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Lets spectate on the Justice system

So at this upcoming quakecon, Zenimax is going to release some info on the new Justice system... im pretty excited but have no idea at all on how this is going to work, i never played a MMO with a crime system (even though i almost bought Ultima online and that has a crime system right...?)

 

Anyways, how could this work? And still feel Elder Scrollsy at the same time...?

 

Speculation?

Comments

  • ScotScot UKPosts: 5,769Member Uncommon
    Speculation leads to anticipation, anticipation leads to angst when you don't get what you want. That's story of many an IP turned into a game right there. :)
  • EhllfhireEhllfhire Sacramento, CAPosts: 597Member
    Im game, what are we watching for OP?

    Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
    PS3

  • ReklawReklaw Am.Posts: 6,478Member Uncommon

    I hope they can bring it to a point where you can no longer just loot any bag/sack/crate etc.. when there is a NPC around, especially one in a shop.

    Hope it brings in pickpocketing

    All these things might lead to prison time if caught but you could get options like: pay a fine, sit time or try to escape.

    Hopefully a new skill line's, Thieves Guild and Darkbrother Hood?

    Being able to place bounty's? (PVP related)

    These are just some of my speculations I might wish for...we'll see where we end up with and as alway's I play what is given and not what I might wish for.....

     

     

  • aesperusaesperus Hamshire, NVPosts: 5,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by mmogamerlover

    So at this upcoming quakecon, Zenimax is going to release some info on the new Justice system... im pretty excited but have no idea at all on how this is going to work, i never played a MMO with a crime system (even though i almost bought Ultima online and that has a crime system right...?)

    Anyways, how could this work? And still feel Elder Scrollsy at the same time...?

    Speculation?

    Not to pee in your koolaid, but I wouldn't expect too much.

    From what I understand they are basically trying to do a system somewhat similar to Skyrim, where if you attack NPCs, or steal from them / etc. and get caught, you can be punished / go to jail.

    This might be neat for some, and it was a cool feature in the single player games, but I can't help but wonder what the actual purpose will be in this MMO. Of the few MMOs that have added such a feature, it's primarily used as a tool to police the population. To prevent griefers / PKers / etc. from getting too out of hand. The better games have a player run council to decide how to proceed, and it is a pretty cool system.

    The problem w/ ESO, is it really doesn't have anything close to that dynamic. I suspect that whatever end product they end up with will seem like a hallow version of what other games have done. Kinda like promising large-epic pvp, and then delivering a small instanced version instead.

    I could be wrong, and it would be nice for them to prove me wrong, but that's just my suspicions based on what I've already experienced with the game thus far. Then again, I am debating on whether or not I want to keep playing this game, so take that how you will.

  • MetricaMetrica Dover, DEPosts: 37Member Common
    Originally posted by aesperus
    Originally posted by mmogamerlover

    So at this upcoming quakecon, Zenimax is going to release some info on the new Justice system... im pretty excited but have no idea at all on how this is going to work, i never played a MMO with a crime system (even though i almost bought Ultima online and that has a crime system right...?)

    Anyways, how could this work? And still feel Elder Scrollsy at the same time...?

    Speculation?

    Not to pee in your koolaid, but I wouldn't expect too much.

    From what I understand they are basically trying to do a system somewhat similar to Skyrim, where if you attack NPCs, or steal from them / etc. and get caught, you can be punished / go to jail.

    This might be neat for some, and it was a cool feature in the single player games, but I can't help but wonder what the actual purpose will be in this MMO. Of the few MMOs that have added such a feature, it's primarily used as a tool to police the population. To prevent griefers / PKers / etc. from getting too out of hand. The better games have a player run council to decide how to proceed, and it is a pretty cool system.

    The problem w/ ESO, is it really doesn't have anything close to that dynamic. I suspect that whatever end product they end up with will seem like a hallow version of what other games have done. Kinda like promising large-epic pvp, and then delivering a small instanced version instead.

    I could be wrong, and it would be nice for them to prove me wrong, but that's just my suspicions based on what I've already experienced with the game thus far. Then again, I am debating on whether or not I want to keep playing this game, so take that how you will.

     

    Not with that attitude, at least.  For once an MMO developer has proven that they are willing to dramatically shift focus to appease fans (first person, lootable environments, justice and crime) and there will still be people who have no faith or value to add to conversation but insist on airing their opinions. 

  • EntinerintEntinerint brooklyn, NYPosts: 843Member Uncommon

    Well they've already stated that there will be a PvP aspect where players can sign up as guards and hunt down players who are criminals.  Not sure if this will work like Empire v Rebel in SWG where it is flaggable open PvP but it will occur in the PvE zones that is known for sure.

     

    I am just hoping that stage 4 vampires are seen as criminals as well as werewolves that turn in towns.  Both of those should be attacked by any NPC guard and it's kinda ridiculous that they're not even now.

  • wuhsin88wuhsin88 Hamilton, ALPosts: 70Member

    Here's what I am speculating they will do with it based on their previous design philosophy of taking the easiest route and not giving a damn what the players think. 

     

    1. They keep it entirely in PVP, basically giving you a small bounty for hunting down players in enemy factions. If they do it this way, basically nothing changes in the game, except maybe you get a few gold pieces for killing certain enemies. But without nameplates, it will be hard to tell which players have the bounties on them.

    2. It gets implemented in PVE, but since there are no jails in any of the towns/cities, all they will do is have an NPC guard run up to you and fine you a certain amount of gold whenever you kill an NPC. I'm guessing they will not even give you the option to resist arrest, and the NPC guard will simply walk away like everything's fine if you don't have the money to pay.

    3. Players who kill NPC's in PVE zones will be marked as  traitors, and will be forced to PVP against other players. Since other players can't actually arrest you, jails won't be necessary, so that will save Zenimax some time and development cost. The problem with this is players couldn't preemptively attack non-criminals hunting them down, making it an extremely one-sided fight. If they could, people would be killing NPC's just so they could enter PVP mode to gank other players. Of course, phasing could be used so that criminals only see players who have become guards, and other criminals. This would create more issues with grouping though. 

     

    Basically no matter how Zenimax goes about this, they are going to shoot themselves in the foot. They can't make it like the games because of the reasons I mentioned. Criminals would either be ganking unsuspecting players, or a Cops v.s. Robbers phase would alienate the guards and criminals from the other players questing in an area. Imagine you are questing with your girlfriend, when she decides it would be funny to shoot Old McDonald's chicken. Suddenly she disappears, and is screaming for help as she runs from a bunch of guard players in another phase that you can't see. Terrible, right? If it's PVP only, the PVE crowd will feel betrayed, as they'll still have nothing to do but quest and grind VR's.

  • superconductingsuperconducting Rochester, NYPosts: 843Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Scot
    Speculation leads to anticipation, anticipation leads to angst when you don't get what you want. That's story of many an IP turned into a game right there. :)

    No no you've got it all wrong. It goes like this:

     

    “Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate... leads to suffering.”

    image
  • yaminsuxyaminsux KajangPosts: 812Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by superconducting

    Originally posted by Scot
    Speculation leads to anticipation, anticipation leads to angst when you don't get what you want. That's story of many an IP turned into a game right there. :)

    No no you've got it all wrong. It goes like this:

     

    “Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate... leads to suffering.”

     

    So yoda were saying, ESO gets a lot of hate because of people fear this game?
  • cerulean2012cerulean2012 Colorado Springs, COPosts: 367Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Metrica
    Originally posted by aesperus
    Originally posted by mmogamerlover

    So at this upcoming quakecon, Zenimax is going to release some info on the new Justice system... im pretty excited but have no idea at all on how this is going to work, i never played a MMO with a crime system (even though i almost bought Ultima online and that has a crime system right...?)

    Anyways, how could this work? And still feel Elder Scrollsy at the same time...?

    Speculation?

    Not to pee in your koolaid, but I wouldn't expect too much.

    From what I understand they are basically trying to do a system somewhat similar to Skyrim, where if you attack NPCs, or steal from them / etc. and get caught, you can be punished / go to jail.

    This might be neat for some, and it was a cool feature in the single player games, but I can't help but wonder what the actual purpose will be in this MMO. Of the few MMOs that have added such a feature, it's primarily used as a tool to police the population. To prevent griefers / PKers / etc. from getting too out of hand. The better games have a player run council to decide how to proceed, and it is a pretty cool system.

    The problem w/ ESO, is it really doesn't have anything close to that dynamic. I suspect that whatever end product they end up with will seem like a hallow version of what other games have done. Kinda like promising large-epic pvp, and then delivering a small instanced version instead.

    I could be wrong, and it would be nice for them to prove me wrong, but that's just my suspicions based on what I've already experienced with the game thus far. Then again, I am debating on whether or not I want to keep playing this game, so take that how you will.

     

    Not with that attitude, at least.  For once an MMO developer has proven that they are willing to dramatically shift focus to appease fans (first person, lootable environments, justice and crime) and there will still be people who have no faith or value to add to conversation but insist on airing their opinions. 

    Metrica, I respect that they are trying to do something different, but so far they haven't done much good. 

    Now if they do pull this off and create a system that both pvp & pve people enjoy then that is good and I do wish them the best, but from the track record I have had with them (playing) and seeing that they don't seem to grasp things to well then I am pessimistic about it.

    Even if they do make this a good feature it is still going to take a lot more then that to get a lot of the people to return to the game that left.

  • ScotScot UKPosts: 5,769Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by superconducting
    Originally posted by Scot
    Speculation leads to anticipation, anticipation leads to angst when you don't get what you want. That's story of many an IP turned into a game right there. :)

    No no you've got it all wrong. It goes like this:

     

    “Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate... leads to suffering.”

    I did indeed get my inspiration from the great Yoda. Just look at the posts so far, whatever the justice system will be, someone is going to be disappointed.

     

  • Moar61Moar61 Miramichi, NBPosts: 259Member
    Originally posted by Reklaw

    I hope they can bring it to a point where you can no longer just loot any bag/sack/crate etc.. when there is a NPC around, especially one in a shop.

    Hope it brings in pickpocketing

    All these things might lead to prison time if caught but you could get options like: pay a fine, sit time or try to escape.

    Hopefully a new skill line's, Thieves Guild and Darkbrother Hood?

    Being able to place bounty's? (PVP related)

    These are just some of my speculations I might wish for...we'll see where we end up with and as alway's I play what is given and not what I might wish for.....

     

     

     

    Bounty's would be super cool to have if they did it right. After a certain amount of crimes you'll get a warning that a bounty has been placed on your head, and then another player could retrieve that. If you die you die, not really a big deal. If you kill them then it makes you even more of a badass. Goes Vice Versa as well so I think it'd be a great system

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