The Elder Scrolls Online: Morrowind expansion announced

124

Comments

  • DKLondDKLond AlbertslundMember RarePosts: 2,070
    edited February 24
    Distopia said:
    DKLond said:
    It's really simple. The expansion should be purchasable with crowns - amounting to 40$ / monthly subscription cost * monthly crowns.

    Probably around 5000 crowns.

    It would motivate people to subscribe right now - and please existing subscribers.

    That's so obviously worth a LOT more than the few sales they'd be missing out on.

    Unfortunately, they went the Homestead way of fleecing their customers. It's not a good path to be on.


    It's only fleecing people if it isn't worth the money. This idea that if a company doesn't do as certain folks wish they're evil bastages, is quite petulant really. Especially when the jury is still out on the actual product that is still months away. The reasoning here is what's simple, they want to profit off of the expansion, buy it or don't, that's up to you.

    The Sub arguments in regard to this release are getting a bit tired as well. No one that is a previous subscriber is getting screwed by this, as they've delivered to those people all along. Be it crowns, content, crafting bags etc.. so that's a non sequitur. 

    It only effects the sub going forward which with such advanced notice, there's ample time to rethink it's value and act accordingly. 


    Please, if you can't argue your case without a strawman - at least make an effort when inventing it.

    I don't believe I've said anything about morality or "evil" people here. I'm talking about ways you can profit and do business.

    What I mean by fleecing, in this case, is making people pay for something they want - that you could easily give them ANOTHER way of buying without losing much, if anything. Here, I'm arguing that they will gain in the longer term by offering subscribers the opportunity to spend their crowns on the expansion.

    I haven't said ANYTHING about being screwed.

    I'm going to buy the expansion (if I'm still playing it in june) - because I think it has value for me.

    That doesn't mean I think it's a good way to do business - or a good way to value your loyal subscribers.


    Post edited by DKLond on
  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCMember LegendaryPosts: 9,819
    Distopia said:
    It's only fleecing people if it isn't worth the money. This idea that if a company doesn't do as certain folks wish they're evil bastages, is quite petulant really. 


    So what do you call disparaging critics with reductive strawman quips characterizing what they're saying as calling the company "evil bastages" and posting crying baby memes?

    ZOS had many options on how they added Vvanderfell, the Warden and PVP battlegrounds to the game including doing it using their existing DLC model. They chose one option. Some don't like that option and some don't care.

    WTF is your problem with people who feel like criticizing their choice that you feel compelled to jump in with your insults despite being a very casual player who hardly ever plays the game by your own admission?
    When you come to a fork on the road, take it.
    You can observe a lot by just watching.
    No one goes there nowadays, it's too crowded.

    -- Yogi --
  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDMember EpicPosts: 21,106
    edited February 24
    DKLond said:


    Please, if you can't argue your case without a strawman - at least make an effort when inventing it.

    I don't believe I've said anything about morality or "evil" people here. I'm talking about ways you can profit and do business.

    What I mean by fleecing, in this case, is making people pay for something they want - that you could easily give them ANOTHER way of buying without losing much, if anything. Here, I'm arguing that they will gain in the longer term by offering subscribers the opportunity to spend their crowns on the expansion.

    I haven't said ANYTHING about being screwed.

    I'm going to buy the expansion (if I'm still playing it in june) - because I think it has value for me.

    That doesn't mean I think it's a good way to do business - or a good way to value your loyal subscribers.


    I'm sorry, what else are you saying when you throw terms around like fleecing? Which the definition of is swindling folks.... which is performing a fraudulent act or scheme. Who does that besides immoral people? I used an exaggeration (evil bastages) to make a point toward that statement, that's not creating a strawman... If you're going to use words, understand what they imply...


    My post wasn't just directed at you btw it was toward the outcry in general.


    Post edited by Distopia on

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDMember EpicPosts: 21,106
    Iselin said:
    Distopia said:
    It's only fleecing people if it isn't worth the money. This idea that if a company doesn't do as certain folks wish they're evil bastages, is quite petulant really. 


    So what do you call disparaging critics with reductive strawman quips characterizing what they're saying as calling the company "evil bastages" and posting crying baby memes?

    ZOS had many options on how they added Vvanderfell, the Warden and PVP battlegrounds to the game including doing it using their existing DLC model. They chose one option. Some don't like that option and some don't care.

    WTF is your problem with people who feel like criticizing their choice that you feel compelled to jump in with your insults despite being a very casual player who hardly ever plays the game by your own admission?
    There's critique, then there's sensationalizing. You jump that shark when throwing around terms that have a specific meaning. Especially when you act as though that term has no sinister implications. 

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCMember LegendaryPosts: 9,819
    Distopia said:
    There's critique, then there's sensationalizing. You jump that shark when throwing around terms that have a specific meaning. Especially when you act as though that term has no sinister implications. 
    You mean terms like "evil bastages"?
    When you come to a fork on the road, take it.
    You can observe a lot by just watching.
    No one goes there nowadays, it's too crowded.

    -- Yogi --
  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDMember EpicPosts: 21,106
    edited February 24
    Iselin said:
    You mean terms like "evil bastages"?
    Who else "fleeces" their customers? I'm also not acting as though that term doesn't carry those sinister implications.
    Post edited by Distopia on

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCMember LegendaryPosts: 9,819
    Distopia said:
    Iselin said:
    You mean terms like "evil bastages"?
    Who else "fleeces" their customers? I'm also not acting as though that term doesn't carry those sinister implications.
    One of the definitions of the verb is to charge excessively for goods or services and another one is to do so by fraud or extortion.

    I guess every theater that sells overpriced cola and pop-corn are "evil bastages" in your world.

    His opinion clearly is that they're overcharging and you disrespected his opinion by zeroing in on your preferred definition of "fleece" to call him petulant. 

    It's no better than the dumbass post trying to silence criticism with lame baby crying memes.
    When you come to a fork on the road, take it.
    You can observe a lot by just watching.
    No one goes there nowadays, it's too crowded.

    -- Yogi --
  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDMember EpicPosts: 21,106
    edited February 24
    Iselin said:
    One of the definitions of the verb is to charge excessively for goods or services and another one is to do so by fraud or extortion.

    I guess every theater that sells overpriced cola and pop-corn are "evil bastages" in your world.

    His opinion clearly is that they're overcharging and you disrespected his opinion by zeroing in on your preferred definition of "fleece" to call him petulant. 

    It's no better than the dumbass post trying to silence criticism with lame baby crying memes.
    It seems to me, by his own admission; he's saying they could make more...... "if anything. Here, I'm arguing that they will gain in the longer term by offering subscribers the opportunity to spend their crowns on the expansion."  

    Wouldn't that imply they're undershooting their potential earnings?

    My post was blunt as they always are, I try and leave no room for mistaking what I'm saying. Nor how I feel about the subject at hand. I feel most reactions gamers have toward corporate decisions are petulant (bad tempered), I won't apologize for that. Ignore me or whatever you need to do, as that won't change.

    And sure he could have meant that, I could have been wrong, I don't shy away from admitting that either. That's the point of debate, the reality is sometimes you have to clarify your thoughts. Especially when they can be read in different ways. 

    As for overcharging being sinister? No, I don't think it is, it's the name of the game in the business world, especially the entertainment industry. It's not me talking such practices down or reacting to them in such a way...
    Post edited by Distopia on

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCMember LegendaryPosts: 9,819
    edited February 24
    Distopia said:
    Iselin said:
    Distopia said:
    Iselin said:
    You mean terms like "evil bastages"?
    Who else "fleeces" their customers? I'm also not acting as though that term doesn't carry those sinister implications.
    One of the definitions of the verb is to charge excessively for goods or services and another one is to do so by fraud or extortion.

    I guess every theater that sells overpriced cola and pop-corn are "evil bastages" in your world.

    His opinion clearly is that they're overcharging and you disrespected his opinion by zeroing in on your preferred definition of "fleece" to call him petulant. 

    It's no better than the dumbass post trying to silence criticism with lame baby crying memes.
    It seems to me, by his own admission; he's saying they could make more...... "if anything. Here, I'm arguing that they will gain in the longer term by offering subscribers the opportunity to spend their crowns on the expansion."  

    Wouldn't that imply they're undershooting their potential earnings?
    Yes he did say that but you chose to focus on "fleece" to call him petulant.

    But you're not trying to say that overcharging is the best way to maximize earnings are you?
    Post edited by Iselin on
    When you come to a fork on the road, take it.
    You can observe a lot by just watching.
    No one goes there nowadays, it's too crowded.

    -- Yogi --
  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDMember EpicPosts: 21,106
    edited February 24
    Iselin said:
    Yes he did say that but you chose to focus on "fleece" to call him petulant.

    But you're not trying to say that overcharging is the best way to maximize earnings are you?
    You'll simply have to read my edit. And no I don't post just to insult people, that was a very small part of my post. Not even close to the crux of it.
    Post edited by Distopia on

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • DKLondDKLond AlbertslundMember RarePosts: 2,070
    Distopia said:
    DKLond said:


    Please, if you can't argue your case without a strawman - at least make an effort when inventing it.

    I don't believe I've said anything about morality or "evil" people here. I'm talking about ways you can profit and do business.

    What I mean by fleecing, in this case, is making people pay for something they want - that you could easily give them ANOTHER way of buying without losing much, if anything. Here, I'm arguing that they will gain in the longer term by offering subscribers the opportunity to spend their crowns on the expansion.

    I haven't said ANYTHING about being screwed.

    I'm going to buy the expansion (if I'm still playing it in june) - because I think it has value for me.

    That doesn't mean I think it's a good way to do business - or a good way to value your loyal subscribers.


    I'm sorry, what else are you saying when you throw terms around like fleecing? Which the definition of is swindling folks.... which is performing a fraudulent act or scheme. Who does that besides immoral people? I used an exaggeration (evil bastages) to make a point toward that statement, that's not creating a strawman... If you're going to use words, understand what they imply...


    My post wasn't just directed at you btw it was toward the outcry in general.


    I made it clear what I meant by it. I don't care about morals or ethics - as that's so subjective as to be useless unless we all agree from the beginning, which is incredibly unlikely.

    I'm focusing on benefit versus harm, and I'm including both parties.

    Also, if you don't mean to direct a post at me - then consider not quoting me and saying stuff like "it's up to you".
  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDMember EpicPosts: 21,106
    edited February 24
    DKLond said:


    I made it clear what I meant by it. I don't care about morals or ethics - as that's so subjective as to be useless unless we all agree from the beginning, which is incredibly unlikely.

    I'm focusing on benefit versus harm, and I'm including both parties.

    Also, if you don't mean to direct a post at me - then consider not quoting me and saying stuff like "it's up to you".
    "It's up to you" was meant toward pretty much any reader (open discussion), not toward you specifically.

    While I quoted you it was just to highlight the point I opened with. Even the petulance comment wasn't toward you specifically (hence saying certain folks)....  as such reactions are essentially normalized in these types of communities. Speaking toward them is far reaching.

    The only things I mentioned toward your post specifically were, it wouldn't be fleecing if the product is worth the cost. As well as where I used your "it's simple" line. Everything else I tried to keep broad as to not get too personal. Hence the usage of those people in reference to subs, certain folks in regard to reactions. 






    Post edited by Distopia on

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • DKLondDKLond AlbertslundMember RarePosts: 2,070
    Distopia said:
    DKLond said:
    Distopia said:
    DKLond said:


    Please, if you can't argue your case without a strawman - at least make an effort when inventing it.

    I don't believe I've said anything about morality or "evil" people here. I'm talking about ways you can profit and do business.

    What I mean by fleecing, in this case, is making people pay for something they want - that you could easily give them ANOTHER way of buying without losing much, if anything. Here, I'm arguing that they will gain in the longer term by offering subscribers the opportunity to spend their crowns on the expansion.

    I haven't said ANYTHING about being screwed.

    I'm going to buy the expansion (if I'm still playing it in june) - because I think it has value for me.

    That doesn't mean I think it's a good way to do business - or a good way to value your loyal subscribers.


    I'm sorry, what else are you saying when you throw terms around like fleecing? Which the definition of is swindling folks.... which is performing a fraudulent act or scheme. Who does that besides immoral people? I used an exaggeration (evil bastages) to make a point toward that statement, that's not creating a strawman... If you're going to use words, understand what they imply...


    My post wasn't just directed at you btw it was toward the outcry in general.


    I made it clear what I meant by it. I don't care about morals or ethics - as that's so subjective as to be useless unless we all agree from the beginning, which is incredibly unlikely.

    I'm focusing on benefit versus harm, and I'm including both parties.

    Also, if you don't mean to direct a post at me - then consider not quoting me and saying stuff like "it's up to you".
    "It's up to you" was meant toward pretty much any reader (open discussion), not toward you specifically.

    While I quoted you it was just to highlight the point I opened with. Even the petulance comment wasn't toward you specifically (hence saying certain folks)....  as such reactions are essentially normalized in these types of communities.

    Speaking toward them is far reaching. The only things I mentioned toward your post specifically were, it wouldn't be fleecing if the product is worth the cost. As well as where I used your "it's simple" line. Everything else I tried to keep broad as to not get too personal. Hence the usage of those people in reference to subs, certain folks in regard to reactions. 






    I don't remember stating having a problem with your alleged personal statements.

    I've been debating stuff online for many, many years.

    The only thing that has any real impact on me would be rational arguments. To me, personal insults only support my position - because it's a weakness to use them unless warranted, which they rarely are.

    That said, frankly, I didn't really notice whether you insulted me or not. It's just noise for the most part.

    I simply pointed out where you were wrong and where I disagreed.


  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDMember EpicPosts: 21,106
    DKLond said:
    Distopia said:
    DKLond said:
    Distopia said:
    DKLond said:


    Please, if you can't argue your case without a strawman - at least make an effort when inventing it.

    I don't believe I've said anything about morality or "evil" people here. I'm talking about ways you can profit and do business.

    What I mean by fleecing, in this case, is making people pay for something they want - that you could easily give them ANOTHER way of buying without losing much, if anything. Here, I'm arguing that they will gain in the longer term by offering subscribers the opportunity to spend their crowns on the expansion.

    I haven't said ANYTHING about being screwed.

    I'm going to buy the expansion (if I'm still playing it in june) - because I think it has value for me.

    That doesn't mean I think it's a good way to do business - or a good way to value your loyal subscribers.


    I'm sorry, what else are you saying when you throw terms around like fleecing? Which the definition of is swindling folks.... which is performing a fraudulent act or scheme. Who does that besides immoral people? I used an exaggeration (evil bastages) to make a point toward that statement, that's not creating a strawman... If you're going to use words, understand what they imply...


    My post wasn't just directed at you btw it was toward the outcry in general.


    I made it clear what I meant by it. I don't care about morals or ethics - as that's so subjective as to be useless unless we all agree from the beginning, which is incredibly unlikely.

    I'm focusing on benefit versus harm, and I'm including both parties.

    Also, if you don't mean to direct a post at me - then consider not quoting me and saying stuff like "it's up to you".
    "It's up to you" was meant toward pretty much any reader (open discussion), not toward you specifically.

    While I quoted you it was just to highlight the point I opened with. Even the petulance comment wasn't toward you specifically (hence saying certain folks)....  as such reactions are essentially normalized in these types of communities.

    Speaking toward them is far reaching. The only things I mentioned toward your post specifically were, it wouldn't be fleecing if the product is worth the cost. As well as where I used your "it's simple" line. Everything else I tried to keep broad as to not get too personal. Hence the usage of those people in reference to subs, certain folks in regard to reactions. 






    I don't remember stating having a problem with your alleged personal statements.

    I've been debating stuff online for many, many years.

    The only thing that has any real impact on me would be rational arguments. To me, personal insults only support my position - because it's a weakness to use them unless warranted, which they rarely are.

    That said, frankly, I didn't really notice whether you insulted me or not. It's just noise for the most part.

    I simply pointed out where you were wrong and where I disagreed.


    Fair enough, I obviously projected the conversation with Islen onto you there, so my bad. 

    I was just trying to clarify i didn't quote you to attack you outright. 

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • chjumalievchjumaliev Member CommonPosts: 6
    I have questions, If i have steam edition, can i buy non-steam key and activate it in my account?
  • jgn77jgn77 Cary, NCMember UncommonPosts: 15
    My least favorite thing to do in MMOs is quest. Following around all knowing markers and having absolutely zero chance to fail or affect the situation is just grueling. So its incredibly disappointing to see that ZOS has thrown most of their efforts to questing content and treat PVP, Dungeons, Trials, and crafting as secondary options. If you look at all the most popular MMOs, none of them concentrate around questing except ESO. Its just so damn frustrating to see such wasted potential. 
  • gervaise1gervaise1 .Member RarePosts: 4,283
    jgn77 said:
    My least favorite thing to do in MMOs is quest. Following around all knowing markers and having absolutely zero chance to fail or affect the situation is just grueling. So its incredibly disappointing to see that ZOS has thrown most of their efforts to questing content and treat PVP, Dungeons, Trials, and crafting as secondary options. If you look at all the most popular MMOs, none of them concentrate around questing except ESO. Its just so damn frustrating to see such wasted potential. 
    ESO does have a lot - an awful lot - of quests. You can go months and not do anything else. And its an ES game so there is no way that ZoS could release a "quest-lite" game. That would have had zero potential.

    It did release with - and has - a fully developed PvP campaign. And dungeons. And sophisticated crafting. First trials came pretty soon after.

    Follow up content has added mixed PvP/PvE, more dungeons, more trials - and yes even more quests.

    As with many games the ratio of quests to dungeons/trials has fallen since they released. A DLC comes out it has a trial, a few dungeons and "only" a few dozen quests. I think what you are really commenting on though is that ESO has an awful lot of (solid) quest based content.
  • baphametbaphamet omaha, NEMember RarePosts: 3,283
    gervaise1 said:
    jgn77 said:
    My least favorite thing to do in MMOs is quest. Following around all knowing markers and having absolutely zero chance to fail or affect the situation is just grueling. So its incredibly disappointing to see that ZOS has thrown most of their efforts to questing content and treat PVP, Dungeons, Trials, and crafting as secondary options. If you look at all the most popular MMOs, none of them concentrate around questing except ESO. Its just so damn frustrating to see such wasted potential. 
    ESO does have a lot - an awful lot - of quests. You can go months and not do anything else. And its an ES game so there is no way that ZoS could release a "quest-lite" game. That would have had zero potential.

    It did release with - and has - a fully developed PvP campaign. And dungeons. And sophisticated crafting. First trials came pretty soon after.

    Follow up content has added mixed PvP/PvE, more dungeons, more trials - and yes even more quests.

    As with many games the ratio of quests to dungeons/trials has fallen since they released. A DLC comes out it has a trial, a few dungeons and "only" a few dozen quests. I think what you are really commenting on though is that ESO has an awful lot of (solid) quest based content.
    not to mention you don't even have to quest if you do not want to.

    i'm guessing a lot of comments like that are of people that haven't played the game recently. you can literally ignore all the quests and just run around and kill stuff and craft if you want.

    but if you are a fan of the ES single player titles, you will understand why this is a quest driven game because ES games are traditionally quest driven games and the way you acquire quests in ESO is no different than how you acquire quests in skyrim.




  • SaunZSaunZ Las Vegas, NVMember UncommonPosts: 384
    I act like I'm going to quest and then don't so that they ESO NPCs can't profile me

    Sz  :)
  • RawynRawyn USAMember UncommonPosts: 178
    edited March 18
    Thinking I may buy ESO, haven't played it since it was beta. From the looks of this it looks like if I pre-order morrowind I get the base game which is Tamriel Unlimited too...Is this correct? 

    It seems that's the case from the site. Just want to make sure. I'm assuming it won't have the Dark Brotherhood, thieves guild, Orsinium, imperial city, and palamino horse if I go this route but will be cheaper and the best bang for my bucks.

    Morrowind® Digital Edition

    Morrowind_pc_box_art

    $59.99

    THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A BETTER TIME TO EXPERIENCE THE ELDER SCROLLS® ONLINE

    • Return to Morrowind in this new chapter of the award-winning online role-playing series, The Elder Scrolls® Online. Morrowind is on the verge of destruction, and it’s up to you to save it from a deadly Daedric threat. Embark on a dangerous journey through legendary locales, from volcanic ashlands to mushroom-filled forests.
      • SAVE MORROWIND - Stop a meteor from crashing into Vivec City by helping a demi-god regain his lost powers.
      • BECOME THE WARDEN – Harness the nature-based magic of an all-new class with a War Bear battle companion at your side.
      • PARTNER WITH AN ASSASSIN – Aid a legendary elite member of the Morag Tong who will guide you through deadly political intrigue.
      • FIGHT TOGETHER IN PVP BATTLEGROUNDS – Take the battle to the Ashlands with new 4v4v4 player vs. player combat set in competitive arena-style environments.
      Includes The Elder Scrolls® Online: Tamriel Unlimited™, the first game of the acclaimed online RPG series. Pre-order today and get the Discovery Pack!
    Post edited by Rawyn on
  • gervaise1gervaise1 .Member RarePosts: 4,283
    Seems to be the case @Rawyn ;

    There are sales on some of the DLC - Orsinium was 750 crowns pre-Christmas (75% off), ditto Thieve's Guild sale etc.

    4 of the 5 DLC can also be added via a quad-pack - the ones you list + Imperial City but not the Hist DLC. Base price is "5500 crowns" but there have been "50% off" type sales. There are also sales on crowns - you might be able to combine the two.

    The horse .... I was lucky and a son of mine got a code for the Imperial option in a Loot crate!
  • RawynRawyn USAMember UncommonPosts: 178
    edited March 18
    gervaise1 said:
    Seems to be the case @Rawyn ;

    There are sales on some of the DLC - Orsinium was 750 crowns pre-Christmas (75% off), ditto Thieve's Guild sale etc.

    4 of the 5 DLC can also be added via a quad-pack - the ones you list + Imperial City but not the Hist DLC. Base price is "5500 crowns" but there have been "50% off" type sales. There are also sales on crowns - you might be able to combine the two.

    The horse .... I was lucky and a son of mine got a code for the Imperial option in a Loot crate!
    Cool thanks, I just wanted make sure i could play the base game now if I buy the morrowind pre-order. Seems like the best deal is to buy the pre-order for morrowind rather than buy the base game then buy the pre-order. I suppose like you said I can buy the packs later if I want them. Are there any in those packs that are must haves for leveling and gaining money?
    Post edited by Rawyn on
  • gervaise1gervaise1 .Member RarePosts: 4,283
    @Rawyn  

    Nothing in the packs that are must haves for levelling no - some extra quests but as I mentioned above the base game has a huge number.

    And since One Tamriel launched characters can do "most content" from level 1. There is no "traditional" end zone. (Not to say you don't get more powerful.)

    Same goes for money. With the exception of the theft that the Thieve's Guild DLC adds the economics of the new zones are the same. (Loot improves as you level up to a point.) 
  • RawynRawyn USAMember UncommonPosts: 178
    edited March 18
    gervaise1 said:
    @Rawyn  

    Nothing in the packs that are must haves for levelling no - some extra quests but as I mentioned above the base game has a huge number.

    And since One Tamriel launched characters can do "most content" from level 1. There is no "traditional" end zone. (Not to say you don't get more powerful.)

    Same goes for money. With the exception of the theft that the Thieve's Guild DLC adds the economics of the new zones are the same. (Loot improves as you level up to a point.) 
    Great, sounds great. Ty for the replies, appreciate it. If I end up liking the game I can just subscribe and get the dlc or just wait on sales of the dlc I may want so we'll see how it goes :) Really hoping it can keep my attention. I really like having a subscription option if it offers something good.
    Post edited by Rawyn on
  • RawynRawyn USAMember UncommonPosts: 178
    edited March 19
    Well, not a good start so far. After creating an account and buying and downloading the game from their site, I keep getting login failed. I suppose I'll have to create a ticket....if I can find it in the support page, not having luck finding that yet, lol. 
    Post edited by Rawyn on
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