That's what I don't understand.... Why People are hyping it so much it's Archeage just in a prettier package..........
I guess because Trion made so many mistakes with that game that this is gonna be the new sandbox savior now????
Not to be rude but this is gonna have the same fate......... People say they want sandbox but in all reality they never do well.......
I think most people aren't looking for this game to be the savior of anything so they can appreciate it for what it is rather than being angst filled about what may or may not be in the cash shop months from now.
You seem to think that this revenue (read skinning players alive) model will never creep in to a western made MMO. Well, I don't follow financial statements of korean gaming companies but I'm sure all western devs do. It probably only takes a single eastern game to make mad cash in the west for some people to go: "Well shiiiit, look at these koreans skinning 'our' guys alive, lets get in on it guys, lets incorporate this labor nonesense and real money gambling for upgrades in our games guys!" And with the increasing number of korean MMOs getting published in EU/NA in the last 6-7 years, sooner or later one wil strike gold.
How many 'WoW clones" have you seen since WoW hit the jackpot? Exactly. game companies will copy/paste financally successful ideas and systems no mater where they come from. So, pray for BDO to flop in EU/NA or it's at least a decade of 'labor and gambling for upgrades"western made MMOs to follow, IMO of course.
How on earth do you come to that conclusion? GeezerGamer said nothing about his expectations of the future he asked about what you expected of an 'Asian Game'.
While you make a reasonable sounding argument about what might happen if there is a runaway success of an 'Asian Game' in the Western market. But that is hypothetical.
You seem to think that this revenue (read skinning players alive) model will never creep in to a western made MMO. Well, I don't follow financial statements of korean gaming companies but I'm sure all western devs do. It probably only takes a single eastern game to make mad cash in the west for some people to go: "Well shiiiit, look at these koreans skinning 'our' guys alive, lets get in on it guys, lets incorporate this labor nonesense and real money gambling for upgrades in our games guys!" And with the increasing number of korean MMOs getting published in EU/NA in the last 6-7 years, sooner or later one wil strike gold.
How many 'WoW clones" have you seen since WoW hit the jackpot? Exactly. game companies will copy/paste financally successful ideas and systems no mater where they come from. So, pray for BDO to flop in EU/NA or it's at least a decade of 'labor and gambling for upgrades"western made MMOs to follow, IMO of course.
In light of what Chris Roberts is doing these days I think the Asians have quite a bit to learn from us about "skinning" whales.
It won't be P2W like AA not because I have some magical belief that publishers don't want money but more so based on what changes have occurred in KR/RU, specifically. Sounds like the publisher, based on closed betas, is very willing to modify to the needs of the community.
Trion straight up ignored everyone. But I guess we'll see in the end.
Need more modify to the game still someone pointed out the pearls in the cash shop after seeing their packs there going be pearl to trade in for gold use gold to buy high level gear but don't know if how much that will come to play the gear that is, only people who are testing out endgame on KR just know about this more.
You got me, I didn't realize that. I didn't stay in the game for that long. I played it at launch though, liked it a lot and played it some more, until the 'honeymoon' ended and I realized how much of a blatant money grab system it actually had. Uninstalled and never looked back.
It's a pride thing more then money issue, I'm an old fart gamer (gaming since early 80's) and I can afford to spend as much as I like on games but these feeling of people taking unfair advantage of my addiction just wont let me.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
In light of what Chris Roberts is doing these days I think the Asians have quite a bit to learn from us about "skinning" whales.
Very true but Star Citizen deserves it's own thread in the appropriate forum section because you know if i comment on it I will just derail my own thread. Maybe I should start a thread on SC forum. I already have a title: "Star Citizen , the true 4th generation MMO"
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
It won't be P2W like AA not because I have some magical belief that publishers don't want money but more so based on what changes have occurred in KR/RU, specifically. Sounds like the publisher, based on closed betas, is very willing to modify to the needs of the community.
Trion straight up ignored everyone. But I guess we'll see in the end.
I'm not sure how many of those changes have been to the business model. I don't claim to be an expert on BDO but from what I've read most changes seem to concern what level PvP is enabled and changes to the Karma system and OW PvP.
I've seen nothing concerning the buying of pearls and enchanting of gear, which seems to be the major concern of P2W worries.
The game does look good to me but if at level cap it turns into a "pay to enchant your gear for a PvP advantage" then it's cause for concern, especially if the grind for mats needed for enchants is excessively long, which appears to be the case.
As I said I'm no expert and I could be wrong but that's the information I've found and I can only form an opinion based on that.
It won't be P2W like AA not because I have some magical belief that publishers don't want money but more so based on what changes have occurred in KR/RU, specifically. Sounds like the publisher, based on closed betas, is very willing to modify to the needs of the community.
Trion straight up ignored everyone. But I guess we'll see in the end.
Need more modify to the game still someone pointed out the pearls in the cash shop after seeing their packs there going be pearl to trade in for gold use gold to buy high level gear but don't know if how much that will come to play the gear that is, only people who are testing out endgame on KR just know about this more.
I have absolutely no clue what you're saying. The publisher is still able to make it so costumes, for example, cannot be sold in the auction house, thus eliminating any issues with pearls. Apparently, it has happened on the RU P2P server. So, with that said, just means that publishers do have some say in what they can or cannot do in regards to P2W potential problems.
Comon guys we are all adults here and BDO isn't going to be anyone's first MMORPG (I hope). We are all aware that trying to find a scenario where this game doesn't end up being a full blown P2W money sucking affair like Archeage when all the signs are there is just a wishfull thinking and a setup for just another dissapointment right? Right?
I fully understand the appeal though, video games especially MMOs have built-in habit inducing mechanisms that can quickly turn into an addiction and nobody is immune to it. And in this particular game, thanks to graphics advancements they are serving innocent 'face like angel' perfect looking character models with skimpy clothes and bouncing boobs as a hook to a whole new young generation raised on playstations and porn lol. Its almost not fair and too easy, not many young players will be able to resist pulling the trigger on this one.
For me personally, I'd like to check out the warrior class (always my favorite) and the combat system and abilities ( probably the most important feature for me) even though I hate flashy animations with passion. But I'm not willing to pay 30 bucks just for that. Eventhough I have spent a lot of money on gaming over the years I have to draw a line somewhere. Maybe if it goes F2P or a trial I guess.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
Expect an Asian Grind from an Asian Game I guess..Its such a shame because the combat in the game feels really nice. I hear theres also some pay to win aspects in regards to the enchantment system to +20 so ill probably have to skip this game.
I don't think there is much of a difference between the "Asian grind" and the one seen prior to the linear quest driven grind of the post-WoW themepark model. I thought EQ was much the same kind of grind, camping a spot and going, going, going for small upgrades over time. I didn't mind it then and I'd like a modern one now, ironically.
The key you brought up was the combat, which I agree is really nice and I think it pairs perfectly with how the game plays out. There are still a lot of quests too, albeit basic. The difference is that BDO feels more like an open world with things to do by choice, than a compartmentalized string of areas linked meticulously together by led-by-the-nose questing.
To the subject at hand I think waiting to see how they handle the CS for the EU/NA region would be best. Also, and is a heavily debated subject, is a server or toggle for OWPvP. It may seem like a different subject but it makes sense to me that if there were an option like that people may not care as much about any CS P2W routes and would still make playing a possibility. I know it is for me.
But I'm not willing to pay 30 bucks just for that. Eventhough I have spent a lot of money on gaming over the years I have to draw a line somewhere. Maybe if it goes F2P or a trial I guess.
Maybe im slow and not really getting the whole point of mmo's, but i enjoy simply playing these games....been doing it since 97 for the mmo's and i simply find them fun, I dont have to dominate any particular portion of them. I just like the ability to shift my playing style when I get tired of a certain aspect. I enjoyed the beta, and i guess my point is so what if someone spends tons of dough to max out their character ingame... it makes zero difference to my play style, and if it makes them feel like they "win" then more power to them, it only serves to strengthen this industry when people throw money at it.
You seem to think that this revenue (read skinning players alive) model will never creep in to a western made MMO. Well, I don't follow financial statements of korean gaming companies but I'm sure all western devs do. It probably only takes a single eastern game to make mad cash in the west for some people to go: "Well shiiiit, look at these koreans skinning 'our' guys alive, lets get in on it guys, lets incorporate this labor nonesense and real money gambling for upgrades in our games guys!" And with the increasing number of korean MMOs getting published in EU/NA in the last 6-7 years, sooner or later one wil strike gold.
How many 'WoW clones" have you seen since WoW hit the jackpot? Exactly. game companies will copy/paste financally successful ideas and systems no mater where they come from. So, pray for BDO to flop in EU/NA or it's at least a decade of 'labor and gambling for upgrades"western made MMOs to follow, IMO of course.
"What I seem to think"? With all due respect, you have no clue "What I seem to think". You pulled that shit 100% from your own ass and pinned it on me. There's no way you can come up with all that based on "It's an Asian game" You wanna express your opinions? Fine, that's what these forums are for. But don't sit there and post your statement under someone else's quote that has nothing to do with that quote and open with "So what you are saying is...."
It won't be P2W like AA not because I have some magical belief that publishers don't want money but more so based on what changes have occurred in KR/RU, specifically. Sounds like the publisher, based on closed betas, is very willing to modify to the needs of the community.
Trion straight up ignored everyone. But I guess we'll see in the end.
Need more modify to the game still someone pointed out the pearls in the cash shop after seeing their packs there going be pearl to trade in for gold use gold to buy high level gear but don't know if how much that will come to play the gear that is, only people who are testing out endgame on KR just know about this more.
I have absolutely no clue what you're saying. The publisher is still able to make it so costumes, for example, cannot be sold in the auction house, thus eliminating any issues with pearls. Apparently, it has happened on the RU P2P server. So, with that said, just means that publishers do have some say in what they can or cannot do in regards to P2W potential problems.
More just saying there pearls in the cash shop can be traded for gold if it gets to be aloud if it does that means can end up alot people buying pearl to trade in for gold for higher level gear or even upgrades for in game items. Just need to wait and see what there cash shop is like if they open it in close beta 2.
I enjoyed the beta, and i guess my point is so what if someone spends tons of dough to max out their character ingame... it makes zero difference to my play style...
I'd say a big majority of MMO gamers, including me feel the same as you.... in a PVE game. In a PVP centric game ( this includes all korean MMOs published in the west ) not so much. Knowingly or not knowingly, we all play a game for one main reason, to win. That's the goal of a game of any kind. MMORPG have the added factor of a roleplay but we still play a roll of some kind of hero or a winner at something. In my 15 years of MMOs not once have a met someone roleplaying a loser. And of course where there are winners there are also losers. In a PVE MMORPG, every player is a winner, losers are the NPCs. Therefore, not many give a shit if someone bought his dream sword from RMT in a PVE game because that dude isn't competing against me, the mobs are. In a PVP game however you are in a direct competition with other players and any edge they got on you have to come from player skill in order for you to accept your defeat because nobody likes to lose at something that you payed for and it's supposed to entertain you.
This is why open world PVP is never very popular and should be kept in arenas and on equal footing gear wise (think Guild Wars) or otherwise the idiots that bought their advantage will drive the normal players away in a short period of time. Open world PVP sounds great to some because it gives a sense of freedom that people lack in real life but it doesnt take long for human nature to take over and turn it into a frustraiting experience for all but few griefers and sociopaths that bought their power from the cash shop.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
I enjoyed the beta, and i guess my point is so what if someone spends tons of dough to max out their character ingame... it makes zero difference to my play style...
I'd say a big majority of MMO gamers, including me feel the same as you.... in a PVE game. In a PVP centric game ( this includes all korean MMOs published in the west ) not so much. Knowingly or not knowingly, we all play a game for one main reason, to win. That's the goal of a game of any kind. MMORPG have the added factor of a roleplay but we still play a roll of some kind of hero or a winner at something. In my 15 years of MMOs not once have a met someone roleplaying a loser. And of course where there are winners there are also losers. In a PVE MMORPG, every player is a winner, losers are the NPCs. Therefore, not many give a shit if someone bought his dream sword from RMT in a PVE game because that dude isn't competing against me, the mobs are. In a PVP game however you are in a direct competition with other players and any edge they got on you have to come from player skill in order for you to accept your defeat because nobody likes to lose at something that you payed for and it's supposed to entertain you.
This is why open world PVP is never very popular and should be kept in arenas and on equal footing gear wise (think Guild Wars) or otherwise the idiots that bought their advantage will drive the normal players away in a short period of time. Open world PVP sounds great to some because it gives a sense of freedom that people lack in real life but it doesnt take long for human nature to take over and turn it into a frustraiting experience for all but few griefers and sociopaths that bought their power from the cash shop.
You sure talk a lot about a game you don't think is worth $30.
You seem to think that this revenue (read skinning players alive) model will never creep in to a western made MMO. Well, I don't follow financial statements of korean gaming companies but I'm sure all western devs do. It probably only takes a single eastern game to make mad cash in the west for some people to go: "Well shiiiit, look at these koreans skinning 'our' guys alive, lets get in on it guys, lets incorporate this labor nonesense and real money gambling for upgrades in our games guys!" And with the increasing number of korean MMOs getting published in EU/NA in the last 6-7 years, sooner or later one wil strike gold.
How many 'WoW clones" have you seen since WoW hit the jackpot? Exactly. game companies will copy/paste financally successful ideas and systems no mater where they come from. So, pray for BDO to flop in EU/NA or it's at least a decade of 'labor and gambling for upgrades"western made MMOs to follow, IMO of course.
"What I seem to think"? With all due respect, you have no clue "What I seem to think". You pulled that shit 100% from your own ass and pinned it on me. There's no way you can come up with all that based on "It's an Asian game" You wanna express your opinions? Fine, that's what these forums are for. But don't sit there and post your statement under someone else's quote that has nothing to do with that quote and open with "So what you are saying is...."
Your short comment implies that western or non-asian games don't have the same issues that asian games do, which is not the case, at all. If you want a better reply make a much clearer statement or question...
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
You sure talk a lot about a game you don't think is worth $30.
I'm hoping for a flop for the reasons I gave and me talking a lot in a thread I made specifically to highlight the game's flaws is a given, do you see me posting in any other BDO thread?
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
I how love condescending you were about players who enjoy cosmetic items. As if everyone who does (which is most) just sits there all day playing with outfits for months on end and nothing else. I fail to see what's wrong with making our toons look how we want them to in a game lol.
Well it's just odd that you would pay extra money to improve a character's looks. Maybe for items of power or extra efficiency or convenience, all very logical.
But looks? Just no.
Have you bought your monocle yet?
Maybe we should take a look at your precious Eve Online. Want to talk about a shitty game you can look no further then that one. You're a fucking spacecraft with an excel background. But hey, that's all very logical.
Well no, I didn't buy a monacle, nor any of the "cool looking" ship skins as I don't care what my ship or avatar looks like, (outside of what they offer for free) but am only concerned about the stats.
BTW, since you know about the monacle, you know EVE as a very welll developed avatar generator and while CCP sells the ability to change their looks it never crosses my mind.
As for the game play itself, more of a naval simulation than anything else, but is far more thsn a speadsheet I assure you.
But we're way off topic and feel free to start a new thread in the EVE forums if you like.
As for the OP, I'd say give it a chance first, just dont be surprised if it doesn't meet all expectations.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
You sure talk a lot about a game you don't think is worth $30.
I'm hoping for a flop for the reasons I gave and me talking a lot in a thread I made specifically to highlight the game's flaws is a given, do you see me posting in any other BDO thread?
Ah so you couldn't be bothered to even wait and see what's actually in the cash shop on this version before hoping it will fail, classy.
I don't have to check their cash shop to make up my mind no. Archeage's cash shop started somewhat timid as well before it turned into a full blown money sucking machine. Also, you needed to come at a stage of enchanting your gear (took a month or two) in order to understand and see for yourself how messed up that silly expensive RNG based mechanic really is. Or you needed to get serious about crafting to understand the same thing about high tier armor and weapons. Black Desert has the same game mechanics in place. What makes you think it will be any different?
Remember, their revenue model is selling shit in the cash shop. This affects game economy and development in a major way. The game ends up not being about who is more skilled at gaming or who is willing or able to sink more time in it but who is able and willing to sink more money in it. No thanks.
EDIT: PS: If by any chance I'm wrong about this, I'll be first to admit it and apologize to all the fans for pissing in their cereals.... 6 months after launch. Maybe BDO devs learned something from Archeage who knows. I'll be here no worries, and I promise I wont rub it in and say "I told you so" if the game turns out Archeage 2.0.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
its IP locked for south africa and we get all the games,but most mmo`s suck and you have to pay for this asian game and most of their free games suck,so maybe they can stick their game
Comments
While you make a reasonable sounding argument about what might happen if there is a runaway success of an 'Asian Game' in the Western market. But that is hypothetical.
As for now It's an Asian game.
WTF do you expect?
I didn't stay in the game for that long.
I played it at launch though, liked it a lot and played it some more, until the 'honeymoon' ended and I realized how much of a blatant money grab system it actually had.
Uninstalled and never looked back.
It's a pride thing more then money issue, I'm an old fart gamer (gaming since early 80's) and I can afford to spend as much as I like on games but these feeling of people taking unfair advantage of my addiction just wont let me.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
Maybe I should start a thread on SC forum.
I already have a title:
"Star Citizen , the true 4th generation MMO"
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
I've seen nothing concerning the buying of pearls and enchanting of gear, which seems to be the major concern of P2W worries.
The game does look good to me but if at level cap it turns into a "pay to enchant your gear for a PvP advantage" then it's cause for concern, especially if the grind for mats needed for enchants is excessively long, which appears to be the case.
As I said I'm no expert and I could be wrong but that's the information I've found and I can only form an opinion based on that.
I have absolutely no clue what you're saying. The publisher is still able to make it so costumes, for example, cannot be sold in the auction house, thus eliminating any issues with pearls. Apparently, it has happened on the RU P2P server. So, with that said, just means that publishers do have some say in what they can or cannot do in regards to P2W potential problems.
We are all aware that trying to find a scenario where this game doesn't end up being a full blown P2W money sucking affair like Archeage when all the signs are there is just a wishfull thinking and a setup for just another dissapointment right?
Right?
I fully understand the appeal though, video games especially MMOs have built-in habit inducing mechanisms that can quickly turn into an addiction and nobody is immune to it.
And in this particular game, thanks to graphics advancements they are serving innocent 'face like angel' perfect looking character models with skimpy clothes and bouncing boobs as a hook to a whole new young generation raised on playstations and porn lol.
Its almost not fair and too easy, not many young players will be able to resist pulling the trigger on this one.
For me personally, I'd like to check out the warrior class (always my favorite) and the combat system and abilities ( probably the most important feature for me) even though I hate flashy animations with passion.
But I'm not willing to pay 30 bucks just for that.
Eventhough I have spent a lot of money on gaming over the years I have to draw a line somewhere.
Maybe if it goes F2P or a trial I guess.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
I don't think there is much of a difference between the "Asian grind" and the one seen prior to the linear quest driven grind of the post-WoW themepark model. I thought EQ was much the same kind of grind, camping a spot and going, going, going for small upgrades over time. I didn't mind it then and I'd like a modern one now, ironically.
The key you brought up was the combat, which I agree is really nice and I think it pairs perfectly with how the game plays out. There are still a lot of quests too, albeit basic. The difference is that BDO feels more like an open world with things to do by choice, than a compartmentalized string of areas linked meticulously together by led-by-the-nose questing.
To the subject at hand I think waiting to see how they handle the CS for the EU/NA region would be best. Also, and is a heavily debated subject, is a server or toggle for OWPvP. It may seem like a different subject but it makes sense to me that if there were an option like that people may not care as much about any CS P2W routes and would still make playing a possibility. I know it is for me.
In a PVP centric game ( this includes all korean MMOs published in the west ) not so much.
Knowingly or not knowingly, we all play a game for one main reason, to win.
That's the goal of a game of any kind.
MMORPG have the added factor of a roleplay but we still play a roll of some kind of hero or a winner at something.
In my 15 years of MMOs not once have a met someone roleplaying a loser.
And of course where there are winners there are also losers.
In a PVE MMORPG, every player is a winner, losers are the NPCs.
Therefore, not many give a shit if someone bought his dream sword from RMT in a PVE game because that dude isn't competing against me, the mobs are.
In a PVP game however you are in a direct competition with other players and any edge they got on you have to come from player skill in order for you to accept your defeat because nobody likes to lose at something that you payed for and it's supposed to entertain you.
This is why open world PVP is never very popular and should be kept in arenas and on equal footing gear wise (think Guild Wars) or otherwise the idiots that bought their advantage will drive the normal players away in a short period of time.
Open world PVP sounds great to some because it gives a sense of freedom that people lack in real life but it doesnt take long for human nature to take over and turn it into a frustraiting experience for all but few griefers and sociopaths that bought their power from the cash shop.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
If you want a better reply make a much clearer statement or question...
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
BTW, since you know about the monacle, you know EVE as a very welll developed avatar generator and while CCP sells the ability to change their looks it never crosses my mind.
As for the game play itself, more of a naval simulation than anything else, but is far more thsn a speadsheet I assure you.
But we're way off topic and feel free to start a new thread in the EVE forums if you like.
As for the OP, I'd say give it a chance first, just dont be surprised if it doesn't meet all expectations.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Archeage's cash shop started somewhat timid as well before it turned into a full blown money sucking machine.
Also, you needed to come at a stage of enchanting your gear (took a month or two) in order to understand and see for yourself how messed up that silly expensive RNG based mechanic really is.
Or you needed to get serious about crafting to understand the same thing about high tier armor and weapons.
Black Desert has the same game mechanics in place.
What makes you think it will be any different?
Remember, their revenue model is selling shit in the cash shop.
This affects game economy and development in a major way.
The game ends up not being about who is more skilled at gaming or who is willing or able to sink more time in it but who is able and willing to sink more money in it.
No thanks.
EDIT:
PS: If by any chance I'm wrong about this, I'll be first to admit it and apologize to all the fans for pissing in their cereals.... 6 months after launch.
Maybe BDO devs learned something from Archeage who knows.
I'll be here no worries, and I promise I wont rub it in and say "I told you so" if the game turns out Archeage 2.0.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.