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[Column] Elder Scrolls Online: I’m OK with ESO Faction Turncoats

SBFordSBFord Associate Editor - News ManagerThe Land of AZPosts: 16,581MMORPG.COM Staff Uncommon

There’s been a lot of controversy lately about “faction turncoats” now that it’s known pre-ordering any version of Elder Scrolls Online will allow you to play any race in any faction of the game. What’s funny to me is that this is the kind of thing players have been dying for Zenimax to allow. But now that we have it (even if it’s tied to pre-orders), the folks who wanted factions to remain race-locked are now speaking out about how they think this move is a.) A cash grab or b.) Somehow wronging the lore or c.) Breaking the game’s PVP. I wanted to ramble a bit today about why I think all three upset parties are crying over a bit of spilt milk, and why this is all better for the game in my eyes.

Read more of Bill Murphy's Elder Scrolls Online:  I'm OK with Faction Turncoats.

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Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
Follow me on Twitter: @MMORPGMom

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Comments

  • HrothaHrotha -Posts: 821Member
    Good for you, Bill.

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  • handlewithcarehandlewithcare hartenbosPosts: 322Member

    I wanted to be a high elf with aldmeri dominion but ill be an imperial,still sticking to aldmeri faction.

    ill play a imperial scared I will not get my extras if I play any other race[imperial addition]

  • blazzen67blazzen67 Virginia Beach, VAPosts: 65Member

    just have to argue one point with you and that's My opinion on the Imperial edition. I don't have a problem with it because #1, The imperial Race isn't more powerful than any other race in the game #2 doesn't give anyone an advantage over any other player in the game and doesn't impact the game what so ever, and #3, anyone can make imperial weapons and armor. to me, the imperial edition is just a way to promote the game and to sell the game. Which is no different than any other developer that has released an MMO. Besides, Zenimax never said that the race can not be unlocked through game play for the life of the game. When i first heard about the imperial race, the first thought that i had was "well, that's cool, they are giving people an early chance to play the race instead of through game play at a later date". Sort of what WOW did with the death knight.  At first i did have a problem with the "any race in any alliance" thing, but after reading your article, you have changed my stance, what you wrote makes sense...every war had defectors

     

  • dontadowdontadow Detroit, MIPosts: 1,044Member

    I like it cause it allows me to play the race i want with friends of another race. I want to be an orc, i'm always an orc, but my wife wants to be a cat woman. Now we both win. And it goes great with my whole back story of being one of the good orcs.

    If we're going for realism, everyone of a race isn't bad or good. I like that approach.

  • AnthurAnthur StolbergPosts: 686Member Uncommon

    I don't really care about the cash grab, although it's a quite cheap way to do it.

    But imo it's definately bad for AvA because it just makes all alliances too equal. The great part about DAoC RvR was that the realms were so different. Different races, different classes, different lore. That was the reason why up to now you still find Midgards who taunt (not sure it is the right word) Albs and Hibbies and vice versa.

    Now ESO AvA just looks like GW2 WvW, there is no pride for your faction because it is actually just like any other faction.

  • dkmp117dkmp117 RoosendaalPosts: 3Member
    It'd be rather silly if this would end up that there'd be more members from other races than the races from the actual alliance.
  • GillleanGilllean NewYork, ALPosts: 169Member
    The only Problem is that it's for pre order ! I got my CE.. but I find it unfair that they sell not full access to game considering that other people pay for box as well..... if this was IN BOX it would be ok BUT limited to preorders and later will be in cash shop is a cash grab. Fraction unlock it self is ok if we remember TES always was full of random races and with random background.
  • orbitxoorbitxo fort lauderdale, FLPosts: 1,405Member Uncommon
    xcly bill, ill be a high elf in snowy slopes now!
  • garrettgarrett Posts: 260MMORPG.COM Staff Uncommon
    Yep, now I can play an EbonHeart orc. 
     :p 
  • PurutzilPurutzil East Stroudsburg, PAPosts: 2,923Member Uncommon
    See, most people I don't think have a problem with factions having all races possibly being on any side.... its the fact you need to preorder to have it (or buy collectors to be an imperial) that bother most people.
  • ElRenmazuoElRenmazuo Alexandria, VAPosts: 4,546Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by blazzen67

    just have to argue one point with you and that's My opinion on the Imperial edition. I don't have a problem with it because #1, The imperial Race isn't more powerful than any other race in the game #2 doesn't give anyone an advantage over any other player in the game and doesn't impact the game what so ever, and #3, anyone can make imperial weapons and armor. to me, the imperial edition is just a way to promote the game and to sell the game. Which is no different than any other developer that has released an MMO. Besides, Zenimax never said that the race can not be unlocked through game play for the life of the game. When i first heard about the imperial race, the first thought that i had was "well, that's cool, they are giving people an early chance to play the race instead of through game play at a later date". Sort of what WOW did with the death knight.  At first i did have a problem with the "any race in any alliance" thing, but after reading your article, you have changed my stance, what you wrote makes sense...every war had defectors

     

    What if my Dark Elf character is born and raised or an orphan raised in Darggerfall, will I still be considered defector because of my race?

  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Niagara Falls, NYPosts: 3,436Member Uncommon
    Argonian Sorcerer raised by a High Elf here! Happy as hell.

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  • evilastroevilastro EdinburghPosts: 4,270Member
    It should have been a betrayal quest line in the game proper.  Not emotional blackmail to force players to become early adopters.
  • DignaDigna City, CTPosts: 2,014Member Uncommon

    I don't think it's a cash grab in the sense of greed but rather a cash infusion in terms of 'need'. Which creates  at least a background cautionary flag in the dim recesses of my mind.

    They maintained 'faction lock' ....until they did a complete about face. Why? Seems unlikely they just changed their minds. I applaud them for taking it in the gut (with the assumption that it occurred to stimulate a cash infusion) but it has left me with an echo of past bottoms falling out of past boats and hoping there is no future portent in this.

    I like this game. I bought the DCE. Looking forward to it and hoping it bloody wells goes on for a good long time.

  • GutrunnerGutrunner AarhusPosts: 11Member

    You missed the whole point about breaking PvP. For me it has nothing to do with balance. In fact the difference from each Alliance, or realm if you will, would be welcome.

    The PvP in this game is being compared to that of Dark Age of Camelot. In that game, you hated the enemy for various reasons but mainly because you could differentiate yourself from the enemy, be it race, class or something else. It was fun to hate Lurikeens because they were freaking annoying, and Animists because their shrooms were a pain to handle... all those things combined made the game and made the PvP. You had reasons why you didn't like a specific player, guild or whatever on the other side.

    That is basically ruined. The lines are so blurred and the "any race for all alliances" system made it even worse. Now you can look at the lore and make that your point, but most players won't. In a split second on the battlefield, you won't be able to tell the difference between each alliance - it's just colors now. That's what bothers me.

    It might not be an issue but it's still a valid concern.

  • Jerek_Jerek_ tulsa, OKPosts: 409Member

    The "cash grab" augment you make assumes that we have to pre-order any game we are interested in.  That would have been true before, but at this point I'm done with pre-ordering, no matter what perks they add. 

     

    Missing out on the normal kinds of items you get with pre-orders won't be a problem for me, but when they start linking game functionality to collectors editions and pre-orders it becomes an issue.  I don't really see it as any more of a cash grab than any other offer.  It won't convince me to pre-order games again-  I just don't feel I can know enough about an MMO to put money down before release, but knowing I can't freely choose my race or faction as punishment for not buying it blindly will stop me from buying it later.

     
     
     
  • TelondarielTelondariel Ottawa, ONPosts: 1,001Member
    Originally posted by Gutrunner

    You missed the whole point about breaking PvP. For me it has nothing to do with balance. In fact the difference from each Alliance, or realm if you will, would be welcome.

    The PvP in this game is being compared to that of Dark Age of Camelot. In that game, you hated the enemy for various reasons but mainly because you could differentiate yourself from the enemy, be it race, class or something else. It was fun to hate Lurikeens because they were freaking annoying, and Animists because their shrooms were a pain to handle... all those things combined made the game and made the PvP. You had reasons why you didn't like a specific player, guild or whatever on the other side.

    That is basically ruined. The lines are so blurred and the "any race for all alliances" system made it even worse. Now you can look at the lore and make that your point, but most players won't. In a split second on the battlefield, you won't be able to tell the difference between each alliance - it's just colors now. That's what bothers me.

    It might not be an issue but it's still a valid concern.

    "Red is dead" is still the rule, whatever the race is.  Makes it simple.

     

    I think there is so much going for the AvA system that you really need to adjust and dive in to support your alliance, or don't.  Nothing is ruined.  This is the closest thing to a DAoC2 we're going to see, and I'm certainly not going to let minor changes get me in a dither.

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  • UsualSuspectUsualSuspect CardiffPosts: 1,243Member

    What's with all the defending of ESO on this site? I'm sorry, but the 'any race any alliance' is not a good idea. You can make any excuse for it, anyone can go anywhere, sure, an orc might be raised differently, but this is a game we're talking about and the races and alliances are in place for a reason. If the races were guidelines, if they said the preferred race for the alliances were X, Y and Z, then fine, but they're not, they're there to differentiate the alliances.

    Now you can preorder and throw the alliances all out of whack, there's no immediate difference between the three alliances, anyone can belong to anything, and, to me, that breaks the entire point of splitting them up in the first place.

  • Jerek_Jerek_ tulsa, OKPosts: 409Member
    Originally posted by UsualSuspect

    What's with all the defending of ESO on this site? I'm sorry, but the 'any race any alliance' is not a good idea. You can make any excuse for it, anyone can go anywhere, sure, an orc might be raised differently, but this is a game we're talking about and the races and alliances are in place for a reason. If the races were guidelines, if they said the preferred race for the alliances were X, Y and Z, then fine, but they're not, they're there to differentiate the alliances.

    Now you can preorder and throw the alliances all out of whack, there's no immediate difference between the three alliances, anyone can belong to anything, and, to me, that breaks the entire point of splitting them up in the first place.

    or if your cynical, it shows that the entire point of splitting them up was to sell them back to us.

  • orbitxoorbitxo fort lauderdale, FLPosts: 1,405Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilastro
    It should have been a betrayal quest line in the game proper.  Not emotional blackmail to force players to become early adopters.

    this sounds good to me.

  • DrakynnDrakynn The Pas, MBPosts: 2,030Member
    Originally posted by Purutzil
    See, most people I don't think have a problem with factions having all races possibly being on any side.... its the fact you need to preorder to have it (or buy collectors to be an imperial) that bother most people.

    ^This.

    If they want to 180 on the whole faction race lock thing that they hyped up as an important game play feature then give it to everyone don't hide it behind preorders or a cash shop unlock later on.

    Honestly there's no practical reason for a faction race lock in this game anymore anyway.Any race can wear any other races armor style so factions already have no distinction in PvP anyways just generic armies on both sides so let people be any race they choose.

    To me this just indicates how Zenimax will act in the future with the game and makes me not want to trust them with my sub fee.So I am passing for now because of it.

    For the record I don't like the Imperial race being sold like it is but it wasn't a deal breaker and the rest of the Imperial edition stuff is fine.

  • VincyntVincynt Weyburn, SKPosts: 3Member
    Originally posted by evilastro
    It should have been a betrayal quest line in the game proper.  Not emotional blackmail to force players to become early adopters.

    I completely agree.  Though if it was a question you could do in the game to switch sides AND they gave people who pre-order the ability to "skip the quest" and just either a) start with the other faction or b) switch via an in-game npc after the starting area I'd be cool with that too.

  • VincyntVincynt Weyburn, SKPosts: 3Member
    Originally posted by Telondariel

    This is the closest thing to a DAoC2 we're going to see, and I'm certainly not going to let minor changes get me in a dither.

    If you're looking for DAoC2 this isn't the game you're looking for...  You should instead be following Camelot Unchained :p

  • discord235discord235 Woodland, CAPosts: 143Member Uncommon
    Personally I don't care too much about the lore, and to have faction restrictions is limiting. The less limiting in a game, the better.

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  • Nzscorpion80Nzscorpion80 sydneyPosts: 50Member
    Pretty sure there has been references to the alliances in previous ES lore. Like the Ebonheart pact where the Nords?dunmer & argonians joined up to kill some invading arkavi. They didn't just make these names up for the sake of ESO.
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