Looking for MMOG with world class crafting

Shadanwolf

The game I'm waiting for is still being developed(Camelot Unchained).  Until then I would love to find an acceptable mmog with fantastic crafting. The game foes not have to have pvp. Crafting is key....and what ever the other features turn out to be I hope to be able to enjoy them.
Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

Quizzical

A Tale in the Desert.  It's old, but if you want good crafting and haven't played it yet, you should fix that at once.

Scorchien

Project Gorgon, EQ2 , ESO ,FF14 or LOTRO ... all have good crafting imo

Amathe

If only you could play original SWG ....

EQ2 has really good crafting. 

Distopia

SWG emu. 

Scorchien

also will add Therian Saga to this list , pretty incredibly deep crafting there also , Maybe the deepest of the bunch...

http://www.theriansaga.com/

rodingo

Fallen Earth has pretty good crafting. At least it used to when I last played it several years ago.

Wizardry

EQ2 and FFXIV have good crafting,EQ2 has housing items so it adds a different aspect.

FFXI had the most depth in crafting but took a very long time to get anywhere and is well past it's prime days.It was also designed that you wouldn't benefit from it until on your 3/4/5th ++ classes.

ROM was an interesting game,the crafting was all about gear and Runes and could take awhile as well.The blemish was that as good as the system was it was geared towards cash shop and that is a bug negative on any front.
If i was looking for a holdover,it would be EQ2 because you can play somewhat free,although if aiming for the best mats to craft near best gear you need to be a member,so there is no real best answer but free is good if no intention to play long term.

IMO it is pointless to half ass play a game waiting for Camelot and also imo Camelot is not a game worth waiting for.

Eldurian

Wurm Online hands down. It is still the only game I've played that the actual process of crafting an item constitutes more work gathering the materials for it. It's 2017. There is no excuse for the actual crafting process to be a timer bar and an animation anymore. 

SaunZ

I like ESO crafting because it is fun, there are daily crafting quests and crafting meant something every level.  I craft all my gear and have been since level 3.  Its fun.

Sz 

Eldurian

Robokapp said:

Eldurian said:

 It's 2017. There is no excuse for 

would've been a fair statement in 2007. you're about 10 years past the mmo innovation.

Right. But there is no excuse for that either.

Eldurian

Wizardry said:

FFXI had the most depth in crafting but took a very long time to get anywhere and is well past it's prime days. It was also designed that you wouldn't benefit from it until on your 3/4/5th ++ classes.

That is the hallmark of a bad crafting system to me. There should be benefit at every level of crafting. It shouldn't be something you have to invest a fortune into to get anything back out of. Yes if you are taking up a new craft you might ruin some materials before making something of value. Dependent on the craft. No you aren't going to make hundreds of thousands of items to get to the point where you break even on materials.

The difference is in real life crafting an item of much value generally takes significant work beyond just gathering the materials. In games, no effort is involved in the actual crafting system.

IMO, any crafting system that fails to address this is automatically disqualified from being "World Class."

Scorchien

Eldurian said:

Wurm Online hands down. It is still the only game I've played that the actual process of crafting an item constitutes more work gathering the materials for it. It's 2017. There is no excuse for the actual crafting process to be a timer bar and an animation anymore. 

Ive tried Wurm 4 or 5 times over the years , its a shit game , hampered by unintuitive systems ,and one of, if not the most cumbersome UI in the genre and the reasons it has so few players .. Nice idea terribly built  game ,that will never be able to escape its core problems ..

Eldurian

Scorchien said:

Eldurian said:

Wurm Online hands down. It is still the only game I've played that the actual process of crafting an item constitutes more work gathering the materials for it. It's 2017. There is no excuse for the actual crafting process to be a timer bar and an animation anymore. 

Ive tried Wurm 4 or 5 times over the years , its a shit game , hampered by unintuitive systems ,and one of, if not the most cumbersome UI in the genre and the reasons it has so few players .. Nice idea terribly built  game ,that will never be able to escape its core problems ..

As I've said in other topics I'm willing to forgive some downsides for innovation. The GUI and graphics are something I can get over in order to enjoy the rest of the game. The fact games like EQ2, ESO, FF14 and LOTRO are all the same game with a few slight variations isn't. I've played that game and I'm tired of it. 

bcbully

I'm not sure what a MMOG is but if you want a MMORPG with great crafting try Age of Wushu or ESO.

Scorchien

Eldurian said:

Scorchien said:

Eldurian said:

Wurm Online hands down. It is still the only game I've played that the actual process of crafting an item constitutes more work gathering the materials for it. It's 2017. There is no excuse for the actual crafting process to be a timer bar and an animation anymore. 

Ive tried Wurm 4 or 5 times over the years , its a shit game , hampered by unintuitive systems ,and one of, if not the most cumbersome UI in the genre and the reasons it has so few players .. Nice idea terribly built  game ,that will never be able to escape its core problems ..

As I've said in other topics I'm willing to forgive some downsides for innovation. The GUI and graphics are something I can get over in order to enjoy the rest of the game. The fact games like EQ2, ESO, FF14 and LOTRO are all the same game with a few slight variations isn't. I've played that game and I'm tired of it. 

Aside from Voxel terraforming which was Notchs work and why he left and took it to Minecraft with him , what innovation does Wurm bring ...

Eldurian

Scorchien said:

Eldurian said:

Scorchien said:

Eldurian said:

Wurm Online hands down. It is still the only game I've played that the actual process of crafting an item constitutes more work gathering the materials for it. It's 2017. There is no excuse for the actual crafting process to be a timer bar and an animation anymore. 

Ive tried Wurm 4 or 5 times over the years , its a shit game , hampered by unintuitive systems ,and one of, if not the most cumbersome UI in the genre and the reasons it has so few players .. Nice idea terribly built  game ,that will never be able to escape its core problems ..

As I've said in other topics I'm willing to forgive some downsides for innovation. The GUI and graphics are something I can get over in order to enjoy the rest of the game. The fact games like EQ2, ESO, FF14 and LOTRO are all the same game with a few slight variations isn't. I've played that game and I'm tired of it. 

Aside from Voxel tereforming which was Notchs work and why he left and took it to Minecraft with him , what innovation does Wurm bring ...

The fact that Wurm is unlike any other game you will play. The closest things you will get are games like Xsyon and Life is Feudal which came after and and are trying to clone some of Wurm's best features. But I'll give you a breakdown:

Crafting - The improvement phase is unique to Wurm. In most games you craft get the needed materials for an item, execute the recipe, and boom there is your item. In Wurm it follows that process at first but the item that pops out is a low quality item for anything except bulk items like nails and planks. Low quality items are virtually useless in most cases. Making the item useful involves a process of improving the item that requires exponentially more time the higher quality you want to make it to the point QL 99 weapons, tools, armor etc. are exceptionally rare. This process is what generates the value of an item more than the materials it is made from. So crafters can easily make back and exceed the value of materials. No making 10,000 daggers at a loss to be able to even break even. It also makes being a blacksmith actually feel like being a blacksmith, instead of being a miner.

Cooking - In the more recent updates Wurm has made it so food gives you various benefits, some unique to your character (Temporary increased training speed in a skill) and some universal (fat, calorie, protein and carb ratings.) There are hundreds of recipes in-game and even slight variations on the same recipe (Such as changing the grain used to make a pie crust) can alter the effects leading to an exceptionally detailed, fun, and interesting cooking system.

Animal Breeding - Animals such as horses can be bred giving random chances for various positive and negative traits. Traits present in the parents increase the chance of traits being present in offspring but there is also a chance for new traits to emerge. Inbreeding also increases the chances of negative effects.

Spellcasting - Spellcasting is done very differently in Wurm. Spellcasters are priests aligned to a particular deity, who give up the ability to do many things to please their deity. Unlike your generic spellcaster, Wurm spellcasters have abilities not at all associated with combat. For instance my priest type allows me to use magic to make plants around me grow faster. Some priests can remove negative traits from animals or fill in cave tiles with rock. Priests are an essential part of the crafting system and economy of the game. But the things they give up means very few people choose to play them as their main, and those who do are very dependent on their social connections to get certain things. Powerful priests tend to be the most valuable characters in the game.

Healing - Wurm works based on a wound system. Wounds that are light or very light heal naturally like in other games. Medium wounds heal naturally if you have any conditions positively effecting your healing rate but do not heal if you do not. Bad and severe wounds worsen over time and eventually lead to death untreated. Wurm uses a system where you apply healing covers of differing potencies based on their ingredients to wounds in order to stop or reverse damage from wounds. LiF copies some elements of this system but overall it's unique to Wurm, and lead to some really immersive encounters where I've saved (or attempted to save) myself, friends, and random strangers from bad wounds.

Full Sandbox - You don't go questing to level up in Wurm. There are no scripted quests. There aren't even many dev built cities. For the most part, the entire world is colonizable and players do whatever they want leading to an experience very unlike the vast majority of MMOs on the market.

Honestly. Despite the fact Wurm was the first to do it, it's terraforming system is one of the least unique things to set it apart these days.

Scorchien

Eldurian said:

Scorchien said:

Eldurian said:

Scorchien said:

Eldurian said:

Wurm Online hands down. It is still the only game I've played that the actual process of crafting an item constitutes more work gathering the materials for it. It's 2017. There is no excuse for the actual crafting process to be a timer bar and an animation anymore. 

Ive tried Wurm 4 or 5 times over the years , its a shit game , hampered by unintuitive systems ,and one of, if not the most cumbersome UI in the genre and the reasons it has so few players .. Nice idea terribly built  game ,that will never be able to escape its core problems ..

As I've said in other topics I'm willing to forgive some downsides for innovation. The GUI and graphics are something I can get over in order to enjoy the rest of the game. The fact games like EQ2, ESO, FF14 and LOTRO are all the same game with a few slight variations isn't. I've played that game and I'm tired of it. 

Aside from Voxel tereforming which was Notchs work and why he left and took it to Minecraft with him , what innovation does Wurm bring ...

The fact that Wurm is unlike any other game you will play. The closest things you will get are games like Xsyon and Life is Feudal which came after and and are trying to clone some of Wurm's best features. But I'll give you a breakdown:

Crafting - The improvement phase is unique to Wurm. In most games you craft get the needed materials for an item, execute the recipe, and boom there is your item. In Wurm it follows that process at first but the item that pops out is a low quality item for anything except bulk items like nails and planks. Low quality items are virtually useless in most cases. Making the item useful involves a process of improving the item that requires exponentially more time the higher quality you want to make it to the point QL 99 weapons, tools, armor etc. are exceptionally rare. This process is what generates the value of an item more than the materials it is made from. So crafters can easily make back and exceed the value of materials. No making 10,000 daggers at a loss to be able to even break even. It also makes being a blacksmith actually feel like being a blacksmith, instead of being a miner.

Cooking - In the more recent updates Wurm has made it so food gives you various benefits, some unique to your character (Temporary increased training speed in a skill) and some universal (fat, calorie, protein and carb ratings.) There are hundreds of recipes in-game and even slight variations on the same recipe (Such as changing the grain used to make a pie crust) can alter the effects leading to an exceptionally detailed, fun, and interesting cooking system.

Animal Breeding - Animals such as horses can be bred giving random chances for various positive and negative traits. Traits present in the parents increase the chance of traits being present in offspring but there is also a chance for new traits to emerge. Inbreeding also increases the chances of negative effects.

Spellcasting - Spellcasting is done very differently in Wurm. Spellcasters are priests aligned to a particular deity, who give up the ability to do many things to please their deity. Unlike your generic spellcaster, Wurm spellcasters have abilities not at all associated with combat. For instance my priest type allows me to use magic to make plants around me grow faster. Some priests can remove negative traits from animals or fill in cave tiles with rock. Priests are an essential part of the crafting system and economy of the game. But the things they give up means very few people choose to play them as their main, and those who do are very dependent on their social connections to get certain things. Powerful priests tend to be the most valuable characters in the game.

Healing - Wurm works based on a wound system. Wounds that are light or very light heal naturally like in other games. Medium wounds heal naturally if you have any conditions positively effecting your healing rate but do not heal if you do not. Bad and severe wounds worsen over time and eventually lead to death untreated. Wurm uses a system where you apply healing covers of differing potencies based on their ingredients to wounds in order to stop or reverse damage from wounds. LiF copies some elements of this system but overall it's unique to Wurm, and lead to some really immersive encounters where I've saved (or attempted to save) myself, friends, and random strangers from bad wounds.

Full Sandbox - You don't go questing to level up in Wurm. There are no scripted quests. There aren't even many dev built cities. For the most part, the entire world is colonizable and players do whatever they want leading to an experience very unlike the vast majority of MMOs on the market.

Honestly. Despite the fact Wurm was the first to do it, it's terraforming system is one of the least unique things to set it apart these days.

umm .. all those things were in UO and or ATITD before WURM .... so not innovative

Gdemami

DMKano said:
No game has "world class" crafting

wtf is "world class crafting" ?!

postlarval

DMKano said:

I say go down to your local hardware store - pick up some woodworking tools and start crafting

No game has "world class" crafting

Most games have NO crafting.

"Press the button, watch the progress bar, and get a prize" is more accurate.

At least EQ2 made you pay attention while you were crafting.

karmath

Doesn't exist. Instead of crafting cool shit, you buy it in the cash shop.

SEANMCAD

Shadanwolf said:

The game I'm waiting for is still being developed(Camelot Unchained).  Until then I would love to find an acceptable mmog with fantastic crafting. The game foes not have to have pvp. Crafting is key....and what ever the other features turn out to be I hope to be able to enjoy them.
Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

Wurm Online or Life is Feudal.

SEANMCAD

Eldurian said:

Scorchien said:

Eldurian said:

Scorchien said:

Eldurian said:

Wurm Online hands down. It is still the only game I've played that the actual process of crafting an item constitutes more work gathering the materials for it. It's 2017. There is no excuse for the actual crafting process to be a timer bar and an animation anymore. 

Ive tried Wurm 4 or 5 times over the years , its a shit game , hampered by unintuitive systems ,and one of, if not the most cumbersome UI in the genre and the reasons it has so few players .. Nice idea terribly built  game ,that will never be able to escape its core problems ..

As I've said in other topics I'm willing to forgive some downsides for innovation. The GUI and graphics are something I can get over in order to enjoy the rest of the game. The fact games like EQ2, ESO, FF14 and LOTRO are all the same game with a few slight variations isn't. I've played that game and I'm tired of it. 

Aside from Voxel tereforming which was Notchs work and why he left and took it to Minecraft with him , what innovation does Wurm bring ...

The fact that Wurm is unlike any other game you will play. The closest things you will get are games like Xsyon and Life is Feudal which came after and and are trying to clone some of Wurm's best features. But I'll give you a breakdown:

Crafting - The improvement phase is unique to Wurm. In most games you craft get the needed materials for an item, execute the recipe, and boom there is your item. In Wurm it follows that process at first but the item that pops out is a low quality item for anything except bulk items like nails and planks. Low quality items are virtually useless in most cases. Making the item useful involves a process of improving the item that requires exponentially more time the higher quality you want to make it to the point QL 99 weapons, tools, armor etc. are exceptionally rare. This process is what generates the value of an item more than the materials it is made from. So crafters can easily make back and exceed the value of materials. No making 10,000 daggers at a loss to be able to even break even. It also makes being a blacksmith actually feel like being a blacksmith, instead of being a miner.

Cooking - In the more recent updates Wurm has made it so food gives you various benefits, some unique to your character (Temporary increased training speed in a skill) and some universal (fat, calorie, protein and carb ratings.) There are hundreds of recipes in-game and even slight variations on the same recipe (Such as changing the grain used to make a pie crust) can alter the effects leading to an exceptionally detailed, fun, and interesting cooking system.

Animal Breeding - Animals such as horses can be bred giving random chances for various positive and negative traits. Traits present in the parents increase the chance of traits being present in offspring but there is also a chance for new traits to emerge. Inbreeding also increases the chances of negative effects.

Spellcasting - Spellcasting is done very differently in Wurm. Spellcasters are priests aligned to a particular deity, who give up the ability to do many things to please their deity. Unlike your generic spellcaster, Wurm spellcasters have abilities not at all associated with combat. For instance my priest type allows me to use magic to make plants around me grow faster. Some priests can remove negative traits from animals or fill in cave tiles with rock. Priests are an essential part of the crafting system and economy of the game. But the things they give up means very few people choose to play them as their main, and those who do are very dependent on their social connections to get certain things. Powerful priests tend to be the most valuable characters in the game.

Healing - Wurm works based on a wound system. Wounds that are light or very light heal naturally like in other games. Medium wounds heal naturally if you have any conditions positively effecting your healing rate but do not heal if you do not. Bad and severe wounds worsen over time and eventually lead to death untreated. Wurm uses a system where you apply healing covers of differing potencies based on their ingredients to wounds in order to stop or reverse damage from wounds. LiF copies some elements of this system but overall it's unique to Wurm, and lead to some really immersive encounters where I've saved (or attempted to save) myself, friends, and random strangers from bad wounds.

Full Sandbox - You don't go questing to level up in Wurm. There are no scripted quests. There aren't even many dev built cities. For the most part, the entire world is colonizable and players do whatever they want leading to an experience very unlike the vast majority of MMOs on the market.

Honestly. Despite the fact Wurm was the first to do it, it's terraforming system is one of the least unique things to set it apart these days.

I would add also suggest Life is Feudal which does have an MMO version in beta.

Its amazing how often people say 'an MMO with deep crafting doesnt exist' and yet some of us play said game every night. (I dont play wurm much anymore but you get my point)

Eldurian

@Scorchien

Eldurian said:

Crafting - The improvement phase is unique to Wurm. In most games you craft get the needed materials for an item, execute the recipe, and boom there is your item. In Wurm it follows that process at first but the item that pops out is a low quality item for anything except bulk items like nails and planks. Low quality items are virtually useless in most cases. Making the item useful involves a process of improving the item that requires exponentially more time the higher quality you want to make it to the point QL 99 weapons, tools, armor etc. are exceptionally rare. This process is what generates the value of an item more than the materials it is made from. So crafters can easily make back and exceed the value of materials. No making 10,000 daggers at a loss to be able to even break even. It also makes being a blacksmith actually feel like being a blacksmith, instead of being a miner.

Scorchien said:

umm .. all those things were in UO and or ATITD before WURM .... so not innovative

Blacksmithing in UO

Blacksmithing in WO

Really? I only checked the first and most important item on the list but you're at least wrong in that regard. I'll trust you probably saw some loose similarities in the list and then made your inaccurate assessment based on that. That seems about like you.

Scorchien

Eldurian said:

@Scorchien

Eldurian said:

Crafting - The improvement phase is unique to Wurm. In most games you craft get the needed materials for an item, execute the recipe, and boom there is your item. In Wurm it follows that process at first but the item that pops out is a low quality item for anything except bulk items like nails and planks. Low quality items are virtually useless in most cases. Making the item useful involves a process of improving the item that requires exponentially more time the higher quality you want to make it to the point QL 99 weapons, tools, armor etc. are exceptionally rare. This process is what generates the value of an item more than the materials it is made from. So crafters can easily make back and exceed the value of materials. No making 10,000 daggers at a loss to be able to even break even. It also makes being a blacksmith actually feel like being a blacksmith, instead of being a miner.

Scorchien said:

umm .. all those things were in UO and or ATITD before WURM .... so not innovative

Blacksmithing in UO

Blacksmithing in WO

Really? I only checked the first and most important item on the list but you're at least wrong in that regard. I'll trust you probably saw some loose similarities in the list and then made your inaccurate assessment based on that. That seems about like you.

LMFAO ,you obviously have no idea what is involved at all with UO smithing , but cherry picking the absolute simplest thing , excluding so much to fit your agenda ..But include a full Wurm vid ..

  That sounds about you ..

 I would take the time to educate you , but from experience it is fruitless and clearly a waste of time ..

 Or we could have a poll and im certain you would lose at 5-6 ratio again , and then cry polls are useless ...

  And thx for the Wurm video reminding us all at how unintuitve and cumbersome this shit game is .  And its nearly the same , you can create higher quality items in UO depending on ore and Blacksmithing /Mining /Armslore Skills  .. Wurm is just a slight alteration  to UOs system (no inovation in WUrm)and of course graphically different ...

  ANd i quote the Wurm video ,, " And thats all there is to it , to create higher quality , its just my skill is to low"

SEANMCAD

Scorchien said:

Eldurian said:

@Scorchien

Eldurian said:

Crafting - The improvement phase is unique to Wurm. In most games you craft get the needed materials for an item, execute the recipe, and boom there is your item. In Wurm it follows that process at first but the item that pops out is a low quality item for anything except bulk items like nails and planks. Low quality items are virtually useless in most cases. Making the item useful involves a process of improving the item that requires exponentially more time the higher quality you want to make it to the point QL 99 weapons, tools, armor etc. are exceptionally rare. This process is what generates the value of an item more than the materials it is made from. So crafters can easily make back and exceed the value of materials. No making 10,000 daggers at a loss to be able to even break even. It also makes being a blacksmith actually feel like being a blacksmith, instead of being a miner.

Scorchien said:

umm .. all those things were in UO and or ATITD before WURM .... so not innovative

Blacksmithing in UO

Blacksmithing in WO

Really? I only checked the first and most important item on the list but you're at least wrong in that regard. I'll trust you probably saw some loose similarities in the list and then made your inaccurate assessment based on that. That seems about like you.

LMFAO ,you obviously have no idea what is involved at all with UO smithing , but cherry picking the absolute simplest thing , excluding so much to fit your agenda ..But include a full Wurm vid ..

  That sounds about you ..

 I would take the time to educate you , but from experience it is fruitless and clearly a waste of time ..

 Or we could have a poll and im certain you would lose at 5-6 ratio again , and then cry polls are useless ...

  And thx for the Wurm video reminding us all at how unintuitve and cumbersome this shit game is .  And its nearly the same , you can create higher quality items in UO depending on ore and Blacksmithing /Mining /Armslore Skills  .. Wurm is just a slight alteration  to UOs system (no inovation in WUrm)and of course graphically different ...

  ANd i quote the Wurm video ,, " And thats all there is to it , to create higher quality , its just my skill is to low"

unless I missed it he didnt tell you what that 'thing' was. so you are klind of comparing the two and his concern completley blindly unless you knew what he was refering to ahead of time becuas e it was obvious.


there isnt a crafting system in the entire gaming industry that is so complex that you guys can not disucss the details.

So if you dont mind, please explain durability and improving in OU