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No motion capture in ESO? Really?

DenambrenDenambren Montreal, QCPosts: 320Member Uncommon

In every ESO video that has been released, we have yet to see motion capture incorporated into any of the animations. How can this be? Skyrim had such beautiful animation with mo-cap. The animation in ESO is an embarrassment in comparison. 

 

There have been plenty of negative prophecies made by plenty of people about plenty of upcoming MMOs, but ESO looks like it may be setting the hugest scale of disappointment yet. I get the feeling that with a release date now set for April 4th 2014, this game has completely given up on being a success and is just cutting losses.

 

My sympathies go out to everyone who expected something from this game. With luck, the game will be so bad that it becomes a comical cultural reference. And then the Elder Scrolls franchise can continue its tradition of bringing humor to the internet.

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Comments

  • Tabloid42Tabloid42 New York, NYPosts: 152Member

    Making ESO 'on the cheap' ?  Ugg,.

    Someone else mentioned this but I agree,.it's feeling like SWTOR all over again.

     

     

  • Kicksave321Kicksave321 Red wing, MNPosts: 262Member
    Oh yippy another doom and gloom post about ESO.  Boy does misery love company on this site.   
  • drgrandrgran Guelph, ONPosts: 192Member Uncommon

    well just think with the PC and mac versions being released in April and the PS4 and XBone being released in June. The console players will be happy to know that PC/Mac will be the testers.

    So I'll wait until the console release to get the PC version.

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  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCPosts: 5,610Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Oh yippy another doom and gloom post about ESO.  Boy does misery love company on this site.   

     Just waiting for the "What, no Dolores House of Pain mod in ESO?" Fail! image

  • bcbullybcbully Westland, MIPosts: 8,273Member Uncommon
    They way it looks and plays is one of the top 3 reasons I'm going to buy. Idk what that says about the games other features, but yeah.
  • Kicksave321Kicksave321 Red wing, MNPosts: 262Member
    Oh just a little helpful hint.  A single player game will have much more room for graphical advances then an MMO.  I understand some don't understand this but it's really not that hard of a concept one player on the screen vs many is a huge difference.  It's the same reason why Call of Duty no longer can handle four player split screen the graphical advanced are just too much to have 4 screens at once.  Mmos do have limitations just based on their size.  
  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Posts: 5,447Member Uncommon
    Do you mean when the game has a slow motion action shot of your finishing move when you kill a mob? If so how would that work in a dungeon when a tank is in a slow motion show of killing a mob and he needs to be taunting a mob that smacking the healer? Or in PvP in a 3v3 fight and someone dies so that team is stuck in a slow motion shot as the other team unloads on you and you cant do anything till its over. Or you asking for some other feature I am unclear of?


    =-D Only on a forum can optimism be called bad and pessimism the good thing =-D Welcome to the internet and forums. 


  • evilizedevilized columbus, OHPosts: 564Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Oh yippy another doom and gloom post about ESO.  Boy does misery love company on this site.   

    Did you ever consider that nobody has anything nice to say about the game because… well, there's nothing nice to say? if you think this site is filled with criticism you should have seen the beta forums during the last event.

  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Posts: 5,447Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilized
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Oh yippy another doom and gloom post about ESO.  Boy does misery love company on this site.   

    Did you ever consider that nobody has anything nice to say about the game because… well, there's nothing nice to say? if you think this site is filled with criticism you should have seen the beta forums during the last event.

    Im sure this falls under the NDA =-P


    =-D Only on a forum can optimism be called bad and pessimism the good thing =-D Welcome to the internet and forums. 


  • Kicksave321Kicksave321 Red wing, MNPosts: 262Member
    Originally posted by evilized
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Oh yippy another doom and gloom post about ESO.  Boy does misery love company on this site.   

    Did you ever consider that nobody has anything nice to say about the game because… well, there's nothing nice to say? if you think this site is filled with criticism you should have seen the beta forums during the last event.

     

    Haha beta forums those are the worst.  People these days kids don't understand the purpose of a beta even when they outlined their goals.  People these days use betas as free trials and don't understand that the version we had in beta was at least two behind the current version they have.  Beta forums haha too funny. 
  • reeereeereeereee Posts: 1,202Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilized
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Oh yippy another doom and gloom post about ESO.  Boy does misery love company on this site.   

    Did you ever consider that nobody has anything nice to say about the game because… well, there's nothing nice to say? if you think this site is filled with criticism you should have seen the beta forums during the last event.

    I don't know, I'm still optimistic this game will be better than gw2 which people on this sight lavished untold amounts of praise on before it was released.

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member

    All of the animations in EQ2 were mocap'd.  Incidentally, the animations in the game are largely disliked by people.

    The thing about mocap is that it works well for cutscenes or other animations where the player isn't in control (Dragon kills in Skyrim), because the whole animation can play out as intended.  Most animations, however, need to be able to work well with other animations and bits of scenery, something which mocap can't handle.

    For example, a lot of older games have an issue when your character is standing or walking up a hill, and their toes are inside the ground and their heels are sort of floating, because they are using the same walking animation for all variations of steepness.  Newer games can use tech which dynamically positions the skeleton to allow the feet and legs to actually be where they should be.  Guild Wars 2 is a great example of this, where the legs and feet will bend to properly rest on the terrain.

    There are other things as well, like being able to have different animations play on different parts of the body at the same time, such as running and casting a spell.  With mocap, you'd basically need to record someone doing every possible combination of actions.

    When does mocap makes sense (aside from cutscenes)?  First person shooters can make great use of them, because you no longer have to worry about the actual player character animations.  You can just mocap general actions like taking cover next to a door, crouching, aiming, and whatever else you need.  Since damage is done at range, very little realism is lost when they jerk back after being hit.  Of course, FPS games can't use those animations during multiplayer (other than stuff like knife kills) because actual players are in control of what you are seeing, and mocap doesn't handle that well.

    Many games do have really poor animations, but that's just because they didn't invest in them.  I guess it's easy to get some that are "good enough" for development, and just keep them for release because of time or budget reasons.

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  • RaquisRaquis hartenbosPosts: 536Member Common

    its not going to work in a mmo you are moving the whole time, no time for motion capture.

    is there motion capture in real life?

  • DenambrenDenambren Montreal, QCPosts: 320Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Mmos do have limitations just based on their size.  

    I'm going to make yet another player-driven prophecy.

     

    Rubbing my hands over my crystal ball I see: Skyrim being a game with more content and "size" than ESO will ever have.

     

    Also, to my memory, Star Wars Galaxies is the first game to have incorporated motion capture in an MMO, and that game was from 2003.

     

    Ten years later, many other MMOs have done it. There is no reason why ESO should not, other than budget limitations or engine limitations.

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member
    Originally posted by evilized
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Oh yippy another doom and gloom post about ESO.  Boy does misery love company on this site.   

    Did you ever consider that nobody has anything nice to say about the game because… well, there's nothing nice to say? if you think this site is filled with criticism you should have seen the beta forums during the last event.

    I've been on this site for a long time, and got to see WoW basically get bashed on for all kinds of reasons over the years.  It was so bad that simply mentioning in a post that you played it was enough to invalidate whatever argument you were making.  Obviously WoW was not a bad game, but you couldn't have known based on these forums.

    As for why nobody says anything nice about the game... remember there is an NDA in effect.  Only so much can be said.  Even still, I see plenty of people saying nice things about it, or trying to dispel misinformation, but they do tend to get drowned out by the people who aren't happy that it's not Modded Skyrim Online.

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  • PurutzilPurutzil East Stroudsburg, PAPosts: 2,924Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Tabloid42

    Making ESO 'on the cheap' ?  Ugg,.

    Someone else mentioned this but I agree,.it's feeling like SWTOR all over again.

     

     

    Um... SWTOR wasn't made on the cheap, that game was made on the extremely expensive side. It completely missed what made a good MMO and couldn't live up to the hype at all, but it wasn't made on the cheap remotely at all.

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member
    Originally posted by Purutzil
    Originally posted by Tabloid42

    Making ESO 'on the cheap' ?  Ugg,.

    Someone else mentioned this but I agree,.it's feeling like SWTOR all over again.

     

     

    Um... SWTOR wasn't made on the cheap, that game was made on the extremely expensive side. It completely missed what made a good MMO and couldn't live up to the hype at all, but it wasn't made on the cheap remotely at all.

    What's really ironic is that one of the few good things about SWTOR are it's animations, lol.  Most of which, by the way, used mocap.

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  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCPosts: 5,610Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilized
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Oh yippy another doom and gloom post about ESO.  Boy does misery love company on this site.   

    Did you ever consider that nobody has anything nice to say about the game because… well, there's nothing nice to say? if you think this site is filled with criticism you should have seen the beta forums during the last event.

    Did you ever considered that MMOs based on well-known pre-existing IPs always bring out the self-declared #1 (insert IP here) fan... typically with weird and wacky ideas about how the game should have been done if only the developers were even half as intelligent as he, the deluded amateur fan?

     

    OTOH, make an original IP, clone the shit out of WOW = praise. (Wildstar anyone?)

     

    But I digress... the OP here is not saying he's the #1 fan... just a connosieur of the finer technical aspects of MMO development... if only he had been part of the team. Someday, we'll have an MMO totally designed by public opinion polling of amateurs... and we'll get cars and houses designed the same way... because, as everyone on the internet knows, people who do this shit for a living know nothing and we know it all image

  • CthulhuPuffsCthulhuPuffs Henderson, NVPosts: 363Member Common
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Originally posted by evilized
    Originally posted by Kicksave321
    Oh yippy another doom and gloom post about ESO.  Boy does misery love company on this site.   

    Did you ever consider that nobody has anything nice to say about the game because… well, there's nothing nice to say? if you think this site is filled with criticism you should have seen the beta forums during the last event.

     

    Haha beta forums those are the worst.  People these days kids don't understand the purpose of a beta even when they outlined their goals.  People these days use betas as free trials and don't understand that the version we had in beta was at least two behind the current version they have.  Beta forums haha too funny. 

    Then maybe the Devs making these games should quit using Betas as mini "free trials" and start letting actual Testers into their games.

    You cant get squat tested in a 3 Day Beta Weekend. Thats not a Beta Test, its a Pre-Release Preview for Marketing purposes.

    Instead they get Players because their Beta Applications have questions like "How many games have you played?", "Do you operate a Gaming Fan Site?", "Do you prefer PvP, PvE, Crafting, Other?"

     

    They arent looking for experienced Game Testers anymore. They want FANS.

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  • evilizedevilized columbus, OHPosts: 564Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Iselin
    because, as everyone on the internet knows, people who do this shit for a living know nothing and we know it all image

    well, if you consider the current trend of games being forced to go F2P due to lack of player interest then yes i wouldn't feel bad about agreeing with that statement. 

     

    also, criticism is what they should be listening and responding to. if they just plug their ears and hum they will be in for a nasty surprise come april 4th. i couldn't imagine ignoring people's criticism of my work, i would never get paid. 

  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCPosts: 5,610Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilized
    Originally posted by Iselin
    because, as everyone on the internet knows, people who do this shit for a living know nothing and we know it all image

    well, if you consider the current trend of games being forced to go F2P due to lack of player interest then yes i wouldn't feel bad about agreeing with that statement. 

     

    also, criticism is what they should be listening and responding to. if they just plug their ears and hum they will be in for a nasty surprise come april 4th. i couldn't imagine ignoring people's criticism of my work, i would never get paid. 

    Well sounds like you and I do different types of work. The people who criticize my work and actually know wtf they're talking about are few and far between... they're treasured reources. People in this forum? Not so much.

  • DenambrenDenambren Montreal, QCPosts: 320Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Iselin

    But I digress... the OP here is not saying he's the #1 fan... just a connosieur of the finer technical aspects of MMO development... if only he had been part of the team. Someday, we'll have an MMO totally designed by public opinion polling of amateurs... and we'll get cars and houses designed the same way... because, as everyone on the internet knows, people who do this shit for a living know nothing and we know it all image

    The OP here is saying that there is no motion capture in ESO and that it's an enormous step backwards from Skyrim.

     

    I guess what you're trying to say is that anyone who is horrified by an MMO design choice is a self-proclaimed connoiseur of the finer techincal aspects of MMO development. If that's true, then we're either all connoiseurs, or.. you know, we're just gamers that have an opinion (and who ultimately influence sales).

  • TatercakeTatercake Auburn, WAPosts: 279Member
    after being in the betta i was so anoyed with combat system and  it will not be ready  when they say so many bugs glitchs  to this game and it makes me sick that they copied  gw2 combat system will be a let down for many 
  • IselinIselin Vancouver, BCPosts: 5,610Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Denambren
    Originally posted by Iselin

    But I digress... the OP here is not saying he's the #1 fan... just a connosieur of the finer technical aspects of MMO development... if only he had been part of the team. Someday, we'll have an MMO totally designed by public opinion polling of amateurs... and we'll get cars and houses designed the same way... because, as everyone on the internet knows, people who do this shit for a living know nothing and we know it all image

    The OP here is saying that there is no motion capture in ESO and that it's an enormous step backwards from Skyrim.

     

    I guess what you're trying to say is that anyone who is horrified by an MMO design choice is a self-proclaimed connoiseur of the finer techincal aspects of MMO development. If that's true, then we're either all connoiseurs, or.. you know, we're just gamers that have an opinion (and who ultimately influence sales).

    Mocap is just one way to do it that makes a lot of sense in some types of games (sports sims) and is just one of many ways to do it in others. How they do their animations is irelevant as long as they're well done... I'm not seeing anything objectionable about ESO's... so yeah, it sounds like useless technical nit-picking to me.

  • RedempRedemp Hot Springs, ARPosts: 1,042Member
     I've seen no issues with the combat system, it seems to play welll as it is. If Zenimax not using Mo-cap is an issue for some people, then well there's not much that can be done for them. As to the system currently in place ... I see no harm in the lack thereof thus far.
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