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How they Butchered the starting experience of all future players.

DatastarDatastar Austin, TXPosts: 195Member Common

I just want it known that before the last beta the game and its starting tutorial and subsequent starting islands were as close to perfection as you can get in terms of a story and lore filled game as you can get.  With their latest and last rendition of beta build they forced people to the main city and made those islands which in my opinion are vital to understanding the lore behind the factions "optional" content.

My experience in that beta was nothing short of confusion and disgust,  it felt like they wrote a book and then because some people complained they didnt like the first 3 chapters they ripped them out of the book and just drew a giant arrow on a piece of paper pointing to the main city and taped it in its place.  I dont have an issue with skipping the starter islands at all but to force everyone to the city which to be fair is overwhelming, confusing, and poorly executed is a terrible choice and when launch date hits and the complaints start rolling in they will realize what a mistake they have made.  

In closing you only get one first impression and due to these latest changes i feel its going to be a bad one for many.  I only wish to advocate this game and not see it fail as I really enjoy the aspects of the game but to cater to a small vocal minority and ignore the rest of the playerbase is...disturbing.

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Comments

  • NightliteNightlite Maple Grove, MNPosts: 95Member Uncommon
    Farily certain only your second character gets the free port to the main city.
  • DatastarDatastar Austin, TXPosts: 195Member Common
    No you only get the choice to skip the prison the starting islands are optional for all now and the story is completely borked due to this.
  • NatjurNatjur WellingtonPosts: 124Member

    Even your first char will bypass the starter island but they are added a new quest dude at the place you land now who will tell you about the island and give you a quest to go there. (this was not there in the last beta but will be for early release)

     

    Fixed

     

    You now have the best of both worlds

    image

  • SenanSenan Tuscaloosa, ALPosts: 783Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Natjur

    Even your first char will bypass the starter island but they are added a new quest dude at the place you land now who will tell you about the island and give you a quest to go there.

     

    Fixed

     

    You now have the best of both worlds

    That seems so backwards to me. Why wouldn't they do what just about every other mmorpg (with a seperate tutorial area) has done in the past and start you there by default -- with the option to leave if you don't want to stay? Doing it in the opposite order seems strange.

    image
  • RedCurryRedCurry Frisco, TXPosts: 70Member Uncommon
    Should require to do starting areas at least once, then option to skip with any character after that.
  • DatastarDatastar Austin, TXPosts: 195Member Common
    thats not a fix its a bandaid thats falling off if you havent participated in the last few beta's you wouldnt understand.
  • kartoolkartool Hamilton, ONPosts: 472Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Datastar
    No you only get the choice to skip the prison the starting islands are optional for all now and the story is completely borked due to this.

    The game isn't released and you have no idea how they are actually going to handle it at release. It's possible you will be given an option after character creation to enter the tutorial or not, or they'll make your first character have to go through the starter area, or whatever. Anyone who has played through a few betas now is sick of the starter stuff and I see no reason to do it again at release. As long as there's a choice to do that part of the game for new players, you really have nothing to complain about. Choice is better than no choice, it's something devs are hopefully starting to learn.

  • ArndushArndush Dallas, TXPosts: 303Member
    I discussed this in another thread. I think they could've handled it a little better if they have done this;
     
    Originally posted by Arndush

    I still think it would be better and make more sense just to go to the starter island first, have Razum-Dar say, "Nice landing, Razum-Dar would've added a back flip, but not bad. By the way, we could really use your help here and it would help to blend in, since you fell from the sky. But, if you like to stand out, by all means, take this note to the docks and you can go straight to the mainland."

    I just think it would flow better than having to skip the island, only to go back to it if you want to.

     

     
  • DatastarDatastar Austin, TXPosts: 195Member Common
    Im just saying they butchered the experience for me and many many more, i have several friends who participated in that last beta for the first time and wont touch this game after that.  It made me look like a fool to them for recommending this title to them based on prior play sessions i had.  Are they addressing the broken quests yes, are they making the starting islands easier to get to from the city yes, but did they fix the flow and continuity the game previously had at the start hell no.
  • Bad.dogBad.dog Belleville, ONPosts: 1,108Member
    That's what the squeaky wheel get's ....the vocal minority ruined it for the majority
  • ZegalothZegaloth Gladstone, ORPosts: 54Member
    Originally posted by Datastar
    Im just saying they butchered the experience for me and many many more, i have several friends who participated in that last beta for the first time and wont touch this game after that.  It made me look like a fool to them for recommending this title to them based on prior play sessions i had.  Are they addressing the broken quests yes, are they making the starting islands easier to get to from the city yes, but did they fix the flow and continuity the game previously had at the start hell no.

    There is a quest to go there as soon as you get out of the tutorial, and you are near the boat from the get go. You are blowing something way out of proportion. If you and many others are after the lore, then you will end up going there right away anyways, and the people who want to skip the starter zone will.

     

    There are many things to whine and cry about, but this change isn't one of them. I was happy that I wasn't forced to be on the island right off the bat, and I am sure many others feel the same (See what I did there?).

  • kartoolkartool Hamilton, ONPosts: 472Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Datastar
    Im just saying they butchered the experience for me and many many more, i have several friends who participated in that last beta for the first time and wont touch this game after that.  It made me look like a fool to them for recommending this title to them based on prior play sessions i had.  Are they addressing the broken quests yes, are they making the starting islands easier to get to from the city yes, but did they fix the flow and continuity the game previously had at the start hell no.

    It was a beta test. Enough people have tested the starter areas, and it's a damn good thing people were skipped past it since it ended up with introduction of a giant issue with quests in highly populated areas breaking. Beta's are for finding problems so I'd say this last one did it's job.

    For all you know, they won't even have the option to skip at release, maybe it was just done for beta. You and your friends need to take a deep breathe and wait to see what they decide to do.

  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCPosts: 5,611Member Uncommon

    At least they made another change. When you get off the boat now the first NPC you see who will be in your face is the one directing you back to the starter Islands.

     

    Still, I'd liked it better if they did it the other way: sending you to the starter island and given you an NPC there to let you skip it - with an appropriate caution that if you're new, you probably shouldn't skip it.

     

    It's all Bill Murphy's fault :)

  • DatastarDatastar Austin, TXPosts: 195Member Common
    Originally posted by Zegaloth
    Originally posted by Datastar
    Im just saying they butchered the experience for me and many many more, i have several friends who participated in that last beta for the first time and wont touch this game after that.  It made me look like a fool to them for recommending this title to them based on prior play sessions i had.  Are they addressing the broken quests yes, are they making the starting islands easier to get to from the city yes, but did they fix the flow and continuity the game previously had at the start hell no.

    There is a quest to go there as soon as you get out of the tutorial, and you are near the boat from the get go. You are blowing something way out of proportion. If you and many others are after the lore, then you will end up going there right away anyways, and the people who want to skip the starter zone will.

     

    There are many things to whine and cry about, but this change isn't one of them. I was happy that I wasn't forced to be on the island right off the bat, and I am sure many others feel the same (See what I did there?).

    Do you even rp or read lore in games? The act of going back optionally somewhere you supposedly had already been to be treated as if you had never been there in the first place BREAKS THE LORE and IMMERSION.  unless of course they introduced time travel which would be new to me. 

  • ZegalothZegaloth Gladstone, ORPosts: 54Member

    Caps lock so everyone can hear you.

     

    I run a weekly Palladium campaign so yes I lift.

    I just don't whine on a 3rd party forum about miniscule issues as if they are game breaking. Losing immersion for a 1/10th of a second isn't a big deal to me, and they will probably fix the lore to properly fit the change, but complaining on MMORPG like its going to destroy the game is hilarious.

     

    Also time travel was needed in Skyrim to retrieve the shout needed to kill the dragons, do you even read the lore or RP, or do you just find things to complain about for the sake of it?

  • MpfiveMpfive LondonPosts: 295Member
    Originally posted by Datastar

    I just want it known that before the last beta the game and its starting tutorial and subsequent starting islands were as close to perfection as you can get in terms of a story and lore filled game as you can get.  With their latest and last rendition of beta build they forced people to the main city and made those islands which in my opinion are vital to understanding the lore behind the factions "optional" content.

    My experience in that beta was nothing short of confusion and disgust,  it felt like they wrote a book and then because some people complained they didnt like the first 3 chapters they ripped them out of the book and just drew a giant arrow on a piece of paper pointing to the main city and taped it in its place.  I dont have an issue with skipping the starter islands at all but to force everyone to the city which to be fair is overwhelming, confusing, and poorly executed is a terrible choice and when launch date hits and the complaints start rolling in they will realize what a mistake they have made.  

    In closing you only get one first impression and due to these latest changes i feel its going to be a bad one for many.  I only wish to advocate this game and not see it fail as I really enjoy the aspects of the game but to cater to a small vocal minority and ignore the rest of the playerbase is...disturbing.

    I'm sure you're get over it ;)

  • DatastarDatastar Austin, TXPosts: 195Member Common
    Originally posted by Zegaloth

    Caps lock so everyone can hear you.

     

    I run a weekly Palladium campaign so yes I lift.

    I just don't whine on a 3rd party forum about miniscule issues as if they are game breaking. Losing immersion for a 1/10th of a second isn't a big deal to me, and they will probably fix the lore to properly fit the change, but complaining on MMORPG like its going to destroy the game is hilarious.

    Well i just wanted to make my point clear as you seemed to not clearly understand the issue at hand, now that you do perhaps ill take my finger off the shift button.  As someone who has pre-ordered a product I have the right to voice my opinion and be concerned with the actions taken by ZOS to sacrifice story and lore to make the game easier(which was already easy to begin with). So on that note while you are entitled to your opinion unless you've got something constructive to add i bid you farewell as my eyes will gaze elsewhere in the future.

  • Doriangray1Doriangray1 Los Angeles, CAPosts: 53Member
    Your first toon still have to go through the islands. Plus, you have the option to choose what you want to do. No one is twisting your hand to skip it. I enjoy the lore... I have been playing other elder scrolls games...You are just over dramatizing things here. I am okay with people who don't care about the lore and the ones that do. You do not have to interact with everybody in the game. The main purpose behind making games is money, everything else comes second. They reached a happy medium where people who didn't like those parts can skip it... you still don't have to. Many people just want to rush to the end game. It's their choice and experience. You shouldn't try to interfere with that. Just do as you please and play however you want.

    Rubber duck is incapable of hate.

    " The extinction of Rubber Ducks will bring forth the end of our days. "

  • jdlamson75jdlamson75 Jacksonville, FLPosts: 984Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Datastar
    Im just saying they butchered the experience for me and many many more, i have several friends who participated in that last beta for the first time and wont touch this game after that.  It made me look like a fool to them for recommending this title to them based on prior play sessions i had.  Are they addressing the broken quests yes, are they making the starting islands easier to get to from the city yes, but did they fix the flow and continuity the game previously had at the start hell no.

    Your friends won't play because the tutorial isn't the best?  The tutorial area?  The part that equals out to be less than 1% of what they'll see should they decide to play on?  Tutorial zone?  Tutorial?  We talkin' 'bout tutorial, man.  Tutorial.  It's a tutorial.

  • DatastarDatastar Austin, TXPosts: 195Member Common
    Originally posted by jdlamson75
    Originally posted by Datastar
    Im just saying they butchered the experience for me and many many more, i have several friends who participated in that last beta for the first time and wont touch this game after that.  It made me look like a fool to them for recommending this title to them based on prior play sessions i had.  Are they addressing the broken quests yes, are they making the starting islands easier to get to from the city yes, but did they fix the flow and continuity the game previously had at the start hell no.

    Your friends won't play because the tutorial isn't the best?  The tutorial area?  The part that equals out to be less than 1% of what they'll see should they decide to play on?  Tutorial zone?  Tutorial?  We talkin' 'bout tutorial, man.  Tutorial.  It's a tutorial.

    In a mmorpg crowded market with many options and many failed titles that left a bad taste in many peoples mouths is it so hard to believe that all a game gets anymore is its first impressions?

  • ZegalothZegaloth Gladstone, ORPosts: 54Member
    Originally posted by Datastar
    Originally posted by Zegaloth

    Caps lock so everyone can hear you.

     

    I run a weekly Palladium campaign so yes I lift.

    I just don't whine on a 3rd party forum about miniscule issues as if they are game breaking. Losing immersion for a 1/10th of a second isn't a big deal to me, and they will probably fix the lore to properly fit the change, but complaining on MMORPG like its going to destroy the game is hilarious.

    Well i just wanted to make my point clear as you seemed to not clearly understand the issue at hand, now that you do perhaps ill take my finger off the shift button.  As someone who has pre-ordered a product I have the right to voice my opinion and be concerned with the actions taken by ZOS to sacrifice story and lore to make the game easier(which was already easy to begin with). So on that note while you are entitled to your opinion unless you've got something constructive to add i bid you farewell as my eyes will gaze elsewhere in the future.

    Well then why don't you go to the official forums and voice them in a spot that matters? I seriously doubt Zenimax employees would come to a site where almost every topic is someone whining about the game, or heralding its death.
     If you want to provide constructive support for the game you pre ordered then do it, but here isn't the place unless you are linking to a thread on their forums pertaining to what you are so irate about.

     

    I pre ordered, and I am fine with the change as long as the change the 3 or 4 lines of dialogue that doesn't sync up with you traveling by boat instead of falling out of the sky (Which I could really care less about anyways).

  • DatastarDatastar Austin, TXPosts: 195Member Common
    Originally posted by Zegaloth
    Originally posted by Datastar
    Originally posted by Zegaloth

    Caps lock so everyone can hear you.

     

    I run a weekly Palladium campaign so yes I lift.

    I just don't whine on a 3rd party forum about miniscule issues as if they are game breaking. Losing immersion for a 1/10th of a second isn't a big deal to me, and they will probably fix the lore to properly fit the change, but complaining on MMORPG like its going to destroy the game is hilarious.

    Well i just wanted to make my point clear as you seemed to not clearly understand the issue at hand, now that you do perhaps ill take my finger off the shift button.  As someone who has pre-ordered a product I have the right to voice my opinion and be concerned with the actions taken by ZOS to sacrifice story and lore to make the game easier(which was already easy to begin with). So on that note while you are entitled to your opinion unless you've got something constructive to add i bid you farewell as my eyes will gaze elsewhere in the future.

    Well then why don't you go to the official forums and voice them in a spot that matters? I seriously doubt Zenimax employees would come to a site where almost every topic is someone whining about the game, or heralding its death.
     If you want to provide constructive support for the game you pre ordered then do it, but here isn't the place unless you are linking to a thread on their forums pertaining to what you are so irate about.

     

    I pre ordered, and I am fine with the change as long as the change the 3 or 4 lines of dialogue that doesn't sync up with you traveling by boat instead of falling out of the sky (Which I could really care less about anyways).

    I have thank you, as well as on Reddit AMA but thanks for checking.  In fact this is the best place to post as many people come here before they buy a new mmorpg, this is one of the very places where the change came from initially as well but once again ive put my eyes apon your text and left equally dissatisfied there wont be a third time.

  • StilerStiler Athens, TNPosts: 599Member

    I do not get some of the people that are getting so upset over this change.

     

    If you read any news or previews, before the NDA was dropped when the gaming sites were allowed to post impressions a while back almost ALL of them were negative and terrible BECAUSE of this "starting island."

    They talked about how it felt enclosed and not "open" like a TES game, it was a bunch of negative press all around.

     

    Then finally when they got off the starting islands and into the game further the impressions started to drastically change for hte better.

     

    It was obvious the starting islands were giving people a bad "first impression" of the game whereas the main islands were giving a much better impression.

     

    So Zenimax made them OPTIONAL, they were a pain to find and so now they are adding the npc right outside the door from where you start on the main island that will lead new players and people to the starting islands IF they wish to go there.

     

    So how on earth is this BAD in any way? It gives peopel a way to skip it, it allows for that "open" feeling of the TES seires, and the area's that you wanted are STILL there.

     

    This has to be one of the strangest things I've seen people get upset over.

  • MardukkMardukk Posts: 1,556Member Uncommon
    OP, your friends are willing to quit an MMO because the story is a bit disjointed?  Why are they playing MMO's for the "story" anyway, I thought single player games and books were for telling stories.
  • DatastarDatastar Austin, TXPosts: 195Member Common

      I am not alone so silly people unite

    Poll: About the starting zone (477 member(s) have cast votes)

    Do you miss the old weapon choice in the prison? Voted Yes (362 votes [76.05%]) No (90 votes [18.91%]) No opinion (24 votes [5.04%])

    Do you feel the story line is now broken? Voted Yes (239 votes [50.21%]) No (186 votes [39.08%]) No opinion (51 votes [10.71%])

    Do you want to skip the starting island? Yes (61 votes [12.82%]) Voted No (378 votes [79.41%]) No opinion (37 votes [7.77%])

    Do you mind poping on the starter island then taking the boat to the main land? Yes, let me pop directly on the main island (57 votes [11.97%]) Voted No, I'm ok with that (377 votes [79.20%]) No opinion (42 votes [8.82%])

    Would you prefer the option: "Go to the starter island" and "Skip the starter island" to pop at the end of the prison? Voted Yes (296 votes [63.38%]) No, it's fine like it is now (86 votes [18.42%]) Other, please precise in a comm (31 votes [6.64%]) No opinion (54 votes [11.56%])

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