Summer Web Sale and some news that just went down

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Comments

  • TheocritusTheocritus Gary, INMember RarePosts: 5,361
    Its probably what 5 years before this game even considers launch? odds are it probably wont make it.
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Boca Raton, FLMember EpicPosts: 7,185
    Nanfoodle said:
    Distopia said:
    So they introduced items and perks that were supposedly "exclusive" rewards from the kickstarter pledges, into a summer sale available for everyone? Am I getting this right, if not can someone explain what happened.
    It seems they are offering lifetime subs when it was supposed to be exclusive. Their rebuttal is that charging a lesser fee for the KS lifetime threshold is still an exclusive offer. Since they're charging more for it now.

    Either way people are paying an arm and a leg to play a game forever, they may never get to play ever...
    On the KS pledge page, the life time sub never said exclusive. Items were but not the life time sub. 


    Right on your picture it says:
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Lifetime subscription to Ashes of Creation!!

    That's pretty unambiguous and trying to state it means anything other than that is just silly.

    Asm0deus

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Member EpicPosts: 7,600
    Nanfoodle said:
    Distopia said:
    So they introduced items and perks that were supposedly "exclusive" rewards from the kickstarter pledges, into a summer sale available for everyone? Am I getting this right, if not can someone explain what happened.
    It seems they are offering lifetime subs when it was supposed to be exclusive. Their rebuttal is that charging a lesser fee for the KS lifetime threshold is still an exclusive offer. Since they're charging more for it now.

    Either way people are paying an arm and a leg to play a game forever, they may never get to play ever...
    On the KS pledge page, the life time sub never said exclusive. Items were but not the life time sub. 


    Right on your picture it says:
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Lifetime subscription to Ashes of Creation!!

    That's pretty unambiguous and trying to state it means anything other than that is just silly.

    Funny on the official forums yesterday someone post a capture of the pledge and it showed it was not exclusive. I could not find the post so I took a capture without reading it. The one posted on the official forums must have been photo shopped. Hmmmm
    MadFrenchieRealizer



  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Boca Raton, FLMember EpicPosts: 7,185
    Nanfoodle said:
    Nanfoodle said:
    Distopia said:
    So they introduced items and perks that were supposedly "exclusive" rewards from the kickstarter pledges, into a summer sale available for everyone? Am I getting this right, if not can someone explain what happened.
    It seems they are offering lifetime subs when it was supposed to be exclusive. Their rebuttal is that charging a lesser fee for the KS lifetime threshold is still an exclusive offer. Since they're charging more for it now.

    Either way people are paying an arm and a leg to play a game forever, they may never get to play ever...
    On the KS pledge page, the life time sub never said exclusive. Items were but not the life time sub. 


    Right on your picture it says:
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Lifetime subscription to Ashes of Creation!!

    That's pretty unambiguous and trying to state it means anything other than that is just silly.

    Funny on the official forums yesterday someone post a capture of the pledge and it showed it was not exclusive. I could not find the post so I took a capture without reading it. The one posted on the official forums must have been photo shopped. Hmmmm
    I'm sure there's a lot of photoshopping and revising of history going on over there.  just like the whole bit with the Kickstarter "miscommunication" where they broke the rules and posted bits and pieces of Emails.  It's a pattern and it's going to continue IMHO.


    NycteliosKyleranMrMelGibsonRealizer

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Member EpicPosts: 7,600
    Nanfoodle said:
    Nanfoodle said:
    Distopia said:
    So they introduced items and perks that were supposedly "exclusive" rewards from the kickstarter pledges, into a summer sale available for everyone? Am I getting this right, if not can someone explain what happened.
    It seems they are offering lifetime subs when it was supposed to be exclusive. Their rebuttal is that charging a lesser fee for the KS lifetime threshold is still an exclusive offer. Since they're charging more for it now.

    Either way people are paying an arm and a leg to play a game forever, they may never get to play ever...
    On the KS pledge page, the life time sub never said exclusive. Items were but not the life time sub. 


    Right on your picture it says:
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Lifetime subscription to Ashes of Creation!!

    That's pretty unambiguous and trying to state it means anything other than that is just silly.

    Funny on the official forums yesterday someone post a capture of the pledge and it showed it was not exclusive. I could not find the post so I took a capture without reading it. The one posted on the official forums must have been photo shopped. Hmmmm
    I'm sure there's a lot of photoshopping and revising of history going on over there.  just like the whole bit with the Kickstarter "miscommunication" where they broke the rules and posted bits and pieces of Emails.  It's a pattern and it's going to continue IMHO.


    I would not paint IS as being shady. Its a fan who photo shopped the image. I think they are being fair extending the crowed funding for a month so everyone can join in that could not use a credit card on the KS forum. 



  • SeariasSearias Edmonton, ABMember UncommonPosts: 741
    Go to the campaign tab and scroll down to the rewards picture with all the images of the rewards, there the backer reward under Braver of worlds doesn't say that lifetime sub is a Kickstarter exclusive. Seriously guys don't you read stuff before backing? 

    <InvalidTag type="text/javascript" src="http://www.gamebreaker.tv/cce/e.js"></script><div class="cce_pane" content-slug="which-world-of-warcraft-villain-are-you" ctype="quiz" d="http://www.gamebreaker.tv"></div>;

  • CrazKanukCrazKanuk Elmira, ONMember EpicPosts: 5,735
    Nanfoodle said:
    Nanfoodle said:
    Distopia said:
    So they introduced items and perks that were supposedly "exclusive" rewards from the kickstarter pledges, into a summer sale available for everyone? Am I getting this right, if not can someone explain what happened.
    It seems they are offering lifetime subs when it was supposed to be exclusive. Their rebuttal is that charging a lesser fee for the KS lifetime threshold is still an exclusive offer. Since they're charging more for it now.

    Either way people are paying an arm and a leg to play a game forever, they may never get to play ever...
    On the KS pledge page, the life time sub never said exclusive. Items were but not the life time sub. 


    Right on your picture it says:
    Kickstarter Exclusive - Lifetime subscription to Ashes of Creation!!

    That's pretty unambiguous and trying to state it means anything other than that is just silly.

    Funny on the official forums yesterday someone post a capture of the pledge and it showed it was not exclusive. I could not find the post so I took a capture without reading it. The one posted on the official forums must have been photo shopped. Hmmmm
    I'm sure there's a lot of photoshopping and revising of history going on over there.  just like the whole bit with the Kickstarter "miscommunication" where they broke the rules and posted bits and pieces of Emails.  It's a pattern and it's going to continue IMHO.



    Question, what if he had said Summer Exclusive 100 year subscription!!!? Lol. It's effectively the same, right? Shit, even a 10 year subscription would probably be more than you'd ever need. So they could do 100, 99, 98.... 10 so like 91 more exclusives lol. 

    I mean, in the grand scheme of things, if we're talking about the exclusive lifetime subscription, there are probably (well 91) other things they could say which would be effectively the same and mean the exact same thing. 

    Honestly, I'd be more concentrated on the items than anything else. 

    Crazkanuk

    ----------------
    Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
    Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
    Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
    Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
    Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
    ----------------

  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Member EpicPosts: 7,600
    Searias said:
    Go to the campaign tab and scroll down to the rewards picture with all the images of the rewards, there the backer reward under Braver of worlds doesn't say that lifetime sub is a Kickstarter exclusive. Seriously guys don't you read stuff before backing? 
    You mean here? 




  • SeariasSearias Edmonton, ABMember UncommonPosts: 741
    Nanfoodle said:
    Searias said:
    Go to the campaign tab and scroll down to the rewards picture with all the images of the rewards, there the backer reward under Braver of worlds doesn't say that lifetime sub is a Kickstarter exclusive. Seriously guys don't you read stuff before backing? 
    You mean here? 


    Yup

    <InvalidTag type="text/javascript" src="http://www.gamebreaker.tv/cce/e.js"></script><div class="cce_pane" content-slug="which-world-of-warcraft-villain-are-you" ctype="quiz" d="http://www.gamebreaker.tv"></div>;

  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 14,381
    Yep, it says exclusive and I'm sure they didn't intend to extend crowdfunding past the KS. They didn't foresee that people would be excluded. The exclusives were meant for crowdfunding which was expected to stop at the end of KS.

    It was probably short-sighted, but they also probably didn't expect a small bunch of pedantic little knob gobblers to make a fuss just because they like to stir shit up.

    I'm glad they're not letting those people down who've been patiently waiting for this. I wouldn't mind a lifetime sub, but I can't see $400 more at this point. I'm pretty happy with the founder thing. I hope we'll get the summer backer rewards as KS contributors, but if not, meh. The fluff is just skins.
    NanfoodleMrMelGibsonSedrynTyros
    Notice: The artist or album content may be offensive or controversial.
    Avatar Artist: Flesh For Lulu
    Album: Plastic Fantastic
    Featured Tracks: Decline and Fall, Time & Space, I Go Crazy (bonus track on digital release)
  • NycteliosNyctelios Novo Hamburgo - RS - BrazilMember EpicPosts: 2,248
    I don't think the term miscommunication applies when it is intentional.

    So many developers and publishers go back on their word or twist words to bail on their fans later that big part of mainstream market became numb to it - and just accept it as a standard.

    They knew (and know) what they are doing: All the public statements are nothing but lies to damage control, posing as victims or saying the others that took it wrong.
    Slapshot1188Asm0deusjpedrote52

    " Tawnos's blueprints were critical to the creation of my armor. As he once sealed himself in steel, I sealed myself in a walking crypt. "
    —Urza

    - Steam ID Discord ID: Night # 6102
  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Member EpicPosts: 7,600
    Nyctelios said:
    I don't think the term miscommunication applies when it is intentional.

    So many developers and publishers go back on their word or twist words to bail on their fans later that big part of mainstream market became numb to it - and just accept it as a standard.

    They knew (and know) what they are doing: All the public statements are nothing but lies to damage control, posing as victims or saying the others that took it wrong.
    Go back to my OP, thats not the case at all. Steve has been very open and honest. 
    Slapshot1188Nyctelios



  • HashbrickHashbrick Green Bay, WIMember UncommonPosts: 1,255
    Nanfoodle said:
    Distopia said:
    So they introduced items and perks that were supposedly "exclusive" rewards from the kickstarter pledges, into a summer sale available for everyone? Am I getting this right, if not can someone explain what happened.
    It seems they are offering lifetime subs when it was supposed to be exclusive. Their rebuttal is that charging a lesser fee for the KS lifetime threshold is still an exclusive offer. Since they're charging more for it now.

    Either way people are paying an arm and a leg to play a game forever, they may never get to play ever...
    On the KS pledge page, the life time sub never said exclusive. Items were but not the life time sub. 


    Do you have a reading comprehension problem?
    I'm a simple man spoiled from MMOs of the old age.  Looking for a home but deserted.  My heart and time is not worthy for the MMOs of the new age.
  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCMember LegendaryPosts: 9,906
    KS backer angst. It'll take a lot of energy to keep feeling pissed for 3 or 4 years. Yet another reason why I never pledge.

    I rather wait and get pissed off when the game launches if there's reason to be pissed then. I just saved myself 4 years of fretting... profit! :)
    MadFrenchieMrMelGibsonConstantineMeruslaseritSedrynTyros
    When you come to a fork on the road, take it.
    You can observe a lot by just watching.
    No one goes there nowadays, it's too crowded.

    -- Yogi --
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Boca Raton, FLMember EpicPosts: 7,185
    Torval said:
    Yep, it says exclusive and I'm sure they didn't intend to extend crowdfunding past the KS. 
    Seriously?   Do you honestly believe that?  They just magically set up and launched a fully functional store a mere 3 weeks after the Kickstarter ended?

    And do you REALLY think this "Summer Sale" is the end of crowdfunding? Come on, you've been around long enough.   There will be another "sale" and another.. all the way until launch and then on from there.

    They may take a pause for a month or two to count their money and develop some more pixels, but I guarantee crowdfunding is going to continue ad nauseum.

    Realizer

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  • CrazKanukCrazKanuk Elmira, ONMember EpicPosts: 5,735
    Torval said:
    Yep, it says exclusive and I'm sure they didn't intend to extend crowdfunding past the KS. 
    Seriously?   Do you honestly believe that?  They just magically set up and launched a fully functional store a mere 3 weeks after the Kickstarter ended?

    And do you REALLY think this "Summer Sale" is the end of crowdfunding? Come on, you've been around long enough.   There will be another "sale" and another.. all the way until launch and then on from there.

    They may take a pause for a month or two to count their money and develop some more pixels, but I guarantee crowdfunding is going to continue ad nauseum.


    And if they ship, does that mean that the end justifies the means? Difficult to say. If SC ships and this ends up shipping, this pushing of pixels could become the de facto standard for executing funding for games which require larger budgets. 

    You're probably right, it's probably not likely to be their last funding. It's also quite possible they'll take on some private funding. It's effectively what every other project of this nature has done in recent memory. Even if they said they wouldn't do anything else, I don't know why people would expect any different. Remember, this guy doesn't know what he's doing because he's never developed a game :) 

    Crazkanuk

    ----------------
    Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
    Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
    Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
    Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
    Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
    ----------------

  • Tiamat64Tiamat64 Member RarePosts: 806
    edited June 22
    CrazKanuk said:
    And if they ship, does that mean that the end justifies the means? 
    Question should be modified to be "if they ship AND if the game is good".

    Shipping by itself without the latter won't really accomplish much after all.  Just look at say, Shroud of the Avatar for proof of that.
    Post edited by Tiamat64 on
    CrazKanukDistopiaMrMelGibsonlaserit
  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDMember EpicPosts: 21,106
    When you lay with the devil, you get burned. In this case the devil being business.....

    In the pursuit of money and success people are nothing but a stepping stone. People need to come to grips with that. Exclusives are rarely truly exclusive, in the entertainment industry especially. How do you think people who spend hundreds on convention exclusives (including price of entry/hotel stays etc..) feel when they see it on Thinkgeek for pennies to the dollar of what they paid? 

    The only decision you can trust these folks to make is the one that leads to more funds, that's the bottom line. 
    NanfoodleMrMelGibsonSedrynTyros

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 14,381
    Torval said:
    Yep, it says exclusive and I'm sure they didn't intend to extend crowdfunding past the KS. 
    Seriously?   Do you honestly believe that?  They just magically set up and launched a fully functional store a mere 3 weeks after the Kickstarter ended?

    And do you REALLY think this "Summer Sale" is the end of crowdfunding? Come on, you've been around long enough.   There will be another "sale" and another.. all the way until launch and then on from there.

    They may take a pause for a month or two to count their money and develop some more pixels, but I guarantee crowdfunding is going to continue ad nauseum.


    I don't care if they planned it or not. I don't think they anticipated everything but if they did then good for them for having that foresight.

    And yeah, I think people can set up a fully functioning web store in 3 weeks. I think it took that long because they had to build out a way to integrate existing KS pledges into accounts. If they didn't have to do that then a simple account based store would be easy.

    I already put my opinion about continued crowdfunding on their site. It's the same opinion that I have about CU and Pantheon - they should keep it up all the time and not do limited time campaigns. I hope they realize that at some point in the future and just keep the store open. CSE and VR are smart for continuing to offer backer buy-in tiers. They're mmos. It's about getting a lot of people playing the game together why wouldn't they keep the store open and let people do what they want? I hope they do.
    Notice: The artist or album content may be offensive or controversial.
    Avatar Artist: Flesh For Lulu
    Album: Plastic Fantastic
    Featured Tracks: Decline and Fall, Time & Space, I Go Crazy (bonus track on digital release)
  • PonziniPonzini Hollister, CAMember UncommonPosts: 411
    Distopia said:
    When you lay with the devil, you get burned. In this case the devil being business.....

    In the pursuit of money and success people are nothing but a stepping stone. People need to come to grips with that. Exclusives are rarely truly exclusive, in the entertainment industry especially. How do you think people who spend hundreds on convention exclusives (including price of entry/hotel stays etc..) feel when they see it on Thinkgeek for pennies to the dollar of what they paid? 

    The only decision you can trust these folks to make is the one that leads to more funds, that's the bottom line. 
    Man you guys are so dramatic. This was an extension of the kickstarter for 1 month for people who couldn't take part in the regular kickstarter campaign. How shit would it be to not include the same rewards everyone else got? Not everything has to be a scandal, my dudes. 
    Scarah
  • NycteliosNyctelios Novo Hamburgo - RS - BrazilMember EpicPosts: 2,248
    Ponzini said:
    Distopia said:
    When you lay with the devil, you get burned. In this case the devil being business.....

    In the pursuit of money and success people are nothing but a stepping stone. People need to come to grips with that. Exclusives are rarely truly exclusive, in the entertainment industry especially. How do you think people who spend hundreds on convention exclusives (including price of entry/hotel stays etc..) feel when they see it on Thinkgeek for pennies to the dollar of what they paid? 

    The only decision you can trust these folks to make is the one that leads to more funds, that's the bottom line. 
    Man you guys are so dramatic. This was an extension of the kickstarter for 1 month for people who couldn't take part in the regular kickstarter campaign. How shit would it be to not include the same rewards everyone else got? Not everything has to be a scandal, my dudes. 
    Took you long enough

    " Tawnos's blueprints were critical to the creation of my armor. As he once sealed himself in steel, I sealed myself in a walking crypt. "
    —Urza

    - Steam ID Discord ID: Night # 6102
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 14,381
    Nyctelios said:
    Ponzini said:
    Distopia said:
    When you lay with the devil, you get burned. In this case the devil being business.....

    In the pursuit of money and success people are nothing but a stepping stone. People need to come to grips with that. Exclusives are rarely truly exclusive, in the entertainment industry especially. How do you think people who spend hundreds on convention exclusives (including price of entry/hotel stays etc..) feel when they see it on Thinkgeek for pennies to the dollar of what they paid? 

    The only decision you can trust these folks to make is the one that leads to more funds, that's the bottom line. 
    Man you guys are so dramatic. This was an extension of the kickstarter for 1 month for people who couldn't take part in the regular kickstarter campaign. How shit would it be to not include the same rewards everyone else got? Not everything has to be a scandal, my dudes. 
    Took you long enough
    Not quicker than you, slappy, and the happy crew. Think about that from your glass house.
    SedrynTyros
    Notice: The artist or album content may be offensive or controversial.
    Avatar Artist: Flesh For Lulu
    Album: Plastic Fantastic
    Featured Tracks: Decline and Fall, Time & Space, I Go Crazy (bonus track on digital release)
  • KajidourdenKajidourden Panama City, FLMember RarePosts: 1,422
    Yet another over-promise, under-deliver KS campaign.  
    Iselin
  • WizardryWizardry Ontario, CanadaMember EpicPosts: 12,969
    I like the part with that Steven guy.

    Sort of says,oh thanks for being a backer but we really don't care about you after we get your money,we move on to new fish to lure in.It will always be like this in scam operations,there will be some new gimmick to lure in more money down the road hanging backers out to dry.
    In reality,it says your NOT a backer,just some random person giving another random person some free money.

    The real scam is in the wording >>>Lifetime subscription.This game will not survive but a few months as a sub game,it will be a for certain cash shop game meaning that claim of lifetime sub is meaningless.

    Epic mount....so you will run around the game showing yourself as having bought your item and not earned it in game,no difference than just rmt gaming,which devs USED to ban people for,now it has become common place for luring in money.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Boca Raton, FLMember EpicPosts: 7,185
    Torval said:
    Nyctelios said:
    Ponzini said:
    Distopia said:
    When you lay with the devil, you get burned. In this case the devil being business.....

    In the pursuit of money and success people are nothing but a stepping stone. People need to come to grips with that. Exclusives are rarely truly exclusive, in the entertainment industry especially. How do you think people who spend hundreds on convention exclusives (including price of entry/hotel stays etc..) feel when they see it on Thinkgeek for pennies to the dollar of what they paid? 

    The only decision you can trust these folks to make is the one that leads to more funds, that's the bottom line. 
    Man you guys are so dramatic. This was an extension of the kickstarter for 1 month for people who couldn't take part in the regular kickstarter campaign. How shit would it be to not include the same rewards everyone else got? Not everything has to be a scandal, my dudes. 
    Took you long enough
    Not quicker than you, slappy, and the happy crew. Think about that from your glass house.
    Me?  All I did was point out that it only took 3 weeks for them to break the "Kickstarter Exclusive" statement.  Don't worry... lots more to come.


    For the record yeah I agree that any company would be crazy to turn away revenue... that doesn't excuse blatant lying though.  If something is a Kickstarter Exclusive that means if goes away after Kickstarter.  There is no wiggle room.   If you want to sell it after Kickstarter don't call it an exclusive.  It's a pretty simple concept.

    Say what you mean and do what you say.  Simple stuff.


    KyleranNycteliosTalonsin

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

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