Demonstrable Proof of Zero Tolerance - Catching Gold Sellers - Albion Online Videos - MMORPG.com

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  • F2PlagueF2Plague Toronto, ONMember UncommonPosts: 98
    Robbgobb said:
    This is a PR thing. I accept that. I also accept that I am glad to see it. I know this is not how they catch them but if they see something and act on it over waiting for everything else then shouldn't that be a good thing. I remember getting items in EQ. I really enjoyed that system though not very efficient. Gold sellers are not going away.

    I have known ex-friends who ended up telling me they bought currency. I have known ex-friends who bragged about exploiting games to make big gains. Some were banned and others not. I for sure did not want to stay friends with them. Virtual or physical actions are not separate from the person. I don't trust the "it is online so it is not like I am actually doing something bad".

    I have reported people who tell me that stuff. I don't want to deal with it. Bad enough that I have to deal with bots but if I will do my part in reporting when I can even if it means nothing.
    You must have a lot of friends. "Virtual or physical actions are not separate from the person" are you insane? You're suggesting that because I like to go on PK frenzies that I am actually a mass murderer in real life? Cause that is literally what you are saying. The things people do in virtual worlds have very little bearing on who they are as a person. Basically all you have told people is "I cant keep a secret and I will rat you out at the drop of a hat cause I value this game world more than any friendship" My lord..  
    Iselin
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,411
    edited August 11
    waynejr2 said:
    Renoaku said:
    SBI could also start by fixing this game with removing theh ability to convert "Gold" to "Silver" immediately after purchase for example having to wait 30 days minimum after buying gold before being allowed to trade it this allowed "Legitimate users" the ability who have had their credit-cards stolen to file a charge-back if a chharge back is filed no harm done the illegal account is banned and none of the gold upset's the economy.

    Another good option is to do what "Arche Age" "WOW" "EVE" do and sell "PLEX" or an item that adds a certain amount of gold, or credits to a users account or rather play-time, this would restrict RMT by a bunch, and make it easier to track in game, for example a $20 USD card would give 5000 gold, and $40 would give 10,000 gold etc.

    Although users could illegally still convert it and buy from RMT sites, it would be way easier to track and prevent selling, as well as there could be imposed limits on accounts until they rearch a certain fame, or 30 day period for orders this prevents fraud purchasing.

    Although Gold Sellers might learn about the 30 days period buy their first one legitimate then buy a bunch of othehr illegal transactions to then sell before they get banned but it still makes it harder.

    If someone gets caught breaking the rules and banned, they earned it.  Didn't you get banned?
    Yeah during beta lol, but the company still never fully proved there was a gold purchase, the only followed 4.5.1 which states if a "Large Amount OF Currency Traded with nothing in equal value" they will assume it was for real money, they also admit in at least one forum post thaht I remember, and a support ticket that evideince is reviewed "but not always accurate" as well as a logging system that isn't perfect, and admit that basically it could be wrong.

    Regardless given I played the game 4 years the company themselves should have actually looked at it that maybe there was no actual purchase especially given it was beta, and I had no previous infractions of any kind, as well as its not my responsibility for another person who does illegal activity I am not supposed to monitor this or always know. (There is no doubt of a rule broken which I was unaware of my argument is there was no actual real money traded.)

    This is the Iron Bank Incident I was talking about too, if the developers had done their job properly this would have never happened in the first place, I assume Iron Bank is 100% Legitimate unless proven guilty, but I am just saying how easy it would be to actually rig it all just to try to make a massive amount of gold back, either way the game really needs work to fix this before the next bid happens.


    waynejr2 said:



    If someone gets caught breaking the rules and banned, they earned it.  Didn't you get banned?


    Yes. He posted in another thread that he listed a health potion for 300K Silver, which was then purchased by a known gold seller. But he swears he is just good at selling stuff on the AH.

    Albion Online, is advertised as a "Free Makret" (Free to Trade Your Way) if a person wants to buy all the potions on the market for example for 1 silver and list them at 300 silver or whatever and a gold seller happens to buy them or someone else then it has to be assumed it is a legitimate transaction, or the GM needs to reverse both transactions at any time something goes wrong with an illegal buyer, but never should a player be held accountable for the illegal actions of another person.

    If Free trading isn't allowed they should remove it and make it like BDO so it can only increase and decrease so much.
    Post edited by Renoaku on
    ExcessionGdemami
  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,849
    edited August 10
    F2Plague said:
    Robbgobb said:
    This is a PR thing. I accept that. I also accept that I am glad to see it. I know this is not how they catch them but if they see something and act on it over waiting for everything else then shouldn't that be a good thing. I remember getting items in EQ. I really enjoyed that system though not very efficient. Gold sellers are not going away.

    I have known ex-friends who ended up telling me they bought currency. I have known ex-friends who bragged about exploiting games to make big gains. Some were banned and others not. I for sure did not want to stay friends with them. Virtual or physical actions are not separate from the person. I don't trust the "it is online so it is not like I am actually doing something bad".

    I have reported people who tell me that stuff. I don't want to deal with it. Bad enough that I have to deal with bots but if I will do my part in reporting when I can even if it means nothing.
    You must have a lot of friends. "Virtual or physical actions are not separate from the person" are you insane? You're suggesting that because I like to go on PK frenzies that I am actually a mass murderer in real life? Cause that is literally what you are saying. The things people do in virtual worlds have very little bearing on who they are as a person. Basically all you have told people is "I cant keep a secret and I will rat you out at the drop of a hat cause I value this game world more than any friendship" My lord..  
    LOL, I do equate peoples in game behavior to what they are like in real life.

    While you might not be a raging murderer I'm fairly certain you aren't the sort of person I would associate with.
    Post edited by Kyleran on

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  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 15,017
    edited August 10
    F2Plague said:
    Robbgobb said:
    This is a PR thing. I accept that. I also accept that I am glad to see it. I know this is not how they catch them but if they see something and act on it over waiting for everything else then shouldn't that be a good thing. I remember getting items in EQ. I really enjoyed that system though not very efficient. Gold sellers are not going away.

    I have known ex-friends who ended up telling me they bought currency. I have known ex-friends who bragged about exploiting games to make big gains. Some were banned and others not. I for sure did not want to stay friends with them. Virtual or physical actions are not separate from the person. I don't trust the "it is online so it is not like I am actually doing something bad".

    I have reported people who tell me that stuff. I don't want to deal with it. Bad enough that I have to deal with bots but if I will do my part in reporting when I can even if it means nothing.
    You must have a lot of friends. "Virtual or physical actions are not separate from the person" are you insane? You're suggesting that because I like to go on PK frenzies that I am actually a mass murderer in real life? Cause that is literally what you are saying. The things people do in virtual worlds have very little bearing on who they are as a person. Basically all you have told people is "I cant keep a secret and I will rat you out at the drop of a hat cause I value this game world more than any friendship" My lord..  
    No, he's suggesting that if you're lying and cheating in the game then it likely plays out similarly in real life. Integrity doesn't disappear or get altered because we're online.

    I don't think you can have a true friendship like that. Someone who expects you to lie and take part in their cheating even if it's just excusing or covering it up; that person is not your friend. And if you're a good friend you'll call them on it and set a boundary for what's acceptable in your friendship.
    Post edited by Torval on
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  • BruceYeeBruceYee Member RarePosts: 1,086

    Torval said:


    F2Plague said:


    Robbgobb said:

    This is a PR thing. I accept that. I also accept that I am glad to see it. I know this is not how they catch them but if they see something and act on it over waiting for everything else then shouldn't that be a good thing. I remember getting items in EQ. I really enjoyed that system though not very efficient. Gold sellers are not going away.



    I have known ex-friends who ended up telling me they bought currency. I have known ex-friends who bragged about exploiting games to make big gains. Some were banned and others not. I for sure did not want to stay friends with them. Virtual or physical actions are not separate from the person. I don't trust the "it is online so it is not like I am actually doing something bad".



    I have reported people who tell me that stuff. I don't want to deal with it. Bad enough that I have to deal with bots but if I will do my part in reporting when I can even if it means nothing.


    You must have a lot of friends. "Virtual or physical actions are not separate from the person" are you insane? You're suggesting that because I like to go on PK frenzies that I am actually a mass murderer in real life? Cause that is literally what you are saying. The things people do in virtual worlds have very little bearing on who they are as a person. Basically all you have told people is "I cant keep a secret and I will rat you out at the drop of a hat cause I value this game world more than any friendship" My lord..  


    No, he's suggesting that if you're lying and cheating in the game then it likely plays out similarly in real life. Integrity doesn't disappear or get altered because we're online.

    I don't think you can have a true friendship like that. Someone who expects you to lie and take part in their cheating even if it's just excusing or covering it up; that person is not your friend. And if you're a good friend you'll call them on it and set a boundary for what's acceptable in your friendship.



    Torval
  • BruceYeeBruceYee Member RarePosts: 1,086

    DMKano said:



    Viper482 said:


    Anyone who thinks this is not working isn't paying attention to the DDoS attacks that have been occurring in response to it.






    Lol no.



    Proffesional large scale gold selling businesses never DDOS because that is revenue lost.



    Gold sellers are all about making real money, so they need the game to be UP to farm and sell gold, DDOS prevents their operation and the customers buying.



    There was a a ransom with the Albion DDOS for bitcoin, this is a known group (known by FBI cyberops that is) that is not tied to gold selling.



    And yes FBI has agents assigned for US online video game companies to track attacks, I know that every large us game company has a direct agent contact.








    But if the company does a good job of keeping up with the bans and gold sellers keep losing their accounts + stuff then how do they make any money?
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 15,017
    Because doing it the manual way like that can't ever keep up with the rate of account recreation. That's why leveraging the power of data is a good way to keep up with the issue in real time with the minimum resources. There's all that information just sitting there. Why not leverage that in a way humans can't.
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  • LackingMMOLackingMMO Tucson, AZMember UncommonPosts: 206
    I think its good to see a company actively hitting people like this in the open. I remember in vanguard they would announce bans and for what publicly. I liked that, of course more on the back end needs to be done but saying is one thing, at least they are showing. Of course we already have Renoaku to vouch they ban people who buy gold. 

    I also see fighting gold sellers as a losing battle, every single game I see has them, they are always worse at launch, in EVERY game. There needs to be in game mechanics to help minimalize the need for them. 
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,411
    I think its good to see a company actively hitting people like this in the open. I remember in vanguard they would announce bans and for what publicly. I liked that, of course more on the back end needs to be done but saying is one thing, at least they are showing. Of course we already have Renoaku to vouch they ban people who buy gold. 

    I also see fighting gold sellers as a losing battle, every single game I see has them, they are always worse at launch, in EVERY game. There needs to be in game mechanics to help minimalize the need for them. 
    Actually if the game forbids it, and the company can prove 100% that a person purchased the gold I have no problems with such as the video which clearly shows a person offering to sell them gold, then absolutely I salute them for taking fast action against fraud.

    I am just against a game company that falsely bans people even if just 1% of the population getting it wrong when a user actually didn't buy gold using real currency, its simply never happened at least personally with any other game I have played in 17 years, a couple of incidents crossed paths with illegal gold trades, or item trades before but never resulted in any bans for such they just reversed the transactions, with Albion 4.5.1 the rule is that this company will likely accuse you of buying gold even if you just accept currency from someone who is involved in such activiity without knowledge of it, or play the market and sell some items really over priced which are in game mechanics and totally allowed under the EULA.

    I can understand if a transaction starts to happen more than once to different parties for example if I purchased gold on the 5th of Janurary, and then next month, or a couple of weeks later and the same actions took place from different people then absolutely its very likely I am purchasing gold illegaly, but this company does this on any "first offense" even when they can't fully back it up, and they already admit they don't want to show actual evidence of any purchase.

    I would very much love to see a list of all people in game banned and what they are banned for to be open to the public, as well as the company to step up the bans and ways to prevent "RMT" from being a problem in the first place especially when the game just launched.

    GdemamiExcession
  • lahnmirlahnmir UtrechtMember RarePosts: 954
    I think Albion Online does a great job at catching buyers and sellers. They might not catch a lot but the ones they do get, ohh boy, those are well worth it wouldn't you say?  o:)

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
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  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,411
    edited August 11
    lahnmir said:
    I think Albion Online does a great job at catching buyers and sellers. They might not catch a lot but the ones they do get, ohh boy, those are well worth it wouldn't you say?  o:)

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    When its a video like I saw absolutely, I am just pissed at the 1% or so that are false, but I could not help but laugh at those idiots who got busted red handed lol.

    Although I think its more of a PR thing they are doing to try to get a good rep, because other game companies ban just as well such as FFXIV but they don't make it a big open thing like SBI.
    Post edited by Renoaku on
    ExcessionGdemami
  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,849
    Renoaku said:
    lahnmir said:
    I think Albion Online does a great job at catching buyers and sellers. They might not catch a lot but the ones they do get, ohh boy, those are well worth it wouldn't you say?  o:)

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    When its a video like I saw absolutely, I am just pissed at the 1% or so that are false, but I could not help but laugh at those idiots who got busted red handed lol.

    Although I think its more of a PR thing they are doing to try to get a good rep, because other game companies ban just as well such as FFXIV but they don't make it a big open thing like SBI.
    One advantage of being a small indie dev is you can have more fun and not be so stiff and formal as a more corporate entity such as Blizzard or Square E.
    mgilbrtsnTorval

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    On hiatus from EVE Online since Dec 2016 - CCP continues to wander aimlessly

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon




  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 15,017
    Kyleran said:
    Renoaku said:
    lahnmir said:
    I think Albion Online does a great job at catching buyers and sellers. They might not catch a lot but the ones they do get, ohh boy, those are well worth it wouldn't you say?  o:)

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    When its a video like I saw absolutely, I am just pissed at the 1% or so that are false, but I could not help but laugh at those idiots who got busted red handed lol.

    Although I think its more of a PR thing they are doing to try to get a good rep, because other game companies ban just as well such as FFXIV but they don't make it a big open thing like SBI.
    One advantage of being a small indie dev is you can have more fun and not be so stiff and formal as a more corporate entity such as Blizzard or Square E.
    Arena Net has publicly shamed and punished cheaters before. I've seen it done in a few games over the years. Public smitings are the best. :love:
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    Avatar Artist: Howard Blake, Peter Auty (vocalist)
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    Featured Tracks: Walking in the Air
  • RemuNNRemuNN Member CommonPosts: 1
    We played Albion Online untill got bann for "3rd party currency transactions". We played as a small group together at start but then devided into few smaller groups. Some joined one guild, other joined other guilds. I started to play solo. Got few transactions with my friend while we played together. Once i needed 320k silver and traded with him. Game mechanics allow to buy/sell everything at market so i almost never again used trade screen. That one trade was enough to bann me. Noone gived a duck thats your friend and he just gived you some silver. Administration said they had evidence that "you are involved". Though that was one transation for 320k. 320k silver is nothing in game. One hour farm. Thats what is 320k. Heard stories where people got banned even for 100k silver. Thats the worst expirience of communication with support service. They simply dont care, not trying to find out what happened. Dialog? They dont need, they dont listen. Another guy that played with us was banned for LENDING that guy 5k gold. You lend some game currency to your friend in game and administration insist that you are selling gold. They dont care if that happens systematic or once. Literaly - most retarded administration i've seen so far. I mean that was not a surpise for us that this guy was selling gold. Just he was getting it farming in game. He was rich so we could ask him about some silver any time, or lend him some silver cause we know he can return back it in time. I've taken his silver ONCE and got banned. Another guy lended him once and got banned too. Its up to you if you want to play a game where you can be banned anytime. That could be someone else. Few times i accepted game currency from other players that owe me that silver (common practice that one person selling loot from pvp and deviding silver between all group) .. Developers doesnt want to communicate. Seems they dont care.
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