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Another $90 Ship. No game in sight yet.

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  • PepeqPepeq Member UncommonPosts: 1,977
    Originally posted by Kangaroomouse
    Originally posted by JackRuby
    Are these ships part of the funding goals, or just put out for no reason?

    They are not part of any funding goals. These ships are put out to collect more money from fans.

    Of cause everyone can decide for themselves if it's worth spending hundreds of dollars on spaceships that you can supposedly later acquire in the game (something i sincerely doubt because the temptation to keep this spaceship shop running must be pretty high).

    ----

    They produce about 1 ship per month for around $50 - $200 a pop to keep the money flowing. It's smart move since people are more likely to spend smaller amounts monthly than one big sum up front.

    ----

    However, I am seriously questioning their priorities since what they released so far was 8 months late, full of bugs and is not up to industry standards in any shape or form.

    I did not realize there was a written set of standards applicable to game design for independent game developers.  No wonder they're building ships, it doesn't fall under some sort of regulatory approval system.

  • Solar_ProphetSolar_Prophet Member EpicPosts: 1,960
    Originally posted by Axxar

     

    Originally posted by fardreamer
    Without people like me who are willing to pay for a dream, no innovation will ever be made in this area and we will get games like Elite:Dangerous, a game thats following a pretty standard model of game design
    What is this I don't even?

     

    Agreed. This is probably one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read on these forums.

    AN' DERE AIN'T NO SUCH FING AS ENUFF DAKKA, YA GROT! Enuff'z more than ya got an' less than too much an' there ain't no such fing as too much dakka. Say dere is, and me Squiggoff'z eatin' tonight!

    We are born of the blood. Made men by the blood. Undone by the blood. Our eyes are yet to open. FEAR THE OLD BLOOD. 

    #IStandWithVic

  • BallsoutBallsout Member UncommonPosts: 70
    I thought the paying to get in beta was getting crazy, these guys are taking it to a whole new level. I bet 90 bucks you'll never see this game. This game is vaporware and they know it, which is why they are making money anyway they can.

    image
  • PaskePaske Member UncommonPosts: 135

    90$ ?

     

    Its a steal !

     

    Let me get my Gold Mastercard and buy three.

     

    On a serious note, I monitored the game since fundraiser days I a must say I am so very sorry for not buying in 100$ or so package.

     

    Could sell it on ebay for 1000$ easy :)

  • CrazKanukCrazKanuk Member EpicPosts: 6,130
    Originally posted by Kangaroomouse
    Originally posted by JackRuby
    Are these ships part of the funding goals, or just put out for no reason?

    They are not part of any funding goals. These ships are put out to collect more money from fans.

    Of cause everyone can decide for themselves if it's worth spending hundreds of dollars on spaceships that you can supposedly later acquire in the game (something i sincerely doubt because the temptation to keep this spaceship shop running must be pretty high).

    ----

    They produce about 1 ship per month for around $50 - $200 a pop to keep the money flowing. It's smart move since people are more likely to spend smaller amounts monthly than one big sum up front.

    ----

    However, I am seriously questioning their priorities since what they released so far was 8 months late, full of bugs and is not up to industry standards in any shape or form.

    I feel the same... .kinda. I was in on this like early, early, early. I still only have the 1 ship, nothing fancy. I get kind of annoyed, but at the same time, I get it. 

     

    Now, re: seeing an actual game, remember that Arena Commander is out there, and they just put out another game mode. 

     

    So what this tells us is that the core gameplay mechanics are done, you can fly ships around, blow stuff up, yada, yada. So it's probably more the "game" itself. Depending on the scope and complexity (which is likely to be continually growing as they get more money), the actual drop of the game might be a way off still. If you're a fan of Chris Roberts, you know he totally geeks out on space games and I think he really wants to create something that will blow our minds, but he was taken off Freelancer for that same reason. His problem is that he doesn't know when to pull the trigger. He wants to deliver everything at once, but I'd much rather see a working game, with feature updates on an ongoing basis. 

     

    Not likely to be a scam, but whether or not Chris can pull the trigger or not without something mind-blowing will be a different story. 

    Crazkanuk

    ----------------
    Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
    Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
    Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
    Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
    Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
    ----------------

  • KangaroomouseKangaroomouse Member Posts: 394
    Originally posted by Pepeq
    Originally posted by Kangaroomouse
    Originally posted by JackRuby
    Are these ships part of the funding goals, or just put out for no reason?

    They are not part of any funding goals. These ships are put out to collect more money from fans.

    Of cause everyone can decide for themselves if it's worth spending hundreds of dollars on spaceships that you can supposedly later acquire in the game (something i sincerely doubt because the temptation to keep this spaceship shop running must be pretty high).

    ----

    They produce about 1 ship per month for around $50 - $200 a pop to keep the money flowing. It's smart move since people are more likely to spend smaller amounts monthly than one big sum up front.

    ----

    However, I am seriously questioning their priorities since what they released so far was 8 months late, full of bugs and is not up to industry standards in any shape or form.

    I did not realize there was a written set of standards applicable to game design for independent game developers.  No wonder they're building ships, it doesn't fall under some sort of regulatory approval system.

    Well yes, Chris Roberts himself said so. Supposedly the game is AAA Standard. Not my my words, his:

    "To sustain this level of development, we need to keep bringing in additional funds. Star Citizen is still much less than the other published backed AAA games that have similar levels of ambition (some would even say a little less  ) like GTA V, Watch Dogs or Destiny."

    ----

    Nice try to shift the discussion towards game design when we are clearly talking about what was delivered as a "dogfight module" and has nothing to do with design but is in fact a demo of their technology and has to stand up to the comparison of other games with AAA standard, like Watch Dogs, GTA V and Destiny, as Mr. Roberts himself proclaimed.

    In all honesty, to compare a $50 million project by an Industry veteran with Indie development which is usually done by one person with a budget lower than the average american's income is ludicrous and you know it.

     

  • AnirethAnireth Member UncommonPosts: 940

    Given the lack of quality, both technical (bugs, lag etc.) and content wise of many so called AAA games, Chris Roberts can do basically what he wants and still be up to the standard. Even if all he does is order pizza and ferraris.

    And there have been many cancelled games, even far into production. The backers all knew (hopefully, after reading up) what they were paying for. Even more so if you pay for something thats not part of the initial funding. It may be unfortunate if SC never sees the light of day, but all this rage directed at someone who at this point is still innocent, while there are multi-billion dollar companies that do basically the same thing..

    I'll wait to the day's end when the moon is high
    And then I'll rise with the tide with a lust for life, I'll
    Amass an army, and we'll harness a horde
    And then we'll limp across the land until we stand at the shore

  • udonudon Member UncommonPosts: 1,803

    I find a lot of these ship packages very telling as to what the business model in the final game will look like.  How much grinding of credits in game is going to be required to buy some of these $100 plus ship packages?  I mean a $15 a month sub game will give you 8+ months for that much money so is it going to take 8 months playing at normal rates to buy one of these ships in game?

    I am interested in this game and hopeful it works out but I'm not spending a penny until I get a better idea what the expectation for monthly spending on this game is going to be.  I have no interest in playing a game no matter how enjoyable it is if the only way to be able to do enjoyable activities is to spend $100's a month to bypass the grind.

  • vgamervgamer Member Posts: 195
    Originally posted by Axxar

     

    Originally posted by fardreamer
    Without people like me who are willing to pay for a dream, no innovation will ever be made in this area and we will get games like Elite:Dangerous, a game thats following a pretty standard model of game design
    What is this I don't even?

     

    Fardreamer is in his mind a herald of innovation, vanquisher of the old, bringer of novelty. Under his mighty wallet, whole corporations will fall and citizens all over the world will thank his wise decision to pay for a high res picture.

     

    But on a more serious note, I can't even imagine how it will be when this game finally gets released. The hype and the expectations are enormous and history has shown that disappointment is usually the response.

  • KangaroomouseKangaroomouse Member Posts: 394
    Originally posted by Anireth

    Given the lack of quality, both technical (bugs, lag etc.) and content wise of many so called AAA games, Chris Roberts can do basically what he wants and still be up to the standard. Even if all he does is order pizza and ferraris.

    And there have been many cancelled games, even far into production. The backers all knew (hopefully, after reading up) what they were paying for. Even more so if you pay for something thats not part of the initial funding. It may be unfortunate if SC never sees the light of day, but all this rage directed at someone who at this point is still innocent, while there are multi-billion dollar companies that do basically the same thing..

    I fail to see any rage in my OP or replies.

    ----

    Crowd Funding, Kickstarting or whatever you want to call it prides itself with transparency and independence from corporate secrecy. Exactly because of that backers have every right to ask hard questions and the Project has to respond and deliver.

    If that is no longer the case then the spirit of crowd funding as an alternative to traditional game development is lost and we might as well just pay companies a monthly subscription hoping that eventually they will produce a game we might like.

  • CrazKanukCrazKanuk Member EpicPosts: 6,130
    Originally posted by Kangaroomouse
    Originally posted by Anireth

    Given the lack of quality, both technical (bugs, lag etc.) and content wise of many so called AAA games, Chris Roberts can do basically what he wants and still be up to the standard. Even if all he does is order pizza and ferraris.

    And there have been many cancelled games, even far into production. The backers all knew (hopefully, after reading up) what they were paying for. Even more so if you pay for something thats not part of the initial funding. It may be unfortunate if SC never sees the light of day, but all this rage directed at someone who at this point is still innocent, while there are multi-billion dollar companies that do basically the same thing..

    I fail to see any rage in my OP or replies.

    ----

    Crowd Funding, Kickstarting or whatever you want to call it prides itself with transparency and independence from corporate secrecy. Exactly because of that backers have every right to ask hard questions and the Project has to respond and deliver.

    If that is no longer the case then the spirit of crowd funding as an alternative to traditional game development is lost and we might as well just pay companies a monthly subscription hoping that eventually they will produce a game we might like.

    What is your definition of transparency? There is plenty of communication on the RSI site, imo. Much more than what I'd care to go through. They also have a Project Status area, which is a bit fluffy for my liking but it MUST give you some idea of the scope of what we're talking about here. This is going to be a massive game. Could I throw out the idea that this could be the single largest game in history? It could be, for sure. It sounds like it'll do it all so, yeah, it'll be a while. I really hope that he'll do a staggered release and simply add in other game modes, concepts, etc. along the way rather than trying to bite off this large a project with $50 million, but I guess we'll see. Fact is, though, you look at $50 million as a boat load of cash. I look at it as a drop in the bucket since I expect this to be larger than GTA, larger than Destiny, larger than SWTOR, larger than anything that's currently out there, and we want it done on a fraction of that budget. I think that getting to the $50 million mark has his eyes wide, but he'll need a lot more before it's fully realized. 

    Crazkanuk

    ----------------
    Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
    Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
    Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
    Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
    Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
    ----------------

  • vveaver_onlinevveaver_online Member UncommonPosts: 436
    Originally posted by vgamer
     

    Fardreamer is in his mind a herald of innovation, vanquisher of the old, bringer of novelty. Under his mighty wallet, whole corporations will fall and citizens all over the world will thank his wise decision to pay for a high res picture.

    I really enjoyed that description of myself, and I find it quite accurate.  I just believe that SC wont be as novel a game as it currently seems. 

    On a serious note too.

    I was expecting a dogfight module, a buggy text environment where we could discuss and tweek it together with cig, they went well beyond a simple module, yes it was delayed a few months but the arena commander is more like its own little game.

    Chris even said that arena commander will be a "simulation game" inside the 'verse, once the universe is complete. That said, i'm the vanquisher of old!

    Herald of innovation, Vanquisher of the old! - Awake a few hours almost everyday!

  • ReaperUkReaperUk Member UncommonPosts: 759
    Originally posted by Tindale111
    On the bright side Elite Dangerous is in beta 

    The first one of the two games I heard of was SC when one of my guildies in our multi game guild said he was getting a ship and we should look into it too. So I did and was tempted but then another guildie said we should should look into ED too as he thought that would end up being the better game. The result was I bought into the ED premium beta.

    I may still get into SC eventually but it seems a long way off to me. ED's beta is playable now. The trading system is up and running, there are a huge number of planets to visit. You have a choice of solo mode or multiplayer mode and features will be constantly added as time goes on.

    SC is definitely on the back burner for me.

  • Moar61Moar61 Member UncommonPosts: 260
    Things like that will always leave a sour taste in my mouth, regardless if it's the norm or not. Understandably so when most of us grew up in a market which you paid 60 dollars (or a subscription) and got all of it's content
  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Game isn't due out til late 2015

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • AzothAzoth Member UncommonPosts: 840
    Originally posted by Kangaroomouse
    Originally posted by Anireth

    Given the lack of quality, both technical (bugs, lag etc.) and content wise of many so called AAA games, Chris Roberts can do basically what he wants and still be up to the standard. Even if all he does is order pizza and ferraris.

    And there have been many cancelled games, even far into production. The backers all knew (hopefully, after reading up) what they were paying for. Even more so if you pay for something thats not part of the initial funding. It may be unfortunate if SC never sees the light of day, but all this rage directed at someone who at this point is still innocent, while there are multi-billion dollar companies that do basically the same thing..

    I fail to see any rage in my OP or replies.

    ----

    Crowd Funding, Kickstarting or whatever you want to call it prides itself with transparency and independence from corporate secrecy. Exactly because of that backers have every right to ask hard questions and the Project has to respond and deliver.

    If that is no longer the case then the spirit of crowd funding as an alternative to traditional game development is lost and we might as well just pay companies a monthly subscription hoping that eventually they will produce a game we might like.

    It was more as a way to make good games without the suits breathing down your neck. I don't think the reason for crowd funding ever was for every pledger to become suits themselves.

    You pledge toward someone or something that you have faith in, you wait, you reap the game you hoped for or you don't. CR doesn't have to feed you any information, even so, there is a shitload of info released all the time. I don't know what else you could want other than sit on CR lap and watch what he does all day long.

  • AzothAzoth Member UncommonPosts: 840
    Originally posted by Moar61
    Things like that will always leave a sour taste in my mouth, regardless if it's the norm or not. Understandably so when most of us grew up in a market which you paid 60 dollars (or a subscription) and got all of it's content

    You will get all the content for the box price.

  • Moar61Moar61 Member UncommonPosts: 260
    Originally posted by Azoth
    Originally posted by Moar61
    Things like that will always leave a sour taste in my mouth, regardless if it's the norm or not. Understandably so when most of us grew up in a market which you paid 60 dollars (or a subscription) and got all of it's content

    You will get all the content for the box price.

     

    Including these 90 dollar ships?

     

    Sorry, I actually haven't been following this game at all and just from my understanding you pay 90 dollars and get a ship

  • agora012agora012 Member Posts: 31
    Originally posted by Cayll

    I understand where the OP is coming from on this, and I also understand the "It's our money" stance of the fans.

    The issue I have with business practices like this is that it's becoming the norm in the entertainment industry, and it's a pretty scary thing. Kick starting, crowd funding, fan funding, whatever you want to call it, is a very dangerous path to go down as a consumer.

    To put it into context. Let's say I own a restaurant. You all visit my restaurant and it's beautiful, nice paint job, nice furniture. A beautiful waiter/waitress comes over to you and charmingly offers you the most spectacular menu that you've ever seen. You're salivating looking at the food on the menu. You choose a few items off the menu, then the waiter/waitress says "Unfortunately we do not actually have any of this food, but if you want to pay for it now, we can get a team together and have them make the food, we will have it made within a few weeks, then you can come back, we will give you a VIP table and you get your drinks for free".

    This is crowd funding. The problem is there isn't a legal guarantee with it. It's faith based buying. And it promotes companies to gouge you even more because it works. Next time you come back to my restaurant, I might tell you that the food is still not ready, but if you pay another $10, you get you keep your glass.

    At the end of the day, you're down money, you're still hungry, and all you have is your "I ate at the Dirty Spoon Restaurant" sticker, even though you didn't.

    So honestly, can we blame them for this type of business? We are the reason it's becoming the norm, because we live in a society of impulse buyers.

    Also, if anyone is interested, I have a bridge to sell....

     

    90 percent of kickstarter projects are scams. until and unless someone sues kickstarter and the scammer who put the project and a precendence is made in court .scams will happen . 

  • vveaver_onlinevveaver_online Member UncommonPosts: 436
    Originally posted by Moar61
    Originally posted by Azoth
    Originally posted by Moar61
    Things like that will always leave a sour taste in my mouth, regardless if it's the norm or not. Understandably so when most of us grew up in a market which you paid 60 dollars (or a subscription) and got all of it's content

    You will get all the content for the box price.

     

    Including these 90 dollar ships?

     

    Sorry, I actually haven't been following this game at all and just from my understanding you pay 90 dollars and get a ship

    yes all ships will be included in game for ingame credits, im pretty sure that chris even said once the persistent universe goes live 2016 it will be free to play, and all ships can be purchased ingame with ingame credits, and that the credit system will not reflect the current monetary value.  So don't for a second think that a 90$ ship will be worth 90$ingame credits. it might be worth 10$ ingame credits or something along those lines.

    What they said over and over is your helping fund the game and for helping them fund the game they offer you some starter kits. and if you want to fund more you get mor to start with, but all assets will be free/purchasable for ingame credits.

    The only ships that will take any serious amount of grinding will be the guildsized capital ships. 

    Herald of innovation, Vanquisher of the old! - Awake a few hours almost everyday!

  • AzothAzoth Member UncommonPosts: 840
    Originally posted by agora012
    Originally posted by Cayll

    I understand where the OP is coming from on this, and I also understand the "It's our money" stance of the fans.

    The issue I have with business practices like this is that it's becoming the norm in the entertainment industry, and it's a pretty scary thing. Kick starting, crowd funding, fan funding, whatever you want to call it, is a very dangerous path to go down as a consumer.

    To put it into context. Let's say I own a restaurant. You all visit my restaurant and it's beautiful, nice paint job, nice furniture. A beautiful waiter/waitress comes over to you and charmingly offers you the most spectacular menu that you've ever seen. You're salivating looking at the food on the menu. You choose a few items off the menu, then the waiter/waitress says "Unfortunately we do not actually have any of this food, but if you want to pay for it now, we can get a team together and have them make the food, we will have it made within a few weeks, then you can come back, we will give you a VIP table and you get your drinks for free".

    This is crowd funding. The problem is there isn't a legal guarantee with it. It's faith based buying. And it promotes companies to gouge you even more because it works. Next time you come back to my restaurant, I might tell you that the food is still not ready, but if you pay another $10, you get you keep your glass.

    At the end of the day, you're down money, you're still hungry, and all you have is your "I ate at the Dirty Spoon Restaurant" sticker, even though you didn't.

    So honestly, can we blame them for this type of business? We are the reason it's becoming the norm, because we live in a society of impulse buyers.

    Also, if anyone is interested, I have a bridge to sell....

     

    90 percent of kickstarter projects are scams. until and unless someone sues kickstarter and the scammer who put the project and a precendence is made in court .scams will happen . 

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/washington-sues-ed-nash-kickstarter-campaign-173707149.html

  • dakilla666dakilla666 Member UncommonPosts: 306

    To my knowledge, this is the largest kickstarter to date and no one really expected it to reach the size that it did in such a short amount of time. This means that RSI had to completely re-write what they thought they would be working on even before development started.  By the same token, everything they're doing is essentially ground breaking as someone previously stated as no one has ever had this much budget to produce a game without having a financial investment deadline to conform to. 

    Hopefully in the long run all will pan out and they will set a new industry standard, in the mean time, just gonna have to wait for them to iron out their methods and start showing us what the long term content will start to look like in the future.

    Dakilla[666] ~ The Realm ~ Level 1000 enchanter (retired)
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  • PhaserlightPhaserlight Member EpicPosts: 3,072

    There is a bit of an uncanny valley effect going on with this game:

    It looks like something I'd want to play, then there are these "commercials" for exorbitantly priced virtual ships that make monoclegate look like it was conceived by droopy eyed, harmless children.

    One fan of the game claims the average pledge is $100 (at the same time, you have individuals who have claimed to have spent well over $3,000).

    Let that sink in for a minute, then consider: is the game as delivered so far, advertised, and to all outward appearances, worth some of that $100?  The answer is undoubtedly yes, but not all.  Some of that figure is due simply to the name Chris Roberts.

    It's not so much that there are villages in Africa that need wells built (there are); it's that some of that pie should be going toward other indie devs in the same genre, some of whom have been fighting to keep the flame alive for over a decade.

    "The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
    Authored 139 missions in Vendetta Online and 6 tracks in Distance

  • VolkmarVolkmar Member UncommonPosts: 2,501
    imageOriginally posted by Kangaroomouse
    Originally posted by JackRuby
    Are these ships part of the funding goals, or just put out for no reason?

    They are not part of any funding goals. These ships are put out to collect more money from fans.

    Of cause everyone can decide for themselves if it's worth spending hundreds of dollars on spaceships that you can supposedly later acquire in the game (something i sincerely doubt because the temptation to keep this spaceship shop running must be pretty high).

    ----

    They produce about 1 ship per month for around $50 - $200 a pop to keep the money flowing. It's smart move since people are more likely to spend smaller amounts monthly than one big sum up front.

    ----

    However, I am seriously questioning their priorities since what they released so far was 8 months late, full of bugs and is not up to industry standards in any shape or form.

    https://robertsspaceindustries.com/funding-goals

     

    the m50 was the ship unlocked at 4.5mils. Now it is finally ready and offered it again for a week.

    Everyone here should really take a big breath and a reality check. Star citizen has been in development for a couple of years and is nowhere near finished. To me Arena Commander is a great diversion and I enjoy my time shooting down aliens, if you don't that's too bad and the official forum has an area for feedback.

    "If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"



  • MukeMuke Member RarePosts: 2,614
    Originally posted by Kangaroomouse

     

    You can now buy another $90 ship, the Origin M50 Racer.

    ----

    I got to give it to these guys, they know how to milk the audience every month with a new ship.

    ----

    I wonder how many people work on these ships and the "commercials" for them and how many do work on the actual game.

     

    Skipped a test invite because they said I needed to buy ship packages from their gamestore first lol.

     

    "going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

This discussion has been closed.