Does Star Citizen deserve its hate?

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  • RhygarthRhygarth EarthMember UncommonPosts: 145
    hate ? well i spent £25 or £30 on it so atm i don't hate it, even if its vaporware i could not care less, the people that say they hate it either have spent to much cash on it or can't spend enough cash on it, greed or jealousy is why people hate on this game.
  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Nashville, TNMember EpicPosts: 2,394
    Erillion said:
    There is also the possibility to test ships in game during this Alpha using the REC simpod currency that you earn for playtesting. No more real world money required beyond a basic game package. 

    It seems to me that some of the "hate" due to "ships costing hundreds or thousands of real world dollars" stems from a lack of knowledge about the SC Alpha, misinformation and/or an unwillingness to get information about participation in the playtesting. 


    Have fun
    Am I assuming correctly when I say that REC isn't something that will be used to buy such ships at release?  I'm not interested in debating on it or anything, just straight curiosity.

    image
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 7,956
    Erillion said:
    There is also the possibility to test ships in game during this Alpha using the REC simpod currency that you earn for playtesting. No more real world money required beyond a basic game package. 

    It seems to me that some of the "hate" due to "ships costing hundreds or thousands of real world dollars" stems from a lack of knowledge about the SC Alpha, misinformation and/or an unwillingness to get information about participation in the playtesting. 


    Have fun
    Am I assuming correctly when I say that REC isn't something that will be used to buy such ships at release?  I'm not interested in debating on it or anything, just straight curiosity.
    REC cannot be used to buy ships. You can "lease" them for a week for testing. I have hundredthousands of REC left - plenty of opportunities to test various ships. 

    There are simpods in the game. Like Flight Simulators in the old Wing Commander games. The REC currency is the currency used in these simpods. Like the coins one used in old arcade video game machines. It is different from the UEC in game currency used in the persistent SC universe. With UEC earned through missions etc. you will be able to buy ships. It is very easy to get REC through playtesting. 


    Have fun
    MadFrenchieJamesGoblin
  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Nashville, TNMember EpicPosts: 2,394
    Erillion said:
    Erillion said:
    There is also the possibility to test ships in game during this Alpha using the REC simpod currency that you earn for playtesting. No more real world money required beyond a basic game package. 

    It seems to me that some of the "hate" due to "ships costing hundreds or thousands of real world dollars" stems from a lack of knowledge about the SC Alpha, misinformation and/or an unwillingness to get information about participation in the playtesting. 


    Have fun
    Am I assuming correctly when I say that REC isn't something that will be used to buy such ships at release?  I'm not interested in debating on it or anything, just straight curiosity.
    REC cannot be used to buy ships. You can "lease" them for a week for testing. I have hundredthousands of REC left - plenty of opportunities to test various ships. 

    There are simpods in the game. Like Flight Simulators in the old Wing Commander games. The REC currency is the currency used in these simpods. Like the coins one used in old arcade video game machines. It is different from the UEC in game currency used in the persistent SC universe. With UEC earned through missions etc. you will be able to buy ships. It is very easy to get REC through playtesting. 


    Have fun
    Okay, that's where my confusion came in, the difference between REC and UEC.  Thanks for the info.
    ErillionJamesGoblin

    image
  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 1,755
    edited October 3
    The thing that continually amazes me is that people who bought into this game and then bitch about how nothing has been delivered obviously haven't bothered to simply install what has been made available. For me at least, seeing what they have, and what we'll be having here in the near future has laid most of my concerns to rest.

    Haven't even done the basics? Ok well what do they have?

    -Space combat (Check)
    -FPS combat (Check)
    -Racing (Check)
    -Universe with basic missions (Check)
    -Space Travel (Check)
    -Ingame Shops (Check)
    -Working multi-man ships (Check)

    That's all playable if you own the game right now. However if you also count the things they they have playable enough to demonstrate at conferences and will be coming with the next major patch:

    -Ability to land on and explore planets (Check)
    -Ground vehicles (Check)

    Do these features need refining? Sure. Is there a lot more that needs to be done before MMO release? Yes.

    However you can go load up Star Citizen and have fun playing the game right now. Does that count as the basics? It sure as hell does for me.
    Post edited by Eldurian on
    ErillionExcessionBabuinixJamesGoblinMaxBaconConstantineMerus
  • KefoKefo London, ONMember EpicPosts: 3,014
    Eldurian said:
    The thing that continually amazes me is that people who bought into this game and then bitch about how nothing has been delivered obviously haven't bothered to simply install what has been made available. For me at least, seeing what they have, and what we'll be having here in the near future has laid most of my concerns to rest.

    Haven't even done the basics? Ok well what do they have?

    -Space combat (Check)
    -FPS combat (Check)
    -Racing (Check)
    -Universe with basic missions (Check)
    -Space Travel (Check)
    -Ingame Shops (Check)
    -Working multi-man ships (Check)

    That's all playable if you own the game right now. However if you also count the things they they have playable enough to demonstrate at conferences and will be coming with the next major patch:

    -Ability to land on and explore planets (Check)
    -Ground vehicles (Check)

    Do these features need refining? Sure. Is there a lot more that needs to be done before MMO release? Yes.

    However you can go load up Star Citizen and have fun playing the game right now. Does that count as the basics? It sure as hell does for me.

    Space combat...in a space game you say?!? Madness!!
    FPS combat...more lethal then call of duty!
    Racing....I got nothing
    Universe with basic missions.....I'm not sure I would call this a universe
    Space travel...in a space game!
    ingame shops.....not surprised since selling shit is the one thing they are good at
    working multi-man ships.....in a MMO game!

    I think its more about nothing of substance being delivered then nothing delivered after this amount of time

    JamesGoblinMaxBacon
  • ExcessionExcession NottinghamMember RarePosts: 709
    Hate is such a strong word, and should not be bandied about as much as it is, especially with regards to something as trivial as a video game.

    Does SC deserve hate? no, not at all.

    But it does deserve scepticism.
    MaxBaconTurrican187Lawlmonster

    A creative person is motivated by the desire to achieve, not the desire to beat others.

  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member UncommonPosts: 197
    It might be wise to hold onto your money for now, until the future of the game is more certain.
    Turrican187MadFrenchie
  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 1,755
    It might be wise to hold onto your money for now, until the future of the game is more certain.
    Perhaps atm. If you got in at the very start like I did then you could have flipped the ships from the original kickstarter for thousands of dollars and bought hundreds of dollars worth of LTI ships with the profits... like i did. ;)
  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 1,755
    Kefo said:

    Space combat...in a space game you say?!? Madness!!
    FPS combat...more lethal then call of duty!
    Racing....I got nothing
    Universe with basic missions.....I'm not sure I would call this a universe
    Space travel...in a space game!
    ingame shops.....not surprised since selling shit is the one thing they are good at
    working multi-man ships.....in a MMO game!

    I think its more about nothing of substance being delivered then nothing delivered after this amount of time

    Yeah. It's delivered on the basics of what it's promised. Honestly the areas I was most skeptical about during the original KS was that they would be able to integrate FPS gameplay with space combat. That's something EVE has been promising for years that they eventually backed off from it seems like.

    However they have been integrated and do work as you can see right now in the PTU. If you don't consider that to be something of "substance" then I guess you're probably one of those people who wanted everything the game promised and 1000% more delivered to you 2 years before the project started.

    I'm one of those people that remembers it took 7 years for the steaming pile of crap we called SWTOR to be developed on a 200$-300$mil dollar budget so I'm actually pretty impressed with what has been pulled off so far.

    Even if a guy who's never developed a successful game in his 2+ decade development career and who has a personal grudge against Chris Roberts going back decades wants to claim the sky is falling.
    ErillionMaxBacon
  • KefoKefo London, ONMember EpicPosts: 3,014
    Eldurian said:
    Kefo said:

    Space combat...in a space game you say?!? Madness!!
    FPS combat...more lethal then call of duty!
    Racing....I got nothing
    Universe with basic missions.....I'm not sure I would call this a universe
    Space travel...in a space game!
    ingame shops.....not surprised since selling shit is the one thing they are good at
    working multi-man ships.....in a MMO game!

    I think its more about nothing of substance being delivered then nothing delivered after this amount of time

    Yeah. It's delivered on the basics of what it's promised. Honestly the areas I was most skeptical about during the original KS was that they would be able to integrate FPS gameplay with space combat. That's something EVE has been promising for years that they eventually backed off from it seems like.

    However they have been integrated and do work as you can see right now in the PTU. If you don't consider that to be something of "substance" then I guess you're probably one of those people who wanted everything the game promised and 1000% more delivered to you 2 years before the project started.

    I'm one of those people that remembers it took 7 years for the steaming pile of crap we called SWTOR to be developed on a 200$-300$mil dollar budget so I'm actually pretty impressed with what has been pulled off so far.

    Even if a guy who's never developed a successful game in his 2+ decade development career and who has a personal grudge against Chris Roberts going back decades wants to claim the sky is falling.
    That's the problem though. SWTOR was at least a completed game with loops and content to progress through. It might not have been fun but it's still there. 

    SC has been in dev for what 5 years now and has almost reached SWTOR's budget and they are now getting in a gameplay loop for people to try out?

    People on this project might be patient but eventually it will run out and if CIG drops the ball on 3.0 release then that's just going to be the catalyst for many people losing all patience.

    And no I'm not one of those people who wanted things before the project started. I have no money in this project nor will I ever because I know CR will constantly overpromise and under deliver while he continues to waste backer money
  • LawlmonsterLawlmonster Member UncommonPosts: 1,037
    Excession said:
    Hate is such a strong word, and should not be bandied about as much as it is, especially with regards to something as trivial as a video game.

    Does SC deserve hate? no, not at all.

    But it does deserve scepticism.
    Came here to say this, nearly verbatim.

    "This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)

  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 1,755
    Kefo said:
    Eldurian said:
    Kefo said:

    Space combat...in a space game you say?!? Madness!!
    FPS combat...more lethal then call of duty!
    Racing....I got nothing
    Universe with basic missions.....I'm not sure I would call this a universe
    Space travel...in a space game!
    ingame shops.....not surprised since selling shit is the one thing they are good at
    working multi-man ships.....in a MMO game!

    I think its more about nothing of substance being delivered then nothing delivered after this amount of time

    Yeah. It's delivered on the basics of what it's promised. Honestly the areas I was most skeptical about during the original KS was that they would be able to integrate FPS gameplay with space combat. That's something EVE has been promising for years that they eventually backed off from it seems like.

    However they have been integrated and do work as you can see right now in the PTU. If you don't consider that to be something of "substance" then I guess you're probably one of those people who wanted everything the game promised and 1000% more delivered to you 2 years before the project started.

    I'm one of those people that remembers it took 7 years for the steaming pile of crap we called SWTOR to be developed on a 200$-300$mil dollar budget so I'm actually pretty impressed with what has been pulled off so far.

    Even if a guy who's never developed a successful game in his 2+ decade development career and who has a personal grudge against Chris Roberts going back decades wants to claim the sky is falling.
    That's the problem though. SWTOR was at least a completed game with loops and content to progress through. It might not have been fun but it's still there. 

    SC has been in dev for what 5 years...
    Everything you say is invalidated by what you said before I cut you off. Yes SWTOR was completed. 7 years after it was started, with a larger budget.

    5 years into development, no, it was not completed yet. 
  • KefoKefo London, ONMember EpicPosts: 3,014
    Eldurian said:
    Kefo said:
    Eldurian said:
    Kefo said:

    Space combat...in a space game you say?!? Madness!!
    FPS combat...more lethal then call of duty!
    Racing....I got nothing
    Universe with basic missions.....I'm not sure I would call this a universe
    Space travel...in a space game!
    ingame shops.....not surprised since selling shit is the one thing they are good at
    working multi-man ships.....in a MMO game!

    I think its more about nothing of substance being delivered then nothing delivered after this amount of time

    Yeah. It's delivered on the basics of what it's promised. Honestly the areas I was most skeptical about during the original KS was that they would be able to integrate FPS gameplay with space combat. That's something EVE has been promising for years that they eventually backed off from it seems like.

    However they have been integrated and do work as you can see right now in the PTU. If you don't consider that to be something of "substance" then I guess you're probably one of those people who wanted everything the game promised and 1000% more delivered to you 2 years before the project started.

    I'm one of those people that remembers it took 7 years for the steaming pile of crap we called SWTOR to be developed on a 200$-300$mil dollar budget so I'm actually pretty impressed with what has been pulled off so far.

    Even if a guy who's never developed a successful game in his 2+ decade development career and who has a personal grudge against Chris Roberts going back decades wants to claim the sky is falling.
    That's the problem though. SWTOR was at least a completed game with loops and content to progress through. It might not have been fun but it's still there. 

    SC has been in dev for what 5 years...
    Everything you say is invalidated by what you said before I cut you off. Yes SWTOR was completed. 7 years after it was started, with a larger budget.

    5 years into development, no, it was not completed yet. 
    Must be nice to just cut off what someone says so that you can cut out parts that don't help your argument at all. You'll fit right in with the rest of the cheerleading squad.

    When you'd like to have a real argument and not one where you cut out the parts that put you on shaky ground then come back and we can continue 
    MaxBacon
  • TalulaRoseTalulaRose Long Island, NYMember RarePosts: 981
    Don't see the hate. I see people asking questions.

    I do see SC fans leveling anyone who has a question or opinion they don't like as a hater.


    MaxBaconScotchUpTalonsin
  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 1,755
    @Kefo - It's ok. You admitted you aren't a backer, which means you haven't tried the content you were criticizing. You don't even have a clue about the content this game has put out that I've already been playing. Which means pretty much everything you say is crap. Who cares about someone's opinion on a game they have never played? I sure as hell don't
  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 1,755
    edited October 4
    Allow me to give you a realistic perspective. Yes, Chris Roberts does have a reputation for promising more than he can deliver. Freelancer was a great example of this. A lot of what he's talked about in Star Citizen he wanted to put into Freelancer before Microsoft cut him off and forced him to release. However, Freelancer was still a really damn good game for it's time, and even one that still has a devoted community to this day. With the potential exception of Wurm or Runescape I'd say it's the game I've logged the most hours in to date.

    This is similar to how EVE promised atmospheric flight and integration between FPS combat and space combat and all this cool crap and here we are years later with nothing but the captains quarter and Dust 514. And all Dust 514 was is the funnest FPS I have ever played in my life.

    Is Star Citizen going to have every last feature promised? Maybe in like 10 or 20 years.

    But the fact is that saying what they have right now amounts to nothing and pretending like it's a forgone conclusion it will flop is about as dumb as thinking it will release with every promised ship and system in place sometime next year. Everything is on track to deliver the next Freelancer. A game that will fail to deliver on many of it's promises and still be one of the funnest damn games I've ever played.

    See unlike Derek Smart, Chris Roberts actually makes games that are fun. And most people who've actually played a Chris Roberts game instead of just reading about them or watching some reviewer's video will agree to that.
    Post edited by Eldurian on
  • KefoKefo London, ONMember EpicPosts: 3,014
    Eldurian said:
    The only place you've won anything in your own mind. Everything you post is chalk full of logical fallacies and misinformation. I'm sorry you feel that your post that started out talking about how SWTOR finished their game and SC has failed to do so within 5 years when it took 7 years to launch SWTOR is full of good information. You finished with the same level crap you started with including an admission to not having access to any of the currently released content. I just didn't care to pick your post to pieces line by line.

    For the most part I think most people who are capable of critcal thinking don't need me to give them a break down of every way in which you are wrong.
    Except if you read my post you would realize I never said how SC failed to finish their game in 5 years but rather the complete lack of meaningful progress.

    You compared SC to SWTOR and how it's crap and about the budgets and so on and I presented my points in counter argument at which point you just chose to ignore everything because you didn't like the way the argument was going.

    Instead of countering what I said like a normal person would do you just decided to start going after me because you can't be bothered to pick apart my post because you have nothing.

    Generally when someone resorts to just attacking the poster instead of addressing what they said you know they are in damage control mode.
    PhryMaxBaconScotchUpPingu2012
  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 1,755
    edited October 4
    Kefo said:

    Except if you read my post you would realize I never said how SC failed to finish their game in 5 years but rather the complete lack of meaningful progress. 
    Which is an utter horsecrap claim. You admittedly have not even tried what they've produced and have no authority to speak on the subject whatsoever. If you had actually loaded up Star Citizen on computer an tried what they have to offer as I have you would know that it's actually pretty fun and it is making meaningful strides forward every time I check back in on it.
    Post edited by Eldurian on
  • KefoKefo London, ONMember EpicPosts: 3,014
    Eldurian said:
    Allow me to give you a realistic perspective. Yes, Chris Roberts does have a reputation for promising more than he can deliver. Freelancer was a great example of this. A lot of what he's talked about in Star Citizen he wanted to put into Freelancer before Microsoft cut him off and forced him to release. However, Freelancer was still a really damn good game for it's time. With the potential exception of Wurm or Runescape I'd say it's the game I've logged the most hours in to date.

    This is similar to how EVE promised atmospheric flight and integration between FPS combat and space combat and all this cool crap and here we are years later with nothing but the captains quarter and Dust 514. And all Dust 514 was is the funnest FPS I have ever played in my life.

    Is Star Citizen going to have every last feature promised? Maybe in like 10 or 20 years.

    But the fact is that saying what they have right now amounts to nothing and pretending like it's a forgone conclusion it will flop is about as dumb as thinking it will release with every promised ship and system in place sometime next year. Everything is on track to deliver the next Freelancer. A game that will fail to deliver on many of it's promises and still be one of the funnest damn games I've ever played.

    See unlike Derek Smart, Chris Roberts actually makes games that are fun. And most people who've actually played a Chris Roberts game instead of just reading about them or watching some reviewer's video will agree to that.
    You do realize that Microsoft didn't cut him out and forced him to release right? He sold the studio to Microsoft because he was too ambitious and tried to develop too much at once and is rather wasteful with money. Microsoft bought him out, made him a "creative consultant" and then began to scale back all the things that they knew would never be possible. You can thank a big soulless publisher for fixing and saving a game, after giving CR the boot, you have admitted to being in your top 3 for hours played. 

    I never said they have nothing and I have never said its a forgone conclusion they will flop. Perhaps that's directed at someone else but I'll answer like its directed at me to save time. I have said they have nothing of substance after 5 years of dev time and the fact they struggle with things like persistence in a MMO of all things should give you pause.

    Why you bring up Derek Smart is beyond me except he's the go to boogeyman for fans when they need a scapegoat to blame for SC's shortcomings or glacial progress. 

    The last CR game I played was Wing Commander...you know a game he actually finished and wasn't bought out and kicked out of the company because he's a liability. Since then he's only proven he doesn't know how to run a game company and I doubt this time a publisher will come save his ass if backers decide they are fed up with his bullshit.

    PhryMaxBacon
  • KefoKefo London, ONMember EpicPosts: 3,014
    Eldurian said:
    Kefo said:

    Except if you read my post you would realize I never said how SC failed to finish their game in 5 years but rather the complete lack of meaningful progress. 
    Which is an utter horsecrap claim. You admittedly have not even tried what they've produced and have no authority to speak on the subject whatsoever. If you had actually loaded up Star Citizen on computer an tried what they have to offer as I have you would know that it's actually pretty fun.

    What does fun have anything to do with what I said? I never once mentioned if the game is fun but said meaningful progress. You keep saying things that I never actually said and not sure if you are doing it intentionally or not.
    MaxBacon
  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 1,755
    When you have a lot of your core systems in place, and they are actually fun, how could that not be considered "meaningful progress"? Do you actually have a definition of that phrase or is it something you are just arbitrarily throwing out and failing to define so that you can pretend you are saying something worthwhile?
  • PhryPhry OxfordshireMember EpicPosts: 8,868
    It isn't hate to be critical of something, nor is it hate to have an opposing view, at least as long as you can back those things up with a reasonable argument, that is the problem these days, when people say something that people disagree with and they can't counter the arguments being used, the hate label is often used to try and dismiss those arguments as irrelevant.
    Kefo
  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus LondonMember RarePosts: 1,105
    Phry said:
    It isn't hate to be critical of something, nor is it hate to have an opposing view, at least as long as you can back those things up with a reasonable argument, that is the problem these days, when people say something that people disagree with and they can't counter the arguments being used, the hate label is often used to try and dismiss those arguments as irrelevant.
    While you're right. But there's also hate, and hate is pretty popular. 
    MaxBaconLucienRene
    I am a piece of carbon with a soul, wondering where I got it from. 
    - Drunken Mozart in the Desert
  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member UncommonPosts: 197
    edited October 4
    Eldurian said:
    It might be wise to hold onto your money for now, until the future of the game is more certain.
    Perhaps atm. If you got in at the very start like I did then you could have flipped the ships from the original kickstarter for thousands of dollars and bought hundreds of dollars worth of LTI ships with the profits... like i did. ;)
    I looked at the game early on but after the kickstarter I think.

    It seemed pretty interesting, but also more expensive than I'd likely be able to afford based on the ship prices, and some kind of insurance thing I never found the details of but sounded like an additional ongoing expense.

    Hopefully those such as yourself that invested heavily in the game will feel well rewarded when it is fully released. At least you can enjoy parts of it while you wait.
    Post edited by KnightFalz on
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