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Why it takes so long to translate a game ?

LobotomistLobotomist ZagrebPosts: 5,052Member Uncommon

Can someone seriously explain me, why is it taking so long ?

 

They say they are westernizing the game. What does it even mean, beyond translating ?

Is the game played with chopsticks instead of mouse, and you are reviving monsters instead of killing them, and quests are done reverse where you give quest and NPC does the quest ?

I mean what. Is it not the same game ? Can we not play the same game as Koreans ?

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Comments

  • DMKanoDMKano Gamercentral, AKPosts: 8,530Member Uncommon

     

    This has been answered probably 50 times by Trion at this point on twitch streams.

     

    Korean language structure is very different than English/German/French and in fact *most languages* - because it's considered an *isolate* language.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_language

    "Most historical linguists classify Korean as an isolate—a language with no known relationship to any other languages."

    So to make everything in game make *sense* to a westerner - especially from a conceptual/logical standpoint new unique words had to be introduced.

    ArcheAge being so heavy on crafting/gathering components - that part of the game had to be made *consistent* for the western gamer - so if something was called "ash wood" in one part - it was ALWAYS referred to *ash wood* for every instance where that component was actually used.

    This wasn't the case in Korean version where the same item had different terms based on context - it would confuse the westerners greatly why the same crafting component would have different names in different recipes.

    1. The first part was getting it all translated into a coherent and consistent way - to English

    2. Once the English version was complete (which took 80% of the time) it was then translated from English to German and French

     

    I am assuming that's what your question was asking, however if your question was "why is it taking SO LONG for ArcheAge to launch in US/EU" - there is a ton of additional work besides translation - like standing up new infrastructure to support ArcheAge, training Customer Service on how to GM the game, use AA specific tools, develop patch automation, database auditing and backup tools, analytics and metrics tools, integration with Trion's account and billing systems  etc.... - and the hardest piece - integration with Trion's store/platform.

    All the while for every change Trion had to get back to XL, XL had to agree and then code the changes, test them - send them back to Trion for patching, then Trion had to test and confirm - then patch the US/EU servers - yeah that process is going to be a lot slower than when a dev can change/patch the game on the spot.

     

     

     

     

  • NitthNitth AustraliaPosts: 3,684Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Lobotomist
    Can someone seriously explain me, why is it taking so long ?

     

    They say they are westernizing the game. What does it even mean, beyond translating ?

    Is the game played with chopsticks instead of mouse, and you are reviving monsters instead of killing them, and quests are done reverse where you give quest and NPC does the quest ?

    I mean what. Is it not the same game ? Can we not play the same game as Koreans ?


    "Westerners" do not like foreign culture apparently. Thus, these things apparently need to be removed from the game.

    image
    TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  • LobotomistLobotomist ZagrebPosts: 5,052Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DMKano

     

    This has been answered probably 50 times by Trion at this point on twitch streams.

     

    Korean language structure is very different than English/German/French and in fact *most languages* - because it's considered an *isolate* language.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_language

    Boulderdash

    Translating any human language takes aproximately same time. Except if its poetry. And I never heard Archeage was written in verse :D

    A company , that is allready MMO company with all the infrastucture needed. IT staff that knows all about servers, billing staff that knows all about billing and support staff that knows how to talk with MMO customers.

    Its not like they are building MMO company from scratch.

     

    Now if for them the conversion takes almost same time as coding a new MMO (Defiance) , than i can tell you something is very fishy.

     

    image

  • BigdaddyxBigdaddyx California, WAPosts: 1,985Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lobotomist
    Originally posted by DMKano

     

    This has been answered probably 50 times by Trion at this point on twitch streams.

     

    Korean language structure is very different than English/German/French and in fact *most languages* - because it's considered an *isolate* language.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_language

    "Most historical linguists classify Korean as an isolate—a language with no known relationship to any other languages."

    So to make everything in game make *sense* to a westerner - especially from a conceptual/logical standpoint new unique words had to be introduced.

    ArcheAge being so heavy on crafting/gathering components - that part of the game had to be made *consistent* for the western gamer - so if something was called "ash wood" in one part - it was ALWAYS referred to *ash wood* for every instance where that component was actually used.

    This wasn't the case in Korean version where the same item had different terms based on context - it would confuse the westerners greatly why the same crafting component would have different names in different recipes.

    1. The first part was getting it all translated into a coherent and consistent way - to English

    2. Once the English version was complete (which took 80% of the time) it was then translated from English to German and French

     

    I am assuming that's what your question was asking, however if your question was "why is it taking SO LONG for ArcheAge to launch in US/EU" - there is a ton of additional work besides translation - like standing up new infrastructure to support ArcheAge, training Customer Service on how to GM the game, use AA specific tools, develop patch automation, database auditing and backup tools, analytics and metrics tools, integration with Trion's account and billing systems  etc.... - and the hardest piece - integration with Trion's store/platform.

    All the while for every change Trion had to get back to XL, XL had to agree and then code the changes, test them - send them back to Trion for patching, then Trion had to test and confirm - then patch the US/EU servers - yeah that process is going to be a lot slower than when a dev can change/patch the game on the spot.

     

     

     

     

    Boulderdash

    Translating any human language takes aproximately same time. Except if its poetry. And I never heard Archeage was written in verse :D

    And if a company , that is allready MMO company with all the infrastucture needed. IT staff that knows all about servers, billing staff that knows all about billing and support staff that knows how to talk with MMO customers.

    Its not like they are building MMO company from scratch.

     

    Now if for them the conversion takes almost same time as coding a new MMO (Defiance) , than i can tell you something is very fishy.

     

    Have you translated any of the complex asian languages into English? that also not some small book but an enormous game like Arch Age? if yes i am ready to accept your expert opinion other wise..i can't take you seriously.

  • DMKanoDMKano Gamercentral, AKPosts: 8,530Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lobotomist
    Originally posted by DMKano

     

    This has been answered probably 50 times by Trion at this point on twitch streams.

     

    Korean language structure is very different than English/German/French and in fact *most languages* - because it's considered an *isolate* language.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_language

    "Most historical linguists classify Korean as an isolate—a language with no known relationship to any other languages."

    So to make everything in game make *sense* to a westerner - especially from a conceptual/logical standpoint new unique words had to be introduced.

    ArcheAge being so heavy on crafting/gathering components - that part of the game had to be made *consistent* for the western gamer - so if something was called "ash wood" in one part - it was ALWAYS referred to *ash wood* for every instance where that component was actually used.

    This wasn't the case in Korean version where the same item had different terms based on context - it would confuse the westerners greatly why the same crafting component would have different names in different recipes.

    1. The first part was getting it all translated into a coherent and consistent way - to English

    2. Once the English version was complete (which took 80% of the time) it was then translated from English to German and French

     

    I am assuming that's what your question was asking, however if your question was "why is it taking SO LONG for ArcheAge to launch in US/EU" - there is a ton of additional work besides translation - like standing up new infrastructure to support ArcheAge, training Customer Service on how to GM the game, use AA specific tools, develop patch automation, database auditing and backup tools, analytics and metrics tools, integration with Trion's account and billing systems  etc.... - and the hardest piece - integration with Trion's store/platform.

    All the while for every change Trion had to get back to XL, XL had to agree and then code the changes, test them - send them back to Trion for patching, then Trion had to test and confirm - then patch the US/EU servers - yeah that process is going to be a lot slower than when a dev can change/patch the game on the spot.

     

     

     

     

    Boulderdash

    Translating any human language takes aproximately same time. Except if its poetry. And I never heard Archeage was written in verse :D

    And if a company , that is allready MMO company with all the infrastucture needed. IT staff that knows all about servers, billing staff that knows all about billing and support staff that knows how to talk with MMO customers.

    Its not like they are building MMO company from scratch.

     

    Now if for them the conversion takes almost same time as coding a new MMO (Defiance) , than i can tell you something is very fishy.

     

     

    Ultimately every person chooses to believe what they want sometimes in spite all the evidence.

    If you believe that ArcheAge should have been translated and running in Trions data centers in 3 months - no amount of facts will change your mind, as you've already come to your own conclusion.

    So when you come here asking a question, you are not looking for the answer - you seem to be only wanting to reinforce your current position - which is "its too damn slow"

     

  • LobotomistLobotomist ZagrebPosts: 5,052Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx
     

    Have you translated any of the complex asian languages into English? that also not some small book but an enormous game like Arch Age? if yes i am ready to accept your expert opinion other wise..i can't take you seriously.

    I actually speak 5 languages. I dont know if you do speak as many. But I kind of know what i am talking about.

     

    Lets say

    If in English its : I am drinking glass of water

    And in Klingon its: Glass of water is held by man drinking is action that places water into his mouth

     

    A person that speaks Klingon knows that means, he also knows english (this is why he is translator) and he can say the equivalent in english. Always and in 100% with almost 0% trouble.

     

    Except if Klingon talk about words not existant in english language like for example Glumbluxonbrunbia which means (loosely translated) : Being angry while kissing your left elbow and eating Nebulan green worm.

    But I think Koreans are from planet earth, so we dont have such problems.

     

     

     

    image

  • BigdaddyxBigdaddyx California, WAPosts: 1,985Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lobotomist
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx
     

    Have you translated any of the complex asian languages into English? that also not some small book but an enormous game like Arch Age? if yes i am ready to accept your expert opinion other wise..i can't take you seriously.

    I actually speak 5 languages. I dont know if you do speak as many. But I kind of know what i am talking about.

     

    Lets say

    If in English its : I am drinking glass of water

    And in Klingon its: Glass of water is held by man drinking is action that places water into his mouth

     

    A person that speaks Klingon knows that means, he also knows english (this is why he is translator) and he can say the equivalent in english. Always and in 100% with almost 0% trouble.

     

    Except if Klingon talk about words not existant in english language like for example Glumbluxonbrunbia which means (loosely translated) : Being angry while kissing your left elbow and eating Nebulan green worm.

    But I think Koreans are from planet earth, so we dont have such problems.

     

     

     

    I speak manadarin, japanese thanks to my mom and dad. I was born in France and later moved to US so i also speak french and english. I have little experience with Korean but i can assure you that out of all these mandarin and korean are the most complex languages.

    And did you just give an example of klingon?

    I don't know if you are pulling my leg right now or being serious.

    So like i said earlier since you have no first hand experience with the language so i am going to dis regard what you said.

  • cheyanecheyane Rome Posts: 3,002Member Uncommon
    Do you know what they need ? Korean drama translators. I watch a lot of Korean drama and if a popular drama comes out at 2 pm today by about 12 midnight 95 % of the drama is translated in sites like Viki by volunteers. The language is indeed complex and although thanks to my avid Korean drama watching I can understand some words I still find some of their expressions very difficult to grasp.

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  • HystericHysteric Louisville, KYPosts: 35Member Uncommon

    Holy crap, did he just give you an example of Klingon in his argument?  Haha, wow lost all respect for your argument with that.

     

  • LobotomistLobotomist ZagrebPosts: 5,052Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx
    Originally posted by Lobotomist
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx
     

    Have you translated any of the complex asian languages into English? that also not some small book but an enormous game like Arch Age? if yes i am ready to accept your expert opinion other wise..i can't take you seriously.

    I actually speak 5 languages. I dont know if you do speak as many. But I kind of know what i am talking about.

     

    Lets say

    If in English its : I am drinking glass of water

    And in Klingon its: Glass of water is held by man drinking is action that places water into his mouth

     

    A person that speaks Klingon knows that means, he also knows english (this is why he is translator) and he can say the equivalent in english. Always and in 100% with almost 0% trouble.

     

    Except if Klingon talk about words not existant in english language like for example Glumbluxonbrunbia which means (loosely translated) : Being angry while kissing your left elbow and eating Nebulan green worm.

    But I think Koreans are from planet earth, so we dont have such problems.

     

     

     

    I speak manadarin, japanese thanks to my mom and dad. I was born in France and later moved to US so i also speak french and english. I have little experience with Korean but i can assure you that out of all these mandarin and korean are the most complex languages.

    And did you just give an example of klingon?

    I don't know if you are pulling my leg right now or being serious.

    So like i said earlier since you have no first hand experience with the language so i am going to dis regard what you said.

    So you are good reference.

    A word illustrating this idea: The dog is red

    How more complex (measured in seconds) would be to translate this from french to english , opposed from mandarin to english?

    You can time yourself.

     

     

    And yes.

    It was mistake to use ironical reference to Klingon.

    I thought that illustrating impossible language as to reference to something incredibly difficult to translate will be whimsical if language is also fictional.

    But I know that irony is lost on internet forum goers.

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  • ZegalothZegaloth Gladstone, ORPosts: 54Member

    Well I am sure the people who wasted $50+ on the game would be pretty sore if alpha and beta was over in a few months.

    Those packs are a huge incentive for them not to release the game quicker. Not sure if its true, but why give people something for free if you can get $50+ from them instead.

  • LobotomistLobotomist ZagrebPosts: 5,052Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Zegaloth

    Well I am sure the people who wasted $50+ on the game would be pretty sore if alpha and beta was over in a few months.

    Those packs are a huge incentive for them not to release the game quicker. Not sure if its true, but why give people something for free if you can get $50+ from them instead.

    Logic

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  • BigdaddyxBigdaddyx California, WAPosts: 1,985Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lobotomist
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx
    Originally posted by Lobotomist
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx
     

    Have you translated any of the complex asian languages into English? that also not some small book but an enormous game like Arch Age? if yes i am ready to accept your expert opinion other wise..i can't take you seriously.

    I actually speak 5 languages. I dont know if you do speak as many. But I kind of know what i am talking about.

     

    Lets say

    If in English its : I am drinking glass of water

    And in Klingon its: Glass of water is held by man drinking is action that places water into his mouth

     

    A person that speaks Klingon knows that means, he also knows english (this is why he is translator) and he can say the equivalent in english. Always and in 100% with almost 0% trouble.

     

    Except if Klingon talk about words not existant in english language like for example Glumbluxonbrunbia which means (loosely translated) : Being angry while kissing your left elbow and eating Nebulan green worm.

    But I think Koreans are from planet earth, so we dont have such problems.

     

     

     

    I speak manadarin, japanese thanks to my mom and dad. I was born in France and later moved to US so i also speak french and english. I have little experience with Korean but i can assure you that out of all these mandarin and korean are the most complex languages.

    And did you just give an example of klingon?

    I don't know if you are pulling my leg right now or being serious.

    So like i said earlier since you have no first hand experience with the language so i am going to dis regard what you said.

    So you are good reference.

    A word illustrating this idea: The dog is red

    How more complex (measured in seconds) would be to translate this from french to english , opposed from mandarin to english?

    You can time yourself.

     

     

    And yes.

    It was mistake to use ironical reference to Klingon.

    I thought that illustrating impossible language as to reference to something incredibly difficult to translate will be whimsical if language is also fictional.

    But I know that irony is lost on internet forum goers.

    image

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,588Member Uncommon
    Language complexities are involved with learning a language, not translating it. Translators already understand both languages fluently. Complexity isn't an issue, since they should already be able to think conceptually in either, that is, unless the translator isn't really that fluent in one language or the other.
  • BigdaddyxBigdaddyx California, WAPosts: 1,985Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by GeezerGamer
    Language complexities are involved with learning a language, not translating it. Translators already understand both languages fluently. Complexity isn't an issue, since they should already be able to think conceptually in either, that is, unless the translator isn't really that fluent in one language or the other.

    No matter how fluent you are as a translator the task is till enormous to translate every single korean word into english. it is not same as translating say french into english. I know because i have tried learning Korean and even with my knowledge of chinese language it is still hard.

  • SoandsosoSoandsoso Richmond Hill, ONPosts: 533Member
    Originally posted by Lobotomist

    Can someone seriously explain me, why is it taking so long ?

     

    They say they are westernizing the game. What does it even mean, beyond translating ?

    Is the game played with chopsticks instead of mouse, and you are reviving monsters instead of killing them, and quests are done reverse where you give quest and NPC does the quest ?

    I mean what. Is it not the same game ? Can we not play the same game as Koreans ?

    You could learn to read and write Korean if you think that would be quicker for you.

  • GruntyGrunty TexasPosts: 7,058Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lobotomist
    Originally posted by DMKano

     

    This has been answered probably 50 times by Trion at this point on twitch streams.

     

    Korean language structure is very different than English/German/French and in fact *most languages* - because it's considered an *isolate* language.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_language

    Boulderdash

    Translating any human language takes aproximately same time. Except if its poetry. And I never heard Archeage was written in verse :D

    A company , that is allready MMO company with all the infrastucture needed. IT staff that knows all about servers, billing staff that knows all about billing and support staff that knows how to talk with MMO customers.

    Its not like they are building MMO company from scratch.

     

    Now if for them the conversion takes almost same time as coding a new MMO (Defiance) , than i can tell you something is very fishy.

     

    For the same reason you used boulderdash when the word is balderdash.  Most people don't use grammatically correct language all of the time.  Slang does not translate well. Humor can be difficult to translate. Sarcasm is especially difficult and, between some languages, impossible to translate.

    I could name a regular member here who does his own translation from French Canadian to English and he still can't be understood.

  • Loke666Loke666 MalmöPosts: 17,972Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lobotomist

    Can someone seriously explain me, why is it taking so long ?

    They say they are westernizing the game. What does it even mean, beyond translating ?

    Is the game played with chopsticks instead of mouse, and you are reviving monsters instead of killing them, and quests are done reverse where you give quest and NPC does the quest ?

    I mean what. Is it not the same game ? Can we not play the same game as Koreans ?

    Anyone who ever played a Japanese RPG translated through a babelfish know the answer to this question.... Translating is harder then one would think.

    Then again, they aren't exactly rushing things but there is a lot of work, MMOs have loads of text after all.

  • LobotomistLobotomist ZagrebPosts: 5,052Member Uncommon

    Whatever.

    For fanboy they can say it takes them 2 year because the red color is too red in game and they needed to hire color specialist to convert every red color in game into less red.

    And I would have here a fanboy arguing how its very logical and valid.

     

     

    Point is : lame excuse is lame.

    And for whatever reason they are witholding the game, its not because of translation

    image

  • PepeqPepeq Poway, CAPosts: 1,487Member Uncommon

    Why is EQNext taking so long?  Can't be some lame excuse like the game isn't done... they announced the game, it should have been done then.

     

    AA will go live very soon... and yes, the vendors will still talk in Korean for your authentic asian enjoyment.

  • GruntyGrunty TexasPosts: 7,058Member Uncommon

    You were talking about knowing 5 languages. The title sentence is grammatically incorrect and may not be understood by a native English speaker. Without the question mark it is a declaration that you know why it takes a long time to translate. That contradicts the rest of your post.

    With the question mark an English speaker still has to interpret what you mean because you failed to use the word 'does' as the second word. 

    At the minimum, my first sentence in this post is grammatically wrong. 

  • ThaneThane berlinPosts: 2,232Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Hysteric

    Holy crap, did he just give you an example of Klingon in his argument?  Haha, wow lost all respect for your argument with that.

     

    if he actually speaks klingon, that is no reason to lose respect but to gain it.

    uh wait, i need to add a "haha", right`?

     

    haha, lost all respect for you, a nerd that said klingon is uncool, you sire, are OUT of the club!

    "I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  • Mr.KujoMr.Kujo SwinoujsciePosts: 383Member

    Originally posted by Lobotomist

    Can someone seriously explain me, why is it taking so long ?

     

    Many people tired.

     

    Originally posted by DMKano

    Korean language structure is very different than English/German/French and in fact *most languages* - because it's considered an *isolate* language.

    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx

    I have little experience with Korean but i can assure you that out of all these mandarin and korean are the most complex languages.

    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx

    No matter how fluent you are as a translator the task is till enormous to translate every single korean word into english.

    Originally posted by Grunty

    Slang does not translate well. Humor can be difficult to translate. Sarcasm is especially difficult and, between some languages, impossible to translate.

    Originally posted by Loke666

    Anyone who ever played a Japanese RPG translated through a babelfish know the answer to this question.... Translating is harder then one would think.

     

    Tired really hard.

     

    You should rephrase your question from:

    "Can someone seriously explain me, why is it taking so long?", to:

    "Can someone try to explain it to me, so I can disagree because I think I know better? Just for the sake of arguing"

  • KangaroomouseKangaroomouse MonacoPosts: 394Member
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx
    Originally posted by Lobotomist

    Boulderdash

    Translating any human language takes aproximately same time. Except if its poetry. And I never heard Archeage was written in verse :D

    And if a company , that is allready MMO company with all the infrastucture needed. IT staff that knows all about servers, billing staff that knows all about billing and support staff that knows how to talk with MMO customers.

    Its not like they are building MMO company from scratch.

    Now if for them the conversion takes almost same time as coding a new MMO (Defiance) , than i can tell you something is very fishy. 

    Have you translated any of the complex asian languages into English? that also not some small book but an enormous game like Arch Age? if yes i am ready to accept your expert opinion other wise..i can't take you seriously.

    I like to see some credentials that you can actually judge his skills in translating an Asian language on the assumption that if someone has translated something in a specific language he can translate something else if it is of similar complexity.

    Please send a dissertation to my PM.

    If not i can't take him seriously on the account you are taking him seriously... or not... either of you.

  • BigdaddyxBigdaddyx California, WAPosts: 1,985Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Lobotomist

    Whatever.

    For fanboy they can say it takes them 2 year because the red color is too red in game and they needed to hire color specialist to convert every red color in game into less red.

    And I would have here a fanboy arguing how its very logical and valid.

     

     

    Point is : lame excuse is lame.

    And for whatever reason they are witholding the game, its not because of translation

    Oh boy. Here we are finally to calling names. Well i tried. If you had no intention of seeking answer to your question and already knew the answer. Why even bother starting this topic? it is as if you just wanted to argue for the sake of it.

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