything. You go heavy plate wearing warrior, I think the way it will work is yoiu open up more options as you go along and gain xps. Wich in turn will open up differnt "templates" to borrow skills from.
Also about the non looting your fallen enemys, didn't he say near the end that you will beable to but it isn't taking the loot from their inventory its generating it as if they were a npc mob ? or did I totaly read this wrong.
I love the idea behind the tactics bar, its kinda like wargear...you decide what you want to roll out with, and then hope you chose right. This is extremely cool . All in all great read. Can't wait for E3...I think everyone is chomping at the bit for some movies, etc .
Fantastic article! I am frothing at the mouth for this game. I was excited to see it make its appearance and also that it was being spearheaded by Mythic. While I don't play DAoC at this time, I did for quite awhile and thoroughly enjoyed it.
This article/interview solidified my rabid excitement and I will be following teh development of this one each week!
Having seen this preview, but not being a fan of the Warhammer series, I must say I would buy and play this game for its excellent RvR potential.
Also, identifying lower level and higher level characters through visual differences I think is a great idea.
I have always preferred full collision detection since it makes your enemies seem like solid characters rather than "ghosts" which you can simply walk through.
Looting fallen enemies is also good -- without removing items from their inventory. (Although a small but loud minority of "FFA-PvP-Full Looting" players will consider this "Carebear" since their focus for PvP is not "fighting" but "griefing and ganking.")
Also:
"As players advance, the battles become more significant, culminating in an end-game where the outcome of battles allows sides to conquer territory and eventually – if they do well – sack their enemy’s capital city."
omg, this article is killing me! Release the game NOW imo!
I've been playing MMO's actively for the past 7 years or so, and I got to say this is the one that I'm most excited about so far, seeing how DAoC is still easily the best game around when it comes to pvp, even though it's what, 6 years old? I have faith in you Mythic, and I expect this game to make everyone forget the over-reclamated WoW (don't get me wrong, I have 3 wow accounts and my fair share of 60'ish, but the damn pve never even comes close in comparison to DAoC RvR)
And yes, GREAT work on the article, it really did answer alot of questions and got my hype up even more, even though I'm not so sure I should thank you for that. I was on the edge of going mad in wait for this game even before this article :P
Originally posted by rATIx Originally posted by sauna Excellent preview! Lots of cool information, well done, Dana.
I just hope they won't keep that collision detection. It just doesn't feel right, people blocking eachother. One of the reasons I don't play Guild Wars .
Can't wait for WAR, my MMO hunger has been craving for a game like this ever since I quit DAoC.
Everyone,please note that collision only applies to ENEMIES not your allies.
That's what I was thinking about as well. Even though Guild Wars is not a real MMO and the venues in which you fight are smaller I don't particularly like the concept of blocking and being able to hinder your enemies by just moving in front of them. Can imagine the frustration in the upcoming RvR-fights if collision detection makes retail. Perhaps it won't be such a big deal since we don't know the size of the battlefields and how group fights will be. Only speaking from experience with games that actually has used collision detection, none of which has been very fun for me to play at least.
It's not a real battle without collision detection. Being able to ghost thru enemies is one of the lamest features of any PvP game. It destroys immersion and actual tatics. I always felt DAOC would have been a majorly different and better game if they had just turned on collision detection. If WAR fails to use it then I feel the game looses an important advance and difference from DAOC. Perhaps they could turn it off in Green Zones, and possibly even Yellow Zones and only use it in Red Zones. The ability to actually block a door or choke point can fundementally change the way sieges and even duels are handled. No more ghosting thru an opponent , hitting /face and using a rear attack. That was always one of the lamest "features" of DAOC IMO.
Excellent article, game sounds more interesting to me than it did when announced. That's about as excited as I'm prepared to get just now! I don't think Mythic will have a choice regarding DX10/Vista compatibility when it comes down to it.
I'm thinking Blood Bowl should be the first expansion, complete with some confused Orcs as cheerleaders.
Great preview...and hopefully the game will be just as good.
But you guys are less than subtil, not that I blame you. But everyone who has been around for sometimes know your neutrality is true...except when it come down to Mythic! But you have the same right as everyone to be fanbois!
I am looking forward to Warhammer, even if I lost my hopes in some earlier comments about some stuff, who know...maybe they will prove me wrong.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
First off, let me say that this was a terrific write up, especially for how early into production they are. Im glad they were so open with you all this early in the process.
I remember playing 40K miniatures a bit quite a few years ago which introduced me to the Classic Warhammer setting that this MMO is based on. I really like the way they are going with it, and if they can pull it off, I think they will have an insanely popular game on their hands. The classic Warhammer univers is VERY dark and ..well.. rather harsh and evil. It has absolutely a TON of character. Keeping that level of character and mood while dialing back the harshness is absolutely the way to go here. Having said all that though, I do have a couple of concerns:
I played DAoC and imho (and an opinion shared by quite a few people I played with) Mythic absolutely droped the ball in terms of class balancing in a lot of areas. One particular thing that got under my skin was when they implemented the community's class leads. These were people who would talk to their respective class community, discuss the issues that were being faced by them and provide feedback to the developers to help aid in balancing RvR. This was great on paper, but in more than a few instances, these people were completely and totally ignored by the development team. It frustrated me to no end to play a class for literally 2 years or more and to STILL see the same issues being raised over and over again only to be ignored over and over again. This class balance issue is the A #1 issue that scares the crap out of me when I see Mythic's name on the Warhammer MMO title.
Issue #2 = Server Population Imbalances. The name speaks for itself. Once everyone and their little dog Toto see that one side or the other may be starting to get an edge, here come the band wagon jumpers. "OH, hey.. want to be on the winning zerg??" Come join <insert X race> on <insert Y server> There has GOT to be a way to keep things even, and I will tell you right here and now that NPC fighters will not even come close to cutting it. Will they help? Sure, maybe a very small bit in some isolated instances. However, that will NOT suffice in the grand scheme of things as a tool to balance an entire server population. One way would to only allow 1 character per server and then not allow characters to be created on a particular side once a 15-20% disparity began to crop up. Yes this is an extreme method, but after seeing how much server imbalances ruined a few DAoC servers, I would prefer it this way than the other.
I have more comments, but I will keep some to myself while some time goes by. There is obviously a lot of development time to come and we will just have to wait.
Apostle
P.S. I see people use the phrase Warhammer IP. What the heck does that mean? All I can think of when I see IP is Internet Protocol. (sue me.. Im a tech!)
Oh....and I guess a reply on topic would be nice......I agree with the previous poster. Mythic did alot of things right in Daoc. One thing they did wrong IMHO is their knee-jerk reaction to class balancing. I was really disappointed after ivesting alot of time into a charecter/class only to have my spec line nerf'ed, then buff'ed, then nerf'ed.........it all grew so tiring. I hope they work this out through testing and then stick to their guns...you can't make all of the people happy all of the time, which is what it seemed Mythic was trying to do in DaoC.
oh...and any word on 40K ?
Notice: The views expressed in this post are solely those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the views of MMORPG.com or its management.
Sorry man, but its called Dawn of War, and its an RTS.. not an MMO heh.
Speaking of RTS's there is also a Classic Warhammer RTS coming out as well . That being released this year may help spark some interest in the MMO if its a good one which it very well might be. I hear they are purpously trying for a Mature rating to try and capture how harsh the Classic Warhammer setting really is... which.... well it is.
well im psyched about this game! can't wait!, i want to see this game bloom into something beautiful ^-^. woot! lets get it started !! ... next year o.o
Why not 40k? Simply, I am not sure the license is available. Relic has a game license and I don't think they're selling the MMO license seperately.
Also, despite the success of Starcraft, I think you're vastly overestimating the sci-fi market. Star Wars Galaxies failed compared to what they thought they were going to get. Imperator never made it to release. EVE was the only space-game to thrive. From a bean counter's perspective, sci-fi MMOs are a risky market, while fantasy is a proven staple.
Dana Massey Formerly of MMORPG.com Currently Lead Designer for Bit Trap Studios
What I would like to know is how a company could "sell out" because they chose the supposedly less profiting setting. Honestly after reading the post you just made, I don't care how many you have made in the past, I just wasted my 2 min of reading it sadly. I say if Mythic wants to go fantasy let them do it, if you think about it there's alot more modern-day/futurealistic MMO's out there. I am currently playing Planetside and City of Villains and the modern day thing is starting to get very old, no matter how great the game is. Fantasy will hold gamers into WAR more than the sci-fi group
Question for Lepidus: do you know if Mythic will find a way to create an economy that will try to prevent out-of-game transactions for currency or power-leveling in-game? After hearing the most recent podcast it got me thinking that WoW's economy was completely ruined for 75% of players because it got so inflated from currency being so available. I can currently think of SO many games that have had economies ruined by out-of-game transactions.
Because it's so much easier to do fantasy mmorpg than sci-fi. If it were 40k then pretty much every character would have been ranged. Not everyone has heard of Warhammer 40k, people may just know that theres a tabletop game called Warhammer but not specifically Warhammer 40k or anything else.
Ugh. I knew when I saw the first screenshot that this was just a xerox copy of Warcraft with some color added. Seems like a waste of time to me. I'll have to wait for a demo video though to be sure.
Originally posted by thepatriot It's not a real battle without collision detection. Being able to ghost thru enemies is one of the lamest features of any PvP game. It destroys immersion and actual tatics. I always felt DAOC would have been a majorly different and better game if they had just turned on collision detection. If WAR fails to use it then I feel the game looses an important advance and difference from DAOC. Perhaps they could turn it off in Green Zones, and possibly even Yellow Zones and only use it in Red Zones. The ability to actually block a door or choke point can fundementally change the way sieges and even duels are handled. No more ghosting thru an opponent , hitting /face and using a rear attack. That was always one of the lamest "features" of DAOC IMO.
The disabled collision detection in DAoC is not just a technical shortcoming. It was also a deliberate choice to make it impossible to block 'friendly' players to pin them down - just like they turned off 'friendly fire'. That aside, if you know a thing or two about collision detection and lag compensation (movement prediction), you can imagine why collision detection in a fast-paced PvP environment with the usual variable MMO connection latency complicates the movement prediction part of the client software.
Comments
I agree , great review really did open up a bunch more quetsion, but it also answered more. to some of the comments on it being a class based system. I think were looking at more of a template system then anything. You go heavy plate wearing warrior, I think the way it will work is yoiu open up more options as you go along and gain xps. Wich in turn will open up differnt "templates" to borrow skills from.
Also about the non looting your fallen enemys, didn't he say near the end that you will beable to but it isn't taking the loot from their inventory its generating it as if they were a npc mob ? or did I totaly read this wrong.
I love the idea behind the tactics bar, its kinda like wargear...you decide what you want to roll out with, and then hope you chose right. This is extremely cool . All in all great read. Can't wait for E3...I think everyone is chomping at the bit for some movies, etc .
Fantastic article! I am frothing at the mouth for this game. I was excited to see it make its appearance and also that it was being spearheaded by Mythic. While I don't play DAoC at this time, I did for quite awhile and thoroughly enjoyed it.
This article/interview solidified my rabid excitement and I will be following teh development of this one each week!
Having seen this preview, but not being a fan of the Warhammer series, I must say I would buy and play this game for its excellent RvR potential.
Also, identifying lower level and higher level characters through visual differences I think is a great idea.
I have always preferred full collision detection since it makes your enemies seem like solid characters rather than "ghosts" which you can simply walk through.
Looting fallen enemies is also good -- without removing items from their inventory. (Although a small but loud minority of "FFA-PvP-Full Looting" players will consider this "Carebear" since their focus for PvP is not "fighting" but "griefing and ganking.")
Also:
"As players advance, the battles become more significant, culminating in an end-game where the outcome of battles allows sides to conquer territory and eventually – if they do well – sack their enemy’s capital city."
Conquering territory and sacking capital cities.
~ Ancient Membership ~
Release the game NOW imo!
I've been playing MMO's actively for the past 7 years or so, and I got to say
this is the one that I'm most excited about so far, seeing how DAoC
is still easily the best game around when it comes to pvp, even
though it's what, 6 years old?
I have faith in you Mythic, and I expect this game to make everyone
forget the over-reclamated WoW
3 wow accounts and my fair share of 60'ish, but the damn pve
never even comes close in comparison to DAoC RvR)
And yes, GREAT work on the article, it really did answer alot of questions and got my
hype up even more, even though I'm not so sure I should thank you for that.
I was on the edge of going mad in wait for this game even before this article :P
~~ The one and only from the sundsvall elite ~~
That's what I was thinking about as well. Even though Guild Wars is not a real MMO and the venues in which you fight are smaller I don't particularly like the concept of blocking and being able to hinder your enemies by just moving in front of them.
Can imagine the frustration in the upcoming RvR-fights if collision detection makes retail. Perhaps it won't be such a big deal since we don't know the size of the battlefields and how group fights will be. Only speaking from experience with games that actually has used collision detection, none of which has been very fun for me to play at least.
http://kompaniet.mine.nu :+: #kompaniet @ QuakeNet
It's not a real battle without collision detection. Being able to ghost thru enemies is one of the lamest features of any PvP game. It destroys immersion and actual tatics. I always felt DAOC would have been a majorly different and better game if they had just turned on collision detection. If WAR fails to use it then I feel the game looses an important advance and difference from DAOC. Perhaps they could turn it off in Green Zones, and possibly even Yellow Zones and only use it in Red Zones. The ability to actually block a door or choke point can fundementally change the way sieges and even duels are handled. No more ghosting thru an opponent , hitting /face and using a rear attack. That was always one of the lamest "features" of DAOC IMO.
I'm thinking Blood Bowl should be the first expansion, complete with some confused Orcs as cheerleaders.
the dwarves may need to feed a giant BEER so that he’ll go on a rampage against the orcs
I wonder if that was a slip of the tongue considering it was DWARVES
Farok
Great preview...and hopefully the game will be just as good.
But you guys are less than subtil, not that I blame you. But everyone who has been around for sometimes know your neutrality is true...except when it come down to Mythic! But you have the same right as everyone to be fanbois!
I am looking forward to Warhammer, even if I lost my hopes in some earlier comments about some stuff, who know...maybe they will prove me wrong.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
First off, let me say that this was a terrific write up, especially for how early into production they are. Im glad they were so open with you all this early in the process.
I remember playing 40K miniatures a bit quite a few years ago which introduced me to the Classic Warhammer setting that this MMO is based on. I really like the way they are going with it, and if they can pull it off, I think they will have an insanely popular game on their hands. The classic Warhammer univers is VERY dark and ..well.. rather harsh and evil. It has absolutely a TON of character. Keeping that level of character and mood while dialing back the harshness is absolutely the way to go here. Having said all that though, I do have a couple of concerns:
I played DAoC and imho (and an opinion shared by quite a few people I played with) Mythic absolutely droped the ball in terms of class balancing in a lot of areas. One particular thing that got under my skin was when they implemented the community's class leads. These were people who would talk to their respective class community, discuss the issues that were being faced by them and provide feedback to the developers to help aid in balancing RvR. This was great on paper, but in more than a few instances, these people were completely and totally ignored by the development team. It frustrated me to no end to play a class for literally 2 years or more and to STILL see the same issues being raised over and over again only to be ignored over and over again. This class balance issue is the A #1 issue that scares the crap out of me when I see Mythic's name on the Warhammer MMO title.
Issue #2 = Server Population Imbalances. The name speaks for itself. Once everyone and their little dog Toto see that one side or the other may be starting to get an edge, here come the band wagon jumpers. "OH, hey.. want to be on the winning zerg??" Come join <insert X race> on <insert Y server> There has GOT to be a way to keep things even, and I will tell you right here and now that NPC fighters will not even come close to cutting it. Will they help? Sure, maybe a very small bit in some isolated instances. However, that will NOT suffice in the grand scheme of things as a tool to balance an entire server population.
One way would to only allow 1 character per server and then not allow characters to be created on a particular side once a 15-20% disparity began to crop up. Yes this is an extreme method, but after seeing how much server imbalances ruined a few DAoC servers, I would prefer it this way than the other.
I have more comments, but I will keep some to myself while some time goes by. There is obviously a lot of development time to come and we will just have to wait.
Apostle
P.S. I see people use the phrase Warhammer IP. What the heck does that mean? All I can think of when I see IP is Internet Protocol. (sue me.. Im a tech!)
Notice: The views expressed in this post are solely those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the views of MMORPG.com or its management.
Oh....and I guess a reply on topic would be nice......I agree with the previous poster. Mythic did alot of things right in Daoc. One thing they did wrong IMHO is their knee-jerk reaction to class balancing. I was really disappointed after ivesting alot of time into a charecter/class only to have my spec line nerf'ed, then buff'ed, then nerf'ed.........it all grew so tiring. I hope they work this out through testing and then stick to their guns...you can't make all of the people happy all of the time, which is what it seemed Mythic was trying to do in DaoC.
oh...and any word on 40K ?
Notice: The views expressed in this post are solely those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the views of MMORPG.com or its management.
Sorry man, but its called Dawn of War, and its an RTS.. not an MMO heh.
Speaking of RTS's there is also a Classic Warhammer RTS coming out as well . That being released this year may help spark some interest in the MMO if its a good one which it very well might be. I hear they are purpously trying for a Mature rating to try and capture how harsh the Classic Warhammer setting really is... which.... well it is.
www.roxstudiodesigns.com
They make an all-out PvP game and honestly believe PvE players will play it? Watch me prove them wrong.
On the bright side, perhaps the communities in other games improve when PvP players move to this thing.
Also, despite the success of Starcraft, I think you're vastly overestimating the sci-fi market. Star Wars Galaxies failed compared to what they thought they were going to get. Imperator never made it to release. EVE was the only space-game to thrive. From a bean counter's perspective, sci-fi MMOs are a risky market, while fantasy is a proven staple.
Dana Massey
Formerly of MMORPG.com
Currently Lead Designer for Bit Trap Studios
Because it's so much easier to do fantasy mmorpg than sci-fi. If it were 40k then pretty much every character would have been ranged. Not everyone has heard of Warhammer 40k, people may just know that theres a tabletop game called Warhammer but not specifically Warhammer 40k or anything else.