ESO is using Hero Engine afterall...

Dihoru

Originally posted by Knotwood

Originally posted by Dihoru

Originally posted by Knotwood

because they used any part of the Hero's engine in their development they had to use it in credits, its part of the agreement.

 

As far as ESO having its own engine, it does...  I think you have to research more on this before posting, puts some links up ect to see how ESO is different monster then the other games hero engine. 

 

Its one day from launch so I'm not doing that research for you...  have at it

It wouldn't say powered by then, it would merely mention it with a emblem in the intro splash-screen. There's something off there and that's it.

Like I said, I'm not going to do all the work for you....

http://www.heroengine.com/support/terms-of-service/

Here is a good place to start...   "And the truth, shall set you free"

Gods you are denser than on your 10 mil thread... get me a copy of the contract between the HE license holders and ESO's developers because posting a link to the boiler plate TOS for novice developers isn't winning you any points.

Oh and:

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein.

 

Shoko_Lied

Originally posted by jestahr

My face when I was greeted by a "POWERED BY HERO ENGINE" splash screen while installing the launch client.

For those unaware, Hero is the same engine that powers SWTOR. The funny thing is ZOS made a big fuss that Hero Engine was only used for early testing, and that they had built their own engine for the full release. Apparently that was just damage control to distance the game from SWTOR whilst that ship was sinking in 2012/2013.

So now it makes perfect sense why they have no plans for speech bubbles, they cripple the performance of the fragile Hero engine as was evident in SWTOR when they removed them completely in early beta never to be seen again.

I wonder what other suprises are in store. Perhaps they will follow SWTOR's F2P within a year business model too.

The Hero Engine wasn't developed for SWTOR. BW just leased rights to develop with it. Hero Engine shouldn't be getting this much flack just because one developer did something that you don't like with it.

baphamet

so just to be clear, you either think it's a conspiracy and they totally lied through their teeth about making their own in house graphics engine, or you adhere to reality. lol

Knotwood

Originally posted by reeereee

 

2) Zenimax has really really bad lawyers and they found themselves being contractually obligated to post a hero engine advertisement that makes it look like they're running the hero engine even though they haven't used it for years.

they were legaly obligated to put that starting screen on the game the second they decided to use hero engine in any stage of their development.   they knew it was going to have to be posted up there, if it wasn't, they would be sued by hero engine for breaking their agreement with them.  That simple. 

 

Lets use common sense here. we know it was used in the very first stages of the development.

Teala

Originally posted by PAL-18
explains all the dumbing down and instancing and phasing and stuff.

Yep...and probably why there is no underwater swimming, painted on armor...hero engine can't handle it.

rogue187

The repopulation is using hero engine...sorry but that game has ArcheAge runnin for its money as far as features..seems to me as long as they can produce then who cares what engine runs it...in the end we want fun and features..the method is irrelevant

 

Whitebeards

Originally posted by Teala

Originally posted by PAL-18
explains all the dumbing down and instancing and phasing and stuff.

Yep...and probably why there is no underwater swimming, painted on armor...hero engine can't handle it.

To give smooth 200 players battle they made a lot of sacrificies... painted on armor is one of those sacrifices for sake of performance.

Cant have 200 vs 200 battles and amazing looking graphics with highly pixelised armors at the same time.

Righteous_Rock

When beta testing, SWTOR is all I could think about - my nord run animations even look like SWTOR jedi running - they both run like they have sticks up their butts or lower lumbar pain.

baphamet

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Originally posted by reeereee
Originally posted by baphamet   Originally posted by M0rbid And also...if the game does not use Hero Engine they would not be contractually obliged to display it on the splash screen either. Do you have a pre prepared marketing quote to get around that fact too?

  marketing quote? i provided a direct quote from one of these lead devs explaining that they licensed the hero engine and what they used it for. since they licensed it, that would explain why they are obligated to display it on the splash screen. hero engine is not being used in the launch version of ESO, get over it.  

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There are only two possible conclusions:

 

1)  Matt Firor is lying.  (not like that hasn't happened before)

 

2) Zenimax has really really bad lawyers and they found themselves being contractually obligated to post a hero engine advertisement that makes it look like they're running the hero engine even though they haven't used it for years.

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i am not going to pretend i know all the legal aspects of it but it would seem to me that if they licensed it (which there is no question that they did) and used it to develop content for the game, they would have to credit the hero engine in some way.

also, i agree devs have lied before about certain things but not about something this major, not from a AAA developer at least.

this would be a first and i don't buy that at all, just because of the splash screen lol

Octagon7711

Originally posted by reeereee

Originally posted by baphamet

 

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Originally posted by M0rbid
And also...if the game does not use Hero Engine they would not be contractually obliged to display it on the splash screen either. Do you have a pre prepared marketing quote to get around that fact too?

---

 

marketing quote? i provided a direct quote from one of these lead devs explaining that they licensed the hero engine and what they used it for.

since they licensed it, that would explain why they are obligated to display it on the splash screen.

hero engine is not being used in the launch version of ESO, get over it.

 

There are only two possible conclusions:

 

1)  Matt Firor is lying.  (not like that hasn't happened before)

 

2) Zenimax has really really bad lawyers and they found themselves being contractually obligated to post a hero engine advertisement that makes it look like they're running the hero engine even though they haven't used it for years.

Sounds like being used as a whiteboard means some elements of the code is being used in the game.  Makes no matter to me but why make it sound like it's not being used at all and as others said still use the splash screen which in my mind means it's being used, unless it's advertisement for additional income.  Next comes the Pepsi splash screen.  :-)

Yoda_Clone

Guys (and gals, if any in this thread), we've got how many hours until the game starts?

THINK ABOUT IT.

At this point, you've already decided to play (or not); you've already spent your money (or not); and whether or not the Hero Engine is in use... repeat after me:  IT JUST DOESN'T MATTER... IT JUST DOESN"T MATTER... IT JUST DOESN"T MATTER.

If the game is full of bugs when we start playing in the morning, we'll all quit playing, never pay a dollar of subscription money, and those that want to can say "We told you so!"

If the game runs fine, we'll all breathe a sigh of relief that we haven't once again signed up to play a bad game... and we won't give a rat's ass whether or not it's using the Hero Engine.

IT JUST DOESN'T MATTER.

Say it a few times.  You'll feel better.

EDIT: Typo

reeereee

Originally posted by Knotwood

Originally posted by reeereee

 

2) Zenimax has really really bad lawyers and they found themselves being contractually obligated to post a hero engine advertisement that makes it look like they're running the hero engine even though they haven't used it for years.

they were legaly obligated to put that starting screen on the game the second they decided to use hero engine in any stage of their development.   they knew it was going to have to be posted up there, if it wasn't, they would be sued by hero engine for breaking their agreement with them.  That simple. 

 

Lets use common sense here. we know it was used in the very first stages of the development.

Which means their lawyers are terrible if they couldn't negotiate a clause preventing an engine they haven't used anywhere other than the earliest stage of development to take credit for the game.

MsPtibiscuit

I thought they had developped their own engine, too. Meh, as long as the game is good. The engine doesn't matter, it's what they make out of it that matters.

Knotwood

Originally posted by Shoko_Lied

 

The Hero Engine wasn't developed for SWTOR. BW just leased rights to develop with it. Hero Engine shouldn't be getting this much flack just because one developer did something that you don't like with it.

I actually tend to agree with this statement.   We should never hold a game engine responsible for the crapy developments of an IP.   The fault of any game never should lie with its game engine, but the creator of said crapy game.

Distopia

Originally posted by reeereee

Originally posted by Knotwood

Originally posted by reeereee

 

2) Zenimax has really really bad lawyers and they found themselves being contractually obligated to post a hero engine advertisement that makes it look like they're running the hero engine even though they haven't used it for years.

they were legaly obligated to put that starting screen on the game the second they decided to use hero engine in any stage of their development.   they knew it was going to have to be posted up there, if it wasn't, they would be sued by hero engine for breaking their agreement with them.  That simple. 

 

Lets use common sense here. we know it was used in the very first stages of the development.

Which means their lawyers are terrible if they couldn't negotiate a clause preventing an engine they haven't used anywhere other than the earliest stage of development to take credit for the game.

Or they just weren't worried about it...

kishe

Bioware took early beta of heroengine and built their own engine around it.

 

Zenimax online took finalized version of hero engine and built their own engine around it.

Ramonski7

Originally posted by reeereee

Originally posted by baphamet

 

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Originally posted by M0rbid
And also...if the game does not use Hero Engine they would not be contractually obliged to display it on the splash screen either. Do you have a pre prepared marketing quote to get around that fact too?

---

 

marketing quote? i provided a direct quote from one of these lead devs explaining that they licensed the hero engine and what they used it for.

since they licensed it, that would explain why they are obligated to display it on the splash screen.

hero engine is not being used in the launch version of ESO, get over it.

 

There are only two possible conclusions:

 

1)  Matt Firor is lying.  (not like that hasn't happened before)

 

2) Zenimax has really really bad lawyers and they found themselves being contractually obligated to post a hero engine advertisement that makes it look like they're running the hero engine even though they haven't used it for years.

Directly from the Terms of Agreement linked above:

 

Branding. Developer shall comply with Idea Fabrik’s trademark and branding guidelines, including, without limitation, all attribution requirements, which guidelines are available at the Idea Fabrik documentation website, in the Game. Subject to the terms and conditions contained in this Agreement, and further subject to any prior licenses or third-party agreements with respect thereto, each party hereby grants to the other party a non-exclusive, non-transferable, non-sublicenseable right and license during the Term (and as otherwise permitted under Section 12.3) to use the other party’s Brand exclusively in connection with any Game, and the limited purposes of exercising its rights and performing its obligations, at all times in strict accordance with this Agreement. Notwithstanding the foregoing, Idea Fabrik reserves the right to have its marks removed from the Developer’s Game(s) at its sole discretion.  Each party will retain all right, title and interest in and to its Brand, and all goodwill associated therewith will inure solely to the benefit of such party. Each party will not challenge, or assist others to challenge the other party’s Brand, or attempt to register any trademarks, trade names, service marks or logos confusingly similar to the other party’s Brand. - See more at: http://www.heroengine.com/support/terms-of-service/#sthash.uzYsuXB7.dpuf

 

Sounds like he's about right to me....and I ain't even buying the game anymore.

Pyatra

When through launcher and splash screens..... no Hero Engine splash.... um, seriously.  Either post a screenshot someone or I call Bull S&^t

Hengist

Strange.....

When I load up I get Bethesda...then Zenimax Online, then Havok. I see absolutely no reference at for for "Powered by Hero Engine" at all. Love to see a screen shot of it.....

sgel

Originally posted by baphamet

 

also, i agree devs have lied before about certain things but not about something this major, not from a AAA developer at least.

this would be a first and i don't buy that at all, just because of the splash screen lol

So you still haven't given an intelligent explanation about the splash screen.

Also Mythic lying about how PvP points worked in Warhammer was a pretty big lie.

 

My theory is they're using a heavily modified version of the Hero engine. Why else would they need the splash screen.

And if they had they're own engine why haven't they advertised it more?... hell maybe even the name of their engine

 

alterfenix

Originally posted by M0rbid
What has been disproved exactly? Are you saying that ESO does not use the Hero Engine? Or are you saying the Hero Engine doesn't become crippled when adding chat bubbles?

Would love to see your sources as most people know both of those statements are true.

For starters http://www.heroengine.com/heroengine/heroengine-client-specifications/

HeroEngine is Windows exclusive while TESO is also available for Mac (native client not some Wine wrapper) and will come to PS4 and Xbox soon.

I believe HeroEngine's graphics support is built around Direct3D. Direct3D is Windows exclusive again and again TESO does not use Wine and is coming to consoles.

HeroEngine does not support technologies even similar to megaserver nor anything big that could potentially support it with no major modification. So even if it is HeroEngine then it would have to be HE totally rewritten anyway (like DirectX out or only optional - both approaches are usually tough unless code is good).

And to all HeroEngine haters. Not saying that it is so great engine at all. But keep in mind that i.e. both Rift and Oblivion are using Gamebryo. Do they look the same? Is performance the same (with no players around you in Rift)?

Hengist

It is kind of funny how many conspiracy theorists jumped out of the woodwork without an ounce of evidence.....

baphamet

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Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by reeereee Originally posted by Knotwood Originally posted by reeereee   2) Zenimax has really really bad lawyers and they found themselves being contractually obligated to post a hero engine advertisement that makes it look like they're running the hero engine even though they haven't used it for years.

they were legaly obligated to put that starting screen on the game the second they decided to use hero engine in any stage of their development.   they knew it was going to have to be posted up there, if it wasn't, they would be sued by hero engine for breaking their agreement with them.  That simple.    Lets use common sense here. we know it was used in the very first stages of the development.

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Which means their lawyers are terrible if they couldn't negotiate a clause preventing an engine they haven't used anywhere other than the earliest stage of development to take credit for the game.

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Or they just weren't worried about it...

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exactly, it says zenimax and bethesda blasted all over it already.

alterfenix

Originally posted by sgel

Originally posted by baphamet

 

also, i agree devs have lied before about certain things but not about something this major, not from a AAA developer at least.

this would be a first and i don't buy that at all, just because of the splash screen lol

So you still haven't given an intelligent explanation about the splash screen.

Also Mythic lying about how PvP points worked in Warhammer was a pretty big lie.

 

My theory is they're using a heavily modified version of the Hero engine. Why else would they need the splash screen.

And if they had they're own engine why haven't they advertised it more?... hell maybe even the name of their engine

 

Simple HE for prototyping, real engine for release. Showing such information may be still required in order to meet licence requirements as even with such approach HeroEngine is used in development or testing, or build process. Keep in mind that we have no idea what agreements they have.

Also engine for WoW is also known widely more as WoW's engine with some calling it "the engine that evolved from Warcraft 3 engine":-) No need to advertise the technology that you do not intend to sell anyway.

Iselin

Originally posted by Baikal

Strange.....

When I load up I get Bethesda...then Zenimax Online, then Havok. I see absolutely no reference at for for "Powered by Hero Engine" at all. Love to see a screen shot of it.....

You only see it on a new install, not the splash screens on load... and it's a new thing.

 

When I originally installed my beta client a few months back, it didn't say that. But I just re-installed clean about a week ago to get it on my faster SSD and I saw it at install only.

 

I have no idea what it means...it's got enough Hero still for install credits but not for launch credits? I guess if anyone is interested they can read the Hero lease contract fine print and find out why it needs to be mentioned in one and not the other,