Next Pantheon Stream this Friday

2»

Comments

  • DMKanoDMKano Gamercentral, AKMember LegendaryPosts: 16,694
    Pantheon to me looked fine even with the old lighting - it just looks even better.

    To me - the graphics are not going to be what makes or breaks this game - heck I still play Project 99 with graphics from 1999 and it makes no difference - what makes it great is the gameplay.

    So - gameplay will be everything for Pantheon - as graphics are already far beyond "sufficient", the game is looking great so the focus should really shift to the hard part - which is game systems and gameplay. 


    NildenGdemamicheyaneAnthurjimmywolfpantarodcutbi001
  • AmatheAmathe Miami, FLMember RarePosts: 2,908
    Pantheon looks better in pre-alpha than a lot of games I played at launch. 
    KilsinTokken

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • ShaighShaigh Member RarePosts: 1,458
    In an mmorpg I prefer stylized over photorealism simply because its extremely difficult to make such a huge game while maintaining the same attention to details.

    My initial reaction on watching the clip was that it looked ugly, not because the game lacked attention to graphical detail but instead it was the feeling that the attention to graphical details weren't cohesive. The sedimentary rock species and plants didn't feel as real as the rocks, trees and grass. The characters felt like they were taken from a different game.

    Its easier to get things to look cohesive if you shoot for something more stylized.


    jimmywolfdrivendawn
    The cynic knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.
  • KilsinKilsin AustraliaMember RarePosts: 494
    DMKano said:
    Pantheon to me looked fine even with the old lighting - it just looks even better.

    To me - the graphics are not going to be what makes or breaks this game - heck I still play Project 99 with graphics from 1999 and it makes no difference - what makes it great is the gameplay.

    So - gameplay will be everything for Pantheon - as graphics are already far beyond "sufficient", the game is looking great so the focus should really shift to the hard part - which is game systems and gameplay. 


    The focus has never stopped being on the "hard part" though, we have a different team for graphics and systems, mechanics, features etc. and all work hard in their respective roles, we are just careful with what we reveal and are focused on getting the game ready for testing.

    It just happens to be a lot easier to show off graphics than code and boring backend systems ;)

    Community & Web Manager | Visionary Realms, Inc.
    Visit our Development Website. | Facebook | Twitter

  • DMKanoDMKano Gamercentral, AKMember LegendaryPosts: 16,694
    edited September 30
    Kilsin said:
    DMKano said:
    Pantheon to me looked fine even with the old lighting - it just looks even better.

    To me - the graphics are not going to be what makes or breaks this game - heck I still play Project 99 with graphics from 1999 and it makes no difference - what makes it great is the gameplay.

    So - gameplay will be everything for Pantheon - as graphics are already far beyond "sufficient", the game is looking great so the focus should really shift to the hard part - which is game systems and gameplay. 


    The focus has never stopped being on the "hard part" though, we have a different team for graphics and systems, mechanics, features etc. and all work hard in their respective roles, we are just careful with what we reveal and are focused on getting the game ready for testing.

    It just happens to be a lot easier to show off graphics than code and boring backend systems ;)

    I know - damned if you do, damned if you dont - show something too early (a system that gets changed or scrapped) - and you'll be hated for it. Don't show it because you want to make sure it's 100% final - you're hated because it took too long.

    The joys of open development, eh?

    So yep - you're left with showing off the least important longterm feature - graphics -  which incidentally is also the most important as far as early sales.

    The graphics is what attracts and sells - as that's what masses see and go "ooooh shiny, /open_wallet".  But again as we all know - that's not what keeps people playing longterm.

    Gameplay is the bottom line

    Post edited by DMKano on
    Kilsin
  • DMKanoDMKano Gamercentral, AKMember LegendaryPosts: 16,694
    Zindaihas said:
    Boy, I've gotta tell ya, there was a thread on here recently talking about the graphics being Pantheon's weak spot.  If that's true, then it's going to be one awesome game.  I see nothing weak about those graphics.  Now that's not to say that there might be other weak things about the game, but that video is very encouraging.  Which goes to show, it's good to keep putting out updates like this periodically to show that progress is being made.  There have been rumblings from some followers of Pantheon about its progress.  Hopefully this will quiet those rumblings...for the time being.


    The graphics look great - but this is a MMORPG - so what's obviously missing and what they havent' shown is how the game (both client and servers) perform with lots of players on screen.

    That to me is far more important than just the quality of graphics.

    Throw 50-100 players (not bots but actual players from around the globe) all running around and doing stuff - how's the performance?

    Yep - that's what they need to nail, as if the game is running at 13FPS - nobody is going to care about shadows and foliage on the screen if the performance tanks.
    jimmywolfXarko
  • cheyanecheyane EarthMember EpicPosts: 4,787
    edited October 6
    I agree with DM, I too have no issue with graphics since I too go back to Everquest frequently. So graphics are fine let's just focus on gameplay now.
    Post edited by cheyane on
    Xarko
    image
  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member EpicPosts: 3,436
    edited September 30
    Are Races going to have specific factions at creation?

    Yes. While there are some nuances to faction and alignment adjustment, evil races such as the Ogre, Skar, and Dark Myr will have a hard time getting close to good race cities. This is not set in stone, however, as you can adjust your faction and alignment through your actions in the game world.


    This right here is keeping me interested in the game. A major problem that faction based games usually have is that factions are set from the start and remain, but this to me seems more realistic and a good way to keep longevity in the game.


    Post edited by Albatroes on
  • RexKushmanRexKushman lake como, NJMember UncommonPosts: 308
    I've got to say, as someone who has doubted this team since the beginning, it is coming along nicely.  That is a huge visual upgrade over the last time I saw a live stream. The game just moved back into my interested list. Well done.

  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread PshMember RarePosts: 6,340
    Graphics-wise, it's looking much better than I thought it would.
    Xarko
  • drivendawndrivendawn montgomery, ALMember RarePosts: 1,981
    edited September 30
    Hey the graphics are looking really good. Now lets talk more about game mechanics and classes and such please.  :)
    Post edited by drivendawn on
  • TokkenTokken Portland, ORMember UncommonPosts: 1,516
    Nice progress!!  
    Warriors are like steel, when you lose your temper you lose your worth.
  • XarkoXarko Member RarePosts: 734
    Bruno sure knows his shit. Interesting video.
  • MendelMendel Marietta, GAMember RarePosts: 1,806
    The video was nice, with a few caveats.
    • The presenting system seemed to have the local contrast and gamma set a bit too high.  This made some of the effects, like the beech tree in the sunlight wash out, and the glowing monolith seem too bright.  I can't tell if that was an issue of the presenting system (and graphics card) or something in the underlying code.  Either way, the images caused too much eye strain to play for a long duration.   My eyes are not the best, but I had to look away.
    • Stylistically, I thought that all of streaming images were exceptional.  But I don't know that the 'older' screenshots weren't more 'playable'.  VR is definitely going for a photo-realistic world, and they are coming along nicely with that.
    • The performance on the presentation screen was good, but what happens when the game is seen on a 'lesser' graphics card.  Typically, the way to improve performance on older cards is to turn features off.  I don't know that I would have been able to play with the shadows turned down.  It begs me ask if the player needs to turn down one of the graphics features for performance issues, will the game be acceptable to look at?  My gut feeling at this stage is that anyone without bleeding-edge hardware need not apply.  Minimal system performance seems to be something else on the pile of 'things to do'.
    • I liked the appearance of the water, but it seemed more incomplete than anything the video contained.  The rippling effects were very nice, but are these going to tie into the weather? Ripples and clouds should move in the same direction.  Where are the waves, both blown by wind and created by contact with solid objects (piers, plants, support posts and people)?  If VR is going for a photo-realistic world, the current water would seem very out of place, not so much with the look, but with the performance.  Weather seems to be important to Pantheon, and there's nothing that interacts with water more than the weather.  I'd love to see what they choose to do about wind and rain effects on the water.  And what about some love for moving water as opposed to a still pond?
    Visually, the game is improving to make a much more photo-realistic world than we have had at our disposal previously.  The issues I pointed out here seem very 'fixable' (as long as the developers are aware of these issues.  Fortunately, I just pointed them out).

    Now, let's work on losing the archaic models for a snake that moves as much sideways as it does forwards and the hovering, flapping bat.  Neither seems to match the goal of photo-realistic.

    Progress, yes, but a long, long way to go.  I'm guessing at least 30 man-years more work on the graphics alone.  Time to staff up even more.
    drivendawnkadajvolaju

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • Gyva02Gyva02 Member UncommonPosts: 374
    Mendel said:
    The video was nice, with a few caveats.
    • The presenting system seemed to have the local contrast and gamma set a bit too high.  This made some of the effects, like the beech tree in the sunlight wash out, and the glowing monolith seem too bright.  I can't tell if that was an issue of the presenting system (and graphics card) or something in the underlying code.  Either way, the images caused too much eye strain to play for a long duration.   My eyes are not the best, but I had to look away.
    • Stylistically, I thought that all of streaming images were exceptional.  But I don't know that the 'older' screenshots weren't more 'playable'.  VR is definitely going for a photo-realistic world, and they are coming along nicely with that.
    • The performance on the presentation screen was good, but what happens when the game is seen on a 'lesser' graphics card.  Typically, the way to improve performance on older cards is to turn features off.  I don't know that I would have been able to play with the shadows turned down.  It begs me ask if the player needs to turn down one of the graphics features for performance issues, will the game be acceptable to look at?  My gut feeling at this stage is that anyone without bleeding-edge hardware need not apply.  Minimal system performance seems to be something else on the pile of 'things to do'.
    • I liked the appearance of the water, but it seemed more incomplete than anything the video contained.  The rippling effects were very nice, but are these going to tie into the weather? Ripples and clouds should move in the same direction.  Where are the waves, both blown by wind and created by contact with solid objects (piers, plants, support posts and people)?  If VR is going for a photo-realistic world, the current water would seem very out of place, not so much with the look, but with the performance.  Weather seems to be important to Pantheon, and there's nothing that interacts with water more than the weather.  I'd love to see what they choose to do about wind and rain effects on the water.  And what about some love for moving water as opposed to a still pond?
    Visually, the game is improving to make a much more photo-realistic world than we have had at our disposal previously.  The issues I pointed out here seem very 'fixable' (as long as the developers are aware of these issues.  Fortunately, I just pointed them out).

    Now, let's work on losing the archaic models for a snake that moves as much sideways as it does forwards and the hovering, flapping bat.  Neither seems to match the goal of photo-realistic.

    Progress, yes, but a long, long way to go.  I'm guessing at least 30 man-years more work on the graphics alone.  Time to staff up even more.
    A little bit of quality was lost in the recording, the live stream was a little more crisp. 

    As far as Bats and snakes go, I've always enjoyed the hovering bat, I'm also hoping the snakes have a decent kick... :) 

  • WizardryWizardry Ontario, CanadaMember EpicPosts: 12,981
    edited September 30
    Not one single developer has put mobs into a realistic design.Small rodents should not pose a big threat to anyone aside from perhaps carrying a disease or poison etc etc.Like they should have low accuracy but if they do hit you perhaps you receive stat penalties that could even be lengthy if no way to cure poison or a virus that has no cure and simply needs to take it's course over time.

    I am certain anyone having played a Blue mage knows how fun that type of class would be ,would be nice to see something similar.yeah i am a greed monger,i would love to see every last cool idea all in one game,would keep me happy forever.
    As to graphics...
    I always look at graphics ,not because i need to see the highest end stuff but it gives me a guideline to know how much care or effort the developer puts into it's game.An example just because it is an easy one to relate to and that is Wow.

    Wow had crappy low end graphics but because it offered me nothing more than linear questing ,it was a combo i could not handle.I much rather like combat than clicking npc's with yellow markers over their heads and that is not even close in comparison,like combat is the 99/100 and linear questing the 1/100.So if you want to give me low end graphics,the rest of the game had better be solid .aka FFXI.
    Post edited by Wizardry on
    Shaigh

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • Mackaveli44Mackaveli44 Huntington Beach, CAMember UncommonPosts: 319
    Rukushin said:
    Fingers crossed for better animations because EQ animations in a post-2017 game are not what is hoped for. 
    If you haven't watched any of their previous development videos, they said that the current iteration of animations is a placeholder and that they're being worked on.  
  • ZindaihasZindaihas Seattle, WAMember UncommonPosts: 3,626
    DMKano said:

    The graphics look great - but this is a MMORPG - so what's obviously missing and what they havent' shown is how the game (both client and servers) perform with lots of players on screen.

    That to me is far more important than just the quality of graphics.

    Throw 50-100 players (not bots but actual players from around the globe) all running around and doing stuff - how's the performance?

    Yep - that's what they need to nail, as if the game is running at 13FPS - nobody is going to care about shadows and foliage on the screen if the performance tanks.
    No question.  The servers have to be able to handle the stress of thousands of players at once.  And that is a science in game development unto itself.  However, based on EQ and Vanguard's track record, I'm not too worried about it at this point.  Neither of those games ever seemed to have serious server issues.  Of course EQ played on Sony's servers and Pantheon will not (not sure who hosted Vanguard until Sony took it over), so it's not an exact comparison.  But I'm pretty confident in their ability to deal with the server issue right now.  Hopefully they've been anticipating the workload from the beginning.

  • LackingMMOLackingMMO Tucson, AZMember UncommonPosts: 187
    Game is looking better and better. I remember the first vid, I was thinking wow they really went for an old school look along with the concept. Now it looks like a brand new game and it looks amazing. Can NOT wait for this to come out, seriously thinking about breaking my rule of pledging to games on this one lol.
    Gyva02dcutbi001
  • Gyva02Gyva02 Member UncommonPosts: 374
    Game is looking better and better. I remember the first vid, I was thinking wow they really went for an old school look along with the concept. Now it looks like a brand new game and it looks amazing. Can NOT wait for this to come out, seriously thinking about breaking my rule of pledging to games on this one lol.
    Same here, I never pledge but had to with this one, I opted for the $100 keepers pledge. It gave me 2 copies of the game and access to Beta so I figured it was a fair deal. Now my son and I can play together when it releases :) 
  • LackingMMOLackingMMO Tucson, AZMember UncommonPosts: 187
    Gyva02 said:
    Game is looking better and better. I remember the first vid, I was thinking wow they really went for an old school look along with the concept. Now it looks like a brand new game and it looks amazing. Can NOT wait for this to come out, seriously thinking about breaking my rule of pledging to games on this one lol.
    Same here, I never pledge but had to with this one, I opted for the $100 keepers pledge. It gave me 2 copies of the game and access to Beta so I figured it was a fair deal. Now my son and I can play together when it releases :) 

    I was actually looking at that one as well. 50 per copy plus extra and beta access is a pretty decent deal if you ask me. That would give me a copy plus one for my son too, might be a little hard playing with a 5yr old but it would be fun. My question would be do both accounts get the in game items or only one? Either way that looks like best one for me.

    One thing that stood out in the video to me was the attention to the little things, when they were on the tower, just the way everything looked had a certain feel to it. Sometimes the feel of a game is what can keep you coming back for more. Hopefully those keep coming.

  • SlyLoKSlyLoK Sugar Grove, VAMember RarePosts: 2,213
    I really liked the clouds! I hope they can get them to change based on the weather. Sunny , Cloudy , Rain , Storm.

    Also look forward to seeing the water finished and the flags.

    image

Sign In or Register to comment.