So CIG has taken in over 150 million and yet they still need to take out loans? How much are the big four at CIG paying themselves?
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
1. Is this a) a loan or b) a line of credit that can be drawn upon as required.
2. Does this mean that DS etc. accept that CIG now "has the money" to finish SC? I seem to recall that when CIG said it had sufficient funds to complete development there were doubters. However with DS seemingly putting this line of argument to bed ......
EDIT: Answered via the posted link - see below. This is a - presumably earlier - arrangement - being wound up.
What I basically can not understand is why the hell the WHOLE company ... all IP, all digital and physical assets. And it is a risk, what if funding stagnates, what if there is another global banking crisis - they are putting >400 jobs at risk - there are too many things that can happen and they wont get any other financial support because they went all-in on one card.
No they really aren't lol, they are leveraging their fortune to have acess to more money a will most likely hire more 100+ people in the next years. Their head count keeps growing and growing and they have people all over the world working on the game. Frankfurt Studio will probably become as big as the UK one in a couple of years.
So you expect $50mil+ p.A. in ship sales from the backers in the next couple of years? This implicites that you won't be able to buy the ships ingame for years, which will delay the game economy even further.
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it. The cake is a lie.
Anyone expecting a decline in funding or backers will clearly hasn't been paying attention lol
Let those haters emotionaly masturbate from the wishful thinking of seing Star Citizen collapse while we backers just enjoy the development of the most ambitious video-game ever.
Except it looks like funding is starting to stagnate if you're looking at the year over year.
28.37 mil made in 2013 32.8 mil made in 2014 an increase of 15.61% from 2013 35.9 mil made in 2015 an increase of 9.45% from 2014 36 mil made in 2016 an increase of 0.27% from 2015
Now these numbers don't mean that 2017 will be a negative growth year for CIG but it does show the decline and almost stagnation between funding years which could be related to backer will.
Of course you will probably ignore this post or construct some silly strawman to try and counter what I just said because it doesn't shine the best light on the project.
1. Is this a) a loan or b) a line of credit that can be drawn upon as required.
2. Does this mean that DS etc. accept that CIG now "has the money" to finish SC? I seem to recall that when CIG said it had sufficient funds to complete development there were doubters. However with DS seemingly putting this line of argument to bed ......
1) it's a loan 2) CIG often stated that they have enough money to finish the project, the last statement was they have enough money to finish SQ42.
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it. The cake is a lie.
So you expect $50mil+ p.A. in ship sales from the backers in the next couple of years? This implicites that you won't be able to buy the ships ingame for years, which will delay the game economy even further.
That's irrelevant to the ability to earn and buy ships in-game.
The alpha currency is set to do just that, first we will see the ability to buy components, later the ships, the stuff bought with the currency is ofc wiped time to time as major updates arrive.
That's fine but why has the bank to allow CIG to develop further if CIG still owns the IP and just loose it when they are not paying? There seems to be a term that Coutts is ALLOWING CIG "to develop, produce, exploit and otherwise deal with the Game." This allowance expires if they can not pay.
Furthermore what happens if any other studio needs financial support from a bank. All stuff that they've got or will get in the future are covered.
If you're taking that out of reading people that read it with selective bias we might be missing context and clarity to that. [...]
Well max was right about the selective bias but he probably didn't think he was talking about himself lol
Interesting indeed:
Am I correct in my reading - see Page 21:
Section 2 is a Deed of Release.
B ) Pursuant to the terms of this deed set out below the Chargor and Chargee hereby agree that the Security Interest is now being released.
NOW IT IS HEREBY AGREED as follows:
With immediate effect from the date of this Deed the Chargor hereby (a) unconditionally and irrevocably releases and discharges the Chargor from any and all of its covenants,liabilities and obligations ........
Anyone expecting a decline in funding or backers will clearly hasn't been paying attention lol
Let those haters emotionaly masturbate from the wishful thinking of seing Star Citizen collapse while we backers just enjoy the development of the most ambitious video-game ever.
Except it looks like funding is starting to stagnate if you're looking at the year over year.
28.37 mil made in 2013 32.8 mil made in 2014 an increase of 15.61% from 2013 35.9 mil made in 2015 an increase of 9.45% from 2014 36 mil made in 2016 an increase of 0.27% from 2015
Now these numbers don't mean that 2017 will be a negative growth year for CIG but it does show the decline and almost stagnation between funding years which could be related to backer will.
Of course you will probably ignore this post or construct some silly strawman to try and counter what I just said because it doesn't shine the best light on the project.
Ofc it shines the project in the best light, CIG got all that money with a "broken tech demo" alone, wanna bet how much they will get when 3.0 lands and they flesh it out more and more lol?
These 153$ millions are peanuts for CIG, they will rack up way way more money easily as the game gets more and more updates. Remember the great majority of gamers are adverse of risking into crowdfuding or even playing "alpha builds".
Star Citizen has plenty of monetization options and a community willing to spend and support them for as long as they see progress. Besides it has a more world wide appeal contrary to the small constricted niche games like elite or nms for example.
These financial problems were nothing more than a derpie smart invention to lure bitter goons into rallying with him to atack CIG, that ended up being picked up by the general haters of Star Citizen, based on nothing but hot air blown by the regular tryhard haters they are like a ingoing parody for us backers, 90 days tops is a cool meme so we got that going, which is nice lol.
That's fine but why has the bank to allow CIG to develop further if CIG still owns the IP and just loose it when they are not paying? There seems to be a term that Coutts is ALLOWING CIG "to develop, produce, exploit and otherwise deal with the Game." This allowance expires if they can not pay.
Furthermore what happens if any other studio needs financial support from a bank. All stuff that they've got or will get in the future are covered.
If you're taking that out of reading people that read it with selective bias we might be missing context and clarity to that. [...]
Well max was right about the selective bias but he probably didn't think he was talking about himself lol
Interesting indeed:
Am I correct in my reading - see Page 21:
Section 2 is a Deed of Release.
B ) Pursuant to the terms of this deed set out below the Chargor and Chargee hereby agree that the Security Interest is now being released.
NOW IT IS HEREBY AGREED as follows:
With immediate effect from the date of this Deed the Chargor hereby (a) unconditionally and irrevocably releases and discharges the Chargor from any and all of its covenants,liabilities and obligations ........
Deed of Release has not been signed ... Edit: and don't confuse Chargee and Chargor it could cost you many money
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it. The cake is a lie.
@gervaise1 You're confused there, the deed of release is just like a mortgage, is only issued once the debt has been paid in full.
But by all means, the bank still doesn't stand any right over it if you do not breach the contract.
If I buy a guitar on monthly rates but may take it to gigs from the first rate, I can play my gigs and make money but the owner would be the music store, it makes no difference in the outcome who the owner is so this is irrelevant as long as the rates get paid
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it. The cake is a lie.
Babuinix said: Ofc it shines the project in the best light, CIG got all that money with a "broken tech demo" alone, wanna bet how much they will get when 3.0 lands and they flesh it out more and more lol?
They got the money with selling dreams and a carrot on stick tactic, do you really think that if I am going back to 2012 and show them what we've got in summer2017 with no info nor release date for SQ42 that they would have been able to gather so much money?
Babuinix said: These 153$ millions are peanuts for CIG, they will rack up way way more money easily as the game gets more and more updates. Remember the great majority of gamers are adverse of risking into crowdfuding or even playing "alpha builds".
These $153mil are all they've got all from the backers and they are dependant of the confidence of the backers so as long as they don't rename themselfs to Global Online Peanut Imperium Inc. (GOPII) that's really all they've got ... they'll better release a 3.0 that pleases the backers otherwise confidence will vanish sooner or later. A loan that takes all and everything as collateral isn't working for confidence either.
Babuinix said: Star Citizen has plenty of monetization options and a community willing to spend and support them for as long as they see progress. Besides it has a more world wide appeal contrary to the small constricted niche games like elite or nms for example.
We don't know the number of Backers or actual Players of the "broken tech demo" all we know are played hours/times over 6 months from months ago and that the backer number is something 600k+. But I guess you just meant it as your opinion and it just looked like stated facts.
Babuinix said: These financial problems were nothing more than a derpie smart invention to lure bitter goons into rallying with him to atack CIG, that ended up being picked up by the general haters of Star Citizen, based on nothing but hot air blown by the regular tryhard haters they are like a ingoing parody for us backers, 90 days tops is a cool meme so we got that going, which is nice lol.
I know nothing about financial problems, so I guess you just wanted to troll a bit - in the end we are all humans
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it. The cake is a lie.
All the money CIG has now was earned with their continuous hard work and ability to keep it's community engaged by delivering on the game they want. It's an ongoing team effort which joins passionate dev's eager to make a dream game and passionate gamers eager to play it and going to extra lengths to make it happen.
gervaise1 said: Not confused about what a deed of release is. What I don't know is whether this is the deed of release.
In law a Recital - which is what the document starts with - consists of an account or repetition of the details of some act, proceeding or fact.
So is this something new or the end of something? And whilst the deed of relase hasn't been signed nothing has been fully signed.
Maybe it is nothing more that funding to ensure that SC will release.
I saw the bit about FQ42 and Chargor, at the start mentions CIG is the Chargor and the bank is the Chargee.
But yeah they are ensuring funding side of the crowdfund, overall companies would go with layoffs to cheapen their costs but they seem to be making a push in this area so the team can be maintained as it is, or even grow/outsource if necessary.
Anyone expecting a decline in funding or backers will clearly hasn't been paying attention lol
Let those haters emotionaly masturbate from the wishful thinking of seing Star Citizen collapse while we backers just enjoy the development of the most ambitious video-game ever.
Except it looks like funding is starting to stagnate if you're looking at the year over year.
28.37 mil made in 2013 32.8 mil made in 2014 an increase of 15.61% from 2013 35.9 mil made in 2015 an increase of 9.45% from 2014 36 mil made in 2016 an increase of 0.27% from 2015
Now these numbers don't mean that 2017 will be a negative growth year for CIG but it does show the decline and almost stagnation between funding years which could be related to backer will.
Of course you will probably ignore this post or construct some silly strawman to try and counter what I just said because it doesn't shine the best light on the project.
Ofc it shines the project in the best light, CIG got all that money with a "broken tech demo" alone, wanna bet how much they will get when 3.0 lands and they flesh it out more and more lol?
These 153$ millions are peanuts for CIG, they will rack up way way more money easily as the game gets more and more updates. Remember the great majority of gamers are adverse of risking into crowdfuding or even playing "alpha builds".
Star Citizen has plenty of monetization options and a community willing to spend and support them for as long as they see progress. Besides it has a more world wide appeal contrary to the small constricted niche games like elite or nms for example.
These financial problems were nothing more than a derpie smart invention to lure bitter goons into rallying with him to atack CIG, that ended up being picked up by the general haters of Star Citizen, based on nothing but hot air blown by the regular tryhard haters they are like a ingoing parody for us backers, 90 days tops is a cool meme so we got that going, which is nice lol.
What I basically can not understand is why the hell the WHOLE company ... all IP, all digital and physical assets. And it is a risk, what if funding stagnates, what if there is another global banking crisis - they are putting >400 jobs at risk - there are too many things that can happen and they wont get any other financial support because they went all-in on one card.
They have gone all in because it is the only move they have. 'Leveraging their wealth' LOL - you dont give away your IP if you are doing that.
Does this agreement mean that CIG has already used up their $150 million crowdfunding?
Using all their assets and IP as collateral isn't really strange because the game assets have very little value as anything other but a complete package. But you don't take this kind of loan unless you expect to need it. Star Citizen has made huge sums with crowdfunding, they have a lot of ability to control how much revenue they get through concept sales and sales. If they have to take a loan like this in addition to all that, with no release of either SQ 42 or Star Citizen in sight, it's really bad.
Does this agreement mean that CIG has already used up their $150 million crowdfunding?
Using all their assets and IP as collateral isn't really strange because the game assets have very little value as anything other but a complete package. But you don't take this kind of loan unless you expect to need it. Star Citizen has made huge sums with crowdfunding, they have a lot of ability to control how much revenue they get through concept sales and sales. If they have to take a loan like this in addition to all that, with no release of either SQ 42 or Star Citizen in sight, it's really bad.
Does this agreement mean that CIG has already used up their $150 million crowdfunding?
Using all their assets and IP as collateral isn't really strange because the game assets have very little value as anything other but a complete package. But you don't take this kind of loan unless you expect to need it. Star Citizen has made huge sums with crowdfunding, they have a lot of ability to control how much revenue they get through concept sales and sales. If they have to take a loan like this in addition to all that, with no release of either SQ 42 or Star Citizen in sight, it's really bad.
SaaZam you win the Cupie Doll, well said.
" Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Those Who Would Threaten It " MAGA
In addition to what Vrika said, what does this mean for the business model after launch? If they are not bringing in the money needed now when they can promise the world and sell jpeg after jpeg, how will selling ships and components be enough to sustain them after launch? Dont forget that everything is supposed to be earned through in-game activities.
I know some will not agree but I see a sub fee in the same fashion as BDO coming at launch.
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
In addition to what Vrika said, what does this mean for the business model after launch? If they are not bringing in the money needed now when they can promise the world and sell jpeg after jpeg, how will selling ships and components be enough to sustain them after launch? Dont forget that everything is supposed to be earned through in-game activities.
I know some will not agree but I see a sub fee in the same fashion as BDO coming at launch.
What does this mean anything after launch?
Again this same silly point, the main monetization model of SC as announced is not in practice and will only be once the transactions are implemented in-game, such model is only effective and logical after the game indeed launches.
Comments
2. Does this mean that DS etc. accept that CIG now "has the money" to finish SC? I seem to recall that when CIG said it had sufficient funds to complete development there were doubters. However with DS seemingly putting this line of argument to bed ......
EDIT: Answered via the posted link - see below. This is a - presumably earlier - arrangement - being wound up.
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it.
The cake is a lie.
28.37 mil made in 2013
32.8 mil made in 2014 an increase of 15.61% from 2013
35.9 mil made in 2015 an increase of 9.45% from 2014
36 mil made in 2016 an increase of 0.27% from 2015
Now these numbers don't mean that 2017 will be a negative growth year for CIG but it does show the decline and almost stagnation between funding years which could be related to backer will.
Of course you will probably ignore this post or construct some silly strawman to try and counter what I just said because it doesn't shine the best light on the project.
2) CIG often stated that they have enough money to finish the project, the last statement was they have enough money to finish SQ42.
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it.
The cake is a lie.
The alpha currency is set to do just that, first we will see the ability to buy components, later the ships, the stuff bought with the currency is ofc wiped time to time as major updates arrive.
Am I correct in my reading - see Page 21:
Section 2 is a Deed of Release.
B ) Pursuant to the terms of this deed set out below the Chargor and Chargee hereby agree that the Security Interest is now being released.
NOW IT IS HEREBY AGREED as follows:
With immediate effect from the date of this Deed the Chargor hereby (a) unconditionally and irrevocably releases and discharges the Chargor from any and all of its covenants,liabilities and obligations ........
These 153$ millions are peanuts for CIG, they will rack up way way more money easily as the game gets more and more updates. Remember the great majority of gamers are adverse of risking into crowdfuding or even playing "alpha builds".
Star Citizen has plenty of monetization options and a community willing to spend and support them for as long as they see progress. Besides it has a more world wide appeal contrary to the small constricted niche games like elite or nms for example.
These financial problems were nothing more than a derpie smart invention to lure bitter goons into rallying with him to atack CIG, that ended up being picked up by the general haters of Star Citizen, based on nothing but hot air blown by the regular tryhard haters they are like a ingoing parody for us backers, 90 days tops is a cool meme so we got that going, which is nice lol.
Edit: and don't confuse Chargee and Chargor it could cost you many money
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it.
The cake is a lie.
But by all means, the bank still doesn't stand any right over it if you do not breach the contract.
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it.
The cake is a lie.
Not confused about what a deed of release is. What I don't know is whether this is the deed of release.
In law a Recital - which is what the document starts with - consists of an account or repetition of the details of some act, proceeding or fact.
So is this something new or the end of something? And whilst the deed of relase hasn't been signed nothing has been fully signed.
Maybe it is nothing more that funding to ensure that SC will release.
These $153mil are all they've got all from the backers and they are dependant of the confidence of the backers so as long as they don't rename themselfs to Global Online Peanut Imperium Inc. (GOPII) that's really all they've got ... they'll better release a 3.0 that pleases the backers otherwise confidence will vanish sooner or later. A loan that takes all and everything as collateral isn't working for confidence either.
We don't know the number of Backers or actual Players of the "broken tech demo" all we know are played hours/times over 6 months from months ago and that the backer number is something 600k+. But I guess you just meant it as your opinion and it just looked like stated facts.
I know nothing about financial problems, so I guess you just wanted to troll a bit - in the end we are all humans
When you have cake, it is not the cake that creates the most magnificent of experiences, but it is the emotions attached to it.
The cake is a lie.
But yeah they are ensuring funding side of the crowdfund, overall companies would go with layoffs to cheapen their costs but they seem to be making a push in this area so the team can be maintained as it is, or even grow/outsource if necessary.
MAGA
MAGA
Using all their assets and IP as collateral isn't really strange because the game assets have very little value as anything other but a complete package. But you don't take this kind of loan unless you expect to need it. Star Citizen has made huge sums with crowdfunding, they have a lot of ability to control how much revenue they get through concept sales and sales. If they have to take a loan like this in addition to all that, with no release of either SQ 42 or Star Citizen in sight, it's really bad.
SaaZam you win the Cupie Doll, well said.
MAGA
I know some will not agree but I see a sub fee in the same fashion as BDO coming at launch.
MAGA
Again this same silly point, the main monetization model of SC as announced is not in practice and will only be once the transactions are implemented in-game, such model is only effective and logical after the game indeed launches.