PSA: The $45,000 refund was fake - updated

245

Comments

  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 14,398
    Kyleran said:
    Amazing how much effort people will go to smear this game.

    Who has this sort of time to devote to this sort of thing and to what gain? 

    I wonder the same thing. I just spent 8 hours battling Oracle. I can't imagine mustering the energy to troll someone on this scale. I can barely manage forum trolling and pvp anymore. I'm getting too old for this.
    KyleranNycteliosXarko
    Notice: The artist or album content may be offensive or controversial.
    Avatar Artist: Flesh For Lulu
    Album: Plastic Fantastic
    Featured Tracks: Decline and Fall, Time & Space, I Go Crazy (bonus track on digital release)
  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,245
    Torval said:
    Kyleran said:
    Amazing how much effort people will go to smear this game.

    Who has this sort of time to devote to this sort of thing and to what gain? 

    I wonder the same thing. I just spent 8 hours battling Oracle. I can't imagine mustering the energy to troll someone on this scale. I can barely manage forum trolling and pvp anymore. I'm getting too old for this.
    Thats my life, 10+ hours a day at work, interact with wife a few hours, play 2-3 hours of Fallout NV (this is the game that never ends, it goes on and on my friends...) and grab 5 hrs sleep. 

    Who can waste their lives trolling SC?
    TorvalConstantineMerus

    On hiatus from EVE Online since Dec 2016 - Screw off-grid PVE boosting changes

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • postofficetcuppostofficetcup Member CommonPosts: 4
    Max Bacon makes strong points but the hate for SC is so much they just ignore common sense and logic. Its like the anti SC goons dont care if what they are doing is right or wrong, they just want SC to burn so they can appear correct in going against SC and inflate their ego even more. I really want to thank you MaxBacon for taking the time to AID against the smear campaigns. I dont ever post here but every time I read your posts I can tell you take tons of time and research to create a well thought out post, and I had to post today to say thank you.

    I have had my doubts about SC and I have my dreams, you help keep the dreams CIG promised alive, since you make it easy to find such great details during such despicable times where people go as far to create fraudulent refund conspiracies. I look forward to reading your future posts where you obviously obliterate the pessimistic hopeful bunch that will grab any thread they can to cause SC to lose funding in hopes of the game never completing.
    CR/SC is fulfilling that last sentence all by themselves...lol


    If you are quoting my last sentence you are saying this, CR/SC is obviously obliterating the pessimistic hopeful bunch that will grab any thread they can to cause SC to lose funding in hopes of the game never completing. Are you referring to when they smashed the fraudulent refund claim? Naw I think you wanted to make a witty statement using my own words against me but failed miserably.
    Gdemami
  • TalulaRoseTalulaRose Long Island, NYMember RarePosts: 981
    edited September 15
    Max Bacon makes strong points but the hate for SC is so much they just ignore common sense and logic. Its like the anti SC goons dont care if what they are doing is right or wrong, they just want SC to burn so they can appear correct in going against SC and inflate their ego even more. I really want to thank you MaxBacon for taking the time to AID against the smear campaigns. I dont ever post here but every time I read your posts I can tell you take tons of time and research to create a well thought out post, and I had to post today to say thank you.

    I have had my doubts about SC and I have my dreams, you help keep the dreams CIG promised alive, since you make it easy to find such great details during such despicable times where people go as far to create fraudulent refund conspiracies. I look forward to reading your future posts where you obviously obliterate the pessimistic hopeful bunch that will grab any thread they can to cause SC to lose funding in hopes of the game never completing.
    CR/SC is fulfilling that last sentence all by themselves...lol


    If you are quoting my last sentence you are saying this, CR/SC is obviously obliterating the pessimistic hopeful bunch that will grab any thread they can to cause SC to lose funding in hopes of the game never completing. Are you referring to when they smashed the fraudulent refund claim? Naw I think you wanted to make a witty statement using my own words against me but failed miserably.
    Max Bacon makes
    I really want to thank you MaxBacon
    I look forward to reading your future posts

    Keep trying.
    Post edited by TalulaRose on
    GdemamiDakeru
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 14,398
    Kyleran said:
    Torval said:
    Kyleran said:
    Amazing how much effort people will go to smear this game.

    Who has this sort of time to devote to this sort of thing and to what gain? 

    I wonder the same thing. I just spent 8 hours battling Oracle. I can't imagine mustering the energy to troll someone on this scale. I can barely manage forum trolling and pvp anymore. I'm getting too old for this.
    Thats my life, 10+ hours a day at work, interact with wife a few hours, play 2-3 hours of Fallout NV (this is the game that never ends, it goes on and on my friends...) and grab 5 hrs sleep. 

    Who can waste their lives trolling SC?
    What is up with FO:NV? How have I racked up those hours? I wish I could see my hours trend for a specific game over the last couple of weeks. I'm not very far either because I always go off track. I'm trying to focus on a task and direction but it's hard. All this stuff always pops up.
    Notice: The artist or album content may be offensive or controversial.
    Avatar Artist: Flesh For Lulu
    Album: Plastic Fantastic
    Featured Tracks: Decline and Fall, Time & Space, I Go Crazy (bonus track on digital release)
  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Algo Star SystemMember RarePosts: 1,909
    MaxBacon said:
    P.S. To the people who say folks like this are paid to slander Star Citizen, who benefits the most from the slander?  Is there some rival kickstarter space game coming out? Makes for a great movie though...
    Quoting Queen: "Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy?"

    What's the benefit you ask? Do they want to feel important for unmasking some great conspiracy that doesn't exist? Whatever it is, it shows no lack of motivation.
    I don't follow.

    I'm asking if people are getting paid to slander SC (I'm not saying they are or aren't) who is the beneficiary? Who would pay and why?

    Trolling both sides of the argument might have been enough motivation for somebody because watching you guys go Belko Experiment on each other can be hilarious at times.
    MadFrenchie
  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Algo Star SystemMember RarePosts: 1,909
    I don't play favorites.

    If people are really going this far to fabricate Star Citizen looking shaky (when there's more than enough real info available) then they're 10x worse than the people I refer to as Citizentologists. All a stunt like this does is substantiate the claims of conspiracy from the fringe backers.

    Now I need a funny name to classify the dummies who did this. Stay tuned.

    P.S. To the people who say folks like this are paid to slander Star Citizen, who benefits the most from the slander?  Is there some rival kickstarter space game coming out? Makes for a great movie though...




    That definitely looks like a movie that Harrison Ford and Gary Oldman immediately regretted being a part of.  :D
    Harrison Ford shaved his head for the role. He definitely regretted it WAY more. LOL.
    MadFrenchie
  • postofficetcuppostofficetcup Member CommonPosts: 4
    Max Bacon makes strong points but the hate for SC is so much they just ignore common sense and logic. Its like the anti SC goons dont care if what they are doing is right or wrong, they just want SC to burn so they can appear correct in going against SC and inflate their ego even more. I really want to thank you MaxBacon for taking the time to AID against the smear campaigns. I dont ever post here but every time I read your posts I can tell you take tons of time and research to create a well thought out post, and I had to post today to say thank you.

    I have had my doubts about SC and I have my dreams, you help keep the dreams CIG promised alive, since you make it easy to find such great details during such despicable times where people go as far to create fraudulent refund conspiracies. I look forward to reading your future posts where you obviously obliterate the pessimistic hopeful bunch that will grab any thread they can to cause SC to lose funding in hopes of the game never completing.
    CR/SC is fulfilling that last sentence all by themselves...lol


    If you are quoting my last sentence you are saying this, CR/SC is obviously obliterating the pessimistic hopeful bunch that will grab any thread they can to cause SC to lose funding in hopes of the game never completing. Are you referring to when they smashed the fraudulent refund claim? Naw I think you wanted to make a witty statement using my own words against me but failed miserably.
    Max Bacon makes
    I really want to thank you MaxBacon
    I look forward to reading your future posts

    Keep trying.
    If you made quality posts like him, you might get some appreciation too. Even after the refund is proved to be a scam you are still in here trying to throw shade at CIG. Do you even understand what is happening to SC? Sooo many people attacking them with fraudulent claims and they are proved to be fraudulent but we have people like you not discussing it but just throwing ANY shade they possibly can. CIG should get empathy for this horrific conspiracy. BTW who the fuck cares if someone got a 45k refund? Its amazing that CIG would even issue it but people act like a whale not supporting CIG is going to end the game. They make like 40k on their shittiest day XD
    Gdemami
  • ShaighShaigh Member RarePosts: 1,456
    These sort of stories are nonsense anyway, it doesn't matter that someone did a $330 or a $45k refund for a game when they can easily make $1M during a concept sale which they do every month.

    The cynic knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.
  • rpmcmurphyrpmcmurphy DublinMember RarePosts: 2,506
    MaxBacon said:
    Cotic said:
    The Star Citizen sub is celebrating this as proof the /r/starcitizen_refunds are all trolls but forgetting that everybody has been trolled by this individual.
    It's not one individual, this has been ongoing and that's only the KNOWN ones that were proven fake, how much of it is real and how much of it is fabricated, impossible to tell.

    Cotic is referring to this particular occurance, it clearly is one person who has trolled the refund subreddit and everyone else.

    There has been plenty of SC and /r/ds diehards who claim to troll the refund sub with false refunds as well.
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Figueira da FozMember EpicPosts: 4,074
    edited September 15
    Cotic is referring to this particular occurance, it clearly is one person who has trolled the refund subreddit and everyone else.

    There has been plenty of SC and /r/ds diehards who claim to troll the refund sub with false refunds as well.
    Refunds are rather meh, with the also fabrication of "leaks" and "internal sources" what has been ongoing for years now, it's a very strong weight on fear monger like of creating a perception that this project is on the verge of collapse (for the past 2 years).
    Post edited by MaxBacon on
    ExcessionGdemami
  • VorpalChicken28VorpalChicken28 UKMember UncommonPosts: 336
    edited September 15
    here's some more info, apparently posted by the guy who claimed the $45k refund he posted it via Discord:

    "Hi I'm [$45k guy]*, I was sent here by a contact on Discord before my Reddit account was deleted. I'm the $45k refund guy and can provide any evidence if necessary. I don't know, I was getting hundreds of messages every hour, it was crazy. I was replying to a reporter from Kotaku and wiritng a long message, then I went to press "send" and Reddit gave me an error. I then refreshed my page and I was logged out. I try to log back n but it says the username and password don't exist. I just checked a few of the news sites I was replying to now, and they are saying the refund was only for $330, but that's not true. $330 is my personal account, not the shared org account. To be clear I did refund $330 too"

    Post edited by VorpalChicken28 on
    Dakerubartoni33
    “Nevertheless, the human brain, which survives by hoping from one second to another, will always endeavor to put off the moment of truth. Moist” 
    ― Terry PratchettMaking Money
  • VorpalChicken28VorpalChicken28 UKMember UncommonPosts: 336
    Hmmmm, just reread the CIG info about the supposed refund, this time while reading it carefully I noticed they didn't actually say that there wasn't a $45k refund or is that just me?
    “Nevertheless, the human brain, which survives by hoping from one second to another, will always endeavor to put off the moment of truth. Moist” 
    ― Terry PratchettMaking Money
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Figueira da FozMember EpicPosts: 4,074
    here's some more info, apparently posted by the guy who claimed the $45k refund he posted it via Discord:
    Let's see if this is not a bluff. If it is true, he can very much talk to the media and prove it, easy peasy.

    To all we know this can just be someone else riding the train hoping to strike gold..

    Hmmmm, just reread the CIG info about the supposed refund, this time while reading it carefully I noticed they didn't actually say that there wasn't a $45k refund or is that just me?
    "$45,000 claimed in posted screenshots and videos which Swofford says do not reflect actual complaints requests logged by the company"

    From what I get of that, it's stating that the screens/vids were not real tickets, so not just omitting it, stating fabrication.
    Gdemami
  • KumaponKumapon Member UncommonPosts: 955
    To be perfectly honest, we still don’t have any actual proof of either set of claims. We have a he said, he said. CIG denied it, not refuted it.
    Excessionrpmcmurphy
  • ExcessionExcession NottinghamMember RarePosts: 709
    Shaigh said:
    These sort of stories are nonsense anyway, it doesn't matter that someone did a $330 or a $45k refund for a game when they can easily make $1M during a concept sale which they do every month.

    It does matter.

    CIG state that all the money they raise goes straight to paying for development of the game.

    If you request a refund, they actually tell you that the money you paid them has already been used for that purpose.

    So, if that is truly the case, every refund they give, is paid for by new backers.

    If potential backers see too many refunds, and realise that they are paying for them, they might not become actual backers.

    It is in CIGs best interest to deflect as much attention away from refunds as possible.

    It might be the reason why 3.0 is suddenly "akin to early access", so they can change their policy once more regarding refunds, and stop giving them completely.
    GdemamiMaxBaconbartoni33

    A creative person is motivated by the desire to achieve, not the desire to beat others.

  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Figueira da FozMember EpicPosts: 4,074
    Excession said:
    It is in CIGs best interest to deflect as much attention away from refunds as possible.
    And on the interest of trolls and goons to bring as much attention to refunds as possible.

    Also wtf, "I'm not going to buy the game because the game gives refunds."... The obvious majority of funding doesn't come from new backers, "It matters! It matters!", seriously wtf...
    GdemamiExcession
  • ExcessionExcession NottinghamMember RarePosts: 709
    MaxBacon said:
    Excession said:
    It is in CIGs best interest to deflect as much attention away from refunds as possible.
    And on the interest of trolls and goons to bring as much attention to refunds as possible.

    Also wtf, "I'm not going to buy the game because the game gives refunds."... The obvious majority of funding doesn't come from new backers, "It matters! It matters!", seriously wtf...
    Max, think carefully before responding.

    New backer money matters more now than early backers money does.

    Early backers money should be gone according to CIG, they have already used it to get the game to the stage it is at now.

    According to CR, they base development on month to month income.

    Without new backers, there is no month to month income.

    Without new backers, there is no finished game.

    And like it or not, seeing refunds being requested and given, will put some people off, and cost CIG money.
    bartoni33MaxBacon

    A creative person is motivated by the desire to achieve, not the desire to beat others.

  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Figueira da FozMember EpicPosts: 4,074
    edited September 15
    Excession said:
    Without new backers, there is no month to month income.

    Without new backers, there is no finished game.
    Uhh...

    Without whales, there is no month to month income, not on this scale.

    Not new backers, those are mostly irrelevant to that core group of backers that have been here and do frequent pledges driven from the continuous new sales.

    Those are still a minority, but it just it takes a few thousands of them to achieve the millions a month this game crowd funds.
    Post edited by MaxBacon on
    Gdemami
  • ExcessionExcession NottinghamMember RarePosts: 709
    MaxBacon said:
    Excession said:
    Without new backers, there is no month to month income.

    Without new backers, there is no finished game.
    Uhh...

    Without whales, there is no month to month income, not on this scale.

    Not new backers, those are mostly irrelevant to that core group of backers that have been here and do frequent pledges driven from the continuous new sales.

    Those are still a minority, but it just it takes a few thousands of them to achieve the millions a month this game crowd funds.
    And when the whales have bought everything on offer? 

    Sure, CIG can keep making new ships/vehicles/whatever, but eventually, even the most invested whales will get to the point where enough is enough.

    Only time will tell which occurs first, whales saying enough, or the game is complete enough for an official launch. 

    A creative person is motivated by the desire to achieve, not the desire to beat others.

  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Figueira da FozMember EpicPosts: 4,074
    Excession said:
    And when the whales have bought everything on offer? 

    Sure, CIG can keep making new ships/vehicles/whatever, but eventually, even the most invested whales will get to the point where enough is enough.

    Only time will tell which occurs first, whales saying enough, or the game is complete enough for an official launch. 
    In the present reality here's how I see this chain:

    Whales, buy mostly everything within different tiers of wealth; Existent backers that buy this and that, upgrade this and that; New Backers at the bottom of what brings in new money.

    But the refunds having any relevant impact on the flow of new players is ridiculous to me; reminds me that this game is meant to "crash and burn" at any second now since 2015, that'd be far more relevant than this.
  • ExcessionExcession NottinghamMember RarePosts: 709
    MaxBacon said:
    Excession said:
    And when the whales have bought everything on offer? 

    Sure, CIG can keep making new ships/vehicles/whatever, but eventually, even the most invested whales will get to the point where enough is enough.

    Only time will tell which occurs first, whales saying enough, or the game is complete enough for an official launch. 
    In the present reality here's how I see this chain:

    Whales, buy mostly everything within different tiers of wealth; Existent backers that buy this and that, upgrade this and that; New Backers at the bottom of what brings in new money.

    But the refunds having any relevant impact on the flow of new players is ridiculous to me; reminds me that this game is meant to "crash and burn" at any second now since 2015, that'd be far more relevant than this.
    I do not disagree, I think it is stupid for anyone to say they will not buy a game because someone else will not buy it, or someone else got a refund from it, for whatever reason.

    But it does happen, and to deny that it does happen, and to deny it has a financial effect is also stupid.

    Just look at this website, and these forum's, you see it many times, posters asking other posters opinion of a game, and basing their willingness, or not, to play that game on that opinion.

    As for it being meant to "crash and burn", do I want CIG/CR to fail, No. I want them to make both games (SC and SQ42), I want them both to be good, fun games to play.

    But at the same time, I do agree with some things said by detractors of CIG/CR, and I really do believe that CR is responsible for mismanaging the development of SC/SQ42.

    A creative person is motivated by the desire to achieve, not the desire to beat others.

  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Figueira da FozMember EpicPosts: 4,074
    edited September 15
    Excession said:
    I do not disagree, I think it is stupid for anyone to say they will not buy a game because someone else will not buy it, or someone else got a refund from it, for whatever reason.

    But it does happen, and to deny that it does happen, and to deny it has a financial effect is also stupid.

    Just look at this website, and these forum's, you see it many times, posters asking other posters opinion of a game, and basing their willingness, or not, to play that game on that opinion.

    As for it being meant to "crash and burn", do I want CIG/CR to fail, No. I want them to make both games (SC and SQ42), I want them both to be good, fun games to play.

    But at the same time, I do agree with some things said by detractors of CIG/CR, and I really do believe that CR is responsible for mismanaging the development of SC/SQ42.
    I don't agree with you on financial impact of it, I think it's nothing compared to the fear monger the whole narrative that exists for years now that paints the imminent collapse of the project has impacted on that aspect, that yes while so speculative it created a perception that generates fear, and fear is a powerful weapon in the reality of a Crowdfunded project.
    Post edited by MaxBacon on
  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Figueira da FozMember EpicPosts: 4,074
    More CIG input on this on this article: https://www.pcgamesn.com/star-citizen/star-citizen-refund-45k

    " When asked about the screens, CIG said a refund was recently issued to a customer, but for $330, rather than $45,000. 

    Asked if this was the same customer, who might have edited the correspondence to make the amount appear bigger, CIG said "yes to the first. Yes to the second… as best as we can tell.""


    Gdemami
  • WalkinGlennWalkinGlenn Member UncommonPosts: 137
    What makes you think CIG isn't lying just to save face?
Sign In or Register to comment.