You link the post, and yet you leave out several MMOs mentioned in said post.
So I repeat my previous sentiment.
EDIT: You also failed to note how in that post Spore is indeed not part of the list, and that I did indeed address that list with a later addendum after you chimed about 'no out of game toolkits' to address only the games which possessed in game ones, adding one to the list of said titles to count five (if including Wurm), of which the only you're even acknowledged of that bunch is Wurm.
Seriously, you 'lol' over the post you link, yet you didn't even seem to read it.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
I think I've decided the OP is perhaps one of the most skilled trolls in the universe or is so completely positively immovable on the subject that we should all just let this thread die.
Minecraft is an MMO that can be played as a single player game. It used to be a single player game that could be played as an MMO. It's advancing in the online player realm fast. And it works. Because it's graphics suck. But it works damn good.
I'm looking forward to Everquest Next which has an offshoot housing game that will allow us to build castles and it's an mmo.
Neverwinter did fail but the concept was good. It was just poorly made and even worse with maintenance. I and many other did make a few dungeons and it was fun. But they needed to fix the creator and crafting system.
It's great giving players the tools to create. Remove terrain from the spawn point so players spawn to their death over and over and explore penis forests. Then you notice something which someone put some effort into get defaced. Also trap rooms which auto attune you to a spot so you cant suicide out.
Eve Online offers players the ability to take territory and hold it. At no point did the creators of Eve ever envision that players would band together in such vast quantities to hold space, due to the work involved and the logistics if they did these would be short lived, but the choices were always there to the player.
Now if you want to be apart of this as a normal player it's simple, join one of these organizations as a lowly grunt and reap the rewards, or own a station solo near a moon and supply it every two weeks with fuel and sell what comes out of it.
Your entire argument was build off the back that Eve Online is super complex at the highest levels of management in the biggest alliances, otherwise the game is complex, but not so complex that it isn't played by hundreds of thousands of people, and is more financially stable than most themepark pieces of shit that get released.
new flash for you friend, numbers don't lie, and Eve isn't going anyway for a LONG time, so it's doing something right, a direct cotradiction to your thread titled "Why giving players tools to create doesn't work."
Eve Online, 10 years old. Still played by hundreds of thousands of people every day - complex as they come full of tools to create with.
Minecraft, a game built on small scale multiplayer servers where you do nothing BUT create.
Skyrim, going strong still because of strong modding tools.
I would offer a counter argument, why not giving players tools to build and create doesn't work.
Originally posted by Beatnik59 City of Heroes had a lot of ways for players to create things:
1) The base editor allowed players to create hotels, city blocks, spaceships, lairs, arcane sanctuaries, parks and so on. I can't tell you how involved some of the designs were.
2) The costume creator was a wonderful tool to create robots, soldiers, superheroes, beastmen, ghosts and so many other personalities.
3) The Architect Entertainment system was loved by roleplayers and average players alike to create story arcs that the regular lore didn't support.
In fact, at the end, I'd have to say that City of Heroes was the most "creator friendly" retail MMO from a major publisher. And it worked, splendidly.
It ruined the world gameplay of city of heroes for me.
Could you expound on that? How did these things "ruin the world gameplay" for you?
The Architect missions were totally volunteer. One had to be in a SG, or be friends with one to experience Bases. The costumes were in place from day one, with additional pieces added with many new issues (updates).
2 of the 3 listed had no effect on "the world", and the other was a main aspect from the beginning, so I am having trouble seeing what got ruined for you.
I guess the "world gameplay" needs to explained for you. World gameplay is players (NOTE: the 's') playing out in the game world. Now don't start jumping with the first thought that it can only mean grouping (DERP). It too the masses (aka many perhaps majority) out of playing the pre-MA game content and put them into MA missions. That is what was ruined FOR ME.
So to sum up how it ruined it for ME (ME= Me, perhaps you had a different experience).
1) Many people running around the game world which you might interact with. I liked this aspect.
2) MA comes out, it pulls people into MA missions. I didn't like this as it took players away from #1.
3) While there were a very small percentage of great MA-missions, they were the vast exception. The center of the bell curve for quality was from poor to good. At the other end is just horrible MA missions. I didn't see this as a positive for ME (ME= Me, perhaps you had a different experience).
4) Inconclusion, MA took away from my positive experience and took it to a much lower experience. That is what I mean by RUINED. If there is a need for me to make a more simple explanation, let me know.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Originally posted by Beatnik59 City of Heroes had a lot of ways for players to create things: 1) The base editor allowed players to create hotels, city blocks, spaceships, lairs, arcane sanctuaries, parks and so on. I can't tell you how involved some of the designs were. 2) The costume creator was a wonderful tool to create robots, soldiers, superheroes, beastmen, ghosts and so many other personalities. 3) The Architect Entertainment system was loved by roleplayers and average players alike to create story arcs that the regular lore didn't support.In fact, at the end, I'd have to say that City of Heroes was the most "creator friendly" retail MMO from a major publisher. And it worked, splendidly.
It ruined the world gameplay of city of heroes for me.
Could you expound on that? How did these things "ruin the world gameplay" for you?The Architect missions were totally volunteer. One had to be in a SG, or be friends with one to experience Bases. The costumes were in place from day one, with additional pieces added with many new issues (updates).2 of the 3 listed had no effect on "the world", and the other was a main aspect from the beginning, so I am having trouble seeing what got ruined for you.
I guess the "world gameplay" needs to explained for you. World gameplay is players (NOTE: the 's') playing out in the game world. Now don't start jumping with the first thought that it can only mean grouping (DERP). It too the masses (aka many perhaps majority) out of playing the pre-MA game content and put them into MA missions. That is what was ruined FOR ME.So to sum up how it ruined it for ME (ME= Me, perhaps you had a different experience).1) Many people running around the game world which you might interact with. I liked this aspect.2) MA comes out, it pulls people into MA missions. I didn't like this as it took players away from #1.3) While there were a very small percentage of great MA-missions, they were the vast exception. The center of the bell curve for quality was from poor to good. At the other end is just horrible MA missions. I didn't see this as a positive for ME (ME= Me, perhaps you had a different experience).4) Inconclusion, MA took away from my positive experience and took it to a much lower experience. That is what I mean by RUINED. If there is a need for me to make a more simple explanation, let me know.
No need to get snippy. I asked for clarification as to what "World Gameplay" meant to you, as I was having trouble seeing what you meant.
The underlined portion of my original reply is for your benefit. Mission Architect did not change that much. From the very beginning of CoH, players went into instances for their "Missions." Remember those? There were players getting pulled off the streets from day 1. Nothing new, but it did add more instances very quickly.
That being said, I agree that MA did impact the game world in a negative way. I was just pointing out that it was NOT a new variable to the game.
Now, take a breath. Let it out. Take another one.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse. - FARGIN_WAR
One of the more repeated lines in this forum is to 'give players the tools to create things and all will be well'.
UO / EVE is held up as a shining example with the UO AH system being singled out as a great thing.
The reality is that this doesn't always work and normally to get it to work requires something a lot more effort from players than to make it within the world.
I know people in the car auctioning industry and most of the things are done automatically (check-in/check out/ uploading items onto the internet) so they can do other things that requires a human brain than an electronic one. Why spend time typing what the car inspection guy wrote on his paper when you can just give him an IPAD and connect that thing to your system?
EVE-Vegas had a presentation on logistics of an alliance and what is needed to make that game work.
I've been told that what was shown is more efficient than some companies with 25,000 employees cause good-god is that just insane!
Yeah, 'give players the tools!' is a great mantra and I too wish a slogan like 'YES WE CAN' can solve all of our problems but here's the reality; how many people are willing to do what was shown?
And if you are, give me some examples and lets see if some people are willing to put their money where their mouth is.
camping almost 30 days straight to be one of the first clerics in EQ on emarr to get his epic cleric , after helping every one of our raid group get their epic weapons? check.
being in a guild of 35 guys that literally took over an entire server in UO, chessie server, and ultimately being banned as a guild? having over 1000 personal kills, in a guild that had kills equalling the total server population at one point, check
helping take a corp from nothing to an alliance that took over a third of eve space, and held it for over a year, to its ultimate demise by backstabbing and betrayal? check
i could go on, but the point is there are players that are in the game, and then there are players that play it.
which , coincidentally is why there are so few challenging games now days, to be blunt: too many people suck at mmorpgs, thus the trend at easier and more user friendly.
case in point, recovering from a tumor removed from my head last year , in the hospital drugged to high heaven for three and a half weeks, i started aion, leveled and geared up a cleric to level 50. When i was released, i quit the game, not remembering anything about it.
camping almost 30 days straight to be one of the first clerics in EQ on emarr to get his epic cleric , after helping every one of our raid group get their epic weapons? check.
being in a guild of 35 guys that literally took over an entire server in UO, chessie server, and ultimately being banned as a guild? having over 1000 personal kills, in a guild that had kills equalling the total server population at one point, check
helping take a corp from nothing to an alliance that took over a third of eve space, and held it for over a year, to its ultimate demise by backstabbing and betrayal? check
i could go on, but the point is there are players that are in the game, and then there are players that play it.
which , coincidentally is why there are so few challenging games now days, to be blunt: too many people suck at mmorpgs, thus the trend at easier and more user friendly.
case in point, recovering from a tumor removed from my head last year , in the hospital drugged to high heaven for three and a half weeks, i started aion, leveled and geared up a cleric to level 50. When i was released, i quit the game, not remembering anything about it.
This thread is still going? o_O
1. Congratz on the successful surgery!
2. All the things you listed, how long did they take?
3. How many people are willing to put in those hours?
4. Even if they are willing how many people can?
The example I have is '2 hours outside the game every day'. You factor in the actual in-game time and that's what... 4 hours a day? So half a regular work hours every day for one MMO. Wow..... you really think that's not a lot of time?
Really?
Gdemami - Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
"Yeah, 'give players the tools!' is a great mantra and I too wish a slogan like 'YES WE CAN' can solve all of our problems" - jpnz
"This is to counter the notion that 'player created tools solve all ills'." - jpnz
Why argue against a point no one has made? Seems a bit on the crazy side to do so.
If you want to really present a counter argument to something, start with a counter for something that actually exists, like:
"Player created content can offer greater longevity"
"Player created content can offer a more personal gameplay experience"
"Player created content can make for a more engaging gameworld."
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I'm also baffles why this thread is still going. Starting from the completely falsified title (there are several examples where giving players tools to create does work, therefore invalidating the claim) and one-sided opening post, it should have died fast.
Then again, this is MMORPG.com, where agitators are not only left unmoderated, but almost encouraged.
"Yeah, 'give players the tools!' is a great mantra and I too wish a slogan like 'YES WE CAN' can solve all of our problems" - jpnz
"This is to counter the notion that 'player created tools solve all ills'." - jpnz
Why argue against a point no one has made? Seems a bit on the crazy side to do so.
If you want to really present a counter argument to something, start with a counter for something that actually exists, like:
"Player created content can offer greater longevity"
"Player created content can offer a more personal gameplay experience"
"Player created content can make for a more engaging gameworld."
People have made that claim; how many 'give player tools' thread goes up on this very forum?
C'mon, lets at least try and appear factual.
That's exactly what I'm asking you to do, and it's hard to tell whether you right now really don't see the difference or if you're just trolling.
Who has made that claim? I have yet to see anyone make the claims you present in the two quotes above. Can you link to these posts you're talking about?So far it seems that only problem here is that you don't understand the difference between "can be / has been a solution for issue x" and "solves all our problems"
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
That's exactly what I'm asking you to do, and it's hard to tell whether you right now really don't see the difference or if you're just trolling.
Who has made that claim? I have yet to see anyone make the claims you present in the two quotes above. Can you link to these posts you're talking about?So far it seems that only problem here is that you don't understand the difference between "can be / has been a solution for issue x" and "solves all our problems"
Yeah, cause EQ: Next with Landmark didn't create any threads.
Nor did the whole 'old fashion MMO were better because it gave player tools' posts ever occur here.
I mean.. really? REALLY?!
And I really want to reiterate that all this thread was suppose to do was 'saying give player tools is great and all, but what's the actual cost?'
Gdemami - Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
After we have had a few MMOs that give the players tools I think we will be in more of a position to answer this question. Can it work in todays MMO environment? I think so, but time will tell.
Originally posted by goldtoofYeah eve, minecraft and terraria were huge flops. Sheeesh.
By this logic, Visual Studios 2013 is the best thing ever for those people.
Can you explain what you mean by this post...
Can you explain what you mean by this post...
I want to know what YOU mean by this post. *waggles finger*
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Originally posted by Loktofeit Originally posted by BarrikorOriginally posted by BarrikorOriginally posted by jpnzOriginally posted by goldtoofYeah eve, minecraft and terraria were huge flops. Sheeesh.
By this logic, Visual Studios 2013 is the best thing ever for those people.Can you explain what you mean by this post...Can you explain what you mean by this post...I want to know what YOU mean by this post. *waggles finger*
I don't get it.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
I want to know what YOU mean by this post. *waggles finger*
=P
I'm under the impression that Jpnz doesn't know what he's talking about, or what Visual "Studios" actually is. Maybe I'm wrong, his post is too vague to tell.
I want to know what YOU mean by this post. *waggles finger*
=P
I'm under the impression that Jpnz doesn't know what he's talking about, or what Visual "Studios" actually is. Maybe I'm wrong, his post is too vague to tell.
And I'm just mashing keys to kill some time while a new build of a game loads. Nevermind me or anything I post during the next half hour.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Well "tools" most certainly can work and we really have seen so little of it,there is nothing of magnitude to draw any conclusions from.
All you need to know is that the "TOOLS" is what games are made from,so of course they can work if the tools are good and the users are given full access.The implementation of the tools also matters.It has worked miracles in other games ,mostly FPS games however in the MMORPG industry there are some huge drawbacks,example allotted bandwidth and WHAT you are allowed to add into the game and COST.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Well "tools" most certainly can work and we really have seen so little of it,there is nothing of magnitude to draw any conclusions from.
All you need to know is that the "TOOLS" is what games are made from,so of course they can work if the tools are good and the users are given full access.The implementation of the tools also matters.It has worked miracles in other games ,mostly FPS games however in the MMORPG industry there are some huge drawbacks,example allotted bandwidth and WHAT you are allowed to add into the game and COST.
I don't think it is about the tools. It is about the talent of the person wielding the tools.
After all, everyone has access to a word processor. How many can write a novel like John Grisham, or David Weber? Just because the tools are available does not mean that most people can create anything good.
Comments
You link the post, and yet you leave out several MMOs mentioned in said post.
So I repeat my previous sentiment.
EDIT: You also failed to note how in that post Spore is indeed not part of the list, and that I did indeed address that list with a later addendum after you chimed about 'no out of game toolkits' to address only the games which possessed in game ones, adding one to the list of said titles to count five (if including Wurm), of which the only you're even acknowledged of that bunch is Wurm.
Seriously, you 'lol' over the post you link, yet you didn't even seem to read it.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
Minecraft is an MMO that can be played as a single player game. It used to be a single player game that could be played as an MMO. It's advancing in the online player realm fast. And it works. Because it's graphics suck. But it works damn good.
I'm looking forward to Everquest Next which has an offshoot housing game that will allow us to build castles and it's an mmo.
Neverwinter did fail but the concept was good. It was just poorly made and even worse with maintenance. I and many other did make a few dungeons and it was fun. But they needed to fix the creator and crafting system.
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
"If the Damned gave you a roadmap, then you'd know just where to go"
Need to weigh in on this ridiculous thread...
Eve Online offers players the ability to take territory and hold it. At no point did the creators of Eve ever envision that players would band together in such vast quantities to hold space, due to the work involved and the logistics if they did these would be short lived, but the choices were always there to the player.
Now if you want to be apart of this as a normal player it's simple, join one of these organizations as a lowly grunt and reap the rewards, or own a station solo near a moon and supply it every two weeks with fuel and sell what comes out of it.
Your entire argument was build off the back that Eve Online is super complex at the highest levels of management in the biggest alliances, otherwise the game is complex, but not so complex that it isn't played by hundreds of thousands of people, and is more financially stable than most themepark pieces of shit that get released.
new flash for you friend, numbers don't lie, and Eve isn't going anyway for a LONG time, so it's doing something right, a direct cotradiction to your thread titled "Why giving players tools to create doesn't work."
Eve Online, 10 years old. Still played by hundreds of thousands of people every day - complex as they come full of tools to create with.
Minecraft, a game built on small scale multiplayer servers where you do nothing BUT create.
Skyrim, going strong still because of strong modding tools.
I would offer a counter argument, why not giving players tools to build and create doesn't work.
I guess the "world gameplay" needs to explained for you. World gameplay is players (NOTE: the 's') playing out in the game world. Now don't start jumping with the first thought that it can only mean grouping (DERP). It too the masses (aka many perhaps majority) out of playing the pre-MA game content and put them into MA missions. That is what was ruined FOR ME.
So to sum up how it ruined it for ME (ME= Me, perhaps you had a different experience).
1) Many people running around the game world which you might interact with. I liked this aspect.
2) MA comes out, it pulls people into MA missions. I didn't like this as it took players away from #1.
3) While there were a very small percentage of great MA-missions, they were the vast exception. The center of the bell curve for quality was from poor to good. At the other end is just horrible MA missions. I didn't see this as a positive for ME (ME= Me, perhaps you had a different experience).
4) Inconclusion, MA took away from my positive experience and took it to a much lower experience. That is what I mean by RUINED. If there is a need for me to make a more simple explanation, let me know.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
The underlined portion of my original reply is for your benefit. Mission Architect did not change that much. From the very beginning of CoH, players went into instances for their "Missions." Remember those? There were players getting pulled off the streets from day 1. Nothing new, but it did add more instances very quickly.
That being said, I agree that MA did impact the game world in a negative way. I was just pointing out that it was NOT a new variable to the game.
Now, take a breath. Let it out. Take another one.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
camping almost 30 days straight to be one of the first clerics in EQ on emarr to get his epic cleric , after helping every one of our raid group get their epic weapons? check.
being in a guild of 35 guys that literally took over an entire server in UO, chessie server, and ultimately being banned as a guild? having over 1000 personal kills, in a guild that had kills equalling the total server population at one point, check
helping take a corp from nothing to an alliance that took over a third of eve space, and held it for over a year, to its ultimate demise by backstabbing and betrayal? check
i could go on, but the point is there are players that are in the game, and then there are players that play it.
which , coincidentally is why there are so few challenging games now days, to be blunt: too many people suck at mmorpgs, thus the trend at easier and more user friendly.
case in point, recovering from a tumor removed from my head last year , in the hospital drugged to high heaven for three and a half weeks, i started aion, leveled and geared up a cleric to level 50. When i was released, i quit the game, not remembering anything about it.
over 20 years of mmorpg's and counting...
This thread is still going? o_O
1. Congratz on the successful surgery!
2. All the things you listed, how long did they take?
3. How many people are willing to put in those hours?
4. Even if they are willing how many people can?
The example I have is '2 hours outside the game every day'. You factor in the actual in-game time and that's what... 4 hours a day? So half a regular work hours every day for one MMO. Wow..... you really think that's not a lot of time?
Really?
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
Can you explain what you mean by this post...
"Yeah, 'give players the tools!' is a great mantra and I too wish a slogan like 'YES WE CAN' can solve all of our problems" - jpnz
"This is to counter the notion that 'player created tools solve all ills'." - jpnz
Why argue against a point no one has made? Seems a bit on the crazy side to do so.
If you want to really present a counter argument to something, start with a counter for something that actually exists, like:
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
People have made that claim; how many 'give player tools' thread goes up on this very forum?
C'mon, lets at least try and appear factual.
Player created content can offer greater longevity - that's true and I agree.
But what's the cost? In this case it is '4 hours per day every day'.
Is that a sustainable model for a MMO playerbase?
I'd say 'no for 99% of MMOs', hence why it doesn't work.
Happy to admit, there can be exceptions but not as a general rule.
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
I'm also baffles why this thread is still going. Starting from the completely falsified title (there are several examples where giving players tools to create does work, therefore invalidating the claim) and one-sided opening post, it should have died fast.
Then again, this is MMORPG.com, where agitators are not only left unmoderated, but almost encouraged.
That's exactly what I'm asking you to do, and it's hard to tell whether you right now really don't see the difference or if you're just trolling.
Who has made that claim? I have yet to see anyone make the claims you present in the two quotes above. Can you link to these posts you're talking about?So far it seems that only problem here is that you don't understand the difference between "can be / has been a solution for issue x" and "solves all our problems"
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Yeah, cause EQ: Next with Landmark didn't create any threads.
Nor did the whole 'old fashion MMO were better because it gave player tools' posts ever occur here.
I mean.. really? REALLY?!
And I really want to reiterate that all this thread was suppose to do was 'saying give player tools is great and all, but what's the actual cost?'
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
Can you explain what you mean by this post...
Can you explain what you mean by this post...
I want to know what YOU mean by this post. *waggles finger*
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Can you explain what you mean by this post...
Can you explain what you mean by this post...
I want to know what YOU mean by this post. *waggles finger*
I don't get it.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
=P
I'm under the impression that Jpnz doesn't know what he's talking about, or what Visual "Studios" actually is. Maybe I'm wrong, his post is too vague to tell.
And I'm just mashing keys to kill some time while a new build of a game loads. Nevermind me or anything I post during the next half hour.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Well "tools" most certainly can work and we really have seen so little of it,there is nothing of magnitude to draw any conclusions from.
All you need to know is that the "TOOLS" is what games are made from,so of course they can work if the tools are good and the users are given full access.The implementation of the tools also matters.It has worked miracles in other games ,mostly FPS games however in the MMORPG industry there are some huge drawbacks,example allotted bandwidth and WHAT you are allowed to add into the game and COST.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I don't think it is about the tools. It is about the talent of the person wielding the tools.
After all, everyone has access to a word processor. How many can write a novel like John Grisham, or David Weber? Just because the tools are available does not mean that most people can create anything good.