It's because the video game side of the house (Consoles, Action Games, Shooters) has all but killed the RPG heritage. I don't see dice-roll based combat coming back any time soon. MMOs are poor substitute for PnP role-playing games (current technology cannot mimic freedom with consequences on the scale of a pen and paper game), and they suck as action games, so they are picking a path and going there.
MMOs will become more and more like action video games, and less like RPGs. That's why I stopped playing MMOs recently, they suck at what they do.
Who says MMOs are supposed to be like pnp rpgs?
I would say they are better at what they do .. becoming better video games. The RPG "heritage" is not what it cracks up to be if people are having fun with action combat.
The only purpose for statbased combat is either compensate for being a shitty player or to gate content. Neither is desirable if you ain't at the bottom and value your time.
Only if you view them as just arcade games where the only thing you are trying to do is show off your "skillz" to your bros. In an RPG stats allow you to play your character and have deep strategic combat. But I have no illusions that people like you won't always be in the majority and devs will cater to you a lot. I just hope actual RPGs don't completely die out because I enjoy them a lot more than FPSes.
lold irl. Deep strategic combat? please, you max your hitcap and follow your shitty BiS guide for max dps. That deep combat. The only requirement is enough time to grind that gear which will compensate for all your failures. This is what pve in mmorpg's has been in at least the last 4 years.
I am curious about the future of action combat and tab-targeting in MMOs. My guess is that a lot of the recently released and currently being developed action MMOs were a direct result of GW2, which was thought by many to be a truly revolutionary game that could be a WoW-killer. That didn't come to pass, and unless I'm mistaken, none of the other action combat MMOs subsequently released have taken the top ranking spots in the West away from tab-target games like WoW, SWTOR and FFXIV. Am I correct in this? If this is the case, will future developers look at the continuing success of tab-target games and go back to this format with new games? I don't think that action combat will go away, but is there room in the future for both styles?
You guys with your wow killers.
No one except maybe some players ever thought GW2 was a wow killer. I don't recall anyone on the guild wars 2 team stating they were making a wow killer. If they did then I'd love to see the quote.
And I believe Tera released prior to GW2. I think Vindictus was released prior to both of them.
"Action combat games" haven't taken top spots because they were "action combat". I suspect there were other more relevant reasons.
Of course there is room for both. For my tastes, I never, ever liked tab targetting, even when I played my first "tab targetting games".
Once I tased vindictus and tera I knew that there was an alternate method of combat that was more to my taste.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
The only purpose for statbased combat is either compensate for being a shitty player or to gate content. Neither is desirable if you ain't at the bottom and value your time.
Only if you view them as just arcade games where the only thing you are trying to do is show off your "skillz" to your bros. In an RPG stats allow you to play your character and have deep strategic combat. But I have no illusions that people like you won't always be in the majority and devs will cater to you a lot. I just hope actual RPGs don't completely die out because I enjoy them a lot more than FPSes.
lold irl. Deep strategic combat? please, you max your hitcap and follow your shitty BiS guide for max dps. That deep combat. The only requirement is enough time to grind that gear which will compensate for all your failures. This is what pve in mmorpg's has been in at least the last 4 years.
You're talking mmos he's talking RPGs in general. I think as combat gets faster the strategic part of it falls behind the player skill and stats do become a mechanic to even the playing field so to speak. Kind of like how world of tanks uses a RNG so skill can only go so far...if the RNG fucks you....you're fucked.
The only purpose for statbased combat is either compensate for being a shitty player or to gate content. Neither is desirable if you ain't at the bottom and value your time.
Only if you view them as just arcade games where the only thing you are trying to do is show off your "skillz" to your bros. In an RPG stats allow you to play your character and have deep strategic combat. But I have no illusions that people like you won't always be in the majority and devs will cater to you a lot. I just hope actual RPGs don't completely die out because I enjoy them a lot more than FPSes.
lold irl. Deep strategic combat? please, you max your hitcap and follow your shitty BiS guide for max dps. That deep combat. The only requirement is enough time to grind that gear which will compensate for all your failures. This is what pve in mmorpg's has been in at least the last 4 years.
This is because MMORPGs have gravitated to the WoW style without doing it as well as WoW combined with the trend of releasing easy end game content.
However, its quite obvious that you have never done a current WoW heroic raid or something like Akylios from Rift because it takes a lot more than getting best in slot and memorizing a priority system (I bet you are one of the people who would call it a rotation)
MMOs as a whole tend top lack challenging group content though.
Even though many action games promise skill-based interesting combat that sucks you into the fight, I personally often just find them extremely spammy and little else. This doesn't just go for MMORPG's either.
For example: I recently bought Batman: Arkham City during the steam summer sale, but found the combat really disappointing (I only like the stealth sections, but the console port is also really bad with the button prompts imo). That's because I can't personally get over the fact that even though Batman might be doing double salto cartwheeling kicks, you're still simply clicking the left & right mouse buttons 90% of the time.
On top of that MMO's are usually visually inferior to that kind of game.
I don't think action combat is wrong, but they need to make it interesting and complex, with abilities that need to be used strategically and have a variety of combo opportunities with each other. Think out of the box and make abilities that do different things if you jump, run or defend against an attack.
Departing from tab targeting also doesn't automatically make things better. Several games that have pretty intense action packed combat still have a type of "lock-on" system similar to tab-targeting that you need to master, such as Dark Souls.
The type of combat an MMO has is directly related to how much or how little realism a developer wants in their product.
At one end of the spectrum you have action combat with aiming and misses and at the other end you have the slower paced tab-targetting. SRPGs take that a step further into turn-based which is still very much alive as the success of Divinity - Oriiginal Sin has shown.
The appeal of the different systems is pretty personal and somewhat related to the gaming "roots" of the player: some people grew up playing and enjoying side-scrollers and FPS where manual dexterity and reaction times are more important and other people favored strategy in their gaming. In the early days almost all RPGs were turn based and it wasn't until Ultima Underworld and ES - Arena that the FPS system came into the RPG world.
In 2014 we're in an age of gaming fusion where the line between FPS and RPG continues to blur and everything seems to require at least a cp-op multiplayer component. MMOs continue to get more FPS-like and the shooters more RPG-like with persistent worlds and many more players simultaneously than ever before... more realism and quick reflexes are taking over the RPG world and FPS games are becoming MMOs (PS2, Defiance, Destiny, The Division, etc.) even if the developers don't want to call them that.
There will probably continue to be a few new tab-targetted MMOs made but IMHO, they will have a narrow, nostalgic, niche appeal. Action combat is here to stay in the mainstream and what we'll be getting will be just slight variations on their implementation (e.g. aim and miss or not?)
Any perceived "backlash" is a forum phenomenom--certainly not reflected by popularity and sales--just like all the other forum movements wanting to return to the "good old days of _____ (insert early MMO where you had a great time here)"
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
If the MMO player base is aging and many think it is, anything that requires a lot of dexterity is out. Old people typically aren't good at twitchy games.
Young people are playing Minecraft or one of the FPS's.
If the MMO player base is aging and many think it is, anything that requires a lot of dexterity is out. Old people typically aren't good at twitchy games.
Young people are playing Minecraft or one of the FPS's.
Aging from 20 to 30 does not impact twitch reaction. We are not talking about seniors here, are we?
If the MMO player base is aging and many think it is, anything that requires a lot of dexterity is out. Old people typically aren't good at twitchy games.
Young people are playing Minecraft or one of the FPS's.
Aging from 20 to 30 does not impact twitch reaction. We are not talking about seniors here, are we?
People whose first computer was an Apple II. Atari 400/800 or Commodore 64 were playing CRPGs like the first Ultima 30-35 years ago - that would put them anywhere from mid 40s to mid 50s... you don't think 16 to 50 makes a difference in reflexes?
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
If the MMO player base is aging and many think it is, anything that requires a lot of dexterity is out. Old people typically aren't good at twitchy games.
Young people are playing Minecraft or one of the FPS's.
Aging from 20 to 30 does not impact twitch reaction. We are not talking about seniors here, are we?
People whose first computer was an Apple II. Atari 400/800 or Commodore 64 were playing CRPGs like the first Ultima 30-35 years ago - that would put them anywhere from mid 40s to mid 50s... you don't think 16 to 50 makes a difference in reflexes?
Twitch in an MMORPG isn't about dexterity or reflexes, its about anticipating an enemies attack, and as long as you are mentally alert its really easy to avoid dangerous attacks towards you. Half the people can't even stay out of fire, and its all about focus and very little to do with age.
Iselin: And the next person who says "but it's a business, they need to make money" can just go fuck yourself.
First mmo I played with action combat was Phantasy Star Online on my Dreamcast. Also Tera launched before GW2. I would say that is action combat. GW2 is half tab target and half action. I wouldn't say GW2 is the reason some of the new mmos are going towards that combat style. A lot of people don't even think it's action combat. So, I think it's only you who might think this.
The reason you are seeing more action combat in MMOs is because technology is finally at a place where action combat works well without lag. 10 years ago, it would of been a lot harder for an mmo to have action combat. You are only going to see more and more action combat mmos coming out. In fact, I bet the majority of new mmos will either have an action combat system like Tera, ESO etc. Or a slight tab target combat system like GW2.
Personally though, I think there is room for both systems. I enjoy both. If I had to choose one or the other. I would take action combat. I like my mmos to require some actual skill. If I want to eat a sandwich while watching a movie, I'll play a tab target mmo.
If the MMO player base is aging and many think it is, anything that requires a lot of dexterity is out. Old people typically aren't good at twitchy games.
Young people are playing Minecraft or one of the FPS's.
Aging from 20 to 30 does not impact twitch reaction. We are not talking about seniors here, are we?
People whose first computer was an Apple II. Atari 400/800 or Commodore 64 were playing CRPGs like the first Ultima 30-35 years ago - that would put them anywhere from mid 40s to mid 50s... you don't think 16 to 50 makes a difference in reflexes?
Hey, that's me. I'm 47. My first real PC computer game was a hacked version of Ultima III my friend and I played on Apple IIe/IIc at school. Before that is was a Commodore Vic 20 in middle school with a cassette tape drive to load programs - that really sucked.
My reflexes are slower than they were 20 or 30 years ago. I can really tell on the console. I can also tell with more competitive reflex games, mostly FPS. With MMOs it's not really that bad though. I don't feel like it makes a huge difference. MMOs have a pacing that is different or slower than most games, even action combat games. They have to take into account latency and positioning through a network that allows for a lot of slop compared to LAN based or single player games.
It is not only about reaction time but at 53 I am having problems playing longer than a couple of hours. If I play a game that has a lot of movement it really takes a toll . I gave up Wildstar because of a persistent ache that now that I am playing FFXIV ARR has gone away.
I am not asking for games to cater to me but it would sadden me a great deal if I have to give up this genre because they have changed it to an action combat but what to do it seems to be going that way.
People whose first computer was an Apple II. Atari 400/800 or Commodore 64 were playing CRPGs like the first Ultima 30-35 years ago - that would put them anywhere from mid 40s to mid 50s... you don't think 16 to 50 makes a difference in reflexes?
Not really. I am 47, and I can still play Diablo 3 without any problem. Sure I can't beat 20 years old on FPSes, but we are not talking about FPS here, we are talking about action RPGs.
People whose first computer was an Apple II. Atari 400/800 or Commodore 64 were playing CRPGs like the first Ultima 30-35 years ago - that would put them anywhere from mid 40s to mid 50s... you don't think 16 to 50 makes a difference in reflexes?
Not really. I am 47, and I can still play Diablo 3 without any problem. Sure I can't beat 20 years old on FPSes, but we are not talking about FPS here, we are talking about action RPGs.
Hey, at least you're finally coming around to calling D3 an ARPG; which is what it is. Progress is a beautiful thing.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
People whose first computer was an Apple II. Atari 400/800 or Commodore 64 were playing CRPGs like the first Ultima 30-35 years ago - that would put them anywhere from mid 40s to mid 50s... you don't think 16 to 50 makes a difference in reflexes?
Not really. I am 47, and I can still play Diablo 3 without any problem. Sure I can't beat 20 years old on FPSes, but we are not talking about FPS here, we are talking about action RPGs.
Hey, at least you're finally coming around to calling D3 an ARPG; which is what it is. Progress is a beautiful thing.
Yes .. D3 is an ARPG, close enough to MMO for me ... there is no conflict and no change. Didn't I always say that?
Plus, a game can be in more than one category. Otherwise, why would LoL, a MOBA, also be classified as a MMO?
I don't understand why people don't consider World of Warcraft to be action combat. The distance between World of Warcraft and say Mario is so small that I don't even acknowledge it.
even EverQuest is a healthy step toward action combat.
People trying to say the RNG stat based game design of an MMORPG is the only real form of an RPG because of pen-and-paper RPGs is laughable. When you sit down to play a PnP RPG, you play for a number of reasons, but one of them is the thrill of the dice rolls. How many times in an MMORPG has anyone cheered that an autoattack scored a crit? Never. So to try and equate the two is laughable.
Are these visual MMORPGs not RPGs because you don't use your imagination to picture the character and world like you do in pen-and-paper RPGs and MUDs? Games like Everquest when it came out didn't have action combat because of technical limitations. Just like during the MUD days, these text based RPGs didn't have graphics.
Yes some people in their nostalgia won't want to accept the change from RNG to action, but then there are some people who still won't change from MUDs to MMORPGs.
People whose first computer was an Apple II. Atari 400/800 or Commodore 64 were playing CRPGs like the first Ultima 30-35 years ago - that would put them anywhere from mid 40s to mid 50s... you don't think 16 to 50 makes a difference in reflexes?
Not really. I am 47, and I can still play Diablo 3 without any problem. Sure I can't beat 20 years old on FPSes, but we are not talking about FPS here, we are talking about action RPGs.
Yeah. Twitch relfex specifically - maybe. But ARPGs and MMORPGs have very little use for that. Most of the skills needed are game knowledge, tactics, teamwork and hand-eye coordination. Now I'm still on my 20s but I doubt any of the first three are that much affected by age, and I am hesitant to believe whether general hand-eye coordination is affected all that much (then again we are all individuals).
Sounds like some good old resistance to change with a taste of excuses.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
People trying to say the RNG stat based game design of an MMORPG is the only real form of an RPG because of pen-and-paper RPGs is laughable. When you sit down to play a PnP RPG, you play for a number of reasons, but one of them is the thrill of the dice rolls. How many times in an MMORPG has anyone cheered that an autoattack scored a crit? Never. So to try and equate the two is laughable.
Really? What the dice represented could be exciting but actually rolling the dice never got me excited. I can get just as excited rolling a natural 20 in a computer RPG than actually rolling the dice.
Are these visual MMORPGs not RPGs because you don't use your imagination to picture the character and world like you do in pen-and-paper RPGs and MUDs? Games like Everquest when it came out didn't have action combat because of technical limitations. Just like during the MUD days, these text based RPGs didn't have graphics.
Yes some people in their nostalgia won't want to accept the change from RNG to action, but then there are some people who still won't change from MUDs to MMORPGs.
Yeah some modern MUDs I've seen are better than most current MMOs in my opinion. Graphics are over-rated and imagination is still important in RPGs.
Tab-target does kind of suck though. Someone needs to figure out how to do turn-based combat well in an MMO.
Well... for 1 GW2 was not the first Action Combat game that came out MMo. A bit silly to give it false credit for that, particularly when the games coming out with action combat came out around the same time, something that isn't likely to happen in a game in the middle of development.
I don't see that much of a backlash against action combat myself, after all Tera Online was the 3rd highest grossing MMo of 2013, with number 1 being Wow and 2 being Lineage 1. If anything it says that people WANT action combat. I don't think it needs to be JUST action combat nor just tab target. I don't see any backlash at all, for the most part its highly welcomed as a change, the issue is many action combat games haven't gotten into the correct niche of what they should do. Until then it might be hard for those games to find their rightful place to stand strong. Tera might be the only one thus far to be recorded as having done well, but I'm certain more will come as they refine themselves.
I've enjoyed Final Fantasy 14 just as much as I've enjoyed Wildstar for MMos I played with both having such opposite forms of gameplay from one another. Both can be fun, and I really don't see a backlash in one over the other.
Comments
Who says MMOs are supposed to be like pnp rpgs?
I would say they are better at what they do .. becoming better video games. The RPG "heritage" is not what it cracks up to be if people are having fun with action combat.
lold irl. Deep strategic combat? please, you max your hitcap and follow your shitty BiS guide for max dps. That deep combat. The only requirement is enough time to grind that gear which will compensate for all your failures. This is what pve in mmorpg's has been in at least the last 4 years.
Pi*1337/100 = 42
You guys with your wow killers.
No one except maybe some players ever thought GW2 was a wow killer. I don't recall anyone on the guild wars 2 team stating they were making a wow killer. If they did then I'd love to see the quote.
And I believe Tera released prior to GW2. I think Vindictus was released prior to both of them.
"Action combat games" haven't taken top spots because they were "action combat". I suspect there were other more relevant reasons.
Of course there is room for both. For my tastes, I never, ever liked tab targetting, even when I played my first "tab targetting games".
Once I tased vindictus and tera I knew that there was an alternate method of combat that was more to my taste.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
You're talking mmos he's talking RPGs in general. I think as combat gets faster the strategic part of it falls behind the player skill and stats do become a mechanic to even the playing field so to speak. Kind of like how world of tanks uses a RNG so skill can only go so far...if the RNG fucks you....you're fucked.
This is because MMORPGs have gravitated to the WoW style without doing it as well as WoW combined with the trend of releasing easy end game content.
However, its quite obvious that you have never done a current WoW heroic raid or something like Akylios from Rift because it takes a lot more than getting best in slot and memorizing a priority system (I bet you are one of the people who would call it a rotation)
MMOs as a whole tend top lack challenging group content though.
Even though many action games promise skill-based interesting combat that sucks you into the fight, I personally often just find them extremely spammy and little else. This doesn't just go for MMORPG's either.
For example: I recently bought Batman: Arkham City during the steam summer sale, but found the combat really disappointing (I only like the stealth sections, but the console port is also really bad with the button prompts imo). That's because I can't personally get over the fact that even though Batman might be doing double salto cartwheeling kicks, you're still simply clicking the left & right mouse buttons 90% of the time.
On top of that MMO's are usually visually inferior to that kind of game.
I don't think action combat is wrong, but they need to make it interesting and complex, with abilities that need to be used strategically and have a variety of combo opportunities with each other. Think out of the box and make abilities that do different things if you jump, run or defend against an attack.
Departing from tab targeting also doesn't automatically make things better. Several games that have pretty intense action packed combat still have a type of "lock-on" system similar to tab-targeting that you need to master, such as Dark Souls.
Just give me less spam and more depth.
Sadly, the grindy nature of many MMO's does lend itself more to spam, so it seems.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
The type of combat an MMO has is directly related to how much or how little realism a developer wants in their product.
At one end of the spectrum you have action combat with aiming and misses and at the other end you have the slower paced tab-targetting. SRPGs take that a step further into turn-based which is still very much alive as the success of Divinity - Oriiginal Sin has shown.
The appeal of the different systems is pretty personal and somewhat related to the gaming "roots" of the player: some people grew up playing and enjoying side-scrollers and FPS where manual dexterity and reaction times are more important and other people favored strategy in their gaming. In the early days almost all RPGs were turn based and it wasn't until Ultima Underworld and ES - Arena that the FPS system came into the RPG world.
In 2014 we're in an age of gaming fusion where the line between FPS and RPG continues to blur and everything seems to require at least a cp-op multiplayer component. MMOs continue to get more FPS-like and the shooters more RPG-like with persistent worlds and many more players simultaneously than ever before... more realism and quick reflexes are taking over the RPG world and FPS games are becoming MMOs (PS2, Defiance, Destiny, The Division, etc.) even if the developers don't want to call them that.
There will probably continue to be a few new tab-targetted MMOs made but IMHO, they will have a narrow, nostalgic, niche appeal. Action combat is here to stay in the mainstream and what we'll be getting will be just slight variations on their implementation (e.g. aim and miss or not?)
Any perceived "backlash" is a forum phenomenom--certainly not reflected by popularity and sales--just like all the other forum movements wanting to return to the "good old days of _____ (insert early MMO where you had a great time here)"
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
If the MMO player base is aging and many think it is, anything that requires a lot of dexterity is out. Old people typically aren't good at twitchy games.
Young people are playing Minecraft or one of the FPS's.
http://gnomophobia.com
Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
Aging from 20 to 30 does not impact twitch reaction. We are not talking about seniors here, are we?
People whose first computer was an Apple II. Atari 400/800 or Commodore 64 were playing CRPGs like the first Ultima 30-35 years ago - that would put them anywhere from mid 40s to mid 50s... you don't think 16 to 50 makes a difference in reflexes?
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Twitch in an MMORPG isn't about dexterity or reflexes, its about anticipating an enemies attack, and as long as you are mentally alert its really easy to avoid dangerous attacks towards you. Half the people can't even stay out of fire, and its all about focus and very little to do with age.
^ you have said all i wanted to say
It is not only about reaction time but at 53 I am having problems playing longer than a couple of hours. If I play a game that has a lot of movement it really takes a toll . I gave up Wildstar because of a persistent ache that now that I am playing FFXIV ARR has gone away.
I am not asking for games to cater to me but it would sadden me a great deal if I have to give up this genre because they have changed it to an action combat but what to do it seems to be going that way.
Not really. I am 47, and I can still play Diablo 3 without any problem. Sure I can't beat 20 years old on FPSes, but we are not talking about FPS here, we are talking about action RPGs.
Hey, at least you're finally coming around to calling D3 an ARPG; which is what it is. Progress is a beautiful thing.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Yes .. D3 is an ARPG, close enough to MMO for me ... there is no conflict and no change. Didn't I always say that?
Plus, a game can be in more than one category. Otherwise, why would LoL, a MOBA, also be classified as a MMO?
I don't understand why people don't consider World of Warcraft to be action combat. The distance between World of Warcraft and say Mario is so small that I don't even acknowledge it.
even EverQuest is a healthy step toward action combat.
People trying to say the RNG stat based game design of an MMORPG is the only real form of an RPG because of pen-and-paper RPGs is laughable. When you sit down to play a PnP RPG, you play for a number of reasons, but one of them is the thrill of the dice rolls. How many times in an MMORPG has anyone cheered that an autoattack scored a crit? Never. So to try and equate the two is laughable.
Are these visual MMORPGs not RPGs because you don't use your imagination to picture the character and world like you do in pen-and-paper RPGs and MUDs? Games like Everquest when it came out didn't have action combat because of technical limitations. Just like during the MUD days, these text based RPGs didn't have graphics.
Yes some people in their nostalgia won't want to accept the change from RNG to action, but then there are some people who still won't change from MUDs to MMORPGs.
Yeah. Twitch relfex specifically - maybe. But ARPGs and MMORPGs have very little use for that. Most of the skills needed are game knowledge, tactics, teamwork and hand-eye coordination. Now I'm still on my 20s but I doubt any of the first three are that much affected by age, and I am hesitant to believe whether general hand-eye coordination is affected all that much (then again we are all individuals).
Sounds like some good old resistance to change with a taste of excuses.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
screw "action combat", I have no use for "twitch" console ritalin-kiddie play-style.
It's not the combat system, it's the entire game...
Same with the "you can't have an open pvp game" threads... It's not the "open pvp" that's the issue, it's the game and development.
Really? What the dice represented could be exciting but actually rolling the dice never got me excited. I can get just as excited rolling a natural 20 in a computer RPG than actually rolling the dice.
Yeah some modern MUDs I've seen are better than most current MMOs in my opinion. Graphics are over-rated and imagination is still important in RPGs.
Tab-target does kind of suck though. Someone needs to figure out how to do turn-based combat well in an MMO.
Well... for 1 GW2 was not the first Action Combat game that came out MMo. A bit silly to give it false credit for that, particularly when the games coming out with action combat came out around the same time, something that isn't likely to happen in a game in the middle of development.
I don't see that much of a backlash against action combat myself, after all Tera Online was the 3rd highest grossing MMo of 2013, with number 1 being Wow and 2 being Lineage 1. If anything it says that people WANT action combat. I don't think it needs to be JUST action combat nor just tab target. I don't see any backlash at all, for the most part its highly welcomed as a change, the issue is many action combat games haven't gotten into the correct niche of what they should do. Until then it might be hard for those games to find their rightful place to stand strong. Tera might be the only one thus far to be recorded as having done well, but I'm certain more will come as they refine themselves.
I've enjoyed Final Fantasy 14 just as much as I've enjoyed Wildstar for MMos I played with both having such opposite forms of gameplay from one another. Both can be fun, and I really don't see a backlash in one over the other.
Why cant people just accept how a games made and get on with it.(or don't)
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development