The biggest problem isn't the story, voice acting or the actual game mechanics

TheScavengerTheScavenger Matrix, NYMember RarePosts: 2,273
edited June 11 in Secret World Legends
The biggest problem wasn't the story, the voice acting, the actual game mechanics.

Most people stopped playing because the animations and character models are horrible (which is funny because in Age of Conan MMO, characters not only look better but have vastly better animations. Why didn't they copy AoC and make the engine more modern?)

TSW has always had an outdated, nerfed game engine compared to their older MMO AoC...which again looks and performs way better. Kinda weird because its older.

If you go on reddit, most people say the game itself is good, but animation is crap. That is the #1 reason I see why most people don't like TSW. They aren't fixing that because it would need a complete remake of the game. 

And that is why I stopped playing, because the characters and animations are so damn ugly. I went to AoC, and it was way better despite being older.

Sadly, TSW Legends is NOT going to see them success. Not only is the game getting an NGE that is even worse (or at very least, just as bad) than what Lucas Arts did to SWG. But they aren't fixing the #1 and #2 problems people quit (again, go on reddit and the vast majority quit because...) character models and animations. And they can't fix that without remaking the game in a better engine like AoC used. Or if it is the same engine, that is really sad and even worse, because I got on AoC the other day and it still looked better (not just graphics/art style, but animations and movement, especially combat wise) than TSW lol.

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Post edited by TheScavenger on
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  • postlarvalpostlarval Member EpicPosts: 1,686
    The biggest problem wasn't the story, the voice acting, the actual game mechanics.

    Most people stopped playing because the animations and character models are horrible (which is funny because in Age of Conan MMO, characters not only look better but have vastly better animations. Why didn't they copy AoC and make the engine more modern?)

    TSW has always had an outdated, nerfed game engine compared to their older MMO AoC...which again looks and performs way better. Kinda weird because its older.

    If you go on reddit, most people say the game itself is good, but animation is crap. That is the #1 reason I see why most people don't like TSW. They aren't fixing that because it would need a complete remake of the game. 

    And that is why I stopped playing, because the characters and animations are so damn ugly. I went to AoC, and it was way better despite being older.

    Sadly, TSW Legends is NOT going to see them success. Not only is the game getting an NGE that is even worse (or at very least, just as bad) than what Lucas Arts did to SWG. But they aren't fixing the #1 and #2 problems people quit (again, go on reddit and the vast majority quit because...) character models and animations. And they can't fix that without remaking the game in a better engine like AoC used. Or if it is the same engine, that is really sad and even worse, because I got on AoC the other day and it still looked better (not just graphics/art style, but animations and movement, especially combat wise) than TSW lol.
    Both games use the Dreamworld engine and the improvements they made for AoC were imported into TSW.
  • TheScavengerTheScavenger Matrix, NYMember RarePosts: 2,273
    The biggest problem wasn't the story, the voice acting, the actual game mechanics.

    Most people stopped playing because the animations and character models are horrible (which is funny because in Age of Conan MMO, characters not only look better but have vastly better animations. Why didn't they copy AoC and make the engine more modern?)

    TSW has always had an outdated, nerfed game engine compared to their older MMO AoC...which again looks and performs way better. Kinda weird because its older.

    If you go on reddit, most people say the game itself is good, but animation is crap. That is the #1 reason I see why most people don't like TSW. They aren't fixing that because it would need a complete remake of the game. 

    And that is why I stopped playing, because the characters and animations are so damn ugly. I went to AoC, and it was way better despite being older.

    Sadly, TSW Legends is NOT going to see them success. Not only is the game getting an NGE that is even worse (or at very least, just as bad) than what Lucas Arts did to SWG. But they aren't fixing the #1 and #2 problems people quit (again, go on reddit and the vast majority quit because...) character models and animations. And they can't fix that without remaking the game in a better engine like AoC used. Or if it is the same engine, that is really sad and even worse, because I got on AoC the other day and it still looked better (not just graphics/art style, but animations and movement, especially combat wise) than TSW lol.
    Both games use the Dreamworld engine and the improvements they made for AoC were imported into TSW.
    Is that something (importing the improvements) they did for Secret World Legends? Cause I saw some leaked videos, and the animations were still...well...junk (especially in combat) compared to AoC. AoC still has some of the best combat in an MMO (not THE best, but better than most). And I didn't see much improvement in characters either. Maybe since it was a beta leak, that could have been from an earlier build that was leaked.

    Either way, TSW Legends is looking to be another SWG NGE experience lol. But most complaints came from animations/models...so really all they had to do was revamp that and keep the game the same. There was never anything wrong with The Secret World game mechanics or gameplay or story. I loved that part of TSW. I loved all the builds you could do. Most people enjoyed that aspect, but the animations killed it for a lot of people (including me).

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  • LeetheLeethe Member UncommonPosts: 893
    I never understood what people meant by that and I still don't now. i never even noticed most of the animations. i mostly stopped playing because of the grind, skill curve and zone design.
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  • DullahanDullahan Member EpicPosts: 4,419
    Animations are a pretty big part of connecting one to their character, but I still think most people would overlook that if the rest of the game was good.

    The real reason people don't play mmos anymore is because they aren't massively multiplayer.
    deniterAgent_JosephLucienRene


  • Agent_JosephAgent_Joseph Member UncommonPosts: 1,254
    only what I dislike in TSW was scenarios ;augment grind,it was bored for me
    brw  ... in mmo's I looking for ingame world/universe ,dont care for animations,combat ...

    only EVE is real MMO...but I am impressive with TSW

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDMember EpicPosts: 21,173
    Dullahan said:


    The real reason people don't play mmos anymore is because they aren't massively multiplayer.
    I have to wonder how many actually care about something like that, especially in a story driven game like TSW. What actual benefit does that provide to such a game?

    A lot of these types of games would probably have faired better if they were designed from the ground up for small scale co-op play IMO. A lot less in the way of limitations would have been imposed on them to provide an MMO design. In turn more fine tuning would have been possible in the way of animation and aspects like that. The MMO part seems more of a detriment to games like this and SWTOR (etc)....
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  • Azaron_NightbladeAzaron_Nightblade KingsmouthMember EpicPosts: 4,286
    only what I dislike in TSW was scenarios ;augment grind,it was bored for me
    brw  ... in mmo's I looking for ingame world/universe ,dont care for animations,combat ...
    Scenarios was one I grew to dislike too.
    Animations & character models are high on the list as well. The former look way too wooden/clunky, and the latter have never really been to my liking compared to other MMOs.

    Part of the reason I loathed scenarios was because they were a painful reminder that despite the gazillion skills the game had to make builds with, it was basically just the "illusion" of choice. If you wanted to do them properly, you were pretty much forced to adopt one of the cheesy spin2win builds.

    So I'm all for the overall of the skill system. Get rid of all that excess bloat that no one ever uses anyway.

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  • Azaron_NightbladeAzaron_Nightblade KingsmouthMember EpicPosts: 4,286
    Distopia said:
    Dullahan said:


    The real reason people don't play mmos anymore is because they aren't massively multiplayer.
    I have to wonder how many actually care about something like that, especially in a story driven game like TSW. What actual benefit does that provide to such a game?

    A lot of these types of games would probably have faired better if they were designed from the ground up for small scale co-op play IMO. A lot less in the way of limitations would have been imposed on them to provide an MMO design. In turn more fine tuning would have been possible in the way of animation and aspects like that. The MMO part seems more of a detriment to games like this and SWTOR (etc)....
    Very few, I imagine. And I think you're right. If they had gone for a similar design as they are doing now, I suspect the game would've been better off.
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  • DullahanDullahan Member EpicPosts: 4,419
    Yes, some games would do better to either design the game all the way to be massively multiplayer, or just make it multiplayer. All the half-assed in between stuff isn't harnessing the potential of a virtual world. Might as well just give everyone their own server and let them invite friends, as there is a whole lot more to doing a successful mmo than throwing people into a persistent world.
    Azaron_NightbladeDistopia


  • MykellMykell MackayMember UncommonPosts: 684
    I left because i hit a point where the skills i had chosen couldn't get past the content and i didn't really understand why. The whole skill wheel thing just wasn't very intuitive and more of a reason why i stopped playing rather than anything to do with models or animation.
    MrMelGibsonHariken
  • SalmonManSalmonMan NZMember UncommonPosts: 138
    edited June 11
    I stopped playing old secret world because it was confusing - the inventory, gear, the skills. All of it. The story and atmosphere was great. That hasn't changed in the new one, but now its much easier to get to grips with weapons and skills. I'll definately be playing more when it launches. Seems like good changes to me.
    Post edited by SalmonMan on
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  • hfztthfztt GlostrupMember RarePosts: 1,255
    I have to agree with what seems to be the majority reply here: The animations was not the issue.

    I never let gfx get in the way of great gameplay. Hell Endless Dungeon is one of my favorite games.

    I the gameplay is not good the game can look however great with the most polished animations ever. Still wont touch it.

    TSW was great for the first Zone. After that progression grind and the very confusing skill wheel started to get in the way of just having fun. That was the main issue for me.
    Azaron_Nightblade
  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,884
    Mykell said:
    I left because i hit a point where the skills i had chosen couldn't get past the content and i didn't really understand why. The whole skill wheel thing just wasn't very intuitive and more of a reason why i stopped playing rather than anything to do with models or animation.
    Yeah, this is one thing which stopped me from continuing. I was in the 2nd part of Egypt and was a melee build and it was getting wearying battling my way thru.

    Animations and character models were never any concern however, just not much of a factor in my decisions to play games.
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  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus LondonMember EpicPosts: 1,338
    Kyleran said:
    Mykell said:
    I left because i hit a point where the skills i had chosen couldn't get past the content and i didn't really understand why. The whole skill wheel thing just wasn't very intuitive and more of a reason why i stopped playing rather than anything to do with models or animation.
    Yeah, this is one thing which stopped me from continuing. I was in the 2nd part of Egypt and was a melee build and it was getting wearying battling my way thru.

    Animations and character models were never any concern however, just not much of a factor in my decisions to play games.
    Wasn't mine either ever. But I was a Sword/Chaos tank and I had to spam a skill which made my toon spin like a fat guy in a ballet class. I tanked several nm a day, and I really fucking hated that. 

    I changed builds only to witness another god awful animation with the freaking hammer. IL

    I realized there's a first time for everything. So I quit over bad animations and effects. Never happened again though. 
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  • Po_ggPo_gg Twigwarren, WestfarthingMember RarePosts: 4,136
    edited June 12
    Kyleran said:
    Mykell said:
    I left because i hit a point where the skills i had chosen couldn't get past the content and i didn't really understand why. The whole skill wheel thing just wasn't very intuitive and more of a reason why i stopped playing rather than anything to do with models or animation.
    Yeah, this is one thing which stopped me from continuing. I was in the 2nd part of Egypt and was a melee build and it was getting wearying battling my way thru.
    It's like complaining about chess being too hard (all those different moves and pieces, too confusing, I just want the pieces move one step forward all the time, and when it's a combat, we do that action-style, arm wrestling, now that is more fun :lol: )

    TSW wasn't the regular "the skills i had chosen ... get past the content" game, adapting was almost half the gameplay... That was the whole point of the design, there were tons of missions explaining it, entire areas for it, TSW was not the game where you play the same skills all the way through the end.

    Sure, after the years of whining it was dumbed down two times, which at the end resulted that exact stage you wanted, with basically any starter deck you could play all the way to Tokyo without ever changing your abilities... but for some even that wasn't enough. Maybe those will love Legend's stone-paved, straightforward, brainwork-free approach :lol: 


    TSW wasn't a perfect game, it had two quite large issues, the Scenarios and the AEGIS (both are still in Legends, just sayin').
    All the rest was just whining over reddit and external forums as Scavenger noted, and Funcom (rightfully so) didn't care much about those voices, besides the dumbing down (which update backfired of course, since it was unnecessary for the players, and haven't brought back whiners either).

    OP says they don't fix the issues in Legends... of course not, why is it a surprise? Legends is only here because Exiles gave them the financial elbow room for some gambling and double-dipping. Too bad they've killed their best game for this money-grabbing chance, and flushed down the toilet one of the best communities out there, but hey, the beancounters said it will be good for the profits! That's all what matters, right?  :flushed:
    Post edited by Po_gg on
  • DMKanoDMKano Gamercentral, AKMember LegendaryPosts: 17,140
    edited June 12
    Not for me - the animations was not the reason I stopped playing.

    Why did I stop playing TSW? - here's my reasons

    1. It got boring, the first zone was the best and then as you "leveled up/got better gear" on each zone got worse
    2. The combat wasn't all that engaging, I had a build that was 100% faceroll (this was at launch)
    3. I did all the content in about 3 weeks of casual play  - there was nothing else to see/do in game
    4. I quit

    That's it

    Not at any time did I go - man look at these animations, and these character models - I am going to quit. Nope that was not the reason at all.

    The #1 reason why people quit games is - boredom/not fun anymore

    Post edited by DMKano on
  • Po_ggPo_gg Twigwarren, WestfarthingMember RarePosts: 4,136
    DMKano said:
    2. The combat wasn't all that engaging, I had a build that was 100% faceroll (this was at launch)
    Yeah, CtP was nerfed quite soon, but apparently not soon enough :smiley:  with the right passives it was a real monster, I remember once in a group of 3 we cleared a lair just with dps-ing everything on sight...

    But it was good for a test of the design, that they only need to adjust (khm. nerf) one ability from the 500+ and it will fix a too OP deck.
  • JeroKaneJeroKane OsloMember RarePosts: 5,898
    Scenarios and the Eagis system is what drove me away. That huge brick progession wall that hit you in the face when entering Tokyo.

    If they don't fix that in SWL, the bye bye.... SWL will go down same way as TSW.
    Po_gg
  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,884
    Po_gg said:
    Kyleran said:
    Mykell said:
    I left because i hit a point where the skills i had chosen couldn't get past the content and i didn't really understand why. The whole skill wheel thing just wasn't very intuitive and more of a reason why i stopped playing rather than anything to do with models or animation.
    Yeah, this is one thing which stopped me from continuing. I was in the 2nd part of Egypt and was a melee build and it was getting wearying battling my way thru.
    It's like complaining about chess being too hard (all those different moves and pieces, too confusing, I just want the pieces move one step forward all the time, and when it's a combat, we do that action-style, arm wrestling, now that is more fun :lol: )

    TSW wasn't the regular "the skills i had chosen ... get past the content" game, adapting was almost half the gameplay... That was the whole point of the design, there were tons of missions explaining it, entire areas for it, TSW was not the game where you play the same skills all the way through the end.

    Apparently I missed the memo. What I saw was a skill wheel with clearly layers of progression so I picked a path and tried to perfect it. Never saw where I was supposed to abandon my hammer build and pick up some pistols.

    But it was the same with ESO, I don't want flexibility in builds. I'm an old school class player, with specific roles, skills and abilities. 

    Which is why I'm playing classic DAOC. From beginning to end my Menti kills with double dots/kiting, my Luri pet pulls killing with a damage shield while I manage power pools and pet healing.  

    Druid is currently a solo build so she kills with a combo of dot, kite, pet damage (tanking or damage add) and wacking the mops with a hammer as the finisher.  Once she gets to 40 I'll flip her spec to full buffer/healer and she'll rarely kill again.

    I just like it this way so yes, when I heard they were going to simplify the skill trees I did grow more interested, as I did enjoy the story.
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  • Po_ggPo_gg Twigwarren, WestfarthingMember RarePosts: 4,136
    edited June 12
    Kyleran said:
    ...I don't want flexibility in builds. I'm an old school class player, with specific roles, skills and abilities.
    Nothing's wrong with that, everyone has different preferences. What bugged me was more like the constant whining over the years (not by you, I mean more generally)...  I just don't get why are people wasting their time instead of focusing on the games they like.

    For example, I don't like Eve or DAoC (no offense :wink:  must be coincidence). But it doesn't mean I spam all over the web with total nonsense, according to their layout, like "PvE server to Eve" "down with the Goons, Mitts sucks", "come on, ban the alt accounts CCP" and similar :lol:
    I just recognise after some play that it's a game not very suitable to me, and I move on. I don't even follow the news and updates of those games (and trust me, there are quite a lot of them I don't play :wink: ) because I don't want to waste my time.
    True, when daoc-dude Firor got ESO I had some sarcastic remarks about the subject... lol.


    Don't get me wrong, Legends is not here just because of those voices, to make a game for those people. If Exiles is not this money-shower to Funcom, I'm sure TSW would've just slowly gone into maintenance mode with AoC and AO. But I believe those years of "change the combat" whine has at least some part of why this is not a "proper" NGE within the same game but a totally new game, with the old one killed off.
    So, basically, it's your fault, people, you should be ashamed of yourselves :smiley:
    Post edited by Po_gg on
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 15,049
    If I were playing and if there weren't an NDA I would probably comment on how much better I like the game and how the combat has improved from spam-a-lot to "spamming will get you killed" on challenging content. But since there is an NDA and I couldn't really comment on whether or not I'm playing then I won't make any assertions because technically they should be baseless. :lol:

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  • Azaron_NightbladeAzaron_Nightblade KingsmouthMember EpicPosts: 4,286
    edited June 17
    Po_gg said:
    Legends is only here because Exiles gave them the financial elbow room for some gambling and double-dipping. Too bad they've killed their best game for this money-grabbing chance, and flushed down the toilet one of the best communities out there, but hey, the beancounters said it will be good for the profits! That's all what matters, right?  :flushed: 
    The former remains to be seen, although you're almost guaranteed to be right when it comes to the community part. TSW's was great, but with F2P opening the floodgates... well... *looks at NWO's community* =/
    Post edited by Azaron_Nightblade on
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  • TheocritusTheocritus Gary, INMember RarePosts: 5,439
    What was bad about TSW:
    1. horrible combat, I killed mobs behind me with a shotgun
    2. bad animations, especially death animations
    3. cutscenes were way overdone, way too much for supposed MMO
    4. The game felt like a single player game with other people running around
    5. The world felt too small and limited
    6. The 3 faction part of the game never felt right
    7. Too much voice acting with my character sitting there looking stupid
  • LimnicLimnic Member UncommonPosts: 127
    I will always remain baffled by those that call TSW's gameplay complex or hard. It was for the most part the weakest part of the experience for me. Building a character that could outperform the difficulty of the game was a pretty easy thing to work around.

    I just didn't have a reason to pay attention to the game as a result. I spent more time collecting clothes and making outfits than anything else.

    I do have interest in seeing how Legends turns out though.
  • Po_ggPo_gg Twigwarren, WestfarthingMember RarePosts: 4,136
    edited June 18
    Torval said:
    ... how much better I like the game and how the combat has improved ...
    Not improved, replaced :wink:  There's nothing left from the original vision of Ragnar, except some slight traces.
    Tastes are different, if you like it better, good for you. Personally I don't, but we surely won't be arguing about that :smile:

    NDA is a funny thing to maintain at this point, game launches in 5-6 days, and there's still nothing about the details, which tells a lot on its own.
    If you are in the beta not, you surely not know how much monetization stuff is not in it right now not. ("That's how it works, right?  Quite" :lol:  I just had a Blake moment: https://youtu.be/Ss42IqSc-w8?t=41s )
    Have you seen the last stream? With no answers to even the most harmless questions? You are in games probably even longer than I am. Can you remember any games launching with only:
    "Yeah, it will be f2p. There will be an exchange between currencies. There will be some kinda patron program too. That's it, move along folks! Details? what do you mean details? You will see when we get there."


    Anyways, I don't really care about Legends, I mostly just try to fix the thrown bile on TSW around here... It was one of my favourite games, and one thing is being happy for Legends, and an another to kicking the corpse of TSW by the same people who basically contributed in its killing :lol:  That's why I follow the threads, and also for information (since I need to know the details, so I could sell my GM to my buddy with backed up data about what he will get from it :lol:  )
    I don't even wish Legends to flop (at least not in the first few months, or else I'm stucked with my GM, haha).


    unrelated, off-topic edit: hey, you are on Crick, if I remember right. You should check in on Shirefest, it has amazing concerts! I'm there too with my Crick lowbie :wink:
    Post edited by Po_gg on
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