Much like a slider for a "Hard" or "Insane" game difficulty I wouldn't mind an experience slider so that I could really slow down the exp gain to stay with friends or ramp it back to normal for alts or for those who simply want to gain levels.
Let me have some control over my progression.
In some games I am gaining so much exp while crafting that gearing and combat experience take a back seat. Not to mention the fact that I am missing content on some levels. Sometimes I wouldn't mind staying around the mid levels for a while just because some of the content really speaks to me.
Of course this might be abused in terms of over gearing for certain level plateaus or in terms of pvp but those problems can be addressed separately and in various ways.
Or you just...level sync. >_>; (or level two classes simultaneously like me).
Oh wait this game is WoW in which this kind of thing isn't possible, I forgot.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Originally posted by Hyanmen Originally posted by MuffinStumpMuch like a slider for a "Hard" or "Insane" game difficulty I wouldn't mind an experience slider so that I could really slow down the exp gain to stay with friends or ramp it back to normal for alts or for those who simply want to gain levels.Let me have some control over my progression. In some games I am gaining so much exp while crafting that gearing and combat experience take a back seat. Not to mention the fact that I am missing content on some levels. Sometimes I wouldn't mind staying around the mid levels for a while just because some of the content really speaks to me.Of course this might be abused in terms of over gearing for certain level plateaus or in terms of pvp but those problems can be addressed separately and in various ways.
Or you just...level sync. >_>; (or level two classes simultaneously like me).
Oh wait this game is WoW in which this kind of thing isn't possible, I forgot.
I was speaking in general terms about character progression control as some of the discussion wasn't RR specific. Perhaps not the best idea on this particular sub-forum. (Even still, not sure why I get the antagonistic response)
At any rate, there is still a degree of difference between those systems to me in terms of true character progression control (shrug)
Originally posted by bcbully Along with the social aspects If the process is to fast, other parts of the game like crafting lose meaning. Leveling turns into nothing more than 1 month filler till sub content.
Trust me, crafting is in no way in danger of losing meaning in FFXIV.
Trust me, these people take the square WoW template and forcibly attach it to the triangle FFXIV mold.
Hurrdurr similar UI, quest icons ==> everything is WoW
I think the reason why most MMOs are making leveling faster and faster is an attempt to make it more social.
There are a group of players who burn through content with amazing speed. It was the same way with EQ. Remember we use to call it EverCrack, well while those guild members or friends played non stop us casuals who didnt have as much time to play on the game fell further and further behind. The logic I think they have is, if we make it easier for casuals to catch up to the 8+ hour a day players everyone can play together. After all the goal is endgame seeing as majority of content added is for endgame and Vocal Forum MMO players always talk about how important endgame is. So why exclude a majority of your playerbase from what people deem as the most important part of a MMO, ENDGAME.
If the most important part of a MMO was Grinding from lvl 1 to cap why did you all b**ch about endgame being the most important and how grinding to cap was annoying and need to be removed back in the day. Now they focus on endgame and try to get rid of grinding to cap and you b**ch about not enough grind to cap.
Like Ive said in earlier Posts MMO players are there own worse enemies. They have no clue what they want.
Years ago we complained about Grinding to cap so they remove it now we complain about no grinding to cap. And Reminisce on how what we complained about in past games was what made them good??!?!?!??!
I know i'm gonna get flayed for this, but I sort of miss Lineage 2 leveling, the group grinding and pvp setup. The game wasn't about getting to the last level, it was about politics, crafting, pvp, and socializing. And you had a nice set of skills relatively early on which made the leveling much less of a pain.
Originally posted by EvolvedMonky
I think the reason why most MMOs are making leveling faster and faster is an attempt to make it more social.
There are a group of players who burn through content with amazing speed. It was the same way with EQ. Remember we use to call it EverCrack, well while those guild members or friends played non stop us casuals who didnt have as much time to play on the game fell further and further behind. The logic I think they have is, if we make it easier for casuals to catch up to the 8+ hour a day players everyone can play together. After all the goal is endgame seeing as majority of content added is for endgame and Vocal Forum MMO players always talk about how important endgame is. So why exclude a majority of your playerbase from what people deem as the most important part of a MMO, ENDGAME.
If the most important part of a MMO was Grinding from lvl 1 to cap why did you all b**ch about endgame being the most important and how grinding to cap was annoying and need to be removed back in the day. Now they focus on endgame and try to get rid of grinding to cap and you b**ch about not enough grind to cap.
Like Ive said in earlier Posts MMO players are there own worse enemies. They have no clue what they want.
Years ago we complained about Grinding to cap so they remove it now we complain about no grinding to cap. And Reminisce on how what we complained about in past games was what made them good??!?!?!??!
LOL whatever guys.
Ever hear the phrase "Don't know what you have until it's gone"?
I feel the leveling speed is right on par with all the other current MMOs I have played recently. I've been playing since release and my highest level is 23. Of course, I have plenty of other jobs leveled along with that but 23 is my highest and where I am with the story line.
Honestly... If it took months to level for most of the people around here who seem to play for 4-8 hours a day... It would take me 2 years or so. Lol. I really love being a casual gamer. Everything is so much more enjoyable haha.
Originally posted by FoomerangSorry to hear that. My experience so far has been different.
Bullshit.Maybe you talked to a few more people but the games mechanics are still same. You can't deny it with a simple one liner. You should have just said it's not the games fault it's yours. Which again is bullshit.
I roleplay and craft.
So you substitute user provided game play to improve socialization in lieu of actual mechanics provided by the developers to encourage it.
It's a good idea, and will let you socialize more than those who are solely relying on a Developer's solution, but it isn't for everyone of course.
Does help to explain why your experience would be quite different than others though.
yep. not sure why people get so defensive though.
btw I am using developer made systems to play the game. It is an rpg complete with chat, emotes, bars, inns, etc. And the crafting system is very interdependent and lends itself to lots of social opportunities.
I know i'm gonna get flayed for this, but I sort of miss Lineage 2 leveling, the group grinding and pvp setup. The game wasn't about getting to the last level, it was about politics, crafting, pvp, and socializing. And you had a nice set of skills relatively early on which made the leveling much less of a pain.
Originally posted by EvolvedMonky
I think the reason why most MMOs are making leveling faster and faster is an attempt to make it more social.
There are a group of players who burn through content with amazing speed. It was the same way with EQ. Remember we use to call it EverCrack, well while those guild members or friends played non stop us casuals who didnt have as much time to play on the game fell further and further behind. The logic I think they have is, if we make it easier for casuals to catch up to the 8+ hour a day players everyone can play together. After all the goal is endgame seeing as majority of content added is for endgame and Vocal Forum MMO players always talk about how important endgame is. So why exclude a majority of your playerbase from what people deem as the most important part of a MMO, ENDGAME.
If the most important part of a MMO was Grinding from lvl 1 to cap why did you all b**ch about endgame being the most important and how grinding to cap was annoying and need to be removed back in the day. Now they focus on endgame and try to get rid of grinding to cap and you b**ch about not enough grind to cap.
Like Ive said in earlier Posts MMO players are there own worse enemies. They have no clue what they want.
Years ago we complained about Grinding to cap so they remove it now we complain about no grinding to cap. And Reminisce on how what we complained about in past games was what made them good??!?!?!??!
LOL whatever guys.
Ever hear the phrase "Don't know what you have until it's gone"?
Lol good point. But IMHO I think the degrading of social interaction in MMOs has more to do with our culture and a lil with current game design, there not innocent in this.
But are you sure its social chat like Barrens that you want or just others depending upon you for there game experience?
Do you guys really want it like it was in EQ where elitism and if you didnt kiss @55 of certain people you were SOL on game content?
Do you guys really want Full loot PvP like it was in UO where gangs and anti-social deliquentism forced the majority of players to camp the city graveyard for undead to level, and when you saw someone out in the wilderness your first instinct was to hide not say hello?
While this post is diverging from the long lvl grind = social bliss. What im trying to point out is that the old systems didnt encourage social interaction but force it upon people.
Seperating players by levels will not cause social interaction but force people into small communities forced to socialize to catch up with there friends. While this worked when there were only a handful off MMOs but with todays market they would just leave..... After all we have social media sites like tumblr, instagram and facebook. People now already have internet communities MMOs are just a place they can play a game together. Compared to us in our youths who had what mIRC and other chat rooms where the rule of the internet was being anonymous.
I think the lack of social skills has less to do with game design and more to do with how our society currently socializes. Case in point, its not up to a video game to make you social. The only tool you need to be social is yourself.
The fact that we blame a software developer for our inability to be social is testament to how skewed our definition of the term has become.
Social these days is twitter one liners and taking pictures of your food.
Originally posted by bcbully Along with the social aspects If the process is to fast, other parts of the game like crafting lose meaning. Leveling turns into nothing more than 1 month filler till sub content.
Trust me, crafting is in no way in danger of losing meaning in FFXIV.
I don't trust you. I have a few crafts leveled myself and really all it is is a way to exchange gil with other crafters currently. No combat jobs really buy your stuff because they lvl so fast and dungeon gear is easy to get and a lot of times better.
Even at lvl 50 if you HQ combat gear and meld the perfect materia it's marginally better than darklight gear if at all. Sure you can make relic base weapons but the market is already over saturated. NPCs fix gear for cheaper so explain to me how crafting is necessary other then to just swap gil between crafters? Dont just say "trust me".
Until there is a real incentive for people with combat jobs to buy stuff there will be no real meaning behind crafting.
Originally posted by k11keeper Originally posted by SilacoidOriginally posted by bcbullyAlong with the social aspects If the process is to fast, other parts of the game like crafting lose meaning. Leveling turns into nothing more than 1 month filler till sub content.
Trust me, crafting is in no way in danger of losing meaning in FFXIV.I don't trust you. I have a few crafts leveled myself and really all it is is a way to exchange gil with other crafters currently. No combat jobs really buy your stuff because they lvl so fast and dungeon gear is easy to get and a lot of times better.
Even at lvl 50 if you HQ combat gear and meld the perfect materia it's marginally better than darklight gear if at all. Sure you can make relic base weapons but the market is already over saturated. NPCs fix gear for cheaper so explain to me how crafting is necessary other then to just swap gil between crafters? Dont just say "trust me".
Until there is a real incentive for people with combat jobs to buy stuff there will be no real meaning behind crafting.
Why do people dismiss crafting just because it caters between other crafters? Thats like saying combat is pointless because its only done with other combat classes. Crafters make gear for other crafters. Blasphemy! Welcome to an aspect of mmos that you are apparently not too familiar with
There are plenty of opportunities to socialize in the game, both while leveling and at endgame. Just because people decide not to while exploiting game mechanics to level as quickly as possible doesn't mean they're not there.
BTW still level 23 on my main combat class. Been doing tons of crafting though.
And no, placing the blame upon the players is not 'bullshit', as one earlier poster put it. You can't force socialization.
It depends on how you level. On your first toon, your story line will slow you down.
But :
1) your story line will make you solo.
2) Duty finder kills the community.
Also gold sellers kill the community , I have over 50 gold sellers blacklisted and they just keep on coming like a bad disease.
They practically destroy chat . Im to the point where Im going to disable shouts soon .
Yeah, all of these things are pretty huge inhibitors to creating a positive social environment, although the personal story quest only to a lesser extent. I think every MMO nowadays has to have some solo content available for a more relaxing, less time constrained game time experience. I also think the main story does an excellent job of guiding players to and incorporating the group content. So there's that.
But this particular duty find suffers from some of the basic problems that have caused a lot of dungeon finders to be the source of major player scrutiny, one of which is undoubtedly its negative impact on community. You get grouped with people who you are not only unlikely to form friendships with - due to the impersonal, zero-social-effort-required nature of the auto-grouping - but are actually not allowed to form friendships with - due to being grouped with players from different servers in an MMO with no cross-server chat or friendlist capabilities. I've met several players already who I've had to say goodbye to forever, which we all did lamentably, because there was simple no feasible way to keep in touch and play with each other again. Not only that, but as soon as you exit the dungeon, your party is instantly disbanded. BAM, friends gone.
Now I happened to be fortunate enough find an awesome group of players from my own server while on a dungeon run in beta, before the duty finder was up and running. I'm actually grateful the duty finder wasn't working at the time.
To the last point, the only other means of social interaction among players is in the open world through /shout chat. The gold sellers really do hurt the game here, as they've caused most players to turn off /shout in their primary chat tab, or they switch to a tab that doesn't have /shout enabled. This all but alienates the player from all other players.
I remember playing EQ and it took months to level up . In that time I would find a lot of friends who were similar levelling speed as myself and play with them a lot .
However in this game it appears that levelling is so fast you can get a level in a few hours easily .
FATES are pretty much anti social as well mostly . And super newtasically easy xp creating some of the worst gamers ever when they dare to set foot inside a dungeon .
Kinda sad in some way this game could've been really something special if they made it a lasting experience from 1 to 50 instead of a slam bang thank you maam type game .
Sorry you feel like this.
For me it's been different.
I have FINALLY removed my sub to World of Warcraft in favor of playing FFXIV: ARR.
The level speed feels quite good though I wish doing dungeons gave more XP.
In FFXIV: ARR people in dungeons actually speak to eachother, at least in the one's I've been in.
In WoW just forget about that, complete silence.
Chat going constantly for one thing or another, not so many rude people, compared to WoW.
Actually surprised at how many nice and helpful people plays FFXIV: ARR.
I'm in a happy place now, for now
You can choose to take your time, you, YOU, personally, have the choice with how quickly you want to advance.
I have played since official release, well, the first week I was hardly able to log on.
Though, my highest lvl character is lvl 28 Archer.
I have taken my time, I am in no hurry, and things are great.
Tons of people from what I know, are at lvl 50 already.
If those people complain about lack of content, then they have no one but themselves to blame.
Yap, I actually believe that, think me silly for it? So be it.
If I decide I want some speed for a few lvls, as I have now and then, then I have that choice.
Not getting a mindless superbly long grind stuffed in my face.
Well, I guess you could call fates that, but it's up to what you make of it yourself.
If it's not for you, don't play it, simple (=
The people and the friends that we have lost, and the dreams that have faded, never forget them~
I have been leveling pretty slowly, I think that the dungeons can be social (just like any game depends on who you go with). As for the pace of leveling, I think that it is pretty similar to most games out now, no? I mean it seems like most games, if you try hard, you can get a level every hour or so. If you are grinding fates then you will probably level a whole lot faster than just doing the quests and dungeons.... I don't know really cause I am still leveling my conjurer.
Originally posted by bcbullyAlong with the social aspects If the process is to fast, other parts of the game like crafting lose meaning. Leveling turns into nothing more than 1 month filler till sub content.
Trust me, crafting is in no way in danger of losing meaning in FFXIV.
I don't trust you. I have a few crafts leveled myself and really all it is is a way to exchange gil with other crafters currently. No combat jobs really buy your stuff because they lvl so fast and dungeon gear is easy to get and a lot of times better.
Even at lvl 50 if you HQ combat gear and meld the perfect materia it's marginally better than darklight gear if at all. Sure you can make relic base weapons but the market is already over saturated. NPCs fix gear for cheaper so explain to me how crafting is necessary other then to just swap gil between crafters? Dont just say "trust me".
Until there is a real incentive for people with combat jobs to buy stuff there will be no real meaning behind crafting.
Why do people dismiss crafting just because it caters between other crafters? Thats like saying combat is pointless because its only done with other combat classes. Crafters make gear for other crafters. Blasphemy! Welcome to an aspect of mmos that you are apparently not too familiar with
Because it's different?
Long ago in the distant past crafters used to make gear that was useful to combat classes, but this has been largely displaced by the dropped gear system being better than all that most MMOs employ today.
SE found a unique solution I think, make dropped gear relevant to combat players, since they fought to obtain it, and to keep crafting relevant, put a solid interdependency between the crafter's.
Pretty good system IMO, makes for a way to keep most everyone happy, except perhaps those players who prefer to craft their own gear to wear in combat, but, I'm not sure that system ever was viable in any game I've played.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Originally posted by Kyleran Originally posted by FoomerangOriginally posted by k11keeperOriginally posted by SilacoidOriginally posted by bcbullyAlong with the social aspects If the process is to fast, other parts of the game like crafting lose meaning. Leveling turns into nothing more than 1 month filler till sub content.
Trust me, crafting is in no way in danger of losing meaning in FFXIV.I don't trust you. I have a few crafts leveled myself and really all it is is a way to exchange gil with other crafters currently. No combat jobs really buy your stuff because they lvl so fast and dungeon gear is easy to get and a lot of times better.Even at lvl 50 if you HQ combat gear and meld the perfect materia it's marginally better than darklight gear if at all. Sure you can make relic base weapons but the market is already over saturated. NPCs fix gear for cheaper so explain to me how crafting is necessary other then to just swap gil between crafters? Dont just say "trust me".Until there is a real incentive for people with combat jobs to buy stuff there will be no real meaning behind crafting. Why do people dismiss crafting just because it caters between other crafters? Thats like saying combat is pointless because its only done with other combat classes. Crafters make gear for other crafters. Blasphemy! Welcome to an aspect of mmos that you are apparently not too familiar with Because it's different?
Long ago in the distant past crafters used to make gear that was useful to combat classes, but this has been largely displaced by the dropped gear system being better than all that most MMOs employ today.
SE found a unique solution I think, make dropped gear relevant to combat players, since they fought to obtain it, and to keep crafting relevant, put a solid interdependency between the crafter's.
Pretty good system IMO, makes for a way to keep most everyone happy, except perhaps those players who prefer to craft their own gear to wear in combat, but, I'm not sure that system ever was viable in any game I've played.
Indeed. This game has a TON of people crafting and gathering. Makes sense since half the starting classes are non combat. And what do all those hard working crafters do for gear when they want to take a break and do a little combat? They get it from other crafters as well.
So lets say half the people playing are crafting (which sounds about right when I look at how many people I see crafting, gathering , fighting), and they get all their crafting gear from crafters. Crafters get a lot of their combat gear from crafters (I know I do), since it is easier to get some good crafted gear and jump into fates for some group pve action.
Then lets say combat players get 100% of their gear from pve content. We will ignore the fact that they still need crafters to meld materia. We will ignore the fact that they use crafted consumables as well. And we will say for arguments sake that half the population only does combat and does not craft or gather.
That is still the minority of where most of the game's items are coming from. Even in those heavily skewed numbers, the majority of items in game are being created by crafters and used by crafters.
And yet, people want to dismiss it completely because its not absolutely 100% the best for everything? Thats not good game design. As an almost exclusive crafter in mmos, even I know that would be horrible game design. Just like its bad game design to funnel all content through a single content type. Whether its for combat or crafting the same rule applies.
The option to level too fast is available in every game. If this is what you solely obsess on then it's lightening fast. Sounds like that is what you are focusing on, leveling as fast as humanly possible? This is your problem due to the option, not a complaint, you need to learn to deal with it is all. You don't have to be a content locust lemming.
I've been playing since launch and am 26. Why? Well, mainly, whats the rush? Play the game the way it's meant to be played would be a good start. There is literally tons to do on the same character, mix things up as the game was designed for this type of play, take advantage of the variety this game offers.
As far as social join a free company I'm in a real social chatty one. When i first joined i died, and then i died again awhile later, after about 6 deaths i finally clued in, i was too engrossed with the chat. lol
My faith is my shield! - Turalyon 2022
Your legend ends here and now! - (Battles Won Long Ago)
It depends on how you level. On your first toon, your story line will slow you down.
But :
1) your story line will make you solo.
2) Duty finder kills the community.
i berly use it anymore i ask fc or i get a couple of people formt he server since you know you can make ANy party setup as long as you have the full light party on the same server
I remember playing EQ and it took months to level up . In that time I would find a lot of friends who were similar levelling speed as myself and play with them a lot .
However in this game it appears that levelling is so fast you can get a level in a few hours easily .
FATES are pretty much anti social as well mostly . And super newtasically easy xp creating some of the worst gamers ever when they dare to set foot inside a dungeon .
Kinda sad in some way this game could've been really something special if they made it a lasting experience from 1 to 50 instead of a slam bang thank you maam type game .
It's not so much the leveling speed, its the quest based leveling. It makes socializing really hard.
Almost all socialization problems in MMORPGs can be resolved easily by being sociable. ANYTHING can be used to be social. Take the comment about gold spammers ruining the community. BULLSHIT!. They are an annoyance for sure but they only ruin what you let them. This morning in Uldah, we have a very interesting conversation in /shout right after we all blisted the spammers, we (those in Uldah) started discussing many aspects of the whys what's and hows etc etc. Point is. If you aren't social in an online game, it's probably because you are waiting for "social" to hit you over the head.
Originally posted by FoomerangSorry to hear that. My experience so far has been different.
Bullshit.
Maybe you talked to a few more people but the games mechanics are still same. You can't deny it with a simple one liner. You should have just said it's not the games fault it's yours. Which again is bullshit.
I roleplay and craft.
So you substitute user provided game play to improve socialization in lieu of actual mechanics provided by the developers to encourage it.
It's a good idea, and will let you socialize more than those who are solely relying on a Developer's solution, but it isn't for everyone of course.
Does help to explain why your experience would be quite different than others though.
I get so sick of seeing these kinds of statements. Being social is on the player, finding friends is on the player, making a community is on the players. IF you decide to just float along like a log in a river, that's on you, you have to actively participate to find friends and make lasting bonds, there's nothing a developer can do to change your social skills.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Originally posted by bcbully Along with the social aspects If the process is to fast, other parts of the game like crafting lose meaning. Leveling turns into nothing more than 1 month filler till sub content.
Trust me, crafting is in no way in danger of losing meaning in FFXIV.
I don't trust you. I have a few crafts leveled myself and really all it is is a way to exchange gil with other crafters currently. No combat jobs really buy your stuff because they lvl so fast and dungeon gear is easy to get and a lot of times better.
Even at lvl 50 if you HQ combat gear and meld the perfect materia it's marginally better than darklight gear if at all. Sure you can make relic base weapons but the market is already over saturated. NPCs fix gear for cheaper so explain to me how crafting is necessary other then to just swap gil between crafters? Dont just say "trust me".
Until there is a real incentive for people with combat jobs to buy stuff there will be no real meaning behind crafting.
The funniest thing about posts like this is when people with absolutely no experience on ARR come to this thread to agree with it. Indeed when someone agrees with you it doesn't matter if they're speaking out of their ass or not.
Dungeon gear is easy to get? I'd like to know how many people here have geared themselves out of dungeon runs with the 3 loot per run divided between 4 people. I'd also like to know how many people bother with this when the game gives them hundreds of thousands of gil to spend on crafted items they can buy immediately from the AH.
Main class is rather easy to keep geared since the one time quests help you with that. After that you're speaking out of your ass if you think dungeons supply the players with enough gear. First you have to get the right drops, then beat others on the need/greed roll. Sounds totally feasible.
You either haven't done any dungeons or you're lying. The game is extremely crafter dependent for every player out there. Armors and weapons sell extremely well on the AH at all level ranges beyond 1 and 5.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Comments
Or you just...level sync. >_>; (or level two classes simultaneously like me).
Oh wait this game is WoW in which this kind of thing isn't possible, I forgot.
Oh wait this game is WoW in which this kind of thing isn't possible, I forgot.
I was speaking in general terms about character progression control as some of the discussion wasn't RR specific. Perhaps not the best idea on this particular sub-forum. (Even still, not sure why I get the antagonistic response)
At any rate, there is still a degree of difference between those systems to me in terms of true character progression control (shrug)
lol
I think the reason why most MMOs are making leveling faster and faster is an attempt to make it more social.
There are a group of players who burn through content with amazing speed. It was the same way with EQ. Remember we use to call it EverCrack, well while those guild members or friends played non stop us casuals who didnt have as much time to play on the game fell further and further behind. The logic I think they have is, if we make it easier for casuals to catch up to the 8+ hour a day players everyone can play together. After all the goal is endgame seeing as majority of content added is for endgame and Vocal Forum MMO players always talk about how important endgame is. So why exclude a majority of your playerbase from what people deem as the most important part of a MMO, ENDGAME.
If the most important part of a MMO was Grinding from lvl 1 to cap why did you all b**ch about endgame being the most important and how grinding to cap was annoying and need to be removed back in the day. Now they focus on endgame and try to get rid of grinding to cap and you b**ch about not enough grind to cap.
Like Ive said in earlier Posts MMO players are there own worse enemies. They have no clue what they want.
Years ago we complained about Grinding to cap so they remove it now we complain about no grinding to cap. And Reminisce on how what we complained about in past games was what made them good??!?!?!??!
LOL whatever guys.
I know i'm gonna get flayed for this, but I sort of miss Lineage 2 leveling, the group grinding and pvp setup. The game wasn't about getting to the last level, it was about politics, crafting, pvp, and socializing. And you had a nice set of skills relatively early on which made the leveling much less of a pain.
Ever hear the phrase "Don't know what you have until it's gone"?
Honestly... If it took months to level for most of the people around here who seem to play for 4-8 hours a day... It would take me 2 years or so. Lol. I really love being a casual gamer. Everything is so much more enjoyable haha.
btw I am using developer made systems to play the game. It is an rpg complete with chat, emotes, bars, inns, etc. And the crafting system is very interdependent and lends itself to lots of social opportunities.
Lol good point. But IMHO I think the degrading of social interaction in MMOs has more to do with our culture and a lil with current game design, there not innocent in this.
But are you sure its social chat like Barrens that you want or just others depending upon you for there game experience?
Do you guys really want it like it was in EQ where elitism and if you didnt kiss @55 of certain people you were SOL on game content?
Do you guys really want Full loot PvP like it was in UO where gangs and anti-social deliquentism forced the majority of players to camp the city graveyard for undead to level, and when you saw someone out in the wilderness your first instinct was to hide not say hello?
While this post is diverging from the long lvl grind = social bliss. What im trying to point out is that the old systems didnt encourage social interaction but force it upon people.
Seperating players by levels will not cause social interaction but force people into small communities forced to socialize to catch up with there friends. While this worked when there were only a handful off MMOs but with todays market they would just leave..... After all we have social media sites like tumblr, instagram and facebook. People now already have internet communities MMOs are just a place they can play a game together. Compared to us in our youths who had what mIRC and other chat rooms where the rule of the internet was being anonymous.
Different times, old ways wont work.
I think the lack of social skills has less to do with game design and more to do with how our society currently socializes. Case in point, its not up to a video game to make you social. The only tool you need to be social is yourself.
The fact that we blame a software developer for our inability to be social is testament to how skewed our definition of the term has become.
Social these days is twitter one liners and taking pictures of your food.
I don't trust you. I have a few crafts leveled myself and really all it is is a way to exchange gil with other crafters currently. No combat jobs really buy your stuff because they lvl so fast and dungeon gear is easy to get and a lot of times better.
Even at lvl 50 if you HQ combat gear and meld the perfect materia it's marginally better than darklight gear if at all. Sure you can make relic base weapons but the market is already over saturated. NPCs fix gear for cheaper so explain to me how crafting is necessary other then to just swap gil between crafters? Dont just say "trust me".
Until there is a real incentive for people with combat jobs to buy stuff there will be no real meaning behind crafting.
I don't trust you. I have a few crafts leveled myself and really all it is is a way to exchange gil with other crafters currently. No combat jobs really buy your stuff because they lvl so fast and dungeon gear is easy to get and a lot of times better.
Even at lvl 50 if you HQ combat gear and meld the perfect materia it's marginally better than darklight gear if at all. Sure you can make relic base weapons but the market is already over saturated. NPCs fix gear for cheaper so explain to me how crafting is necessary other then to just swap gil between crafters? Dont just say "trust me".
Until there is a real incentive for people with combat jobs to buy stuff there will be no real meaning behind crafting.
Why do people dismiss crafting just because it caters between other crafters? Thats like saying combat is pointless because its only done with other combat classes. Crafters make gear for other crafters. Blasphemy! Welcome to an aspect of mmos that you are apparently not too familiar with
There are plenty of opportunities to socialize in the game, both while leveling and at endgame. Just because people decide not to while exploiting game mechanics to level as quickly as possible doesn't mean they're not there.
BTW still level 23 on my main combat class. Been doing tons of crafting though.
And no, placing the blame upon the players is not 'bullshit', as one earlier poster put it. You can't force socialization.
Yeah, all of these things are pretty huge inhibitors to creating a positive social environment, although the personal story quest only to a lesser extent. I think every MMO nowadays has to have some solo content available for a more relaxing, less time constrained game time experience. I also think the main story does an excellent job of guiding players to and incorporating the group content. So there's that.
But this particular duty find suffers from some of the basic problems that have caused a lot of dungeon finders to be the source of major player scrutiny, one of which is undoubtedly its negative impact on community. You get grouped with people who you are not only unlikely to form friendships with - due to the impersonal, zero-social-effort-required nature of the auto-grouping - but are actually not allowed to form friendships with - due to being grouped with players from different servers in an MMO with no cross-server chat or friendlist capabilities. I've met several players already who I've had to say goodbye to forever, which we all did lamentably, because there was simple no feasible way to keep in touch and play with each other again. Not only that, but as soon as you exit the dungeon, your party is instantly disbanded. BAM, friends gone.
Now I happened to be fortunate enough find an awesome group of players from my own server while on a dungeon run in beta, before the duty finder was up and running. I'm actually grateful the duty finder wasn't working at the time.
To the last point, the only other means of social interaction among players is in the open world through /shout chat. The gold sellers really do hurt the game here, as they've caused most players to turn off /shout in their primary chat tab, or they switch to a tab that doesn't have /shout enabled. This all but alienates the player from all other players.
Sorry you feel like this.
For me it's been different.
I have FINALLY
removed 
my sub to World of Warcraft in favor of playing FFXIV: ARR.
The level speed feels quite good though I wish doing dungeons gave more XP.
In FFXIV: ARR people in dungeons actually speak to eachother, at least in the one's I've been in.
In WoW just forget about that, complete silence.
Chat going constantly for one thing or another, not so many rude people, compared to WoW.
Actually surprised at how many nice and helpful people plays FFXIV: ARR.
I'm in a happy place now, for now
You can choose to take your time, you, YOU, personally, have the choice with how quickly you want to advance.
I have played since official release, well, the first week I was hardly able to log on.
Though, my highest lvl character is lvl 28 Archer.
I have taken my time, I am in no hurry, and things are great.
Tons of people from what I know, are at lvl 50 already.
If those people complain about lack of content, then they have no one but themselves to blame.
Yap, I actually believe that, think me silly for it? So be it.
If I decide I want some speed for a few lvls, as I have now and then, then I have that choice.
Not getting a mindless superbly long grind stuffed in my face.
Well, I guess you could call fates that, but it's up to what you make of it yourself.
If it's not for you, don't play it, simple
(=
The people and the friends that we have lost, and the dreams that have faded, never forget them~
No game can prevent the "leveling too fast" without out excessive restrictions. If someone wants to reach cap quickly, they'll do it.
I've been playing almost daily for a few hours since the game was released, and heavily n the weekends. My character is:
36 SCH/SUM - 31 WHM - 26 PUG - 20 THM
Let's also not forget the crafting.
Seriously, games are not always about reaching the "end-game" quickly
Raquelis in various games
Played: Everything
Playing: Nioh 2, Civ6
Wants: The World
Anticipating: Everquest Next Crowfall, Pantheon, Elden Ring
Because it's different?
Long ago in the distant past crafters used to make gear that was useful to combat classes, but this has been largely displaced by the dropped gear system being better than all that most MMOs employ today.
SE found a unique solution I think, make dropped gear relevant to combat players, since they fought to obtain it, and to keep crafting relevant, put a solid interdependency between the crafter's.
Pretty good system IMO, makes for a way to keep most everyone happy, except perhaps those players who prefer to craft their own gear to wear in combat, but, I'm not sure that system ever was viable in any game I've played.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I don't trust you. I have a few crafts leveled myself and really all it is is a way to exchange gil with other crafters currently. No combat jobs really buy your stuff because they lvl so fast and dungeon gear is easy to get and a lot of times better. Even at lvl 50 if you HQ combat gear and meld the perfect materia it's marginally better than darklight gear if at all. Sure you can make relic base weapons but the market is already over saturated. NPCs fix gear for cheaper so explain to me how crafting is necessary other then to just swap gil between crafters? Dont just say "trust me". Until there is a real incentive for people with combat jobs to buy stuff there will be no real meaning behind crafting.
Why do people dismiss crafting just because it caters between other crafters? Thats like saying combat is pointless because its only done with other combat classes. Crafters make gear for other crafters. Blasphemy! Welcome to an aspect of mmos that you are apparently not too familiar with
Because it's different?
Long ago in the distant past crafters used to make gear that was useful to combat classes, but this has been largely displaced by the dropped gear system being better than all that most MMOs employ today.
SE found a unique solution I think, make dropped gear relevant to combat players, since they fought to obtain it, and to keep crafting relevant, put a solid interdependency between the crafter's.
Pretty good system IMO, makes for a way to keep most everyone happy, except perhaps those players who prefer to craft their own gear to wear in combat, but, I'm not sure that system ever was viable in any game I've played.
Indeed. This game has a TON of people crafting and gathering. Makes sense since half the starting classes are non combat. And what do all those hard working crafters do for gear when they want to take a break and do a little combat? They get it from other crafters as well.
So lets say half the people playing are crafting (which sounds about right when I look at how many people I see crafting, gathering , fighting), and they get all their crafting gear from crafters. Crafters get a lot of their combat gear from crafters (I know I do), since it is easier to get some good crafted gear and jump into fates for some group pve action.
Then lets say combat players get 100% of their gear from pve content. We will ignore the fact that they still need crafters to meld materia. We will ignore the fact that they use crafted consumables as well. And we will say for arguments sake that half the population only does combat and does not craft or gather.
That is still the minority of where most of the game's items are coming from. Even in those heavily skewed numbers, the majority of items in game are being created by crafters and used by crafters.
And yet, people want to dismiss it completely because its not absolutely 100% the best for everything? Thats not good game design. As an almost exclusive crafter in mmos, even I know that would be horrible game design. Just like its bad game design to funnel all content through a single content type. Whether its for combat or crafting the same rule applies.
I've been playing since launch and am 26. Why? Well, mainly, whats the rush? Play the game the way it's meant to be played would be a good start. There is literally tons to do on the same character, mix things up as the game was designed for this type of play, take advantage of the variety this game offers.
As far as social join a free company I'm in a real social chatty one. When i first joined i died, and then i died again awhile later, after about 6 deaths i finally clued in, i was too engrossed with the chat. lol
i berly use it anymore i ask fc or i get a couple of people formt he server since you know you can make ANy party setup as long as you have the full light party on the same server
It's not so much the leveling speed, its the quest based leveling. It makes socializing really hard.
People always come up with the most ridiculous reason why there's a lack of community in MMO's.
Besides deciding to grind fates (the fast route to leveling) is a decision you make on your own, want it to go by slower? Slow down...
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I get so sick of seeing these kinds of statements. Being social is on the player, finding friends is on the player, making a community is on the players. IF you decide to just float along like a log in a river, that's on you, you have to actively participate to find friends and make lasting bonds, there's nothing a developer can do to change your social skills.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The funniest thing about posts like this is when people with absolutely no experience on ARR come to this thread to agree with it. Indeed when someone agrees with you it doesn't matter if they're speaking out of their ass or not.
Dungeon gear is easy to get? I'd like to know how many people here have geared themselves out of dungeon runs with the 3 loot per run divided between 4 people. I'd also like to know how many people bother with this when the game gives them hundreds of thousands of gil to spend on crafted items they can buy immediately from the AH.
Main class is rather easy to keep geared since the one time quests help you with that. After that you're speaking out of your ass if you think dungeons supply the players with enough gear. First you have to get the right drops, then beat others on the need/greed roll. Sounds totally feasible.
You either haven't done any dungeons or you're lying. The game is extremely crafter dependent for every player out there. Armors and weapons sell extremely well on the AH at all level ranges beyond 1 and 5.