Originally posted by Hokie I dont know Suzie I dont think waxmask is being callous.Jeremys statements actually came off as very dickish to me. He even says hes going to make it personal (well just a little personal) to others in the industry, or for that matter to anyone in any high-stress job, who've stepped down because of health reasons, or personal and or family issues, and then more or less calls them "pussys" for stepping down for those reasons.And then he goes and does what I feel like is scoreboarding his tragedies. I truly am happy he is a cancer survivor and Im sorry for his losses. Im one of these people who doesnt have any real animosity or ill will towards others.But he comes off as very condescending and unsympathetic to others who have had to step down for whatever reasons. Which Im sure more than some are legitimate "Ive forgot I had a family because my life became about nothing but work." I know because Ive seen it happen to someone close.So in retrospect I suggest you reread what you quote-boxed and see if maybe what waxmask said isnt meant to be callous, but maybe more inline with the image that Jeremy presented himself as. As some who has to justify and validate his leaving. Maybe Im being overly sensitive I dont know. But Ive seen firsthand that sometimes people realize too late that family is the most important thing. And I think some people here are smart enough to know what that means, and I dont need to scoreboard. So really in retro-spec, fuck that guy.
It is hypocritical to criticize him for past comments and then making exactly same comments about him.
While one can agree that his previous comments on other executive step downs are unkind or even ill will, saying "in retro-spec, fuck that guy" or "Still sounds alot like "Take tha moneh and run!" is equally ill will.
There is a lesson to be learned for Jeremy Gaffney and the posters here - do not judge others when you do not know how it is to be in their shoes. And the truth is, you do not know the truth so one should be very careful with their judgements.
Originally posted by BlackWatch TBH, Good luck to the man. i wish him good health and good luck in whatever he wishes to do.I'm not a fanboy, but in all fairness... internet anonymity isn't an excuse to be heartless asshats.
Just got my head around asses wearing hats, now i gota factor in they don't have hearts..
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
While his health is obviously more important than any pixels on a screen, the message seems to gloss over any real reason as to why he left and just gives a partial reason - no doubt as his words are well managed by the company behind him - so he will say the company is great even if he doesnt think it is,
It is a dark partial reason for leaving but it doesnt give actually any greater insight than the standard "its for my family" that other "big names in the industry" give
Originally posted by waxmask You can give any reason. Even excusing beforehand for the comming cliche. Still sounds alot like "Take tha moneh and run!"
It's astonishing someone would even think, let alone say, such a thing. After your first close call health-wise (and it'll happen sooner or later), you'll rethink that callousness.
As a cancer survivor myself, all I can say is, "Godspeed, Mr. Gaffney. Congrats on taking time for what truly matters in this life."
The majority of the human race are just not good people when you combine anonymity + Keyboard = internet badguy/girl. To avoid negative trolls with malicious comment's it might be best to frequent a cancer type forum with more likeminded folks. My 5 Canadian cents.
"The King and the Pawn return to the same box at the end of the game"
While his health is obviously more important than any pixels on a screen, the message seems to gloss over any real reason as to why he left and just gives a partial reason - no doubt as his words are well managed by the company behind him - so he will say the company is great even if he doesnt think it is,
It is a dark partial reason for leaving but it doesnt give actually any greater insight than the standard "its for my family" that other "big names in the industry" give
Did you not read the article or the post linked? Him and his wife had 6 deaths in their family in 2013; that's insanely depressing as it. He also had skin cancer that was not benign and had to go through surgery to get it removed. During this entire time he put the work on Wildstar above everything else and helped push the game through to launch. He's not leaving the company, so he wasn't fired. He's changing his position so that the work is lighter and the stress is far less (which is definitely good and usually recommended by doctors after surgery for cancer).
The comment towards others in the Industry that give the excuse "focusing on family" is a blanket term that others have used in the past without any explanation at all. They don't go into detail and just leave it at that without saying it's medical, without saying it's anything... and yes, it's usually because they got fired (thus they can now focus all their time with their families). They also leave their company entirely, which cements that they were fired. This is not the case for Mr. Gaffney, who's still going to be working on Wildstar with Carbine, just in a less major role.
Conspiracy theorists and anonymous internet trolls be damned to hell for saying that this guy is covering up, didn't have cancer, and was fired by NCSoft. You trolls are so full of bullshit that they can smell it on the International Spacestation.
Originally posted by waxmask You can give any reason. Even excusing beforehand for the comming cliche. Still sounds alot like "Take tha moneh and run!"
It's astonishing someone would even think, let alone say, such a thing. After your first close call health-wise (and it'll happen sooner or later), you'll rethink that callousness.
As a cancer survivor myself, all I can say is, "Godspeed, Mr. Gaffney. Congrats on taking time for what truly matters in this life."
could'nt agree more cancer is an awful thing to have or people you know who have it hopefully we are closer to a cure.
I hope Jeremy can finally get some rest AND this is why we just don't see studios attempting to launch games with as much to them as WildStar. They're too difficult to update without breaking a hundred other systems, they're too expensive and they make good people sacrifice their own physical health to meet deadlines.
I also had surgery to remove cancer and I am 3 years cancer free. It does change how you look at life. I hope he enjoys spending time with people that matter to him.
While his health is obviously more important than any pixels on a screen, the message seems to gloss over any real reason as to why he left and just gives a partial reason - no doubt as his words are well managed by the company behind him - so he will say the company is great even if he doesnt think it is,
It is a dark partial reason for leaving but it doesnt give actually any greater insight than the standard "its for my family" that other "big names in the industry" give
Did you not read the article or the post linked? Him and his wife had 6 deaths in their family in 2013; that's insanely depressing as it. He also had skin cancer that was not benign and had to go through surgery to get it removed. During this entire time he put the work on Wildstar above everything else and helped push the game through to launch. He's not leaving the company, so he wasn't fired. He's changing his position so that the work is lighter and the stress is far less (which is definitely good and usually recommended by doctors after surgery for cancer).
The comment towards others in the Industry that give the excuse "focusing on family" is a blanket term that others have used in the past without any explanation at all. They don't go into detail and just leave it at that without saying it's medical, without saying it's anything... and yes, it's usually because they got fired (thus they can now focus all their time with their families). They also leave their company entirely, which cements that they were fired. This is not the case for Mr. Gaffney, who's still going to be working on Wildstar with Carbine, just in a less major role.
Conspiracy theorists and anonymous internet trolls be damned to hell for saying that this guy is covering up, didn't have cancer, and was fired by NCSoft. You trolls are so full of bullshit that they can smell it on the International Spacestation.
He stated quite clearly that focusing on family is only part of the reason why he is stepping down and gave no reasons other than familial. There IS more to the story, but he is not saying as there are usually Gag clauses in their contracts to cover this sort of thing.
Both Ubisoft and Blizzard lost devs to Cancer (RIP), i dont know if they went through the same situation of ignoring their own health in order to push the product they worked on. But at the end, unfortunately, they lost the battle.
As a 2 times Cancer survivor myself, i wish Gaffney all the best and hope he doesnt ignore his health again for pushing any product out there. However, i also believe the performance of Wildstar was the main reason for him stepping down. Of course his personal situation is part of it, it would be for anyone on his same shoes, but he waited 9 months to make that call... its like WS was more important at that moment. It didnt do very well so he changed priorities.
Going back to my first part of the comment... Their own health should be more important, always. They are not tools, they are the ones making the games we will purchase and play.
Wow..he really did dodge the bullet. The sacrifices people have to make in MMO industry. He is a lucky guy really. Good luck and hope you stay Cancer free in future.
I recently lost a family member to it so i know what a struggle it can be to even get out of bed ever single day.
Take care, good luck. Thanks for all of your work even though Im currently not subbed anymore.
But jeez man, don't ignore that stuff. This video game will die anyways in X amount of years because WE will move on. You have your life which is way more important and will stick around longer. Focus on that!
And I like your no BS policy. Just wish I could devote more time to end game wildstar...wish there were more solo DIFFICULT instanced combat for us, aside form drusera stuff. Not enough for me to spend 15 dollars on.
People think of skin cancer and they think, meh, it's cureable, I'll deal with it later. Well, like all cancers, it spreads to other systems in the body if left unchecked. Eventually it can affect parts of the body that are totally untreatable or have a high mortality rate. People die of skin cancer every day. The sad part is, it is the most treatable form of cancer if caught early on.
My dad has skin cancer. He's not cured. He gets lesions removed and skin grafts, yeah, think about that, that little mole that is only the size of a small pea requires the removal of about 2 inches all around it. Skin then has to be grafted over that so that it can heal. That skin comes from another part of your body. And that area can be up to 12 inches removed. Picture multiple lesions needing said removal? Get the picture. The longer you wait, the worse the scenario gets. Eventually the cancer affects other systems as well and is no longer just skin cancer, it becomes other forms of cancer which are less treatable and cureable if they also have had time to travel about the body.
Skin cancer is no joke. People underestimate how deadly it can be because it is the most cureable form of cancer... yeah you can cut it out, you can't remove your lymphatic system or your pancreas, or your liver, etc.
I wish Jeremy all the best in his decision to "pursue other challenges and opportunities". Hopefully his "9-month wake-up call" will prevent him from taking such reckless risks with his life in the future. My sister was not feeling well for quite some time, but she delayed seeking medical attention for ages because she was too busy. She was diagnosed with lymphatic cancer 2 months ago. Two weeks after the diagnosis was delivered she was dead.
I can't help but wonder though, how would this announcement have been phrased if Wildstar had been a runaway success ? Would it still have been a "stepping down", or would it have been a promotion ? We will never know.
If there are any significant changes to WIldstar's monetization scheme in the near future, that will be pure coincidence I suppose...
Someone that puts off having his cancer treated for 9 months because "work demands it" speaks to me that he probably was not a real pleasant boss to have either. If he can't take care of his own body's needs - then I find it difficult to believe he kept his own employees in the highest of regards either - not to mention what this says about how important his family is to him.
The man's priorities were certainly not in the right order - that much is for sure.
I agree that he was pressured to leave and is just using the cancer / family issue as a soft pillow to make it seem "not as bad."
My own uncle recently had this same "mindset" - that work was ultra-important. My grandma lay in the hospital, unsure if she would wake back up and he went back to work the next day. He's the plant manager where he works - when the owner of the company came in the next day, he asked my uncle what in the world he was doing at work. I don't know what the owner actually said to him but it was basically, "you're not that important - go spend time with your family."
Game launch or not, the president of the company is not so involved in the day to day operations that they can't afford to go have their skin cancer taken care of. After all - dead presidents make no decisions. Dead presidents also make terrible fathers too.
WS declining revenue performance and disappointing results no doubt factored into his departure.
This has been seen in many other MMOs: post launch decline prompts the studio/publisher to change leadership, layoff employees, and alter the direction/vision of the game. Promises that were made are reevaluated, the business model likely changes to cash shop f2p enticement model, and timelines are adjusted. Infrastructure is realigned (server consolidation), support staff is outsourced or greatly reduced, costs are reduced, and areas of the game that offer the biggest bang per dollar invested are prioritized.
Those who believed WS would somehow be different were being optimistic. Those who played the WS closed and open betas and still believed that WS would somehow be different were deluding themselves, as all of Wildstar's current woes were accurately predicted to occur with near certainty.
In the near term we can expect several things:
The game will be made more casual friendly. This can be done in subtle ways but it is inevitable. Moaning from the dwindling WS hardcore player contingent is and always was irrelevant
Servers will merge. Like WOW, they won't actually use the word "merge" since that has bad PR stigma, but it will happen via connected servers, megaserver, or whatever term they end up using.
In the long term aka 12+ months, the game will go F2P.
Is it weird that I never know who any of these people are when it comes to this kind of thing. In the last week or so a lot of names have come up and people always seem to know what they had for lunch + every job they've ever had. It's always news to me that they had names at all :P
With that said... health is always more important than work. Regardless of why he left I hope things turn out well for him....whoever he is :P
Comments
"All we have to choose is how we spend the time we have"
I wish you and your family all the best.
Once again we see the most ruthless MMO publisher in action.
Closing Tabula Rasa after just few months and firing Garriot in the process, without giving him the chance to turn things around.
Then they shut City of Heroes uncerimoniously, though it wasn't as popular as it used to be, it had a strong core fanbase.
Now this.
NCSoft doesn't take failure gracefully, that's for sure.
TBH, Good luck to the man. i wish him good health and good luck in whatever he wishes to do.
I'm not a fanboy, but in all fairness... internet anonymity isn't an excuse to be heartless asshats.
It is hypocritical to criticize him for past comments and then making exactly same comments about him.
While one can agree that his previous comments on other executive step downs are unkind or even ill will, saying "in retro-spec, fuck that guy" or "Still sounds alot like "Take tha moneh and run!" is equally ill will.
There is a lesson to be learned for Jeremy Gaffney and the posters here - do not judge others when you do not know how it is to be in their shoes. And the truth is, you do not know the truth so one should be very careful with their judgements.
Just got my head around asses wearing hats, now i gota factor in they don't have hearts..
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
While his health is obviously more important than any pixels on a screen, the message seems to gloss over any real reason as to why he left and just gives a partial reason - no doubt as his words are well managed by the company behind him - so he will say the company is great even if he doesnt think it is,
It is a dark partial reason for leaving but it doesnt give actually any greater insight than the standard "its for my family" that other "big names in the industry" give
Doesn't bode well for Wildstar.
First developer leaking that their monthly updates were a scam and now Gaffney stepping down for personal reasons.
Good news is that Blade and Soul might be getting more real.
The majority of the human race are just not good people when you combine anonymity + Keyboard = internet badguy/girl. To avoid negative trolls with malicious comment's it might be best to frequent a cancer type forum with more likeminded folks. My 5 Canadian cents.
Did you not read the article or the post linked? Him and his wife had 6 deaths in their family in 2013; that's insanely depressing as it. He also had skin cancer that was not benign and had to go through surgery to get it removed. During this entire time he put the work on Wildstar above everything else and helped push the game through to launch. He's not leaving the company, so he wasn't fired. He's changing his position so that the work is lighter and the stress is far less (which is definitely good and usually recommended by doctors after surgery for cancer).
The comment towards others in the Industry that give the excuse "focusing on family" is a blanket term that others have used in the past without any explanation at all. They don't go into detail and just leave it at that without saying it's medical, without saying it's anything... and yes, it's usually because they got fired (thus they can now focus all their time with their families). They also leave their company entirely, which cements that they were fired. This is not the case for Mr. Gaffney, who's still going to be working on Wildstar with Carbine, just in a less major role.
Conspiracy theorists and anonymous internet trolls be damned to hell for saying that this guy is covering up, didn't have cancer, and was fired by NCSoft. You trolls are so full of bullshit that they can smell it on the International Spacestation.
could'nt agree more cancer is an awful thing to have or people you know who have it hopefully we are closer to a cure.
The comedian?
He stated quite clearly that focusing on family is only part of the reason why he is stepping down and gave no reasons other than familial. There IS more to the story, but he is not saying as there are usually Gag clauses in their contracts to cover this sort of thing.
Both Ubisoft and Blizzard lost devs to Cancer (RIP), i dont know if they went through the same situation of ignoring their own health in order to push the product they worked on. But at the end, unfortunately, they lost the battle.
As a 2 times Cancer survivor myself, i wish Gaffney all the best and hope he doesnt ignore his health again for pushing any product out there. However, i also believe the performance of Wildstar was the main reason for him stepping down. Of course his personal situation is part of it, it would be for anyone on his same shoes, but he waited 9 months to make that call... its like WS was more important at that moment. It didnt do very well so he changed priorities.
Going back to my first part of the comment... Their own health should be more important, always. They are not tools, they are the ones making the games we will purchase and play.
Wow..he really did dodge the bullet. The sacrifices people have to make in MMO industry. He is a lucky guy really. Good luck and hope you stay Cancer free in future.
I recently lost a family member to it so i know what a struggle it can be to even get out of bed ever single day.
Take care, good luck. Thanks for all of your work even though Im currently not subbed anymore.
But jeez man, don't ignore that stuff. This video game will die anyways in X amount of years because WE will move on. You have your life which is way more important and will stick around longer. Focus on that!
And I like your no BS policy. Just wish I could devote more time to end game wildstar...wish there were more solo DIFFICULT instanced combat for us, aside form drusera stuff. Not enough for me to spend 15 dollars on.
Good luck!
People think of skin cancer and they think, meh, it's cureable, I'll deal with it later. Well, like all cancers, it spreads to other systems in the body if left unchecked. Eventually it can affect parts of the body that are totally untreatable or have a high mortality rate. People die of skin cancer every day. The sad part is, it is the most treatable form of cancer if caught early on.
My dad has skin cancer. He's not cured. He gets lesions removed and skin grafts, yeah, think about that, that little mole that is only the size of a small pea requires the removal of about 2 inches all around it. Skin then has to be grafted over that so that it can heal. That skin comes from another part of your body. And that area can be up to 12 inches removed. Picture multiple lesions needing said removal? Get the picture. The longer you wait, the worse the scenario gets. Eventually the cancer affects other systems as well and is no longer just skin cancer, it becomes other forms of cancer which are less treatable and cureable if they also have had time to travel about the body.
Skin cancer is no joke. People underestimate how deadly it can be because it is the most cureable form of cancer... yeah you can cut it out, you can't remove your lymphatic system or your pancreas, or your liver, etc.
I really do wish Gaf the best ! You helped build on hell of a game man ! I'm sure you'll be missed in a lot ways there at Carbine .
Good news ! He beat it and is doing better !
Bad news. WildStar isn't .
I wish Jeremy all the best in his decision to "pursue other challenges and opportunities". Hopefully his "9-month wake-up call" will prevent him from taking such reckless risks with his life in the future. My sister was not feeling well for quite some time, but she delayed seeking medical attention for ages because she was too busy. She was diagnosed with lymphatic cancer 2 months ago. Two weeks after the diagnosis was delivered she was dead.
I can't help but wonder though, how would this announcement have been phrased if Wildstar had been a runaway success ? Would it still have been a "stepping down", or would it have been a promotion ? We will never know.
If there are any significant changes to WIldstar's monetization scheme in the near future, that will be pure coincidence I suppose...
Someone that puts off having his cancer treated for 9 months because "work demands it" speaks to me that he probably was not a real pleasant boss to have either. If he can't take care of his own body's needs - then I find it difficult to believe he kept his own employees in the highest of regards either - not to mention what this says about how important his family is to him.
The man's priorities were certainly not in the right order - that much is for sure.
I agree that he was pressured to leave and is just using the cancer / family issue as a soft pillow to make it seem "not as bad."
My own uncle recently had this same "mindset" - that work was ultra-important. My grandma lay in the hospital, unsure if she would wake back up and he went back to work the next day. He's the plant manager where he works - when the owner of the company came in the next day, he asked my uncle what in the world he was doing at work. I don't know what the owner actually said to him but it was basically, "you're not that important - go spend time with your family."
Game launch or not, the president of the company is not so involved in the day to day operations that they can't afford to go have their skin cancer taken care of. After all - dead presidents make no decisions. Dead presidents also make terrible fathers too.
WS declining revenue performance and disappointing results no doubt factored into his departure.
This has been seen in many other MMOs: post launch decline prompts the studio/publisher to change leadership, layoff employees, and alter the direction/vision of the game. Promises that were made are reevaluated, the business model likely changes to cash shop f2p enticement model, and timelines are adjusted. Infrastructure is realigned (server consolidation), support staff is outsourced or greatly reduced, costs are reduced, and areas of the game that offer the biggest bang per dollar invested are prioritized.
Those who believed WS would somehow be different were being optimistic. Those who played the WS closed and open betas and still believed that WS would somehow be different were deluding themselves, as all of Wildstar's current woes were accurately predicted to occur with near certainty.
In the near term we can expect several things:
The game will be made more casual friendly. This can be done in subtle ways but it is inevitable. Moaning from the dwindling WS hardcore player contingent is and always was irrelevant
Servers will merge. Like WOW, they won't actually use the word "merge" since that has bad PR stigma, but it will happen via connected servers, megaserver, or whatever term they end up using.
In the long term aka 12+ months, the game will go F2P.
Is it weird that I never know who any of these people are when it comes to this kind of thing. In the last week or so a lot of names have come up and people always seem to know what they had for lunch + every job they've ever had. It's always news to me that they had names at all :P
With that said... health is always more important than work. Regardless of why he left I hope things turn out well for him....whoever he is :P