I'll be honest, this is a moment where I wish Blizzard would stick to their guns on keep the game as is in terms of Classic. People wanted it so they have to accept both the GOOD and the BAD. Simple as that. Of course there could've been a lot of things added/adjusted so on and so forth but people screaming for classic should realize it wasn't perfect and deal with it if they want it bad enough. It'll be official so they wont have to worry about logging in one day and their character is gone like they might have to on private servers. If they start changing "little" things then people will keep QQ'ing about what else should change, so just leave everything as is that isnt going to technically impair the game beyond playability.
If i were Blizzard and i wanted to balance the classes, I wouldn't announce it ofc; remember, the private servers we have are trying to reverse engineer the mechanics behind each class. This may lead to a vanilla-like feeling, but only Blizzard themselves have the actual vanilla code and the numbers/coefficients behind each skill/talent.
So if i wanted to make the game more balanced, I would tweak the numbers in that code (not doing anything extreme) without saying anything about it. Nobody would know it would have happened (not even the "purists") but the actual game would be more balanced.
EDIT:
For example, look at these inferred spell coefficients for Paladin skills:
94.90%
Consecration
42.90%
Hammer of Wrath
Holy Shield - 5% per charge (unknown derivation)
42.90%
Flash of Light
71.40%
Holy Light
42.90%
Holy Shock
42.90%
Exorcism
28.60%
Holy wrath
42.90%
Judgement of Command
73.00%
Judgement of Righteousness
20.00%
Seal of Command
Seal of Righteousness - depends on weapon and weapon speed:
Coefficients are 9.2% per 1.0 Speed for 1H and 10.8% per 1.0 Speed for 2H
You really think people would know a change had been implemented if you tweaked those values +-20% to boost paladin dps? They would have to assume it eventually after studying DPS meters but in all likelihood, the feel of vanilla wouldn't be disrupted from such a change.
I realize changing talents in significant way might ruin "muh vanilla" for some, but mere number tweaks are not enough to fix the mess that were vanilla talents.
Blizzard has to make a very difficult choice, whether they fix things and piss off purists or keep them "broken" to make it more vanilla, but have half the specs raid non-viable.
There is no difficult choice - broken things will be fixed, even the purists who say they hate this know that it is a necessity for longterm success.
Things are not that simple. "Fixing things necessary for longterm success" are what turned WoW into what it is today.
The people who would play on the Vanilla server already accepts the game as it was. The good and the bad.
If Blizzard makes changes then doesn't it stop being vanilla and become something in between vanilla and the current build?
Sounds like to me we are in this marketing world of redefining common ideas for $$.
"Hey, lets call it vanilla, but the game mechanics will be of the current version....minus some of the later content....and we get to charge for it.
Like I had said in a previous posting, this isn't going to be WoW as it was. It will most likely end up as WoW: classic remastered. Things are going to be updated in some way.
Also the main reason of why this was a bad idea is starting to show. The community that was interested in this idea is fractured on what makes the ideal classic experience, and when you are dealing with as large of a group as this you are bound to upset a large majority of people.
Few months ago i played on "Vanilla" server. Was fun at the start but then things started to come back what was bad back then. I mean, back then it was all good cause we didnt know for better but as for me i would not touch the classes a lot at all. Maybe give paladins and druids chance to be main tanks in raid cause back then warrior was the only one or give priest buff in shadow spec so they can be a bit useful as dps and not just the healing bots. But what i would love to see is a leveling curve beet tweaked. Meaning that we can have enough quests not to bounce around the world and end up in grinding levels. Also the spawn timers need to be changed. Back then you had to wait 45 min to have named boss spawn for a quest. That is not something that will change WOW from the 2004 but also we all know the world and we know where to go and what to do. We do not even need quest trackers tbh.
If i were Blizzard and i wanted to balance the classes, I wouldn't announce it ofc; remember, the private servers we have are trying to reverse engineer the mechanics behind each class. This may lead to a vanilla-like feeling, but only Blizzard themselves have the actual vanilla code and the numbers/coefficients behind each skill/talent.
So if i wanted to make the game more balanced, I would tweak the numbers in that code (not doing anything extreme) without saying anything about it. Nobody would know it would have happened (not even the "purists") but the actual game would be more balanced.
EDIT:
For example, look at these inferred spell coefficients for Paladin skills:
94.90%
Consecration
42.90%
Hammer of Wrath
Holy Shield - 5% per charge (unknown derivation)
42.90%
Flash of Light
71.40%
Holy Light
42.90%
Holy Shock
42.90%
Exorcism
28.60%
Holy wrath
42.90%
Judgement of Command
73.00%
Judgement of Righteousness
20.00%
Seal of Command
Seal of Righteousness - depends on weapon and weapon speed:
Coefficients are 9.2% per 1.0 Speed for 1H and 10.8% per 1.0 Speed for 2H
You really think people would know a change had been implemented if you tweaked those values +-20% to boost paladin dps? They would have to assume it eventually after studying DPS meters but in all likelihood, the feel of vanilla wouldn't be disrupted from such a change.
People would notice literally immediately. I honestly don't care what they do, but if you up any class or spec's potential DPS output by 20% people are going to notice very quickly.
boost the coefficients by 20% not the total dps output.
I think this is why Classic servers are always a bad idea. MMORPG games are never really finished. They're a perpetual work in progress, and WoW had tons of issues early in its lifecycle. A lot of that has been fixed since then. Things like "Hybrid Tax" were big issues. Also, the way WoW handled Resists was, IMO, worse than EverQuest - which led to people farming full sets of resist gear just to raid.
With the stat squish coming in the next expansion, it will almost feel like classic. I'm not really interested in this, because I'm not strong enough to delude myself into thinking expansion-less WoW was really that good. Compared to the competition, sure. But compared to what it is now... Not quite.
Plus, a lot of those people who played back then do not play anymore, so that's a massive component of the Classic experience that will be missing. You can put expansion-less WoW on a server, but you cannot bring that community back. It's gone - forever.
It will be hilarious to see how people react when they are reminded that half the specs in the game were borderline worthless back then.
I think this is why Classic servers are always a bad idea. MMORPG games are never really finished. They're a perpetual work in progress, and WoW had tons of issues early in its lifecycle. A lot of that has been fixed since then. Things like "Hybrid Tax" were big issues. Also, the way WoW handled Resists was, IMO, worse than EverQuest - which led to people farming full sets of resist gear just to raid.
With the stat squish coming in the next expansion, it will almost feel like classic. I'm not really interested in this, because I'm not strong enough to delude myself into thinking expansion-less WoW was really that good. Compared to the competition, sure. But compared to what it is now... Not quite.
Plus, a lot of those people who played back then do not play anymore, so that's a massive component of the Classic experience that will be missing. You can put expansion-less WoW on a server, but you cannot bring that community back. It's gone - forever.
It will be hilarious to see how people react when they are reminded that half the specs in the game were borderline worthless back then.
You are correct in your last paragraph. Everyone wants a return to exactly how classic was but unless they hire the EXACT same team and do the EXACT same things, it will not be the same. Also the people who played in classic are 12 years older. Those who raided and played for hours on end are older now and a vast majority have responsibilities, so they most likely will not play like they used to. All of it is nostalgia, quite frankly.
Part of the fun/charm was how useless half the specs were.
Why even have them then? Everyone already knows what and how to spec so why have useless filler?
Flavor! "Useless" was never really true, just "sub-optimal" but part of the fun was clearing content with classes/specs you weren't "supposed to" as a challenge.
There are a couple groups of people who will be interested in WoW: Classic.
1. People who didn't play and want to see the "world" pre-Cataclysm.
I am in this group. I will be interested in seeing all of the changes, both in landscape and questlines, that were either changed or retired. Most of us are current players that didn't get to play Vanilla when it was current content. I believe this group of people will have only a temporary interest. Once we've seen all there is to see, we are done with Classic. Our main game will still be current expansion WoW.
2. People who played Vanilla and are disappointed with the changes in WoW since "X" expansion.
These are your hardcore folks who liked farming for arrows as hunters. The complexity and pace of Vanilla was where they liked it, and they immediately got butthurt when Blizz created expansions and "dumbed down" the content so more people could access the game. They are still secretly fuming that they had to jump through endless hoops to get gear or titles that are now practically given to new players. They want the world the way it was. Some of them may be satisfied with WoW: Classic. My guess is, their interest in it will also be short-lived. There just won't be as many people to dominate as they were used to. Many of these in this group are elitists.
3. People who were good at taking advantage of other players.
This group will be sadly disappointed. Any changes forthcoming will certainly close all known exploits and vulnerabilities. That group will likely not be happy with Classic, especially when they find out that they will have to pay for it. Blizzard will never allow their IP or servers to be compromised in the ways it was in the past. It would be foolish for them to accept that, and foolish for people to think that would be OK. This group of people will be short-lived as well, and this effort may result in many banned accounts. Blizz is pretty serious about their TOS.
People would notice literally immediately. I honestly don't care what they do, but if you up any class or spec's potential DPS output by 20% people are going to notice very quickly.
boost the coefficients by 20% not the total dps output.
It's still going to increase damage output by a noticeable amount, if it didn't what would be the point?
Your basically saying that they could boost the numbers and no one would notice because only Blizzard know the actual original numbers. But, we are going to notice when suddenly Ret Pally or Enhance Shaman are viable DPS specs when they never were in Vanilla.
There's no scenario where they could silently attempt to balance out useless specs and have us not notice, unless they changed it so little as to make the changes meaningless.
Random example: if a 40% coefficient is boosted by 20%, the final coefficient will be 48%.
So a base ability that does 100 base damage +40 = 140 will now do 148. That's about 5.7% damage increase. In truth it will be even less, because the coefficients apply to spells and abilities that are complementary to physical attacks x times per minute and not 100% of the damage output.
Balancing out role viability does not mean disrupting class balance; A paladin doing 5.7% extra damage might be more viable to join a raid, but will still be out-dpsed by the pure dps classes. He will still be denied a raid spot by the "elite" guilds but might find it easier to join as dps some less elitist guilds.
Another example: in Nostalrius Consecration was (erronesouly?) getting damage boost from attack power and not spell damage. Did anyone complain?
If people are serious about wanting to play vanilla WoW, then that's exactly what they should get. They shouldn't get balance changes or quality of life improvements. They should get the classic experience.
If you play a pally you don't get to dps, tank, or heal. You buff and rebuff all day. That's it. Oh and you auto attack while leveling.
If you play a warlock you delete your character.
If you play a hunter you get all the weapons and aggro all the mobs.
If you play a shaman, you heal in pve and one-shot people with frostshock in pvp.
If you play a mage you make water, sheep, and spec fire. You also macro "OOM" to #1.
If you play a druid, you are resto and OOM within 10 seconds. Innervate is reserved for the priest.
If you play a priest you are holy. And a dwarf/undead.
If you play a warrior you are prot. Get 4 stacks of sunder asap. In pvp you are rooted the entire match while looking at your Mortal Strike button longingly, you just want to press it one time, just one. But you can't.
If you play a rogue everyone hates you, but you win cause you're a skilled ninja and they're all noobs.
If you want to raid you need to hire an administrative assistant to book everyone's calendars for the same night. Then you spend 4-6 hours waiting on people to use the bathroom, random conversations that don't stop, and DKP or loot councils that ensure you won't get loot for the next year, and when you do, it will be bracers.
If you want to pvp, you either join the pvp collusion ring that account shares and play a chosen character 24/7 in weekly rotations in order to hit GM, or you just play what you can and hit a wall. Unless you're capable of staying up all day every day for a month or so (and don't have a job).
Awesome post! Clicking the awesome button just wasn't enough.
So to summarize since it has been a decade since I last played vanilla WOW and my memory just isn't what it used to be... as an alliance loyalist I should go Priest? Or are you saying I think I want a vanilla warlock but I don't?
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I'm fine with some tweaking and balancing. The way I look at it is if the game back then kept going on without the devs working on new content, expansions, etc, they would have put time into balancing and fixing bugs. So the changes would have eventually happened anyway, but it would not have morphed into what we have today without the level increases and content.
I'm more interested in how the systems worked back then before cataclysm and would welcome changes that balance and fix issues.
It is kind of like in EQ1 on the progression servers. It would be frustrating to play without a shared bank or the advanced loot.
I think this will be a repeat of the 1985 coke, new coke, classic coke __________. We will have vanilla wow, new wow, and now classic wow. If it doesn't feel like vanilla wow, might only just check it out. To hell with the QOL, ez-mode, and major change Aholes out there.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
When it comes to classic wow I would be happy with updated high rez character models .. and that is it (may as well make it look nice) as far as the class balance .. leave it as it was in Vanilla .. Broken .. it added a level of game play. That is how it was back then .. Don't like it .. don't play it
I realize changing talents in significant way might ruin "muh vanilla" for some, but mere number tweaks are not enough to fix the mess that were vanilla talents.
Blizzard has to make a very difficult choice, whether they fix things and piss off purists or keep them "broken" to make it more vanilla, but have half the specs raid non-viable.
There is no difficult choice - broken things will be fixed, even the purists who say they hate this know that it is a necessity for longterm success.
Things are not that simple. "Fixing things necessary for long term success" are what turned WoW into what it is today.
Not that simple I suggest.
BC only - only - added two new races, level 60-70 spells and the removal of faction specific classes (plus associated changes that resulted). Arguably BC didn't increase the number of classes so - in the grand scheme of things - wasn't that big a deal. Not everyone will agree but big picture view: minor.
WotLK though introduced the Death Knight. And in true mmo expansion fashion it was the fotm class. And in true mmo post-expansion fashion it was then toned down.
And so it went on with further cycles of new fotm classes and nerfs to the others.
Its the expansions that turned WoW into what it is today. And insofar as "expansions" were required for long term success yes then OK.
If you do the "fixes" without the expansions though then, I suggest, it would be different.
I realize changing talents in significant way might ruin "muh vanilla" for some, but mere number tweaks are not enough to fix the mess that were vanilla talents.
Blizzard has to make a very difficult choice, whether they fix things and piss off purists or keep them "broken" to make it more vanilla, but have half the specs raid non-viable.
There is no difficult choice - broken things will be fixed, even the purists who say they hate this know that it is a necessity for longterm success.
Things are not that simple. "Fixing things necessary for long term success" are what turned WoW into what it is today.
Not that simple I suggest.
BC only - only - added two new races, level 60-70 spells and the removal of faction specific classes (plus associated changes that resulted). Arguably BC didn't increase the number of classes so - in the grand scheme of things - wasn't that big a deal. Not everyone will agree but big picture view: minor.
WotLK though introduced the Death Knight. And in true mmo expansion fashion it was the fotm class. And in true mmo post-expansion fashion it was then toned down.
And so it went on with further cycles of new fotm classes and nerfs to the others.
Its the expansions that turned WoW into what it is today. And insofar as "expansions" were required for long term success yes then OK.
If you do the "fixes" without the expansions though then, I suggest, it would be different.
BC it put the game in a direction that I personally disliked.
Giving in to the shaman/paladin faction thing.
The shared capital city
Introducing resilience which further segregated the PvP from the rest of the game.
Vanilla gave me an awesome virtual world feel and starting with BC that feeling began to die.
I realize changing talents in significant way might ruin "muh vanilla" for some, but mere number tweaks are not enough to fix the mess that were vanilla talents.
Blizzard has to make a very difficult choice, whether they fix things and piss off purists or keep them "broken" to make it more vanilla, but have half the specs raid non-viable.
There is no difficult choice - broken things will be fixed, even the purists who say they hate this know that it is a necessity for longterm success.
Things are not that simple. "Fixing things necessary for long term success" are what turned WoW into what it is today.
Not that simple I suggest.
BC only - only - added two new races, level 60-70 spells and the removal of faction specific classes (plus associated changes that resulted). Arguably BC didn't increase the number of classes so - in the grand scheme of things - wasn't that big a deal. Not everyone will agree but big picture view: minor.
WotLK though introduced the Death Knight. And in true mmo expansion fashion it was the fotm class. And in true mmo post-expansion fashion it was then toned down.
And so it went on with further cycles of new fotm classes and nerfs to the others.
Its the expansions that turned WoW into what it is today. And insofar as "expansions" were required for long term success yes then OK.
If you do the "fixes" without the expansions though then, I suggest, it would be different.
BC it put the game in a direction that I personally disliked.
Giving in to the shaman/paladin faction thing.
The shared capital city
Introducing resilience which further segregated the PvP from the rest of the game.
Vanilla gave me an awesome virtual world feel and starting with BC that feeling began to die.
But it seems that people want to "fix" the classic wow away from what you and I want.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
I realize changing talents in significant way might ruin "muh vanilla" for some, but mere number tweaks are not enough to fix the mess that were vanilla talents.
Blizzard has to make a very difficult choice, whether they fix things and piss off purists or keep them "broken" to make it more vanilla, but have half the specs raid non-viable.
There is no difficult choice - broken things will be fixed, even the purists who say they hate this know that it is a necessity for longterm success.
Things are not that simple. "Fixing things necessary for long term success" are what turned WoW into what it is today.
Not that simple I suggest.
BC only - only - added two new races, level 60-70 spells and the removal of faction specific classes (plus associated changes that resulted). Arguably BC didn't increase the number of classes so - in the grand scheme of things - wasn't that big a deal. Not everyone will agree but big picture view: minor.
WotLK though introduced the Death Knight. And in true mmo expansion fashion it was the fotm class. And in true mmo post-expansion fashion it was then toned down.
And so it went on with further cycles of new fotm classes and nerfs to the others.
Its the expansions that turned WoW into what it is today. And insofar as "expansions" were required for long term success yes then OK.
If you do the "fixes" without the expansions though then, I suggest, it would be different.
BC it put the game in a direction that I personally disliked.
Giving in to the shaman/paladin faction thing.
The shared capital city
Introducing resilience which further segregated the PvP from the rest of the game.
Vanilla gave me an awesome virtual world feel and starting with BC that feeling began to die.
But it seems that people want to "fix" the classic wow away from what you and I want.
Didn't they already get that?
It would be very interesting to see the game evolve from Vanilla following the original tenets of the game.
I realize changing talents in significant way might ruin "muh vanilla" for some, but mere number tweaks are not enough to fix the mess that were vanilla talents.
Blizzard has to make a very difficult choice, whether they fix things and piss off purists or keep them "broken" to make it more vanilla, but have half the specs raid non-viable.
There is no difficult choice - broken things will be fixed, even the purists who say they hate this know that it is a necessity for longterm success.
Things are not that simple. "Fixing things necessary for long term success" are what turned WoW into what it is today.
Not that simple I suggest.
BC only - only - added two new races, level 60-70 spells and the removal of faction specific classes (plus associated changes that resulted). Arguably BC didn't increase the number of classes so - in the grand scheme of things - wasn't that big a deal. Not everyone will agree but big picture view: minor.
WotLK though introduced the Death Knight. And in true mmo expansion fashion it was the fotm class. And in true mmo post-expansion fashion it was then toned down.
And so it went on with further cycles of new fotm classes and nerfs to the others.
Its the expansions that turned WoW into what it is today. And insofar as "expansions" were required for long term success yes then OK.
If you do the "fixes" without the expansions though then, I suggest, it would be different.
BC it put the game in a direction that I personally disliked.
Giving in to the shaman/paladin faction thing.
The shared capital city
Introducing resilience which further segregated the PvP from the rest of the game.
Vanilla gave me an awesome virtual world feel and starting with BC that feeling began to die.
But it seems that people want to "fix" the classic wow away from what you and I want.
Didn't they already get that?
It would be very interesting to see the game evolve from Vanilla following the original tenets of the game.
Who was it Torval that suggested they need a new team to make the expacs from classic wow in the same style of mechanics as vanilla? That could be good.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Comments
I don't think the people shouting for "Vanilla Servers" are shouting for "Vanilla Servers but with changes".
It's like Blizzard is listening but then their "developer senses" won't allow them to release something they know is flawed.
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So if i wanted to make the game more balanced, I would tweak the numbers in that code (not doing anything extreme) without saying anything about it. Nobody would know it would have happened (not even the "purists") but the actual game would be more balanced.
EDIT:
For example, look at these inferred spell coefficients for Paladin skills:
You really think people would know a change had been implemented if you tweaked those values +-20% to boost paladin dps? They would have to assume it eventually after studying DPS meters but in all likelihood, the feel of vanilla wouldn't be disrupted from such a change.
Like I had said in a previous posting, this isn't going to be WoW as it was. It will most likely end up as WoW: classic remastered. Things are going to be updated in some way.
Also the main reason of why this was a bad idea is starting to show. The community that was interested in this idea is fractured on what makes the ideal classic experience, and when you are dealing with as large of a group as this you are bound to upset a large majority of people.
/Cheers,
Lahnmir
Kyleran on yours sincerely
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Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
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With the stat squish coming in the next expansion, it will almost feel like classic. I'm not really interested in this, because I'm not strong enough to delude myself into thinking expansion-less WoW was really that good. Compared to the competition, sure. But compared to what it is now... Not quite.
Plus, a lot of those people who played back then do not play anymore, so that's a massive component of the Classic experience that will be missing. You can put expansion-less WoW on a server, but you cannot bring that community back. It's gone - forever. It will be hilarious to see how people react when they are reminded that half the specs in the game were borderline worthless back then.
Part of the fun/charm was how useless half the specs were.
You are correct in your last paragraph. Everyone wants a return to exactly how classic was but unless they hire the EXACT same team and do the EXACT same things, it will not be the same. Also the people who played in classic are 12 years older. Those who raided and played for hours on end are older now and a vast majority have responsibilities, so they most likely will not play like they used to. All of it is nostalgia, quite frankly.
Ask your four kids what they would like for dinner.
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1. People who didn't play and want to see the "world" pre-Cataclysm.
I am in this group. I will be interested in seeing all of the changes, both in landscape and questlines, that were either changed or retired. Most of us are current players that didn't get to play Vanilla when it was current content. I believe this group of people will have only a temporary interest. Once we've seen all there is to see, we are done with Classic. Our main game will still be current expansion WoW.
2. People who played Vanilla and are disappointed with the changes in WoW since "X" expansion.
These are your hardcore folks who liked farming for arrows as hunters. The complexity and pace of Vanilla was where they liked it, and they immediately got butthurt when Blizz created expansions and "dumbed down" the content so more people could access the game. They are still secretly fuming that they had to jump through endless hoops to get gear or titles that are now practically given to new players. They want the world the way it was. Some of them may be satisfied with WoW: Classic. My guess is, their interest in it will also be short-lived. There just won't be as many people to dominate as they were used to. Many of these in this group are elitists.
3. People who were good at taking advantage of other players.
This group will be sadly disappointed. Any changes forthcoming will certainly close all known exploits and vulnerabilities. That group will likely not be happy with Classic, especially when they find out that they will have to pay for it. Blizzard will never allow their IP or servers to be compromised in the ways it was in the past. It would be foolish for them to accept that, and foolish for people to think that would be OK. This group of people will be short-lived as well, and this effort may result in many banned accounts. Blizz is pretty serious about their TOS.
So a base ability that does 100 base damage +40 = 140 will now do 148. That's about 5.7% damage increase. In truth it will be even less, because the coefficients apply to spells and abilities that are complementary to physical attacks x times per minute and not 100% of the damage output.
Balancing out role viability does not mean disrupting class balance; A paladin doing 5.7% extra damage might be more viable to join a raid, but will still be out-dpsed by the pure dps classes. He will still be denied a raid spot by the "elite" guilds but might find it easier to join as dps some less elitist guilds.
Another example: in Nostalrius Consecration was (erronesouly?) getting damage boost from attack power and not spell damage. Did anyone complain?
So to summarize since it has been a decade since I last played vanilla WOW and my memory just isn't what it used to be... as an alliance loyalist I should go Priest? Or are you saying I think I want a vanilla warlock but I don't?
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
mages? full frost .....spam frostbolt for 3h....and later on fireball until u are bored to tears...
pld had it worse , keep blessings up ....seal for mana (wand autoattack ftw!)
hunter? lawl autoattack afk
oh and 1 healer OUT OF COMBAT for rezs yay!
I'm more interested in how the systems worked back then before cataclysm and would welcome changes that balance and fix issues.
It is kind of like in EQ1 on the progression servers. It would be frustrating to play without a shared bank or the advanced loot.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
BC only - only - added two new races, level 60-70 spells and the removal of faction specific classes (plus associated changes that resulted). Arguably BC didn't increase the number of classes so - in the grand scheme of things - wasn't that big a deal. Not everyone will agree but big picture view: minor.
WotLK though introduced the Death Knight. And in true mmo expansion fashion it was the fotm class. And in true mmo post-expansion fashion it was then toned down.
And so it went on with further cycles of new fotm classes and nerfs to the others.
Its the expansions that turned WoW into what it is today. And insofar as "expansions" were required for long term success yes then OK.
If you do the "fixes" without the expansions though then, I suggest, it would be different.
Giving in to the shaman/paladin faction thing.
The shared capital city
Introducing resilience which further segregated the PvP from the rest of the game.
Vanilla gave me an awesome virtual world feel and starting with BC that feeling began to die.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
But it seems that people want to "fix" the classic wow away from what you and I want.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
It would be very interesting to see the game evolve from Vanilla following the original tenets of the game.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
Who was it Torval that suggested they need a new team to make the expacs from classic wow in the same style of mechanics as vanilla? That could be good.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"