Really quiet here, is this game stalled?

135

Comments

  • blueturtle13blueturtle13 Valve Corporation Member LegendaryPosts: 9,758
    Trees that are slow to grow bear the best fruit
    francis_baudPhrylaserit

    거북이는 목을 내밀 때 안 움직입니다












  • MaxBaconMaxBacon Figueira da FozMember EpicPosts: 4,102
    Trees that are slow to grow bear the best fruit
    hmmmmmmmmmmm! Bear fruit \o/
    francis_baudblueturtle13
  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,274
    MaxBacon said:
    Trees that are slow to grow bear the best fruit
    hmmmmmmmmmmm! Bear fruit \o/
    Now thats a disturbing image.
    blueturtle13Phry

    On hiatus from EVE Online since Dec 2016 - Screw off-grid PVE boosting changes

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • cameltosiscameltosis ipswichMember EpicPosts: 1,557
    meddyck said:
    Actually CSE has repeatedly declined to give out exact numbers for the amount of vertical progression in CU. We don't know whether it is 5%, 15%, 25%, 50%, or more at this point. They have only said that there will be much, much less vertical progression than what you see in a typical theme park MMO with 50 PvE levels and that new characters won't be 1 shot by veterans and should be able to contribute in RvR right away.
    Yup, I know they've refused to give specifics, it'll be one of those never ending balance issues anyway, but MJ has said his initial thoughts are in the 5-10% range. 

    It going to be a tough line to walk. 

    On the one hand, you really need to keep the power gaps down to 0 in order to make the game enjoyable for newbies. As an almost pure pvp game, you need to get your fresh meat having fun very quickly and that just won't happen if there are power gaps. 

    On the other hand, we expect a certain amount of progression and most people really struggle to understand the concept of horizontal progression. They expect bigger numbers and may not see the point of horizontal progression so CSE need to make the progression important without being vertical. 


    My expectation is that, stat wise, we will see very little progression and thus small power gaps due to stats. However, with the ability builder and the horizontal progression from that, what we'll see is veterans who've unlocked everything and thus have a superior set of skills, so if they've chosen correctly they'll probably still be able to beat most newbies, for example by having access to more armour piercing skills, or a bit more cc etc. 
    francis_baud
  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,274
    meddyck said:
    Actually CSE has repeatedly declined to give out exact numbers for the amount of vertical progression in CU. We don't know whether it is 5%, 15%, 25%, 50%, or more at this point. They have only said that there will be much, much less vertical progression than what you see in a typical theme park MMO with 50 PvE levels and that new characters won't be 1 shot by veterans and should be able to contribute in RvR right away.
    Yup, I know they've refused to give specifics, it'll be one of those never ending balance issues anyway, but MJ has said his initial thoughts are in the 5-10% range. 

    It going to be a tough line to walk. 

    On the one hand, you really need to keep the power gaps down to 0 in order to make the game enjoyable for newbies. As an almost pure pvp game, you need to get your fresh meat having fun very quickly and that just won't happen if there are power gaps. 

    On the other hand, we expect a certain amount of progression and most people really struggle to understand the concept of horizontal progression. They expect bigger numbers and may not see the point of horizontal progression so CSE need to make the progression important without being vertical. 


    My expectation is that, stat wise, we will see very little progression and thus small power gaps due to stats. However, with the ability builder and the horizontal progression from that, what we'll see is veterans who've unlocked everything and thus have a superior set of skills, so if they've chosen correctly they'll probably still be able to beat most newbies, for example by having access to more armour piercing skills, or a bit more cc etc. 
    I expect to see a progression system very much along the lines of DAOCs realm rank abilities as they were in the early days. (pre TOA for sure)

    Improvements of course, but same concept.

    On hiatus from EVE Online since Dec 2016 - Screw off-grid PVE boosting changes

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • Loke666Loke666 KalmarMember EpicPosts: 20,805
    Trees that are slow to grow bear the best fruit
    Eeeeh? That sounds a lot like a bad fake Chinese saying....

     Games slow to develop are not always the best either (a certain Duke Nukem game proves that point) but rushing a game is rarely a good idea.

    Anyways, hopefully are the devs busy making a game instead of overhyping things, MJ probably learned something from when Barnett hyped WAR to an insane level.

    A good game will talk for itself and doesn't really need the devs to constantly talk about what they are doing when they work on it, time that better could be spent on making the game better.
    holdenhamlet
  • collektcollekt Member UncommonPosts: 318
    edited June 11
    Loke666 said:
    Anyways, hopefully are the devs busy making a game instead of overhyping things, MJ probably learned something from when Barnett hyped WAR to an insane level. 

    A good game will talk for itself and doesn't really need the devs to constantly talk about what they are doing when they work on it, time that better could be spent on making the game better.
    I mean, it's not like they're wasting a lot of development time talking about what they're doing. They sometimes stream themselves working on things, and then there's a weekly wrap up once a week that usually goes for like an hour and a half. It's a casual thing where they talk about the week and answer a few questions, so they aren't spending time scripting it or on production value of the video. Realistically this isn't taking anything away from development of the game.

    Transparency and keeping us in the loop has been the plan from day one, and most of the backers appreciate the updates on what they're doing. There's certainly nothing wrong with being transparent, so I'm not sure why you people try to spin that as a negative. If you don't want to hear the updates, then don't tune in for them. They aren't hurting anything.
    Post edited by collekt on
    meddyck
  • ShadanwolfShadanwolf Member UncommonPosts: 2,323
    Twisted77 said:
    Camelot Unchained is definitely a game I might want to give a significant amount of precious game time. 

    However, almost all the games in alpha/beta on MMORPG.com have a lot of hype and forum activity... this one rarely has a post every few days.

    Are people not excited for this game?

    As for me.... I'm simply exhausted.... looking, reading, discussing, expecting,watching a pre beta crunch(last year) that ended up in over a years delay till beta.....so far.
    SO I....try not to get involved with game discussion. It's too frustrating and accomplishes  only more frustration.
    KyleranmeddyckNightblazed
  • Faustina007Faustina007 Member CommonPosts: 4
    waynejr2 said:
    Twisted77 said:
    Camelot Unchained is definitely a game I might want to give a significant amount of precious game time. 

    However, almost all the games in alpha/beta on MMORPG.com have a lot of hype and forum activity... this one rarely has a post every few days.

    Are people not excited for this game?

    All I need is a release date.  I don't need them to spoon feed me information about the dev cycle.
       I am truly excited for this game, and was glad to hear that it looks like Beta 1 will open up next weekend. I hope all the years waiting for this game is worth it. I think it will be. Lol, I am just recently getting flashbacks of pvping in DAoC, so I hope to relieve this pvp itch within the next year with CU!

    I am sure the devs are just as disappointed about the delayed release of this game and that it has taken a long time to develop. However, I, as a gamer would like to see a game that is polished and released with little to no bugs. I think this game will be just that.

    With that said, I may play other games while waiting for CU, but, once this game really goes live...I will be there!
  • MightyUncleanMightyUnclean Member RarePosts: 1,723
    I backed CU.  I also backed The Repopulation and SotA, so maybe my judgement isn't so great.  The good news is, I did it all on the cheap, so I don't have much to lose if it flops.  My hype for CU has died down entirely after all this time.  I'm filing it under "I'll believe it when I see it" along with all the other crowdfunded MMO's stuck in perpetual development.

    ShadanwolfNightblazed
  • ShadanwolfShadanwolf Member UncommonPosts: 2,323
    waynejr2 said:
    Twisted77 said:
    Camelot Unchained is definitely a game I might want to give a significant amount of precious game time. 

    However, almost all the games in alpha/beta on MMORPG.com have a lot of hype and forum activity... this one rarely has a post every few days.

    Are people not excited for this game?

    All I need is a release date.  I don't need them to spoon feed me information about the dev cycle.
       I am truly excited for this game, and was glad to hear that it looks like Beta 1 will open up next weekend. I hope all the years waiting for this game is worth it. I think it will be. Lol, I am just recently getting flashbacks of pvping in DAoC, so I hope to relieve this pvp itch within the next year with CU!

    I am sure the devs are just as disappointed about the delayed release of this game and that it has taken a long time to develop. However, I, as a gamer would like to see a game that is polished and released with little to no bugs. I think this game will be just that.

    With that said, I may play other games while waiting for CU, but, once this game really goes live...I will be there!
    Beta 1 next weekend ??
  • MarkJacobsMarkJacobs CEO City State Entertainment Fairfax, VAMember RarePosts: 648
    waynejr2 said:
    Twisted77 said:
    Camelot Unchained is definitely a game I might want to give a significant amount of precious game time. 

    However, almost all the games in alpha/beta on MMORPG.com have a lot of hype and forum activity... this one rarely has a post every few days.

    Are people not excited for this game?

    All I need is a release date.  I don't need them to spoon feed me information about the dev cycle.
       I am truly excited for this game, and was glad to hear that it looks like Beta 1 will open up next weekend. I hope all the years waiting for this game is worth it. I think it will be. Lol, I am just recently getting flashbacks of pvping in DAoC, so I hope to relieve this pvp itch within the next year with CU!

    I am sure the devs are just as disappointed about the delayed release of this game and that it has taken a long time to develop. However, I, as a gamer would like to see a game that is polished and released with little to no bugs. I think this game will be just that.

    With that said, I may play other games while waiting for CU, but, once this game really goes live...I will be there!
    Beta 1 next weekend ??
    I hope he means that we will have another Beta 1 test this weekend. At least that what I thought I said.  It's a short week for us (obviously) and we're hopeful we can knock out a handful of issues so our Beta 1 folks can get in and see the progress. If not, the week after should be good. We had a higher number of client crashes this past week than we're happy with so we're taking some time to get it right for our Beta 1 folks and not just put up a version we're not happy with just so we can say we did it.
    JamesGoblin

    Mark Jacobs
    CEO, City State Entertainment

  • TuggernutTuggernut Member CommonPosts: 2
    edited August 19
    I was extremely excited about Camelot Unchained when I heard about it. It seemed like the next generation of MMORPGs. I absolutely loved everything about it. So I went to the store to purchase a digital copy of the game and some game time...and that's when I saw it was paypal only. Why? This is such a huge turnoff from the game for me. I have money, but I don't have a paypal account, nor do I want one. I went to sign up for a paypal account so that I could get access to this fantastic game, and paypal wants me to send them picture I.D. and proof of address, which I'm not too excited about. Then I see a lot of people saying you can use your card as a guest through paypal, which I have yet to discover how this is done. 

    I guess my whole issue, and I've seen this all over these forums and others, why are they doing it like this? Why paypal? I understand it CAN be done through paypal...but why? I would LOVE to participate in this game and give this company my money. Just not through paypal.

    This one issue is massively hurting their potential player base, which just blows my mind. How aren't they panicking to get other payment options available, or just do away with paypal? It might save them a bit in development costs, but it's also limiting their customer base. So...why? Why? It's so frustrating. Why in god's name would they do this?
    Post edited by Tuggernut on
    RealizerholdenhamletJamesGoblin
  • WizardryWizardry Ontario, CanadaMember EpicPosts: 12,985
    Man who dream wake up with nothing.

    I understand the human psyche ,people remember that old school game and become attached to anything that resembles it.I understand there is a crowd that just wants to be different,to say that is MY GAME,similar to punk rock era and then rap etc etc.

    There is of course a crowd of people that look at games objectively,dissect them piece by piece but VERY few.A much larger crowd just likes to spend money,have cell phone MUST buy games for my phone,got paid must buy new game from Steam,Blizzard released a new game,i got to have it etc etc,reasoning is often dumbfounded for spending money.

    Naturally i do not have a crystal ball but imo a very strong opinion,CU will be barely an average game.There might be some ok with that,for whatever reason idk,one of the many more than what i listed.
    Pantheon should be the best of the bunch but even that game will be very generic,perhaps some improvements on the generic design but to me that is not nearly good enough.

    Anyone holding their breath or crossing their fingers,don't bother,the best we will get is a very average game,but hey it will be NEW !!,new face/skin,newish mobs,some very familiar classes,yeah AVERAGE gaming.

    The market is so dry and so bad right now,any average developer can release a new game and do decently well.The market can sustain a few of these every year,the problem is do i really want to invest time...years into an average mmorpg?
    pantaro

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,274
    Tuggernut said:
    I was extremely excited about Camelot Unchained when I heard about it. It seemed like the next generation of MMORPGs. I absolutely loved everything about it. So I went to the store to purchase a digital copy of the game and some game time...and that's when I saw it was paypal only. Why? This is such a huge turnoff from the game for me. I have money, but I don't have a paypal account, nor do I want one. I went to sign up for a paypal account so that I could get access to this fantastic game, and paypal wants me to send them picture I.D. and proof of address, which I'm not too excited about. Then I see a lot of people saying you can use your card as a guest through paypal, which I have yet to discover how this is done. 

    I guess my whole issue, and I've seen this all over these forums and others, why are they doing it like this? Why paypal? I understand it CAN be done through paypal...but why? I would LOVE to participate in this game and give this company my money. Just not through paypal.

    This one issue is massively hurting their potential player base, which just blows my mind. How aren't they panicking to get other payment options available, or just do away with paypal? It might save them a bit in development costs, but it's also limiting their customer base. So...why? Why? It's so frustrating. Why in god's name would they do this?
    Perhaps you are confusing CU with another title as it's not available yet to play.

    We've been waiting almost a year now for the open beta announcement.

    Likely they'll have more payment options once they fully launch,  which is looking to be still at least a year away.

    On hiatus from EVE Online since Dec 2016 - Screw off-grid PVE boosting changes

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 10,778
    Loke666 said:
    A good game will talk for itself and doesn't really need the devs to constantly talk about what they are doing when they work on it, time that better could be spent on making the game better.
    That sounds a lot like a bad fake Chinese saying....
    JamesGoblin
  • TuggernutTuggernut Member CommonPosts: 2
    Kyleran said:

    Perhaps you are confusing CU with another title as it's not available yet to play.

    We've been waiting almost a year now for the open beta announcement.

    Likely they'll have more payment options once they fully launch,  which is looking to be still at least a year away.
    Hmm, I could have sworn I read somewhere that the beta would be available in August. Where is the most reliable place to get accurate information? I can't use the CU forums, because it's only available to Backers, which I WOULD be if not for the paypal thing.
    JamesGoblin
  • meddyckmeddyck USAMember UncommonPosts: 1,217
    edited August 19
    Kyleran said:

    Perhaps you are confusing CU with another title as it's not available yet to play.

    We've been waiting almost a year now for the open beta announcement.

    Likely they'll have more payment options once they fully launch,  which is looking to be still at least a year away.
    What we have been waiting on is the date for Beta 1 not Open Beta. CU has 4 stages of beta (Beta 1, 2, & 3 and Open Beta). Right now it is in Alpha. The next stage is Beta 1. That stage will still be very far from Open Beta and most of the actual gameplay expected for launch will not even be in testing at the start of Beta 1.

    Tuggernut said:

    Hmm, I could have sworn I read somewhere that the beta would be available in August. Where is the most reliable place to get accurate information? I can't use the CU forums, because it's only available to Backers, which I WOULD be if not for the paypal thing.
    The best information is in the weekly update and Q&A livestreams that are done every Friday at 4pm ET on CSE's Twitch channel (and also streamed on Youtube). They also send out an end of week email update which is posted in the news section of the official website at

    http://camelotunchained.com/v3/category/news/

    At the end of each month they release a newsletter that includes a summary of progress on the game for that month. Previous newsletters can be found at

    http://camelotunchained.com/v3/newsletter/

    Mark has mentioned adding additional payment options besides PayPal at some point in the future. I imagine that won't happen until after Beta 1 begins though.


    Post edited by meddyck on
    KyleranJamesGoblin

    Camelot Unchained Backer
    DAOC [retired]: R11 Cleric R11 Druid R11 Minstrel R9 Eldritch R6 Sorc R6 Scout R5 Healer

  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,274
    edited August 19
    meddyck said:
    Kyleran said:

    Perhaps you are confusing CU with another title as it's not available yet to play.

    We've been waiting almost a year now for the open beta announcement.

    Likely they'll have more payment options once they fully launch,  which is looking to be still at least a year away.
    What we have been waiting on is the date for Beta 1 not Open Beta. CU has 4 stages of beta (Beta 1, 2, & 3 and Open Beta). Right now it is in Alpha. The next stage is Beta 1. That stage will still be very far from Open Beta and most of the actual gameplay expected for launch will not even be in testing at the start of Beta 1.

    Tuggernut said:

    Hmm, I could have sworn I read somewhere that the beta would be available in August. Where is the most reliable place to get accurate information? I can't use the CU forums, because it's only available to Backers, which I WOULD be if not for the paypal thing.
    The best information is in the weekly update and Q&A livestreams that are done every Friday at 4pm ET on CSE's Twitch channel (and also streamed on Youtube). They also send out an end of week email update which is posted in the news section of the official website at

    http://camelotunchained.com/v3/category/news/

    At the end of each month they release a newsletter that includes a summary of progress on the game for that month. Previous newsletters can be found at

    http://camelotunchained.com/v3/newsletter/

    Mark has mentioned adding additional payment options besides PayPal at some point in the future. I imagine that won't happen until after Beta 1 begins though.


    Well the only date I'm really waiting for is the release date, as I normally only play games 6 months to a year post launch.

    I might break the rule and try this game when it reaches open beta however, as it should have all of its MVP content in place.

    Thanks for sharing the detailed phase plan, although an alpha backer I don't follow any of those communication channels.  

    As I told Mark I don't care what they are busy doing, how hard it is, etc. I only want to know when they plan to be finished doing it all.

    With all of those many Beta phases yet ahead I'm more convinced than ever I won't be playing this game until 2019 or 2020.

    The upside is I'll be eligible to retire by then.

    B)




    Post edited by Kyleran on
    JamesGoblin

    On hiatus from EVE Online since Dec 2016 - Screw off-grid PVE boosting changes

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • KyleranKyleran Paradise City, FLMember LegendaryPosts: 26,274
    edited August 19
    Gdemami said:
    Loke666 said:
    A good game will talk for itself and doesn't really need the devs to constantly talk about what they are doing when they work on it, time that better could be spent on making the game better.
    That sounds a lot like a bad fake Chinese saying....
    Actually, its as much about the marketing as anything else.


    Post edited by Kyleran on
    JamesGoblin

    On hiatus from EVE Online since Dec 2016 - Screw off-grid PVE boosting changes

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon


  • MightyUncleanMightyUnclean Member RarePosts: 1,723
    Yeah, I think it's probably best for me to just forget this exists for a while.  All the minute details released constantly, without any real information on when the betas or full game will probably launch, is like eating shit with a splinter.
  • meddyckmeddyck USAMember UncommonPosts: 1,217
    I think ignoring the game until much later in beta is a good idea for backers or potential future players who aren't really interested in actually testing the game as it develops. Launch won't be happening anytime soon and when Beta 1 starts is still a big question mark despite the optimism that comes from CSE every Friday.
    KyleranJamesGoblin

    Camelot Unchained Backer
    DAOC [retired]: R11 Cleric R11 Druid R11 Minstrel R9 Eldritch R6 Sorc R6 Scout R5 Healer

  • RelampagoRelampago Brooklyn, NYMember UncommonPosts: 272
    Please do not feed the 2 post troll.
  • cameltosiscameltosis ipswichMember EpicPosts: 1,557
    Wizardry said:
    Naturally i do not have a crystal ball but imo a very strong opinion,CU will be barely an average game.There might be some ok with that,for whatever reason idk,one of the many more than what i listed.
    Pantheon should be the best of the bunch but even that game will be very generic,perhaps some improvements on the generic design but to me that is not nearly good enough.

    Anyone holding their breath or crossing their fingers,don't bother,the best we will get is a very average game,but hey it will be NEW !!,new face/skin,newish mobs,some very familiar classes,yeah AVERAGE gaming.

    The market is so dry and so bad right now,any average developer can release a new game and do decently well.The market can sustain a few of these every year,the problem is do i really want to invest time...years into an average mmorpg?
    Obviously, this all comes down to what you want from a game and how you arrive at the rating of "average". 

    Camelot Unchained, to me, looks like the most innovative MMORPG in development:
    • Unique territory control
    • Design and build your own structures in the world (CUBE)
    • Unique take on abilities and combat
    • Horizontal Progression
    • An engine that actually supports massively-multiplayer
    Not only is this game going to be pushing the boundaries compared to everyone else, it also happens to be moving in a direction that I have been arguing for for years. 

    That said, the scope of the game is very narrow and their budget is limited. There will be basically no PvE, just small amounts in The Depths. There will be basically no quests. There will be minimal / no loot drops, just crafted stuff. The graphics are likely to be limited due to the desire to support 1000+ player battles. 


    So, overall, I would probably agree that CU will be an "average" game, but I believe it will achieve that rating by having superior combat, pvp, crafting and progression whilst having sub-par/no questing, story, gear grinds, pve, raids etc. 

    To me, I would rather a game achieved "average" rating by being superior in a few areas and sub-par in over areas, rather than just being average across the board. By focusing on just a few features, you do make yourself niche and risk players leaving when they get bored with that niche, but at least the game is helping to progress the industry as a whole. I would much rather support a game like CU, even if it's only for a few months, than playing a game like ESO or FFXIV which are both average across the board and are doing little or nothing to advance the genre. 

    Of course, I'd rather have a game that both pushes the boundaries, and has breadth of features, and has depth of features......
    JamesGoblin
  • GladDogGladDog Pottstown, PAMember RarePosts: 839
    Right now, the game I am most anticipating, Ship of Heroes, is updating their game engine, working on their random mission generator and painstakingly fixing world collision detection/ occlusions.  This stuff needs to be done, and it is important to the game, especially with characters being able to fly and run at super speed!  But it does not make for good videos.

    So the information is sparse right now.  Once they finish the RMG, I am sure they will show it off for all to see, but with all of the work being mundane stuff, it may end up that the game development goes several weeks with nothing really to show.

    It is likely that CU is in the same spot.
    JamesGoblin


    The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!


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