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The Diaspora of MMOs

ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 22,741

We have long recognised that the more MMOs we had the more issues there were with MMO subscribers. Indeed it was one of the factors in the move to F2P populations and in turn reduced F2P populations as well. But this seems to have happened in entertainment generally. As a fan of SF and fantasy there are more TV series than I can watch, 15 years ago that was not the case. The total number of series is still booming in all genres as far as I know.

So much is being produced we cannot consume a sufficient amount to keep that good MMO or TV series going. Gaming as a whole is not quite so effected as I think the explosion of Indie is balanced by the increasing reliance of gaming houses on franchise titles.

For MMOs this has been negative all down the line. I know many think that the huge choice is a big plus, but the sacrifice in quality, styles of game play, background, quality of writing etc has been huge.

We could use a Netflix model for MMOs, but that brings us back to the idea of subscriptions. Netflix are not too bothered if one TV series does not demand huge numbers, they still keep it archived even if they don’t recommission, as a MMO could be if part of a entertainment package.

Gaming houses have offered a subscription for certain of their games before but by incorporating MMOs into packages for other kinds of entertainment we might bypass some of their issues.

One thing we can’t stop the tide which is making fewer of us play the same MMO and same games. Same for TV, we are divided by suppliers. The cohesion of talking about the same TV has radically reduced just like the communities in MMOs. But at least in gaming the likes of Steam friends is a counter to that.

Comments

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,372
    I think the issue is too many average quality MMOs with little distinction between them.

    There's little special about them to retain a player so bouncing between games is common place for many.

    AA, BDO, Revelation, TERA etc what is really so different between them.

    Same for the many WOW spinoffs over the years...none have anything unique of real significance.

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

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    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

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  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 31,892
    Kyleran said:


    AA, BDO, Revelation, TERA etc what is really so different between them.



    Quite a bit if Black Desert is my main mmo and I don't play those other games. I love Tera's combat but don't like its game play all that much and I don't really like anything I see with Revelation.

    I don't like Archeage's tab targetting and can't stand the "!"


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  • CymdaiCymdai Member UncommonPosts: 1,043
    It has far, far less to do with content over-saturation, and everything to do with a total lack of innovation.

    In the last 5 years, so many impostor MMO's that came out and failed to do anything different at all. I mean, look at the nearly identical looks of WoW and Wildstar. How many games, honestly, even tried to evolve or improve systems that were birthed nearly a decade before them? Most games still haven't even strayed from the basic "fetch-and-retrieve", "escort helpless NPC", or "kill x, deliver y" quests. You're telling me that no one, literally at all, came up with anything better than that in 10 years?

    You mix the total failure to innovate or improve, and you combine it with the travesty that has become F2P games, and its not hard to see why MMORPG's are dying. Games are essentially extremely dumbed-down, pay-to-win cash farms these days. It's a big reason why I stopped writing about them, and stopped playing them, too.

    Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...

  • stayontargetstayontarget Member RarePosts: 6,519
    Kyleran said:

    AA, BDO, Revelation, TERA etc what is really so different between them.

    Same for the many WOW spinoffs over the years...none have anything unique of real significance.

    I can agree with the 2nd part of that statement, but dam dude you don't know the difference between those four games.

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  • CazrielCazriel Member RarePosts: 419
    Interesting idea.  We'll see what Amazon does with its Games Studio.  It might well be that instead of selling individual games, they sell subscription to the services, similar to how you can purchase subs to various channels (HBO, Showtime, etc.) through Amazon. 

    I used to try to game with my friends and follow them to different games, but my interest in how long I wished to play and in what kind of content eventually made that a hollow gesture. 

    Although innovation is often pointed to as why MMOs have gotten stale, I don't agree.  I think the MMO market is now so vast that it would be impossible to design a game that would attract a broad base in the way that WoW did. 

    It used to be that developers were in charge of the narrative.  I'm thinking in terms of "this is the game we made and this is what you'll do in-game and that's it."   Now gamers are in charge of the narrative.  "Nope, not gonna PvP.  Nope, not gonna tab target.  Nope, not gonna play if no housing."   This has made a huge difference in how games are perceived, talked about, reviewed and played. 
  • centkincentkin Member RarePosts: 1,527
    Back in the day there was the all access thing that had the everquests and some other games in it.

    The game industry mostly can't figure out if $100 is too little to pay or $15 too much.
  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Member EpicPosts: 6,601
    All access is still there.
    Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
  • Jill52Jill52 Member UncommonPosts: 85
    "A diaspora (from Greek διασπορά, "scattering, dispersion") is a scattered population whose origin lies within a smaller geographic locale. Diaspora can also refer to the movement of the population from its original homeland."

    Interesting choice of words (and very fitting). These days the players of MMORPGs are scattered throughout too many different games. Some of these games are not even in the MMORPG genre (MOBAs and such).
     If there was a colorful variety of unique and different games which appeal to the smaller niche audiences they are getting because of the population being scattered among so many games this wouldn't be so bad.
     Instead everything seems to be basically the same game with a few minor differences. Why? Because developers are all trying too hard to appeal to everyone. In doing so they make the most bland, uninspired games possible.
    Once they concede to the fact that, for this reason, they will never get the number of players that rare anomalies like WoW got then maybe they might realize making games catering specifically to a smaller yet rabidly loyal niche fan base is the better option for the long term. (unless they are content with making terrible games for short term cash grabs of course)
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,372
    Torval said:
    Kyleran said:
    I think the issue is too many average quality MMOs with little distinction between them.

    There's little special about them to retain a player so bouncing between games is common place for many.

    AA, BDO, Revelation, TERA etc what is really so different between them.

    Same for the many WOW spinoffs over the years...none have anything unique of real significance.

    You know when people say stupid things about EVE and you guys all laugh at them? Yeah... I wouldn't follow you argument down the rabbit hole if I were you. Not seeing the difference between what those games offer doesn't make it insightful. It makes it look like you should find out about those games first.
    I've actually played 3 of those 4 and despite the minor mechanical differences, the core game play is largely the same.

    You will create a character, level it up, mostly solo with occasional grouping thrown in. You'll do some crafting, make tons of money, spend it RNGing your gear, maybe do a bit of PVP, probably complain how P2W it is, decorate a house, do a boss raid or kill, grind new content for new gear, do it again and again ad nauseum.

    Interesting you brought up EVE, its really not much like any of them.

    Oh I know, AA is more sandboxy, has cool boat mechanics, Revelation has flying,  BDO has its unique perks such as AFK fishing but largely you are playing the same core game, for many years actually.

    No wonder people are lukewarm to the genre.

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,372
    Kyleran said:

    AA, BDO, Revelation, TERA etc what is really so different between them.

    Same for the many WOW spinoffs over the years...none have anything unique of real significance.

    I can agree with the 2nd part of that statement, but dam dude you don't know the difference between those four games.
    Of course l know how the 4 differ, but "damn dude" can't you see how very similar they are.

    Trouble with these forums, people take things literally and don't think things through.

    It's OK, I'm used to it.

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,346
    Kyleran said:
    I think the issue is too many average quality MMOs with little distinction between them.

    There's little special about them to retain a player so bouncing between games is common place for many.

    AA, BDO, Revelation, TERA etc what is really so different between them.

    Same for the many WOW spinoffs over the years...none have anything unique of real significance.

    And EVE is completely superfluous now that we have Uncharted Waters Online.  </sarcasm>
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 22,741
    Cazriel said:
    Interesting idea.  We'll see what Amazon does with its Games Studio.  It might well be that instead of selling individual games, they sell subscription to the services, similar to how you can purchase subs to various channels (HBO, Showtime, etc.) through Amazon. 

    I used to try to game with my friends and follow them to different games, but my interest in how long I wished to play and in what kind of content eventually made that a hollow gesture. 

    Although innovation is often pointed to as why MMOs have gotten stale, I don't agree.  I think the MMO market is now so vast that it would be impossible to design a game that would attract a broad base in the way that WoW did. 

    It used to be that developers were in charge of the narrative.  I'm thinking in terms of "this is the game we made and this is what you'll do in-game and that's it."   Now gamers are in charge of the narrative.  "Nope, not gonna PvP.  Nope, not gonna tab target.  Nope, not gonna play if no housing."   This has made a huge difference in how games are perceived, talked about, reviewed and played. 

    I do think lack of innovation is a big issue, but I agree that even huge innovation will struggle in todays MMO market.

    Not sure gamers are in charge, only that common denominators are listened too. So if their analysis says Gamers mostly like X, they put in X regardless of its impact on the nature of MMO gaming. So we get what the majority want without thought to the quality of game you end up producing.
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 22,741
    edited March 2017
    Kyleran said:
    Torval said:
    Kyleran said:
    I think the issue is too many average quality MMOs with little distinction between them.

    There's little special about them to retain a player so bouncing between games is common place for many.

    AA, BDO, Revelation, TERA etc what is really so different between them.

    Same for the many WOW spinoffs over the years...none have anything unique of real significance.

    You know when people say stupid things about EVE and you guys all laugh at them? Yeah... I wouldn't follow you argument down the rabbit hole if I were you. Not seeing the difference between what those games offer doesn't make it insightful. It makes it look like you should find out about those games first.
    I've actually played 3 of those 4 and despite the minor mechanical differences, the core game play is largely the same.

    You will create a character, level it up, mostly solo with occasional grouping thrown in. You'll do some crafting, make tons of money, spend it RNGing your gear, maybe do a bit of PVP, probably complain how P2W it is, decorate a house, do a boss raid or kill, grind new content for new gear, do it again and again ad nauseum.

    Interesting you brought up EVE, its really not much like any of them.

    Oh I know, AA is more sandboxy, has cool boat mechanics, Revelation has flying,  BDO has its unique perks such as AFK fishing but largely you are playing the same core game, for many years actually.

    No wonder people are lukewarm to the genre.

    I agree, look at how different BF, GTA and LFD are. Are the world of MMOs tied down so much by the genre that MMOs have to be so similar? Yes, I understand we can never have the degree of variety "solo" games have, but meanwhile "solo" games are showing MMOs how different multiplayer can be.

    Already a real issue for MMOs and more so down the road, is MMO multiplayer experience going to be able to match what a "solo" game is doing?
    Post edited by Scot on
  • peanutabcpeanutabc Member UncommonPosts: 174
    edited March 2017
    cause mmorpgs are basically call of duty, you played one you've played them all and none will ever be as magical as your first (for most people) 

    • There's barely a handful that are unique.
    • Got to the point where if the level cap is 10000, the 1-9999 doesn't matter because its not the endgame but "filler" no matter how long it takes, what it involves or the depth.
    • none mmorpgs do what people want from mmorpgs better


  • iixviiiixiixviiiix Member RarePosts: 2,256
    peanutabc said:
    cause mmorpgs are basically call of duty, you played one you've played them all and none will ever be as magical as your first (for most people) 

    I don't think so , most of games i played from 2004 to 2010 (no WOW) pretty much as interest as my first MMORPG
    after people start to create the clone of WOW with solo quest hubs and forced group instance , all the game become boring . I rarely manage to play pass 20 level at those game .
    Archeage is exception since i can break between the quests for labor stuffs , but it boring fast since people keep abuse the system to the point broken the game . And the quests and instance aka main contents is as boring as other WOW clone , i don't even want to play it if it wasn't the PVP and non combat contents .
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