Crowfall's $7,000 Castle

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  • IceAgeIceAge SomeWhere In .. RomaniaMember RarePosts: 1,666
    edited August 30
    Sovrath said:
    IceAge said:

    Keep repeating yourself that video games = real life . It seems you didn't quiet understood what I said. 

    I don't care what you do with your life, is your life at the end of the day. What I do care is if you are going to ruin my fun in-game , by paying whatever you earn in real life , just to come online and be that "cool kid". 

    Good thing is that I never step foot in such games, but that doesn't mean I can't have an opinion. 

    From the look of whatever you said, it seems you are also paying your "fun" in-games. Which is a shame. 
    You seem to be asserting one thing "I don't care what you do with your life" but you then have issue with people doing what they want.

    Especially because you are not listening.

    I'm saying that these games that charge considerable amounts for "tailored" experiences", high end experiences "whatever" aren't aimed at you.

    You think they are but they are not.

    You SHOULDN'T be playing these games as they are tailored to a different crowd, those who "want to spend how they want to spend".

    But you have the idea that all video games are catering to the same demographic.

    As far as "thinking video games are real life" you are just going to have to explain yourself better because they are very much "real life".

    you spend money on them, you spend time talking about them and you spend time playing them.

    They are an entertainment, an indulgence. Just like splurging on a sports car is an indulgence.

    Or an even better analogy, spending premium dollars for a theater ticket (Hamilton tickets can get into the thousands). You are essentially looking at life through your own lens and not seeing that it really should be more of a prism. You just don't take into account that the experiences of others, the desires of others are going to be vastly different.

    You "think" that this is going to affect you but most likely it will not. You will play the games made for your demographic (and mine as well, I'm not going to spend thousands for this type of experience) and others will play the games that cater to them.

    Lastly, and this is the most important, you need to learn what the term "Devil's Advocate" means.
    If you would read what I said, I clearly stated that I don't care what you do in real life and what I care is if you come to the virtual life and shit on my entertainment by spending huge sum of cash because you want fame, power, etc. in a game which normally is meant for fun. 

    And yes, I am afraid is not the same, as you said "they are very much real life" , because it is a virtual life after all and not a real life . But hey, maybe somehow , you are living in a virtual life, pretending that is a real life. 

    And again , I did said that I do not play this shitty games and what I say it's just an opinion.

    In the end, do whatever you want with your cash, but as I said , if this involve other players then it's bad. 

    Now tell me , as far as I remember, you loved the shit out of Lineage 2. How did you felt when others bought adena with real cash? You stated above that : You "think" that this is going to affect you but most likely it will not . It's a simple question with a simple answer. If you will answer "No" just to ..I don't know, keep your opinion alive, then you either spent cash by buying adena, or you didn't give a shit about the game. 

    I know what "Devil's Advocate" means. What I don't know is how in the hell you are neutral to a thing like this when history learned us that this kind of.."approach" it's bad for the health of a game. 
    Post edited by IceAge on

    Reporter: What's behind Blizzard success, and how do you make your gamers happy?
    Blizzard Boss: Making gamers happy is not my concern, making money.. yes!

  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAMember LegendaryPosts: 22,883
    edited August 30
    IceAge said:

    If you would read what I said, I clearly stated that I don't care what you do in real life and what I care is if you come to the virtual life and shit on my entertainment by spending huge sum of cash because you want fame, power, etc. in a game which normally is meant for fun. 

    And yes, I am afraid is not the same, as you said "they are very much real life" , because it is a virtual life after all and not a real life . But hey, maybe somehow , you are living in a virtual life, pretending that is a real life. 

    And again , I did said that I do not play this shitty games and what I say it's just an opinion.

    In the end, do whatever you want with your cash, but as I said , if this involve other players then it's bad. 

    Now tell me , as far as I remember, you loved the shit out of Lineage 2. How did you felt when others bought adena with real cash? You stated above that : You "think" that this is going to affect you but most likely it will not . It's a simple question with a simple answer. If you will answer "No" just to ..I don't know, keep your opinion alive, then you either spent cash by buying adena, or you didn't give a shit about the game. 

    I know what "Devil's Advocate" means. What I don't know is how in the hell you are neutral to a thing like this when history learned us that this kind of.."approach" it's bad for the health of a game. 
    Well, several things,

    As ive' said over and over and over and over again, the games that support people paying large amounts of cash are different than, say, a game like Lineage 2 which (at least at the time when I played) did not allow people to do that. It was against the rules.

    A game that has, as part of its monetization, the ability for players to buy in game assets is different than a game where people buying items is against the rules.

    One is catering to people who want to use their real life money to get ahead
    One has to spend time and resources to stop people from using real life money to get ahead.

    You understand this correct? I'm not asking if you agree, just that you understand.

    YOU would not be playing the first game as you are not the client they are interested in. Therefore there is nothing to ruin your experience (well other than cheaters).

    This whole idea of yours that this is a 'virtual life" is way off base.

    This is entertainment. period. It's like a movie or the theater or any other bit if entertainment where you spend money. Video games are a multi-billion dollar a year industry that employs thousands and is accessed by millions. that's as "real" as any industry.

    If you don't want to equate it to buying a luxury car then it's like spending thousands on theater tickets/concert tickets so you can have perks as well as see the show. Or whichever bit of entertainment that allows an experience but you don't have an actual physical item.

    So what I am saying is, whether you like it or not, there are games out there that are catering to a different demographic. I'm ok with that because not everything revolves around me. Others want different experiences so who am I to say no?

    I know what "Devil's Advocate" means. What I don't know is how in the hell you are neutral to a thing like this when history learned us that this kind of.."approach" it's bad for the health of a game.


    really?

    In any case "no" I don't judge people in that way if that is really what you are getting at.

    I should add that "no" I don't like cheaters, "yes" It's ok for people to spend money how they want at a venue that allows their money to be spent that way.
    Post edited by Sovrath on



  • MendelMendel Marietta, GAMember RarePosts: 1,806
    F2Plague said:
    Pay to win or not it is still ridiculous. 10 years ago if someone put a 7000$ dollar castle in a cash shop people would have thought it was insane. Amazing how fast greed can change a genre.

    I agree, it's absolutely absurd by my standards.  But then, there are some truly rich people out there for whom this is a drop in the bucket.  If it's purely cosmetic, and has no effect on the gameplay mechanics of others (someone being emotionally hurt that they can't have as pretty a house not counting in my estimation), then I don't see it hurting the game.  That was my major concern.
    Look at it this way.  Those truly rich people that buy stuff like this aren't likely to be classified as truly rich next year or in five years time.

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • LynxJSALynxJSA Sarasota, FLMember RarePosts: 3,186
    kitarad said:
    It depends on whether you can earn a fortress of similar fortification in game. if the appearance is the only difference then it would be cosmetic.

    Even if you can earn it, are you familiar with the term "pay to win?"  If paying cash gives you an instant, functional item that someone else can earn by investing time, that fits the definition.  IDK, maybe I'm wrong and someone who knows more about Crowfall can chime in saying that this item doesn't give you a real-world advantage for cash.
    What are you winning by buying that castle?
  • Loke666Loke666 KalmarMember EpicPosts: 20,804
    LynxJSA said:
    What are you winning by buying that castle?
    A castle?
    IceAgeJamesGoblin
  • IceAgeIceAge SomeWhere In .. RomaniaMember RarePosts: 1,666
    Sovrath said:
    IceAge said:

    If you would read what I said, I clearly stated that I don't care what you do in real life and what I care is if you come to the virtual life and shit on my entertainment by spending huge sum of cash because you want fame, power, etc. in a game which normally is meant for fun. 

    And yes, I am afraid is not the same, as you said "they are very much real life" , because it is a virtual life after all and not a real life . But hey, maybe somehow , you are living in a virtual life, pretending that is a real life. 

    And again , I did said that I do not play this shitty games and what I say it's just an opinion.

    In the end, do whatever you want with your cash, but as I said , if this involve other players then it's bad. 

    Now tell me , as far as I remember, you loved the shit out of Lineage 2. How did you felt when others bought adena with real cash? You stated above that : You "think" that this is going to affect you but most likely it will not . It's a simple question with a simple answer. If you will answer "No" just to ..I don't know, keep your opinion alive, then you either spent cash by buying adena, or you didn't give a shit about the game. 

    I know what "Devil's Advocate" means. What I don't know is how in the hell you are neutral to a thing like this when history learned us that this kind of.."approach" it's bad for the health of a game. 
    Well, several things,

    As ive' said over and over and over and over again, the games that support people paying large amounts of cash are different than, say, a game like Lineage 2 which (at least at the time when I played) did not allow people to do that. It was against the rules.

    A game that has, as part of its monetization, the ability for players to buy in game assets is different than a game where people buying items is against the rules.

    I am going to quote this, as the rest is really not going anywhere.

    Yes, you are right ! There is a difference. One where legit players don't like the ones who buy "power" in a game where is against the rules, and second , where legit players hates both , the company and the "flower power players" .

    But they do have one thing in common. Legit players don't like "power players" in both games. 

    And this is the reason why such companies ( aka greedy companies ) will always focus on the whales .

    If you don't care or ok , don't react with an opinion against and when one spends huge money in a MMO ( where it affects the others ) then you are part of them and the reason why this .. thing ( MMO ) is going down.

    Ignorance is bad !

    Reporter: What's behind Blizzard success, and how do you make your gamers happy?
    Blizzard Boss: Making gamers happy is not my concern, making money.. yes!

  • FrykkaFrykka Spokane, WAMember UncommonPosts: 22
    edited September 26
    IceAge said:
    Sovrath said:
    IceAge said:
    The general rule is that you charge what the market can bare.  I won't buy a 7k castle but if someone else wants to then good for them. Other games charge 15k, 10k, for digital rental rights and people pay.  I hope it's worth it for them.
    For the love of games, it's wrong man! Is so fucking wrong. 
    Only if you think that every video game has to be made for the every man.

    I'm going to assume that you also think multi million dollar mansions, luxury/sports cars, fine suits and high end jewelry are all wrong (among other things). Perfectly fine if you do.
    You are comparing real life with video games, which is sad coming from you since I "know" you from the beginnings.

    I have nothing against whatever you said. I am very much against people paying huge sum of cash to have advantage and to feed the greedy dev's. 

    If real life was all about "having fun" , then your point could stand. Video games, from my point of view, are about having fun! Saying that someone who is paying 7k wants to have fun is wrong. They pay that sum of cash for personal reasons such as : having a big advantage over others, fame , and alike. 

    I stand 100% against this shit, no matter whatever "reasons" X or Y are having for paying that cash in a video game, especially MMO's , because that is the very main point. If the game was single player , then fuck it. Pay 1 mil, I don't care. Close yourself in a basement , pay 1 mil and play the game solo. But when other players are involved, then we have a problem.

    IceAge said:
    Sovrath said:
    IceAge said:
    The general rule is that you charge what the market can bare.  I won't buy a 7k castle but if someone else wants to then good for them. Other games charge 15k, 10k, for digital rental rights and people pay.  I hope it's worth it for them.
    For the love of games, it's wrong man! Is so fucking wrong. 
    Only if you think that every video game has to be made for the every man.

    I'm going to assume that you also think multi million dollar mansions, luxury/sports cars, fine suits and high end jewelry are all wrong (among other things). Perfectly fine if you do.
    You are comparing real life with video games, which is sad coming from you since I "know" you from the beginnings.

    I have nothing against whatever you said. I am very much against people paying huge sum of cash to have advantage and to feed the greedy dev's. 

    If real life was all about "having fun" , then your point could stand. Video games, from my point of view, are about having fun! Saying that someone who is paying 7k wants to have fun is wrong. They pay that sum of cash for personal reasons such as : having a big advantage over others, fame , and alike. 

    I stand 100% against this shit, no matter whatever "reasons" X or Y are having for paying that cash in a video game, especially MMO's , because that is the very main point. If the game was single player , then fuck it. Pay 1 mil, I don't care. Close yourself in a basement , pay 1 mil and play the game solo. But when other players are involved, then we have a problem.

    You are so far off the mark because you falsely believe that a 7K castle adds some kind of advantage to your gameplay...  it simply doesn't add anything to the player power curve.   It is fluff...   come test the real game instead of spreading bs.  The devs have a number of funding strategies and none of it lines their pockets, it gets the game built.  This is not a AAA title from a major development house, it is a niche game for PvP players offering FvF and GvG or FFA worlds that have endings and win conditions.

    Post edited by Frykka on
    JamesGoblin
  • WizardryWizardry Ontario, CanadaMember EpicPosts: 12,985
    Even if ANY item is cosmetic,the whole idea of immersive gaming inside a mmorpg is what?To buy stuff from a cash shop?
    There is NO EXCUSE for selling game assets that belong 100% inside the game world so that players earn every inch ,everything they build,keep,craft.
    No matter what defensive excuse someone comes up with there is also the added fact that once a cash shop is implemented NOBODY has any control over how far it goes and ruins the game and the immersive feeling players can have.

    So for example,you invest 2-3 years in this game,then all of a sudden they introduce something in the cash shop that is insane and pisses you off,then what,suck it up ,get a refund? "good luck with that,plus your time invested is already ruined/lost.
    Everything in a game should stay in the game,everything in a game should be created in the game,cash shops are and always will be bullshit.

    Create a good game,if you need ongoing costs ,charge a monthly sub fee,if players don't like a sub fee they are telling you that your game is not good enough,so then improve it so there is some value/worth,EASY plan if your business knows what it is doing.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • YaevinduskYaevindusk Ul''dah, CAMember RarePosts: 1,918
    Wizardry said:
    Even if ANY item is cosmetic,the whole idea of immersive gaming inside a mmorpg is what?To buy stuff from a cash shop?
    There is NO EXCUSE for selling game assets that belong 100% inside the game world so that players earn every inch ,everything they build,keep,craft.
    No matter what defensive excuse someone comes up with there is also the added fact that once a cash shop is implemented NOBODY has any control over how far it goes and ruins the game and the immersive feeling players can have.

    So for example,you invest 2-3 years in this game,then all of a sudden they introduce something in the cash shop that is insane and pisses you off,then what,suck it up ,get a refund? "good luck with that,plus your time invested is already ruined/lost.
    Everything in a game should stay in the game,everything in a game should be created in the game,cash shops are and always will be bullshit.

    Create a good game,if you need ongoing costs ,charge a monthly sub fee,if players don't like a sub fee they are telling you that your game is not good enough,so then improve it so there is some value/worth,EASY plan if your business knows what it is doing.

    You hear that 99.99% of the MMOs that were created in the last twenty years?  It's easy if you know what you're doing.  The games that are still seeking funding / creating their game should also just charge subscriptions.  If they can't make money that way, then their pre-alpha isn't good enough.

    If they're not a part of a big company, they shouldn't make games; we can trust big corporations.  Implies Wizardry.

    -----------------------

    This is just a bias rant applying hatred towards something in an out-of-context way.  Poorly thought out in such a way as to imply that only large companies or people with money should be making games, no exceptions.  It puts crowd-funded or games in development on the same level as fully completed games that have been out for years and makes assertions.  Putting Mr. Wizardry's signature and history of bashing certain games aside, there is a specific hatred towards ways for companies to make money or cash shops in general; likely personal experience of completed games that are in the twilight years of their upkeep implementing things he/she had earned and applying that to a game that has it at the start, which uses it as a funding source to even make the game targeted at a niche crowd.  Those who enjoy it or will enjoy it are wrong as it should never have been created under any circumstances, as there is "NO EXCUSE" for cash shops.  Even if they're fluff / aesthetics and used primarily to build the game.  There is also the situation that different genres simply can't live off a subscription.  Does that mean that people that enjoy the niche are wrong and their type of games should never exist? 

    I've felt the sting of a game selling things that I've earned many a time, years after it was completed.  This was as early as Ultima Online with them selling "Advanced Characters" which caused me to quite the game.  Though times change and there are circumstances and conditions that I just have to accept; context to acknowledge and the recognition of my own bias perception or potential hatred of things.  To put simply, I quit games that I find have betrayed my faith in some way.  Though I at least understand the situation they're in, if it was a hard choice to come by and don't hold it against them much.  It is, in my opinion, wrong to apply the same standard of thought to every game, every game company and every situation.

    Star Citizen has a subscription for people right now.  People pay into what they want / believe in / feel is worth it.  We can't change their minds and there are different situations and thoughts for different folds as a whole.
    JamesGoblin
  • berlightberlight almadaMember UncommonPosts: 164
    edited September 26
    wow 7k? jesus christ, I could buy a good 2nd hand car in real life ffs
    Post edited by berlight on

    Beta tester maniac

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