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Why does TSW get such slow content updates?

RazeeksterRazeekster Solon, MEPosts: 2,201Member Uncommon

I've been wanting to buy the game because I did have a blast with it in beta, but I can't get myself to buy a game that doesn't really get any updates. The updates that I have seen for TSW have been quite small and I heard they charge for some updates referring to them as "DLCs" as if TSW was just a normal RPG PC game and not an MMO. I'm not sure if this is true or not, but it is I guess that would even be alright if I also hadn't heard that these $10 DLCs only contain a few quests in them.

 

So yeah, not really sure if I want to buy this game because I don't seem to see it expanding at a very fast rate at all.

Smile

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Comments

  • Po_ggPo_gg Twigwarren, WestfarthingPosts: 2,721Member Uncommon

    True, the plan was a bi-monthly schedule, and it's more like a 3 - 3.5 months in reality. Maybe because the size. You see, they're not small updates, actually they're pretty much qualified to call themselves as DLC - with new mechanics, aux. weapons, etc.

    The "only contains a few quests" usually means +5-6 hours of new story, and a greatly written one, might I add, with external backups and stuff, just check Tyler Freeborn's blog if you don't believe me :) ( I admit, #3 was a short one indeed, but it doesn't matter anyways, since you got Issue #1 - #4 for free with the box. )

    Since the majority is playing TSW for the story and the missions, the 3 Issues that came after the b2p switch are well worthed the price. Which is leading to the $10 part. TSW is b2p with a sub option, and members (subscribers) get those updates for free, with the monthly stipend. Free players can skip them, or buy them for less than a usual monthly fee :)

     

    That above is just for the middle section of your post. As I started, you're right, TSW "don't seem to expanding at a very fast rate at all". I think this present pace of 5 Issues in a year (#5 - #9 in 2013, hopefully :) ) will stay as the standard for TSW.... and I don't think it would be a problem. Good story writing takes time.

  • TheocritusTheocritus Gary, INPosts: 3,754Member Uncommon
    Funcom has had alot of layoffs...They are also working on a new game (miniature legos or something like that).....
  • cheyanecheyane Rome Posts: 3,002Member Uncommon

    It is like writing a book not fed ex fetch quests and not enough supported the game so it is not doing so great. Perhaps if people valued ideas and stories and a game that tries to do something different it might get more people to work on it.

     

    Games need people to support it. Unfortunately no matter how good a game is if not enough people spend money on it it will die eventually. Learn to support the things you value.

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  • pierthpierth San Antonio, TXPosts: 1,503Member

    When I played on release after playing the beta it took me a little over a month of daily play to complete the large majority of the story missions (mostly solo play, about 1/2 way through Transylvania).

    To answer your question I think Funcom just sucks at supporting their product.

    On the other hand, if most players actually took the time to figure out quests themselves rather than googling answers or asking in chat the content would last far longer.

  • DMKanoDMKano Gamercentral, AKPosts: 8,553Member Uncommon

    Content updates for themeparks games are *expensive* - lots of Dev time and lots of devs needed.

    Funcom scaled down their staff so not as many devs to make content updates quickly, and with smaller playerbase = not as much money coming in to afford to pay for more devs.

     

     

  • RazeeksterRazeekster Solon, MEPosts: 2,201Member Uncommon
    Sounds like Funcom is doing pretty bad then... Maybe I'll give it some time to see if things ever manage to turn around, but knowing the company and their previous games they haven't really seemed to have much luck in the MMORPG department besides Anarchy Online and that's a fairly old game.

    Smile

  • ChtugaChtuga OsloPosts: 113Member

    Actually, Funcom has not yet closed down any game.

    They have kept supporting, developing and giving out patches to their games day in and day out. 

    They know how to survive in a cold winters day, and I think we players should also support them and give them credits for their hard work.

    They are what I would call an alternative developer - they are willing to try new things, giving content that is special and unique.

    We players keep asking for it, and Funcom is one of very few that try to deliver this

  • MegilindirMegilindir AnkaraPosts: 89Member
    Originally posted by Chtuga

    Actually, Funcom has not yet closed down any game.

    They have kept supporting, developing and giving out patches to their games day in and day out. 

    They know how to survive in a cold winters day, and I think we players should also support them and give them credits for their hard work.

    They are what I would call an alternative developer - they are willing to try new things, giving content that is special and unique.

    We players keep asking for it, and Funcom is one of very few that try to deliver this

    Then years must 've been passing veery cold for them

    beLIEve

  • AyulinAyulin Mt marion, NYPosts: 334Member
    Originally posted by Cetra
    [mod edit]

    Life support? Hardly.

    I just came back to the game myself  and was concerned I might find it to be the same. Within the first 30 minutes, my concerns were allayed.

    The game is quite active. Always people in Agartha. Always people in the different cities. I'm always coming across people out it the different areas, questing, fighting. The Cabal I'm in has about 20-30 people on a night between all factions, from what I've seen.

    The reason it's getting updates more slowly is because Funcom had laid off people and, I believe, shut down one of their offices. As a result, there are fewer people to work on it. But they still are working on it. In fact, they're still working on story content that was mapped out in advance of the game's release (it's something they did to ensure there would be new content coming out well into the future... a smart move).

    Update 7 has been getting rave reviews from what I've seen/heard (I haven't done it yet, myself), and each update seems to be getting better than the last.

    They've been working on Tokyo, which will be an entirely new area, or group of areas when it's released, with a variety of new missions, characters, story-arcs, etc.

    So, no... TSW is not on life support. Not at all.

     

  • KarteliKarteli Providence, PAPosts: 2,646Member

    OK nobody said it yet ...

     

    but it's quite comical how someone who contributed a grand total of $0 is complaining that there is no funding for new content being released...

     

    I mean if you bought the game, gripe away ... but you played beta and are still thinking about a purchase, then complain that there isn't adequate patches?

     

    Thanks for making my day.

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  • AyulinAyulin Mt marion, NYPosts: 334Member
    Originally posted by Megilindir
    Originally posted by Chtuga

    Actually, Funcom has not yet closed down any game.

    They have kept supporting, developing and giving out patches to their games day in and day out. 

    They know how to survive in a cold winters day, and I think we players should also support them and give them credits for their hard work.

    They are what I would call an alternative developer - they are willing to try new things, giving content that is special and unique.

    We players keep asking for it, and Funcom is one of very few that try to deliver this

    Then years must 've been passing veery cold for them

    And they've weathered them.

    Anarchy Online is still going what... Thirteen  years into its life? Is huge and overflowing with people? No. Is it serving a portion of the MMO playerbase for whom that kind of game and experience is actually what they're seeking? Yes. Is it enough to keep the game going and new stuff being developed? Absolutely.

    At the end of the day, that's all that matters.

    It's a sad sight when people will pass up on a game they feel they could enjoy because it isn't "more popular". That attitude is actually a part of what keeps them not popular... The fewer people playing because "not popular enough", the fewer people to "make it more popular". It's completely self-perpetuating.

    All FC's MMOs are F2P/Hybrid. Though TSW does require an initial purchase.. so it's "B2P", similar to GW2. So why not give it a shot? Even if they went belly up next year... if you enjoyed your time and spent no more than you wanted to... what's the problem?

     

     

  • RaysheRayshe London, ONPosts: 1,284Member

    the B2P killed any hope we had at having regular updates. which sucks cause those "5 or 6 quests per DLC" is usually a large story arc with its own cutscenes and story progression that have all been badass. If anything stopped the regular updates its people being too cheap or being afraid of funcom.

     

    Its sad to because TSW is still one of the best MMO's on the market. if you want proof look at the released popularity on this site. its been either barely behind barely ahead or tied with GW2 for first place. that fact only recently changed with Realm Reborn being released, and that probubly will last until the buzz is gone.

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  • VaporsVapors Fr.Posts: 407Member Uncommon

    Funny how many people always write stuff without knowing barily anything, yes TSW do not bring out monthly DLC's like they wanted. But what do you suppose with a small amount of players. Even though If i am not misstaken they won a price called "most fastly updating content" last year, yes its only for the first 4 months or something:D.

    And to all the guys talking bout life support and they are having bad times since anarchy online, maybe read the latest annual report. Why should they get conatracts with hollywood firms and LEGO, since this firms want to know how the financial future of their partner company could be...

  • AyulinAyulin Mt marion, NYPosts: 334Member
    Originally posted by Rayshe

    the B2P killed any hope we had at having regular updates. which sucks cause those "5 or 6 quests per DLC" is usually a large story arc with its own cutscenes and story progression that have all been badass. If anything stopped the regular updates its people being too cheap or being afraid of funcom.

    People have often cited not liking the combat as their reason for not playing TSW. Now, this is just my opinion, but from where I'm sitting - with all that TSW does extremely well (depth and variety in character development, gorgeous, detailed and convincingly realized environments, downright disturbing stories arcs with  great writing and brilliantly voice-acted characters, very little hand-holding, challenging content, and so on) - it seems to me that people:

    A) Are perhaps intimidated by the breadth and depth of the game and, rather than admitting it's a bit too deep a pool for them to comfortably swim in, they blame it on "poor combat animations".

    B) Really do prefer the shallower waters, where combat animations are more important than everything else I listed above.

    Either way, it just comes across as an amazingly superficial reason. TSW is not a game centered around its combat. It's a much more cerebral game. The brilliance of it is in its depth, detail and mind-bendingly difficult puzzles (assuming you don't just google the solutions or refer to walkthroughs... which people do... but that's not the game's fault).

    But then, aside from the "don't like the combat" side of things... there's a C and D I could think of...

    C:) The game simply isn't up their alley... which is fine. Nothing is for everyone. So long as that's the reason they provide for not liking it, it's a perfectly viable reason. Of course, so many don't do that, and will, in their conceit, decide that if they don't like a game, it must be because it sucks and deserves to crash and burn (because how dare a developer release a game not specifically designed for them).

    D:) Their system isn't quite up to snuff to run the game well. The Dreamworld engine is a bit of a beast, for sure.

    Its sad to because TSW is still one of the best MMO's on the market. if you want proof look at the released popularity on this site. its been either barely behind barely ahead or tied with GW2 for first place. that fact only recently changed with Realm Reborn being released, and that probubly will last until the buzz is gone.

    I walked away from XIV - after being a player through 1.0, with Legacy status, and sticking with them all through ARR's Alpha and all Beta stages into EA. The reasons are myriad at this point, but I'll cite the one that's relevant to this topic... The heavy-handed coddling and hand-holding in ARR is a complete turn-off for me. People griped about certain fights being "too difficult" - even with people explaining, in detail, exactly what to do. SE - afraid to challenge players even a little bit, apparently - dumbed them down to the point where as long as you're not standing in one spot doing nothing, you'll defeat them easily. That's not the kind of game I want to play. I like being challenged. I appreciate it when I get my ass handed to me in a fight. It makes me re-think my approach, develop a new strategy and pay attention. I don't need to be coddled, and I certainly don't want to be coddled.

    TSW doesn't coddle me. It kicks my ass, keeps me in my place and challenges me. It doesn't hold my hand (beyond indicating quest locations, which is an evil I can live with). I like that.

    Ragnar Tornquist made a statement that sums it up beautifully, and I agree with him wholeheartedly:

    "Developers don't give players enough credit. And maybe players don't give players enough credit".

    Beautifully said, and I agree 100%.

    FC respects the intelligence of their players. I, for one, appreciate that.

    The Secret World is, to me, another example of how gamers - many of them anyway - don't really know what they want. Because, they'll clamor for "something different!". Then when they get it (and TSW is different from the typical "standard MMO" in just about every meaningful sense), they complain that it's "too different" and begin wanting things to be like the last MMO they played and liked. Basically.. "I want something completely different, but it better be the same as what I'm used to".

    Then there's the way that gamers tend to ruin their own experience, in game after game after game... and don't ever seem to catch on. They insist that it must be the game, deny that it could possibly be the way they're trying to play it... and move on to the next one, to repeat the cycle all over again... ad nauseum. That's really a whole other topic, though.

     

  • NorseGodNorseGod Behind Enemy Lines, FLPosts: 856Member

    This game is worth playing all the quests and at least all the normal mode dungeons (if you don't want to gear up for endgame content).

    I jump in after every issue or event release to check out the new story lines. That Tyler one was amazing.

    Events are pretty good too. I really liked the End of Days Event.

    Censorship is intended to create an illusion that one side of the debate is correct and unopposed. Silence is not consent.

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member

    The game's retention looks really good, but sales were probably a fifth of what they were projecting. They had to lay off a large number of staff to make the game and the company profitable. That had a dramatic impact on their ability to create updates for the game.

    I think it's a good game. The story lines are pretty good and the game systems work. It's worth the box price (imo). It's just not a game with mass, or even very wide appeal. It is pretty accessible, but requires some reading, some minimal internet research and more effort than what people may expect.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • DrakynnDrakynn The Pas, MBPosts: 2,030Member
    Originally posted by Karteli

    OK nobody said it yet ...

     

    but it's quite comical how someone who contributed a grand total of $0 is complaining that there is no funding for new content being released...

     

    I mean if you bought the game, gripe away ... but you played beta and are still thinking about a purchase, then complain that there isn't adequate patches?

     

    Thanks for making my day.

    Yeah you should never question a product or service before buying into it!!!

    Smart Consumerism is what is killing the economy!!!

  • TalonsinTalonsin Posts: 1,473Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Drakynn

    Yeah you should never question a product or service before buying into it!!!

    Smart Consumerism is what is killing the economy!!!

    +1

    QFT

  • PsychoticHamsterPsychoticHamster Brooklyn, NYPosts: 97Member Common
     I was really interested in TSW before launch cause its premise looked really cool and unusual for an MMO. I probably would've played it from the beginning, and I know that combat isn't everything, but damn is the TSW's combat inexcusable. I'm for that for someone who has played it so far, its not big deal, but really as a game that was launching in 2012 there is no justification for why its combat was so damn floaty, unengaging, and boring. 

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  • flclimaxflclimax Hempstead, NYPosts: 92Member Common

    because the game flopped and is basically on life support. they weren't able to keep up content delivery schedule past 2 months, and laid off 75% of the staff so far. now everything is late and further in between. the content that players are waiting for now were supposed to be out in october-december last year.

    it also suffers from being very buggy, they had one update that had some invasion type event but after it faded all the world NPC's were stuck in combat and thus unusable and broke many quests/vendors.

  • c0existc0exist Round Rock, TXPosts: 192Member
    The problem for me with the game is it felt too much like a single player game.  They make great single player adventure games and thats what this game felt like to me.  The story was great and different, atmosphere  was great as well.  However, the combat was lacking but not a deal breaker for me.  The game is great for what it is and should have been released as a single player game.  As for the OP quit being cheap, its $30.  Not like you are signing a 2 yr contract at $40/month. 
  • AyulinAyulin Mt marion, NYPosts: 334Member
    Originally posted by Drakynn
    Originally posted by Karteli

    OK nobody said it yet ...

     

    but it's quite comical how someone who contributed a grand total of $0 is complaining that there is no funding for new content being released...

     

    I mean if you bought the game, gripe away ... but you played beta and are still thinking about a purchase, then complain that there isn't adequate patches?

     

    Thanks for making my day.

    Yeah you should never question a product or service before buying into it!!!

    Smart Consumerism is what is killing the economy!!!

    There is more than ample information, articles, trailer and gameplay videos, reviews, discussions, let's plays,  etc.. about the game to get an informed opinion of what the game is about. The only way you could possibly call it an "uninformed purchase" is if you don't even bother trying. And, as the saying goes, "in the age of information, ignorance is a choice".

    And since you're mocking the idea of buying something without questioning it first...

    How many games have you bought without any guarantee you'd enjoy them?

    How many movies have you gone to see without any guarantee you'd enjoy  them?

    How many services have you purchased or subscribed to with no guarantee that you'd be satisfied with them?

    ... even when returns or refunds aren't an option...?

    People make "blind faith" purchases all the time, with all kinds of things; you, me, everyone. It's nothing new. So, it seems a bit disingenuous and self-serving to so selectively cherry-pick MMOs as one time where it's suddenly "unreasonable".

     

  • RodentofdoomRodentofdoom NottinghamPosts: 273Member
    Originally posted by Cetra
    [mod edit]

    Anarchy Online was the 1st MMO I ever played

    I compare all other MMO's to it, and find them woefully inadequate

     

    I play TSW as well, as a friend gifted me a copy over steam.

    There are times when the ingame lighting, audio and generic content seriously creep me out

    particularly the 'black house' with the quest objective 'investigate the cellar'

    that left me sat in my chair thinking, but I don't want to go into the cellar

    bad stuff ALWAYS happens in the cellars

     

    the character animation might be a bit shit, but by god they got the atmosphere nailed, and nailed hard.

  • AyulinAyulin Mt marion, NYPosts: 334Member
    Originally posted by flclimax

    because the game flopped and is basically on life support. they weren't able to keep up content delivery schedule past 2 months, and laid off 75% of the staff so far. now everything is late and further in between. the content that players are waiting for now were supposed to be out in october-december last year.

    it also suffers from being very buggy, they had one update that had some invasion type event but after it faded all the world NPC's were stuck in combat and thus unusable and broke many quests/vendors.

    Again... no, it is not on life support.

    I've seen games on life support. Vanguard was in that camp for years, until SOE decided to pull it out of death row. Matrix Online was in that camp for years 'til SOE decided to pull the plug.

    To say TSW is on "life support" is to be using the term in the loosest possible way.

    TSW is an active game, with a noticeable population everywhere you go, chat is active in the different areas, etc. Development is continuing on it. "Slowed" =/= "Stopped".

    People need to stop thinking in terms of this dichotomy where a MMO is either a "raving success" or it's on "life support". There's a vast gray area in-between, and that's where TSW finds itself.

  • VincerKadenVincerKaden Edison, NJPosts: 457Member
    Originally posted by Rodentofdoom
    Originally posted by Cetra
    [mod edit]

    Anarchy Online was the 1st MMO I ever played

    I compare all other MMO's to it, and find them woefully inadequate

     

    I play TSW as well, as a friend gifted me a copy over steam.

    There are times when the ingame lighting, audio and generic content seriously creep me out

    particularly the 'black house' with the quest objective 'investigate the cellar'

    that left me sat in my chair thinking, but I don't want to go into the cellar

    bad stuff ALWAYS happens in the cellars

     

    the character animation might be a bit shit, but by god they got the atmosphere nailed, and nailed hard.

    Even reading your post made me shiver about that house. The atmosphere in TSW is amazing.

    OP, the content updates might not be rapid-fire, but they are quality from what I've experienced so far. Anyone not giving this game a try is only cheating themselves.

    image

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