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GW2 going into e-sports

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Comments

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775



    Of course MMO PVP will never become a popular eSport.  Small team sizes are essentially mandatory for a successful competitive scene.


    World of Tank and WoW are on the top of e-sports game in terms of popularity and prize money, even if you don't count LoL.

    http://mmos.com/editorials/the-biggest-esports
  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906

    GW2's pvp wasn't popular for two reasons.  Up until recently these things have always been around. 

    1.  The classes were well balanced.  

    2.  Everyone was on equal footing.


    These two things players really don't want to deal with.  Which is why WOW's esports was so popular.

    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • CopperfieldCopperfield Member RarePosts: 654
    Heretique said:
    Can't force eSports on a game.
    yes this..

    esports guildwars 2 lol.. arenanet is trying hard lol

    If it were esports on guildwars 1 i would actually understand it.. but gw2 lol no way
  • APThugAPThug Member RarePosts: 542
    Another big problem with gw2 becoming completely esports viable is all the particle effects and game complexity. If you don't know the capabilities of every class and you watched gw2 pvp, you wouldn't know what the hell was even going on. At least in games like counter strike or halo, you'd have a much better understanding of whats remotely going on.

    Thats why most MMO's don't attempt esports.     

    image
  • azurreiazurrei Member UncommonPosts: 332
    lol...gw2 has been "going into e-sports" for 3 years - and by going I mean going nowhere.  GW2 will NEVER be an e-sport - boring as hell to watch and the numbers on live streams like twitch reflect that.  If it were exciting to watch/fun to play, the community would embrace it - Anet wouldn't need to be trying to force it onto people.
  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    Well I know general consensus is that it wont work but there is a ton of players in the arena's right now.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • bcbullybcbully Member EpicPosts: 11,838
    edited December 2015
    Remember when arena junkies was in its prime? They went through this big thing saying how they were adding GW2 Spvp into the Mix with their WoW arena forums. Within about 3 months the Spvp forums were dead. 
    "We see fundamentals and we ape in"
  • aRtFuLThinGaRtFuLThinG Member UncommonPosts: 1,387
    DMKano said:
    Here's a thought - maybe make an esport game instead of trying to change GW2 into something it's not.
    If I remember right, a friend told me once they were working on something for eSports after GW2 came out. But they pulled it back because they just didn't like the way it was going. If WoW's Arenas can have a following, they figure GW2's PVP can too.
    GW2's pvp are difficult to tell what's going on though unlike WoW.

    WoW (back in those days) the actions are clear cut and anyone who plays the game for some time can watch and know exactly what they are doing. GW2 has too many combo on combo effects.
  • AzureProwerAzurePrower Member UncommonPosts: 1,550
  • flizzerflizzer Member RarePosts: 2,454
    Still have a hard time calling these people athletes.
  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter Member UncommonPosts: 3,066
    This isn't going to end well for anybody. I just don't see any MMO which has to balance classes around PvP and PvE ever being suitable for e-sports. One side is always going to suffer. The only way to do it would be to build the game and balance classes solely for PvP, then design all the PvE content around that balance. 

    I've seen way too many fun classes and abilities get rendered useless in PvE for the sake of PvP balance, with Blizzard being the #1 offender in this category ever since they released arenas for WoW. Bioware is close behind. 
    Maybe that is why Arenanet has been splitting skills and traits for PvP/PvE since GW1.

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter Member UncommonPosts: 3,066
    Thupli said:
    No particle effect slider = poor watching conditions
    They have been reducing particle effects though.

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter Member UncommonPosts: 3,066
    Luiden said:
    Isn't GW2 a P2W game?  Don't they have a cash shop?  How can you do esports with that?
    What do you buy in the cash shop that affects sPvP?
    Skins?

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • ScorchienScorchien Member LegendaryPosts: 8,914
    lmao.. this cant end well, possibly the worst pvp on the internet
  • Jonnyp2Jonnyp2 Member UncommonPosts: 243
    DMKano said:
    Here's a thought - maybe make an esport game instead of trying to change GW2 into something it's not.
    If I remember right, a friend told me once they were working on something for eSports after GW2 came out. But they pulled it back because they just didn't like the way it was going. If WoW's Arenas can have a following, they figure GW2's PVP can too.
    GW2's pvp are difficult to tell what's going on though unlike WoW.

    WoW (back in those days) the actions are clear cut and anyone who plays the game for some time can watch and know exactly what they are doing. GW2 has too many combo on combo effects.
    The thing is, WoW arena was (and still is) significantly more populated than GW2 spvp.  It's also more competitive...mostly due to the larger player pool.  GW2 lost almost every top spvp team that was active at its launch, WoW arena kept most of the same top players (who continued to improve) over a couple of expansions.  

    Despite all this, wow still got dropped after a couple years at mlgs.  Now the only tournaments are a few random player run things and Blizzcon.  I just can't see GW2 succeeding with less skilled players and a smaller population.  Maybe throwing more money at it will be a solution?  I mean I'd be tempted to put some effort back into the game if the prize pools were large enough and I could find a few interested players considering how weak the competition would be. 
  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,384
    this was a bad decision.

    there is a reason WoW developers also regret Arena.

    And now we see the effects in GW2 now as well.

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,384
    DMKano said:
    Here's a thought - maybe make an esport game instead of trying to change GW2 into something it's not.
    If I remember right, a friend told me once they were working on something for eSports after GW2 came out. But they pulled it back because they just didn't like the way it was going. If WoW's Arenas can have a following, they figure GW2's PVP can too.
    WoW's Arenas were a disaster, that was only held up by WoW's popularity.
    There is a reason this feature has never worked in a MMO outside of WoW.

    Even WoW's own developers have pointed this out.

    GW2 made  huge mistake that will cost them. Arenas cant be balanced in class based MMOs.
    And with a PvP system like GW2 has, there is no benefit for solo queue, or a solo queue friendly mode like WoW's original Battlegrounds instanced PvP.

    All instanced PvP in GW2 are basically Arenas. Small Scale PvP, which is impossible to balance in a class based MMO without gutting class uniqueness as WoW started to do.

    Also GW2's PvP population wasnt good to began with compared to WoW's Battleground Population before the intro of Arenas in TBC.

    huge bad game design decision on Arena Net's part.

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,384
    filmoret said:

    GW2's pvp wasn't popular for two reasons.  Up until recently these things have always been around. 

    1.  The classes were well balanced.  

    2.  Everyone was on equal footing.


    These two things players really don't want to deal with.  Which is why WOW's esports was so popular.

    What? you joking right?
    DD Ele?
    burst Mesmer
    Shoutbow War
    Med Guardian
    Turret Engi

    all that pre-HoT btw and now we set of meta specs in HoT.

    you say thats balance?

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441
    ,
    I am not sure that this is the best decision for GW2. It certainly would need some new type of maps for it to work. I kinda think the first GW would have been better for E-sports.

    Of course with the right map and enough balancing they could make it, but it would take a lot of work that Anet could put into WvW and PvE instead.
  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    filmoret said:

    GW2's pvp wasn't popular for two reasons.  Up until recently these things have always been around. 

    1.  The classes were well balanced.  

    2.  Everyone was on equal footing.


    These two things players really don't want to deal with.  Which is why WOW's esports was so popular.

    What? you joking right?
    DD Ele?
    burst Mesmer
    Shoutbow War
    Med Guardian
    Turret Engi

    all that pre-HoT btw and now we set of meta specs in HoT.

    you say thats balance?
    You listed 5 out of 8 classes and you are saying its imbalanced?  If every class is op then its balanced.  DOH
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    Well they are offering 200,000$ to the winner of the tournament.  This has success written all over it.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter Member UncommonPosts: 3,066
    edited December 2015
    filmoret said:
    Well they are offering 200,000$ to the winner of the tournament.  This has success written all over it.
    At least in attracting competitive players.
    I'm still not sure if it is a format that is fun for the viewers.

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    filmoret said:
    Well they are offering 200,000$ to the winner of the tournament.  This has success written all over it.
    At least in attracting competitive players.
    I'm still not sure if it is a format that is fun for the viewers.

    They got about 5k viewers on twitch during todays games.  You know this might be the future of gaming esports with financial rewards.  If ESO can afford to randomly give away 1 million imagine if they had tournaments with that kind of reward for winners.  Heck look at how many people play bingo in hopes of winning the jackpot.  I do believe if a company does what LOL did and made it very rewarding to win then you will see a lot more players involved with things of such nature.  It could even reach guild arena battles where you pay money to enter and fight against other guilds for jackpot.  Yea this could easily make it huge in our market and I think LOL did it to be honest.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • EQBallzzEQBallzz Member UncommonPosts: 229
    Realm v realm esport , definitely going to be popular. Who will win this one johhny, zerg from realm x has 80 players, oh but wait, it looks like zerg from realm y has , yes they have 150 players zerg x has got thier hands full, stay tuned folks this ones going to be intense
    lol. I thought something similar when I read this. I can't think of a more boring esport to watch. GW2 PVP was boring to play so I can't imagine why anyone would watch it. Oh look how well he dodged that non-descript ground AE and then used his non-descript self heal and utility! Oh look how his opponent countered with his own non-descript dodge and non-descript self heal and utility! So exciting!
  • YashaXYashaX Member EpicPosts: 3,098
    EQBallzz said:
    Realm v realm esport , definitely going to be popular. Who will win this one johhny, zerg from realm x has 80 players, oh but wait, it looks like zerg from realm y has , yes they have 150 players zerg x has got thier hands full, stay tuned folks this ones going to be intense
    lol. I thought something similar when I read this. I can't think of a more boring esport to watch. GW2 PVP was boring to play so I can't imagine why anyone would watch it. Oh look how well he dodged that non-descript ground AE and then used his non-descript self heal and utility! Oh look how his opponent countered with his own non-descript dodge and non-descript self heal and utility! So exciting!
    One or both of you seem to have totally misunderstood what part of GW2's pvp is being pushed as an esport.
    ....
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