A Living Legacy: Designing Chronicles of Elyria (PAX East 2017 Presentation)

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  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Boca Raton, FLMember EpicPosts: 7,552
    Where'd Jeromy go?
    If you were in a no-win situation, where would you go?

    There is nothing he could say that would satisfy the people who are angling for this game to fail.  Nothing.  I understand his compulsion to come here occasionally and try to join the discussion, but the best thing he can do is to ignore you and everyone like you.  Because addressing your concerns will do nothing for him or the game.  There is no scenario where you relent and he gets to proceed with game development in peace.  You're a provocateur.  And I say that with as much respect as is due.  You serve an important purpose, but you're not helping Jeromy make his game.  So he shouldn't focus on you.  He should ignore you.
    ORRRRRRR....  he could answer the questions.  It really shouldn't be ambiguous if the game is going to have their 3 month no wipe head start 5 months from now or if it's going to happen in 2019.   Go on the official forums and you find people who think this is a 2017 launch and other who think its a 2019 one.   When you sell something to customers, and you give them a date to exoect it, you should update them on that timeline.  I don't think that's too much to ask.  That's pretty basic stuff.  

    You're right though, maybe that wouldn't help him sell the game in the short term.

    As for provocateur... maybe.  I just believe that people should say what they mean and do what they say. When things go wrong and they can't they should humbly be apologizing and providing updates. When it's OBVIOUS that someone over promised I think they should be called on it.  In today's world maybe that's being provocative. If so, I fully accept that mantle.



    I did acknowledge your value, let's not forget that!

    The timeline .... I don't understand why so many of them overpromise, but they do. So why does Chronicles of Elyria get nailed to the cross over this?  I don't see why Chronicles of Elyria needs to be crucified for something almost every other MMO project in recent memory has been guilty of themselves.  Camelot Unchained is approaching 2 years beyond the original projected beta release.  2 fucking years!  Where are the pitch forks?  This is not unusual.
    Umm.. MJ has apologized for the delay.  I even got emails linking discussions about it from them.  On the CoE forms people still think this is launching this year.  See the difference?

    MJ doesn't get a free pass for being late.  He just mitigated his mistake by being humble and acknowledging the issues.  He's also a far more experienced game developer with a far smaller scope.  Everything about CoE has been pie in the sky from day one. 

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  • SedrynTyrosSedrynTyros USMember EpicPosts: 2,003
    edited April 1
    Where'd Jeromy go?
    If you were in a no-win situation, where would you go?

    There is nothing he could say that would satisfy the people who are angling for this game to fail.  Nothing.  I understand his compulsion to come here occasionally and try to join the discussion, but the best thing he can do is to ignore you and everyone like you.  Because addressing your concerns will do nothing for him or the game.  There is no scenario where you relent and he gets to proceed with game development in peace.  You're a provocateur.  And I say that with as much respect as is due.  You serve an important purpose, but you're not helping Jeromy make his game.  So he shouldn't focus on you.  He should ignore you.
    ORRRRRRR....  he could answer the questions.  It really shouldn't be ambiguous if the game is going to have their 3 month no wipe head start 5 months from now or if it's going to happen in 2019.   Go on the official forums and you find people who think this is a 2017 launch and other who think its a 2019 one.   When you sell something to customers, and you give them a date to exoect it, you should update them on that timeline.  I don't think that's too much to ask.  That's pretty basic stuff.  

    You're right though, maybe that wouldn't help him sell the game in the short term.

    As for provocateur... maybe.  I just believe that people should say what they mean and do what they say. When things go wrong and they can't they should humbly be apologizing and providing updates. When it's OBVIOUS that someone over promised I think they should be called on it.  In today's world maybe that's being provocative. If so, I fully accept that mantle.



    I did acknowledge your value, let's not forget that!

    The timeline .... I don't understand why so many of them overpromise, but they do. So why does Chronicles of Elyria get nailed to the cross over this?  I don't see why Chronicles of Elyria needs to be crucified for something almost every other MMO project in recent memory has been guilty of themselves.  Camelot Unchained is approaching 2 years beyond the original projected beta release.  2 fucking years!  Where are the pitch forks?  This is not unusual.
    Umm.. MJ has apologized for the delay.  I even got emails linking discussions about it from them.  On the CoE forms people still think this is launching this year.  See the difference?

    MJ doesn't get a free pass for being late.  He just mitigated his mistake by being humble and acknowledging the issues.  He's also a far more experienced game developer with a far smaller scope.  Everything about CoE has been pie in the sky from day one. 
    Ummm .... well, since the end of 2017 isn't here yet, why don't we see what happens?  Do you remember MJ apologizing for being late in January 2015?  I don't.  Because he wasn't late yet!!  See the difference?

    EDIT:   "Far smaller scope" includes creating your own game engine from scratch?
    Post edited by SedrynTyros on
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Boca Raton, FLMember EpicPosts: 7,552
    Where'd Jeromy go?
    If you were in a no-win situation, where would you go?

    There is nothing he could say that would satisfy the people who are angling for this game to fail.  Nothing.  I understand his compulsion to come here occasionally and try to join the discussion, but the best thing he can do is to ignore you and everyone like you.  Because addressing your concerns will do nothing for him or the game.  There is no scenario where you relent and he gets to proceed with game development in peace.  You're a provocateur.  And I say that with as much respect as is due.  You serve an important purpose, but you're not helping Jeromy make his game.  So he shouldn't focus on you.  He should ignore you.
    ORRRRRRR....  he could answer the questions.  It really shouldn't be ambiguous if the game is going to have their 3 month no wipe head start 5 months from now or if it's going to happen in 2019.   Go on the official forums and you find people who think this is a 2017 launch and other who think its a 2019 one.   When you sell something to customers, and you give them a date to exoect it, you should update them on that timeline.  I don't think that's too much to ask.  That's pretty basic stuff.  

    You're right though, maybe that wouldn't help him sell the game in the short term.

    As for provocateur... maybe.  I just believe that people should say what they mean and do what they say. When things go wrong and they can't they should humbly be apologizing and providing updates. When it's OBVIOUS that someone over promised I think they should be called on it.  In today's world maybe that's being provocative. If so, I fully accept that mantle.



    I did acknowledge your value, let's not forget that!

    The timeline .... I don't understand why so many of them overpromise, but they do. So why does Chronicles of Elyria get nailed to the cross over this?  I don't see why Chronicles of Elyria needs to be crucified for something almost every other MMO project in recent memory has been guilty of themselves.  Camelot Unchained is approaching 2 years beyond the original projected beta release.  2 fucking years!  Where are the pitch forks?  This is not unusual.
    Umm.. MJ has apologized for the delay.  I even got emails linking discussions about it from them.  On the CoE forms people still think this is launching this year.  See the difference?

    MJ doesn't get a free pass for being late.  He just mitigated his mistake by being humble and acknowledging the issues.  He's also a far more experienced game developer with a far smaller scope.  Everything about CoE has been pie in the sky from day one. 
    Ummm .... well, since the end of 2017 isn't here yet, why don't we see what happens?  Do you remember MJ apologizing for being late in January 2015?  I don't.  Because he wasn't late yet!!  See the difference?

    EDIT:   "Far smaller scope" includes creating your own game engine from scratch?
    Fair points and I'm not going to defend MJ.  He screwed up.  To me his apology and humility carry the day but if you want to torch him, it's certainly valid.  That doesn't excuse Mr. Jeromy at all though.

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  • SedrynTyrosSedrynTyros USMember EpicPosts: 2,003
    Where'd Jeromy go?
    If you were in a no-win situation, where would you go?

    There is nothing he could say that would satisfy the people who are angling for this game to fail.  Nothing.  I understand his compulsion to come here occasionally and try to join the discussion, but the best thing he can do is to ignore you and everyone like you.  Because addressing your concerns will do nothing for him or the game.  There is no scenario where you relent and he gets to proceed with game development in peace.  You're a provocateur.  And I say that with as much respect as is due.  You serve an important purpose, but you're not helping Jeromy make his game.  So he shouldn't focus on you.  He should ignore you.
    ORRRRRRR....  he could answer the questions.  It really shouldn't be ambiguous if the game is going to have their 3 month no wipe head start 5 months from now or if it's going to happen in 2019.   Go on the official forums and you find people who think this is a 2017 launch and other who think its a 2019 one.   When you sell something to customers, and you give them a date to exoect it, you should update them on that timeline.  I don't think that's too much to ask.  That's pretty basic stuff.  

    You're right though, maybe that wouldn't help him sell the game in the short term.

    As for provocateur... maybe.  I just believe that people should say what they mean and do what they say. When things go wrong and they can't they should humbly be apologizing and providing updates. When it's OBVIOUS that someone over promised I think they should be called on it.  In today's world maybe that's being provocative. If so, I fully accept that mantle.



    I did acknowledge your value, let's not forget that!

    The timeline .... I don't understand why so many of them overpromise, but they do. So why does Chronicles of Elyria get nailed to the cross over this?  I don't see why Chronicles of Elyria needs to be crucified for something almost every other MMO project in recent memory has been guilty of themselves.  Camelot Unchained is approaching 2 years beyond the original projected beta release.  2 fucking years!  Where are the pitch forks?  This is not unusual.
    Umm.. MJ has apologized for the delay.  I even got emails linking discussions about it from them.  On the CoE forms people still think this is launching this year.  See the difference?

    MJ doesn't get a free pass for being late.  He just mitigated his mistake by being humble and acknowledging the issues.  He's also a far more experienced game developer with a far smaller scope.  Everything about CoE has been pie in the sky from day one. 
    Ummm .... well, since the end of 2017 isn't here yet, why don't we see what happens?  Do you remember MJ apologizing for being late in January 2015?  I don't.  Because he wasn't late yet!!  See the difference?

    EDIT:   "Far smaller scope" includes creating your own game engine from scratch?
    Fair points and I'm not going to defend MJ.  He screwed up.  To me his apology and humility carry the day but if you want to torch him, it's certainly valid.  That doesn't excuse Mr. Jeromy at all though.
    If I want to torch him?!!!  LOL.  Oh man ... nevermind ...
  • NildenNilden Canada, NBMember EpicPosts: 2,323
    There is pretty much no point to almost any kickstarter project giving a date for anything. All they do is miss them and look like incompetent clueless clucks. Just look at Star Citizen...

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer


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