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The MMO industry is pathetic

supertouchmesupertouchme corpus christi, TXPosts: 68Member

Why do developers keep churning out games that don't inconvenience the player but also fail to engage? EQ Next is shaping up to be nothing more than a blend of all the sterile, casual features we've grown accustomed to over the last decade. Yeah, Guild War's system of running around and forming unstructured groups with people you don't even talk to was so fun! I can't wait to travel to any destination instantly like I'm playing Assassin's Creed.

This game will be devoid of peril and suspense but will be perfect for soccer moms who supposedly represent the MMO audience these days.

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Comments

  • evilastroevilastro EdinburghPosts: 4,270Member
    And you are basing this little rant on what exactly?
  • NavinJohnsonNavinJohnson albquerque, NMPosts: 60Member
    We look forward to playing your solution after you fund and develop it.
  • ClywdClywd HeidenheimPosts: 258Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilastro
    And you are basing this little rant on what exactly?

    Maybe on all the information that SOE published so far?

    Currently playing: EQ1
    Ruptura Draconis
    Waiting for Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member

    You've got to give credit to SOE in some respect:

    1) They're deploying some really really good tech for this (forgelight, voxel-farm, story-bricks, experienced mmo team etc)

    2) They're following the current market rage: Create a software platform for 3d-object building integrated with the cash-shop via player-player sales of in-game assets (See minecraft, starforge by microsoft and some other project who's name I've forgotten)

    On that basis I think they'll find success as there's a big market out there it seems AND it is pushing the mmorpg genre a bit wider with building stuff as well as combating stuff. That all said it's not my bag, but I can appreciate it for what it is and could be. There seems to be a strong interest and following already and seems the middle of the market approach.

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member

    SOE has tried to monetize players more than any other dev

    but i still like SOE games

     

    SOE was the first to implement an RMAH back in 2005, w Station Exchange

    http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/130134/soes_station_exchange__the_.php?print=1

    where players could sell gold and even their characters

     

    SOE tried mini adventure packs in 2005 w EQ2 and Splitpaw

    https://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/index.php?threads/announcing-our-upcoming-expansion-and-adventure-pack.74203/

     

    SOE implemented Player Studio in 2012 where players could create things on their marketplace

    http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/09/06/soe-announces-player-studio-create-and-sell-in-game-items-for-everquest-planetside-2/

     

    SOE did have restrictive ftp business model in EQ2

    but repealed almost all restrictions in EQ2 last year

    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/85/view/forums/thread/397226/EQ2-Producer-Letter-0927-no-more-gear-locking-starting-101.html

  • evilastroevilastro EdinburghPosts: 4,270Member
    Originally posted by Clywd
    Originally posted by evilastro
    And you are basing this little rant on what exactly?

    Maybe on all the information that SOE published so far?

    Clearly not, since he thinks it will have waypoints like GW2.

    As for grouping, there is basically next to nothing known about grouping in the game yet, [mod edit]

  • AeliousAelious Portland, ORPosts: 2,849Member Uncommon
    Rather than make a list of features SoE has spoken about that indicate EQN won't be like other MMOs I'll say this:

    It will be free to play so you lose nothing by waiting and actually seeing for yourself whether your assumptions are true.
  • supertouchmesupertouchme corpus christi, TXPosts: 68Member
    Originally posted by evilastro
    Originally posted by Clywd
    Originally posted by evilastro
    And you are basing this little rant on what exactly?

    Maybe on all the information that SOE published so far?

    Clearly not, since he thinks it will have waypoints like GW2.

    As for grouping, there is basically next to nothing known about grouping in the game yet,[mod edit]

    I'm pretty sure they've confirmed that there's no encounter-locking mechanism in place and that loot will be shared. Basically, you'll be able to deliver a single blow to someone's mob and receive credit.

  • ArglebargleArglebargle Austin, TXPosts: 1,413Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by supertouchme
    Originally posted by evilastro
    Originally posted by Clywd
    Originally posted by evilastro
    And you are basing this little rant on what exactly?

    Maybe on all the information that SOE published so far?

    Clearly not, since he thinks it will have waypoints like GW2.

    As for grouping, there is basically next to nothing known about grouping in the game yet,[mod edit]

    I'm pretty sure they've confirmed that there's no encounter-locking mechanism in place and that loot will be shared. Basically, you'll be able to deliver a single blow to someone's mob and receive credit.

    What other positives about the game would you like to share?

    If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  • JJ82JJ82 Chicago, ILPosts: 1,175Member Common
    Originally posted by Nadia

    SOE has tried to monetize players more than any other dev

    I suggest you take a look at Zenimax.

    Take a famous IP, make the base game nothing like it, say it has to be that way for realm pride and because MMOs cant be made like SRPGs....and then continually whittle away at the differences in hopes to quell player outrage culminating in a pre-order that allows you to break the entire base design and everything said before hand about why its being made the way it is!

    At least EQN is actually doing something NEW and not tired old BS that we have seen far too many times already.

    I would take 10 bad new ideas over 100 old ones that I am SICK OF SEEING any day of the week.

    Its the same reason why I don't play Super Mario Bros side scrolling jumpers anymore, its outdated crap that belongs in the past.

    "People who tell you you’re awesome are useless. No, dangerous.

    They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
    http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member
    Originally posted by JJ82
    Originally posted by Nadia

    SOE has tried to monetize players more than any other dev

    I suggest you take a look at Zenimax.

    Take a famous IP, make the base game nothing like it, say it has to be that way for realm pride and because MMOs cant be made like SRPGs....and then continually whittle away at the differences in hopes to quell player outrage culminating in a pre-order that allows you to break the entire base design and everything said before hand about why its being made the way it is!

    At least EQN is actually doing something NEW and not tired old BS that we have seen far too many times already.

    I would take 10 bad new ideas over 100 old ones that I am SICK OF SEEING any day of the week.

    Its the same reason why I don't play Super Mario Bros side scrolling jumpers anymore, its outdated crap that belongs in the past.

    Then you need to get your hands on the parkouring angel dust that is Mikey Shorts for iOS...

    Despite the pros of EQN, it can't shake the "it's all about the money-making potential" that big pubs bring with them. Already talking about the next franchise of SWG using the above tech and the next...

  • AlleinAllein San Diego, CAPosts: 1,650Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by supertouchme

    I'm pretty sure they've confirmed that there's no encounter-locking mechanism in place and that loot will be shared. Basically, you'll be able to deliver a single blow to someone's mob and receive credit.

    How much credit?

  • TelondarielTelondariel Ottawa, ONPosts: 1,001Member
    Originally posted by JJ82
    Originally posted by Nadia

    SOE has tried to monetize players more than any other dev

    I suggest you take a look at Zenimax.

    Take a famous IP, make the base game nothing like it, say it has to be that way for realm pride and because MMOs cant be made like SRPGs....and then continually whittle away at the differences in hopes to quell player outrage culminating in a pre-order that allows you to break the entire base design and everything said before hand about why its being made the way it is!

    At least EQN is actually doing something NEW and not tired old BS that we have seen far too many times already.

    I would take 10 bad new ideas over 100 old ones that I am SICK OF SEEING any day of the week.

    Its the same reason why I don't play Super Mario Bros side scrolling jumpers anymore, its outdated crap that belongs in the past.

    [mod edit]

     

    As for EQN..hmm, who knows how it will really pan out.  Lots of words and promises do not equal something great, especially if you consider who it is that is doing all the talking.  

    image
  • VortigonVortigon PerthPosts: 723Member

    One thing that worries me the whole parkour thing.

    I want to be able to travel along a pathway without coming across artifically inserted 'obstacles' every 10m placed there for the sole reason of making your char parkour all the time - nothing will destroy my enjoyment more than that. The whole concept is just so artifical and cringeworthy - especially the sliding - 'rolls-eyes' - designed for 10 year olds.

  • CaldrinCaldrin CwmbranPosts: 4,533Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by supertouchme

    Why do developers keep churning out games that don't inconvenience the player but also fail to engage? EQ Next is shaping up to be nothing more than a blend of all the sterile, casual features we've grown accustomed to over the last decade. Yeah, Guild War's system of running around and forming unstructured groups with people you don't even talk to was so fun! I can't wait to travel to any destination instantly like I'm playing Assassin's Creed.

    This game will be devoid of peril and suspense but will be perfect for soccer moms who supposedly represent the MMO audience these days.

    why on earth pick on EQ:N its actually one of the most different AAA titles in development at the moment.

    You could have said ESO and I would have said sure you have a good point.

     

    We dont know enough about EQ:N to even comment on how its going to play in the end..

     

    Saying that the only mmorpg i am looknig forward to at he moment is The Repopulation.

  • iridescenceiridescence Elliot Lake, ONPosts: 1,486Member
    Originally posted by MumboJumbo
     

    Despite the pros of EQN, it can't shake the "it's all about the money-making potential" that big pubs bring with them. Already talking about the next franchise of SWG using the above tech and the next...

    Good luck finding a game on the scale of an MMO that isn't really "all about money-making potential". No one runs an MMO as a charity or non-profit.  

  • Mr.KujoMr.Kujo SwinoujsciePosts: 383Member
    Originally posted by supertouchme

    Why do developers keep churning out games that don't inconvenience the player but also fail to engage? EQ Next is shaping up to be nothing more than a blend of all the sterile, casual features we've grown accustomed to over the last decade.

     

    Let me correct that for you:

    Originally posted by supertouchme

    Why do developers keep churning out games that don't inconvenience ME but also fail to engage ME? EQ Next is shaping up to be nothing more than a blend of all the sterile, casual features I'VE grown accustomed to over the last decade.

    The answer to you question would be - because no one cares for you and your egocentric nature.

    To answer topic title - if a $14 billion industry is pathetic to you, show me industry that is great in your opinion and count me in...

  • PyatraPyatra Kansas City, KSPosts: 644Member
    Originally posted by Telondariel
    Originally posted by JJ82
    Originally posted by Nadia

    SOE has tried to monetize players more than any other dev

    I suggest you take a look at Zenimax.

    Take a famous IP, make the base game nothing like it, say it has to be that way for realm pride and because MMOs cant be made like SRPGs....and then continually whittle away at the differences in hopes to quell player outrage culminating in a pre-order that allows you to break the entire base design and everything said before hand about why its being made the way it is!

    At least EQN is actually doing something NEW and not tired old BS that we have seen far too many times already.

    I would take 10 bad new ideas over 100 old ones that I am SICK OF SEEING any day of the week.

    Its the same reason why I don't play Super Mario Bros side scrolling jumpers anymore, its outdated crap that belongs in the past.

    Please keep your ESO rage over on its forums.  It really doesn't need to spill over here. 

     

    As for EQN..hmm, who knows how it will really pan out.  Lots of words and promises do not equal something great, especially if you consider who it is that is doing all the talking.  

     I will agree keep it in the appropriate forum section.

    Anyway back on topic.  I believe we will have to wait until the EQN (not landmark) release to see exactly what they monetize.  I know several people who are already planning to rush for good land just to flip it for real world profit if (or even if they don't) allow the player exchanges like they had before.

  • EugeneKDudleyEugeneKDudley Seaton, ILPosts: 58Member

    Well it seems to me the industry is panicking a bit in the sense what EQN is doing might catch on...And if it does looking at how popular minecraft is, a major paradigm shift is in the works, and the gaming industry which has done nothing terribly innovative since 2004 is starting to sweat a bit. of course this is speculation, and as much as I would love to see it change in this direction, we won't know for sure until EQN starts to make more waves.

    The key player we want to watch is blizzard.... I feel they are already watching and reorganizing to keep ahead of the market trends if we have genre shift to sandbox hybrids, they'll want be market leaders and corner that market fast before others start the process of cloning them and EQN.

     

    "By all means, reach for the stars but you need to build the spaceship first"

  • MaquiameMaquiame Posts: 792Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by supertouchme

    Why do developers keep churning out games that don't inconvenience the player but also fail to engage? EQ Next is shaping up to be nothing more than a blend of all the sterile, casual features we've grown accustomed to over the last decade. Yeah, Guild War's system of running around and forming unstructured groups with people you don't even talk to was so fun! I can't wait to travel to any destination instantly like I'm playing Assassin's Creed.

    This game will be devoid of peril and suspense but will be perfect for soccer moms who supposedly represent the MMO audience these days.

    Watch this video, the entire thing

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45XrbsBt34c

     

    And afterwards come on over

    https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1588672538/pantheon-rise-of-the-fallen/comments#

    image

    Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!

  • XthosXthos Columbus, OHPosts: 2,628Member

    I worry EQN will be way too casual, and I am not a huge f2p fan.  I think the shops often over reach, and I prefer p2p myself.  Just nothing I would p2p out right now, or play for free with no cash shop for the most part.

     

    I will not bad mouth them though, until I see it.  I like the trinity also, but I have also enjoyed games like UO, it had no trinity....  So I will wait and see, I am a little skeptical, but who knows...

     

    Btw for poster above, I did donate to Pantheon, I miss old EQ and I really like VG, just never could recover from the bad launch, and being left on life support for years with almost no development.

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member

    The MMO industry is exactly what players have been voting with their wallets for over the last 10 years.  If you don't like it, blame all the people that were too cheap to afford a $15 subscription and instead wanted games to be "free."

    Nothing is free.  We're just paying the cost in other ways now.

    You make me like charity

  • CalmOceansCalmOceans BergenPosts: 2,273Member
    Originally posted by supertouchme

    This game will be devoid of peril and suspense but will be perfect for soccer moms who supposedly represent the MMO audience these days.

    I don't feel this is a game for soccer moms. I feel it's a game for old people who don't want any danger and want a very casual and friendly game. Younger people and soccer moms usually tend to be experienced enough to go for more challenging MMO with more depth.

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairPosts: 5,586Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Arglebargle
    Originally posted by supertouchme
    Originally posted by evilastro
    Originally posted by Clywd
    Originally posted by evilastro
    And you are basing this little rant on what exactly?

    Maybe on all the information that SOE published so far?

    Clearly not, since he thinks it will have waypoints like GW2.

    As for grouping, there is basically next to nothing known about grouping in the game yet,[mod edit]

    I'm pretty sure they've confirmed that there's no encounter-locking mechanism in place and that loot will be shared. Basically, you'll be able to deliver a single blow to someone's mob and receive credit.

    What other positives about the game would you like to share?

    It's a positive feature if it worked. The way it's intended, everyone receives equal or scaled credit for participation. But the reality is that it's exploited by people running around tagging mobs in DEs and taking off without really helping, leaving others to do all the work.

  • aesperusaesperus Hamshire, NVPosts: 5,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by EugeneKDudley

    Well it seems to me the industry is panicking a bit in the sense what EQN is doing might catch on...And if it does looking at how popular minecraft is, a major paradigm shift is in the works, and the gaming industry which has done nothing terribly innovative since 2004 is starting to sweat a bit. of course this is speculation, and as much as I would love to see it change in this direction, we won't know for sure until EQN starts to make more waves.

    The key player we want to watch is blizzard.... I feel they are already watching and reorganizing to keep ahead of the market trends if we have genre shift to sandbox hybrids, they'll want be market leaders and corner that market fast before others start the process of cloning them and EQN.

    Except Blizzard doesn't keep ahead of the market trends. Their entire success is based around copying existing market trends, and polishing the crap outa them w/ massive budgets. No doubt about it, though. If there's a succesful new sandbox paradigm, Blizzard will try to copy it. They already know their popular IPs have a time stamp on it, and they need to start a new one to keep the money going. Hearthstone was just the first step (though it's not an entirely new IP).

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