How exactly is this legal?

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Comments

  • SedrynTyrosSedrynTyros USMember EpicPosts: 1,811
    These threads keep getting better.  I look forward to watching the escalation progress.
    RenoakuMrMelGibson
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,286
    These threads keep getting better.  I look forward to watching the escalation progress.
    Sure same, I can't wait to see what their developers have to say about it after I brought this up in a few discord chats and guilds today.

    Wonder if they will allow it or not :3.

    grabs popcorn.
    ExcessionTheScavengerGdemami
  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Chicago, ILMember EpicPosts: 5,727
    Renoaku said:
    There are consumer protections laws in place which can override company's terms of service even if you did agree to them but it depends on the country you live in and the specific issue.  A GM once told me in some countries, people who are banned are legally entitled to a refund, I think this was in ESO when they were banning bots everywhere for awhile.
    Ah thanks, well im in The U.S, and they are in Germany, otherwise I would have already taken it to small claims just to get my money back since I have proof of everything I spent, so I think that is kind of an issue.

    Is there any protection Laws that actually protect customers across country, like in the U.S I know it would be easy for me to deal with.
    You could check and see if the company is registered with the BBB.  If so you could file a complaint and contact the attorney general's office for advice.  The BBB might have some advice in general.
    Gdemami

    "Change is the only constant."

  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,267
    Renoaku said:
    Wizardry said:
    I looked more into the read and deciphered it.

    If this Saya is trying to create something "in game economy" she believes should be in game,why is she supporting such a half assed game that doesn't meet the standards she wants?
    To me it is very simple,if a game does not do enough or cater to what i expect from the game,then i won't support it ,period.
    As to what the one poster stated,yes it is all about laws in general ,they are VERY slow to capture gaming as an important reason to create and change laws.
    The reason is gaming is looked down upon like a meaningless entity as well gaming laws need people to THINK as nothing is clear cut easy to figure out.The law would rather tackle easier issues,stuff they can easily lay down a fine with little effort or thought.

    Make no mistake,gaming needs a LOT of new laws and changer will happen,it will be a very long slow process though.
    Ah thanks, well personally I support a free economy like in EVE, which I have never been banned from btw, the economics are great over there, but I do question how a single player in this game can run an entire bank and call it "The Bank OF Albion" this player can pretty much use investments and such to dominate the entire Gold / Silver exchange, possibly even by using 3rd party API's, plugins, or apps to monitor and track economics to know how much to flip, and when to flip etc.

    Like I got no personal problem with a person doing such, but given this game company does accuse people like myself of being guilty before innocent, how can it be legal, and yeah I do understand it takes time to change and stuff, so I am quite curious of the outcome of what will happen or if they will be allowed to simply dominate the entire market / game.

    Personally even if I was still playing this game, or managed to somehow get unbanned I don't think I would ever trust such a service I might get accused of being a gold seller next or just be losing my entire investment, or some how supporting a Top Guilds siege by them making so much in return and only giving like 10% inevstment for example but really profiting more, after all why would a person in a game run such a service if they were not making profit themselves.
    The answer is easy, EVE has had numerous banks, ship building consortiums,  trade organizations and casinos.

    In almost every case the organizers ran them as legitimate businesses until they acquired a sizeable amount of assets, then they cut and ran off with the goods.

    So unless against the EULA or TOS it's a money making scam most likely.




    Octagon7711

    On hiatus from EVE Online since Dec 2016 - Screw off-grid PVE boosting changes

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,286
    edited July 21
    Renoaku said:
    There are consumer protections laws in place which can override company's terms of service even if you did agree to them but it depends on the country you live in and the specific issue.  A GM once told me in some countries, people who are banned are legally entitled to a refund, I think this was in ESO when they were banning bots everywhere for awhile.
    Ah thanks, well im in The U.S, and they are in Germany, otherwise I would have already taken it to small claims just to get my money back since I have proof of everything I spent, so I think that is kind of an issue.

    Is there any protection Laws that actually protect customers across country, like in the U.S I know it would be easy for me to deal with.
    You could check and see if the company is registered with the BBB.  If so you could file a complaint and contact the attorney general's office for advice.  The BBB might have some advice in general.
    Well I did think about the BBB already and filing a complaint, but does the BBB, handle foreign companies because Albion is located in Germany?

    And sure I could contact an "AG" never had to go about any type of legal steps before but is money invovled as I would likely be out over $174 the amount of money that was lost in their game if I remember the founders pack purchase correctly?

    Also is there a specific one I have to contact if located within the U.S actually wikipedia shows some info not really sure what the heck im supposed to say anyways...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Attorney_General

    Not very familiar with the legal steps on these type of things because I've really never had to do any of them or been involved in them.

    Edit: I actually looked up the information on BBB.org, appears I might be able to file a complaint there it redirects me to econsumer.gov so if I can I will go ahead and file there if I can find the information they are asking me about their company.

    Edit 2: Complaint filed, well we see what happens given my account was in good standing perhaps they will actually get in touch with their company's management.

    Edit 3: with the complaint filed it tells me something about ADR, https://www.econsumer.gov/en/AlternativeDisputeResolution#crnt I am unfamiliar with the whole legal step of "ADR" never had to do anything because I've never been banned being accused of purchasing currency from 3rd parties.

    Although what is the steps for ADR is this like even possible across countries, because personally id just like to have access to what I paid for with the agreement I will never trade across games again but if not they can refund my purchases and then do whatever they want as far as I care, because there are more honest and respectful companies id rather deal with which wouldn't do what this company has done.
    Post edited by Renoaku on
    ExcessionTheScavengerGdemami
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,286
    Kyleran said:
    Renoaku said:
    Wizardry said:
    I looked more into the read and deciphered it.

    If this Saya is trying to create something "in game economy" she believes should be in game,why is she supporting such a half assed game that doesn't meet the standards she wants?
    To me it is very simple,if a game does not do enough or cater to what i expect from the game,then i won't support it ,period.
    As to what the one poster stated,yes it is all about laws in general ,they are VERY slow to capture gaming as an important reason to create and change laws.
    The reason is gaming is looked down upon like a meaningless entity as well gaming laws need people to THINK as nothing is clear cut easy to figure out.The law would rather tackle easier issues,stuff they can easily lay down a fine with little effort or thought.

    Make no mistake,gaming needs a LOT of new laws and changer will happen,it will be a very long slow process though.
    Ah thanks, well personally I support a free economy like in EVE, which I have never been banned from btw, the economics are great over there, but I do question how a single player in this game can run an entire bank and call it "The Bank OF Albion" this player can pretty much use investments and such to dominate the entire Gold / Silver exchange, possibly even by using 3rd party API's, plugins, or apps to monitor and track economics to know how much to flip, and when to flip etc.

    Like I got no personal problem with a person doing such, but given this game company does accuse people like myself of being guilty before innocent, how can it be legal, and yeah I do understand it takes time to change and stuff, so I am quite curious of the outcome of what will happen or if they will be allowed to simply dominate the entire market / game.

    Personally even if I was still playing this game, or managed to somehow get unbanned I don't think I would ever trust such a service I might get accused of being a gold seller next or just be losing my entire investment, or some how supporting a Top Guilds siege by them making so much in return and only giving like 10% inevstment for example but really profiting more, after all why would a person in a game run such a service if they were not making profit themselves.
    The answer is easy, EVE has had numerous banks, ship building consortiums,  trade organizations and casinos.

    In almost every case the organizers ran them as legitimate businesses until they acquired a sizeable amount of assets, then they cut and ran off with the goods.

    So unless against the EULA or TOS it's a money making scam most likely.




    Well actually just recently "Casino" were banned from EVE Online likely because of gold sellers because I personally didn't mind it.

    And yes EVE has a lot of free trading, and compared to Albion a lot of ways to sell items, but EVE also doesn't ban a player for accepting currency from someone in game unless a player has purchased currency then they make it go negative on a first offense and likely a suspension or ban on the second offense, but never really had a problem in EVE besides an issue with Plex's from a 3rd party which wasn't on the authroized reseller list.

    And yes I look at Albion as this person could be a scammer, but who knows I just think its really wierd that their Terms & Conditions says your not allowed to trade without anything in return or in other words in the trade window or they will assume you purchased currency illegally, yet this company allows people to run a bank, and other things in the game even a person accepting Gold Donations for leveling up their mounts and stuff and investments.

    It would be great if the company legally allowed this in the UI or something but as for now the game doesn't have this or support it officially, but it still does violate the rules the same ones I was banned for myself.
    ExcessionTheScavengerGdemami
  • brickleulbrickleul timisoaraMember UncommonPosts: 28
    Pemmin said:
    its legal because of the terms of service you agree to when you installed the client. you acknowledged a legal contract.

     1) they state that you can be banned for any reason basically. (you were caught doing unethical currency trading)
     2) you only own the client....... not the servers nor the game. its perfectly legal to deny you access to their property.

    this is basically every service ever on the internet...what rock have you've been under
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    as for the second question 

    That is their choice how they want to monetize and run the in game economy .... and they have to deal with the financial consequences of that choice whether good or bad. so if you want to feed them money in an attempt to destroy there player base....go for it. just be warned its going to take more then 10k and if you destroy the game its akin to throwing your money away for spite.
    You agreed with ToS, but a big part of the ToS infringe the EU laws and directives, they are writing all kind of stuff there  but you are not legally bind to everything, at least not if you are from an EU country. there is COUNCIL DIRECTIVE 93/13/EEC of 5 April 1993 on unfair terms in consumer contracts, terms that are found unfair under the Directive are not binding for consumers. You paid for a service they cannot deny your access without a proof, they have to subdue to EU laws and regulations. 
    RenoakuGdemami
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,286
    brickleul said:
    Pemmin said:
    its legal because of the terms of service you agree to when you installed the client. you acknowledged a legal contract.

     1) they state that you can be banned for any reason basically. (you were caught doing unethical currency trading)
     2) you only own the client....... not the servers nor the game. its perfectly legal to deny you access to their property.

    this is basically every service ever on the internet...what rock have you've been under
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    as for the second question 

    That is their choice how they want to monetize and run the in game economy .... and they have to deal with the financial consequences of that choice whether good or bad. so if you want to feed them money in an attempt to destroy there player base....go for it. just be warned its going to take more then 10k and if you destroy the game its akin to throwing your money away for spite.
    You agreed with ToS, but a big part of the ToS infringe the EU laws and directives, they are writing all kind of stuff there  but you are not legally bind to everything, at least not if you are from an EU country. there is COUNCIL DIRECTIVE 93/13/EEC of 5 April 1993 on unfair terms in consumer contracts, terms that are found unfair under the Directive are not binding for consumers. You paid for a service they cannot deny your access without a proof, they have to subdue to EU laws and regulations. 
    Hm Thanks I will go ahead and try to read up on some of this because I am not familiar with European Laws at all, although I am unsure about something does this apply to countries outside of Region, or are they bound to follow European Laws even if a customer is located in the United States, or would I have to go through hiring a Lawyer across country which would no doubt cost more money than what I even paid for the game?

    And I am sorry for bringing so much argument to these forums the last week, its rather stressful having to deal with such a company that in 17 years I have never encountered anything like this before on this level.

    But as far as your post says they need proof, and all they have me doing in game is accepting a trade from within the game, and breaking the rule that says you can't receive a large amount of items or in game currency without anything of eqaul value in return, this is likely why they have this rule there if I am not mistaking this.

    http://imgur.com/a/87l0d <-- So far this is the recent stuff I was able to collect, which shows the following.

    . Why my account was banned
    . I played Arche Age
    . My purchases from this company the same month my account was banned
    . And support admitting to a guild member who got banned too that their evidence isn't always accurate.

    This morning a person talking to me on Reddit suggested that I send them an email from another account, and don't start out the support ticket with accusing, or trying to appeal, but just say.

     "I accept the faith of my account" (Account Name Here)"

    And basically ask them if I have consent to create a new account, with the promise that I would never break the Terms OF Conditions, or Previous Terms OF Conditions.

    So being curious I actually did that kept it like within 7 lines max in a support ticket, but I have a feeling that the company is just going to block that email, or not even respond to it, but we will see.

    And thanks for the insight on the matter it would be great if I knew as well if they were bound by European Law, and had to have proof before denying someone access to the purchase since I am from U.S and they are from Europe, if it didn't cost me a arm and a leg, I would look into a Lawyer just because I feel its not right.
    ExcessionGdemami
  • LackingMMOLackingMMO Tucson, AZMember UncommonPosts: 187
    *looks at thread title*
    *sees who made the thread*

    Got busted for buying gold again huh?

    SedrynTyrosMrMelGibson
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,286
    edited July 26
    *looks at thread title*
    *sees who made the thread*

    Got busted for buying gold again huh?

    um not really I don't need to buy gold from 3rd parties it was a violation to trade between games though, and the company really thinks I bought it just like in one other game when I tricked people into paying high prices and took over the whole economy on certain resources for 1 week.

    But I did send them another appeal like the guy on reddit suggested I do, and I will see if they have any type of decency to allow me to create a new account if they do I would love to prove to them that I don't cheat in any way besides a unfortunate event or trade that took place.

    And this morning I was taking a look at buying currency illegally on google search, and I found sites that in this game too are laundering it through the in game market.
    Post edited by Renoaku on
    MrMelGibsonExcessionGdemami
  • johnsonbrownjohnsonbrown Member CommonPosts: 1
    It is not legal. They are in breach of contract if they deny services that you paid for and you did not break the terms of service.

    https://www.econsumer.gov/en/ is where to go for this kind of issue. They do have a section for specifying online gaming.
    MrMelGibsonExcessionGdemami
  • MrMelGibsonMrMelGibson USAMember EpicPosts: 2,237
    Renoaku said:
    There are consumer protections laws in place which can override company's terms of service even if you did agree to them but it depends on the country you live in and the specific issue.  A GM once told me in some countries, people who are banned are legally entitled to a refund, I think this was in ESO when they were banning bots everywhere for awhile.
    Ah thanks, well im in The U.S, and they are in Germany, otherwise I would have already taken it to small claims just to get my money back since I have proof of everything I spent, so I think that is kind of an issue.

    Is there any protection Laws that actually protect customers across country, like in the U.S I know it would be easy for me to deal with.
    I'm pretty sure you'd lose that one very quick when they would show their proof of your cheating.


  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,286
    edited August 1
    Renoaku said:
    There are consumer protections laws in place which can override company's terms of service even if you did agree to them but it depends on the country you live in and the specific issue.  A GM once told me in some countries, people who are banned are legally entitled to a refund, I think this was in ESO when they were banning bots everywhere for awhile.
    Ah thanks, well im in The U.S, and they are in Germany, otherwise I would have already taken it to small claims just to get my money back since I have proof of everything I spent, so I think that is kind of an issue.

    Is there any protection Laws that actually protect customers across country, like in the U.S I know it would be easy for me to deal with.
    I'm pretty sure you'd lose that one very quick when they would show their proof of your cheating.


    Meh like I get it a game company has the right to ban a user for any reason, but respectfully when they come out and lie about me personally, or in some other posts of other people with similar incidents can't keep their own story straight, well then that is the issue.

    If it were in the U.S, and I was accused of purchasing currency I would simply take a copy of my banks transactions to a court, and under oath swear that there was no real money currency purchase within the time period specified by the game company, which would be very easy to determine there was no actual gold purchase.

    I could understand if they told me I was banned for violation of 4.5.1 for trading for outside favors and breaking the rules, but then again they never mentioned that being the issue, and also told a friend asking questions that not all evidence is accurate.

    They even banned another person I was taking the time to read about the last few days and can't even keep their facts straight on top of the many problems with the launch which was not ready to launch.

    The good thing is that the other two games I backed, I am sure I won't have any issues, and even if I did they are in the U.S so in the unlikely thing that something does go wrong, well I think I am legally covered because my RL friend is a Lawyer but only handles things in the U.S.
    Post edited by Renoaku on
    ExcessionMrMelGibsonGdemami
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,286
    edited August 1
    It is not legal. They are in breach of contract if they deny services that you paid for and you did not break the terms of service.

    https://www.econsumer.gov/en/ is where to go for this kind of issue. They do have a section for specifying online gaming.
    Thanks I did file a claim here I think 5-7 days ago, but I haven't hear anything back perhaps I filed it wrong because I didn't see a gaming section?

    Is there a specific way I need to file the claim because I believe I filed it under Online/Shopping, but looking at it perhaps I filed it under other because I didn't see any gaming place to file.

    I mean technically they didn't deliver a product because I was never granted access to my product on release which was purchased, not sure if that would work.

    Edit: I actually see a place to file a complaint its under online shopping, I will go ahead and file another report and put all the info in it just in-case I did file it incorrectly.
    Post edited by Renoaku on
    ExcessionGdemami
  • DeepfallDeepfall ParisMember UncommonPosts: 51
    We are glad you were banned. Cheaters are cheaters.
    Go doom another game.
  • FrammshammFrammshamm TokyoMember UncommonPosts: 280
    stop using the word "legal". It doesnt mean what you think it means. I think you are looking for the word "allowed". Nothing here relates to any part of the LAW.
    Renoaku
  • forcelimaforcelima Atlanta, GAMember UncommonPosts: 196
    Cheese and crackers! This is still going on. You must have really liked the game to be this butt hurt over losing your account.
    MrMelGibson

    Pre-release:
    -"Trion is the best publisher XL could have found for AA"
    -"AA will be different in the west, Trion won't mess it up"
    -"Trion's ArcheAge"
    -"Trion will make their own decision according to what's best for AA on the western market"
    -"Trion has total control, it will literally be a different game over here"

    Post-release:
    "People have to learn that it's not Trion's game and that there is little they can do".

    -Volgore

  • SomethingUnusualSomethingUnusual Member UncommonPosts: 507
    They don't need to show proof or anything at all. They have the right to refuse service. Everyone does. Move on. The law will not be on your side here. 

    The only time the law can get involved would be if a legit case of fraud or the like. And even then you're talking about tying up the FTC complaint for years before ever even talking to a magistrate. (Assuming US, other countries also have trade commissions, and the process would take just as long) Even getting to the point of court, good luck, they have more money and lawyers and you have no case. 
    MrMelGibson

    Death stalks me... Well, figuratively that is. I get killed and people take my stuff.

  • FrammshammFrammshamm TokyoMember UncommonPosts: 280
    Not gonna get within 20 km of a court. Guarantee theres an arbitration clause in those terms somewhere.
  • BruceYeeBruceYee Member RarePosts: 987
    edited August 6
    It's clear now what happened with all the information given by the OP.

    Let's play connect the dots...

    OP said he had multiple accounts stacked with islands which would cost a sizable amount of currency that was probably impossible to farm during the beta periods because ya know, math.

    Sandbox noticed that a single person had a large amount of wealth so they checked to see where the currency needed to have an "X" number of islands came from and probably traced it back to suspicious users that were possibly already flagged as gold sellers.

    As a defense against gold buying the OP claimed that the currency was "traded" for currency in another game and played the "I didn't know that was wrong card" while all along Sandbox probably had the internal data of large sums of silver trades from shifty dudes leading to the OP. 

    The OP seems to have wanted to save a few bucks by using a 3rd party site or trading for currency in another game instead of buying directly from Sandbox which is the part I don't get. If you are that serious about a game to have multiple accounts with maxed islands why risk it all to save a few dollars? I understand that he wanted the world and more but why resort to actions that break the rules of the game to get to those goals?
    Post edited by BruceYee on
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,286
    They don't need to show proof or anything at all. They have the right to refuse service. Everyone does. Move on. The law will not be on your side here. 

    The only time the law can get involved would be if a legit case of fraud or the like. And even then you're talking about tying up the FTC complaint for years before ever even talking to a magistrate. (Assuming US, other countries also have trade commissions, and the process would take just as long) Even getting to the point of court, good luck, they have more money and lawyers and you have no case. 
    Yeah I agree, and thanks, I have pretty much given up on this game seeing how much bs this company pulls, all I really wanted out of them was the truth, although I never got the truth from them because they denied service, refused to refund, or show proof, they still did admit to a guild member which sent me the screenshot which clearly shows from customer service that "Not all evidence is accurate even though it is reviewed, which to me is good enough to prove to people in discord, and gaming community how this game bans peoples accounts, refuses to show evidence, and even admit that the ban may not have been justified, or accurate.

    I did submit the complaints to the FTC in their area, I know nothing is likely to come of them, although this being said it has taught me never to trust a small indie company from Germany again, and if this company were from the U.S I would have already taken it to court, perhpas there is an "arbitration" but when a company has clearly accused someone of something, and you can prove otherwise damn right I would take it to a court, and submit documents and records, if SBI actually told me I broke a rule for accepting a trade across games I would have accepted it, but this company clearly doesn't have accurate evidence.

    And besides the whole ban argument and stuff, I don't understand how this company allows virtual banks, or players within Albion to control the economy, and accept donations without anything of equal value in return which seems like the whole issue of why I was banned in the first place, yet other players clearly do this in the game and it breaks the game rules but seems to be allowed by SBI, again proving corruption within the games GM's and staff which allow this as stated in the original post.
    Gdemami
  • Azaron_NightbladeAzaron_Nightblade KingsmouthMember EpicPosts: 4,223
    LOL, you're STILL trying to find a way back into that game? And even considering paying a 3rd party to help make it happen? Geeze, dude... just HOW much did you spend on that game to be this desperate?

    My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)

    Feel free to send me a message if you want a guest pass to try Black Desert Online as well!

  • RenoakuRenoaku Member RarePosts: 2,286
    edited August 6
    BruceYee said:
    It's clear now what happened with all the information given by the OP.

    Let's play connect the dots...

    OP said he had multiple accounts stacked with islands which would cost a sizable amount of currency that was probably impossible to farm during the beta periods because ya know, math.

    Sandbox noticed that a single person had a large amount of wealth so they checked to see where the currency needed to have an "X" number of islands came from and probably traced it back to suspicious users that were possibly already flagged as gold sellers.

    As a defense against gold buying the OP claimed that the currency was "traded" for currency in another game and played the "I didn't know that was wrong card" while all along Sandbox probably had the internal data of large sums of silver trades from shifty dudes leading to the OP. 

    The OP seems to have wanted to save a few bucks by using a 3rd party site or trading for currency in another game instead of buying directly from Sandbox which is the part I don't get. If you are that serious about a game to have multiple accounts with maxed islands why risk it all to save a few dollars? I understand that he wanted the world and more but why resort to actions that break the rules of the game to get to those goals?
    If I understand correctly this is pretty much what happened.

    . I read the agreement pretty much in 2013, like 4 years ago never bothered to read it again.

    . I played a game called "Arche Age" for about 2 years with 7 accounts, and many lands on it, as well as currency and items. ( I ended up handing all my stuff away "for free" which is not something many people do ,and just packing up and leaving, and I ended up being offered a deal for giving away my items too, as I collected many costumes, cosmetics, and mana wisps etc.

    . Basically I quit AA, and we made a trade across both games for some Albion currency, for some items and stuff in AA. (This is what I did not know was illegal) because the forums said only (RMT) was illegal.)

    . A week later the account gets banned from Albion, If I ever knew it was against the rules to freely accept trades in the game or in my case freely do business for outside favors I would never have done it, and I would have no idea if the gold or currency links back to illegal cheaters, or people who commit fraud of any kind, I would never knowingly accept any in game trade from such people, but if its true that some or all of the currency was obtained illegally by the person, why didn't (SBI) have the ability to ban the low life cheating  scum before they were ever allowed to pass off the currency to me, which like over 90% of the currency was used for upgrading my (Personal Islands) in Albion, because that is what the exchange was for.

    The only real money spent in Albion was to SBI, and it can easily be proven by them if they check my purchase history, if I needed to actually buy gold I could have easily done it through their website, but since I was quitting aa, and made an offer I really couldn't refuse it seemed good given you can covert silver to gold I believed it was legitimate at the time.

    But a life ban from a game just for accepting a trade to me is still a bit much given this game promotes free trading, but does say under 4.5.1 you can get banned for trading or giving away whatever they define is a large amount of items or resources with nothing of equal value in return, and how do we explain this too?http://imgur.com/a/B82WK evidence is reviewed but not always accurate.

    And never, I would never risk my account for a few dollars, I would have rather have paid SBI for the currency received if I knew it could havel ead to a ban in the first place.
    Post edited by Renoaku on
    Gdemami
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