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Are MMOs focusing too much on FUN?

TheScavengerTheScavenger Matrix, NYPosts: 911Member Uncommon

I remember old MMOs, they didn't focus on fun. There was no instances (at least in UO and Asheron's Call), no minigames (like in GW2)...they felt far more like worlds (at least the two I played back when). They didn't have a bunch of dailies, instead you just did whatever and made goals for yourself.

 

I remember grinding for 16 hours in the same spot in Asheron's Call, and while it wasn't fun...I ended up making a lot of friends as we brought mobs back to the area. It was more of a world, more of a social experience, than what current MMOs offer.

 

Is this why so many MMOs are failing? I know Vanguard was an attempt to not focus so much on fun (like dumb minigames and jumping puzzles, those don't belong in an MMO)...but more of a world and classic MMO experience. It is sad people didn't give it a chance, but was too buggy I guess and then updates stopped.

 

Now, fun MMOs...sure they are fun for a month to a few months...but then it just gets boring and too unrealistic. But, old classic MMOs? While they didn't focus on fun, it was far more social. It is even proven that people stuck with the SAME MMO for years to decades, and people still play UO and AC and have for longer than most MMOs have been alive.

 

I believe the reason for this is cause they don't do frivelous minigames, jumping puzzles, dailies and point a to b quests. But instead they bring players together to grind, socialize and be a part of the world.

 

I think future MMOs could do really well if they took out all the "fun" (minigames and what not) and brought back the WORLD and socializing aspects of an MMO.

Sorta TLDR

(edit: to expand that thought. In new MMOs, people rush everywhere as they do minigames, puzzles, instances and quests. No chance to make friends, like in old MMOs where people stood in an area and talked as they killed stuff. Much better chances of making friends in that way, than the new way of MMOs and felt far more like a world)

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Comments

  • uplink4242uplink4242 fx, MTPosts: 246Member

    The whole point of games is to have fun. Fun is completly subjective though, and it's not said anywhere that a game needs to have minigames or be casual to be considered fun. Everyone has their own definition of fun. 

    You are mistaking these two things.

    Also, your wording is soon going to start a lot of flaming. lol

  • ArclanArclan Chicago, ILPosts: 1,494Member Uncommon

    OP, I think you may have a point. Although may I disagree with you on Vanguard? SOE required the "funification" of Vanguard as part of the takeover. Quest hubs, no down time between fights, monty haul quest xp and loots, changing of aggro mobs to indifferent, etc., were mandated by SOE.


    With its left hand, SOE rescued Vanguard from drowning and, with its right hand, they plunged a dagger deep into its heart.

    Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon.
    In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 20,008Member Uncommon

    Substitute the phrase "casual game play " everywhere you used the word "FUN" OP and your post will make much more sense.

    But then your thread becomes very similar to about 3 or 4 others currently active on the forum and we're really re-treading the same old ground here.

    Face it, a greater proportion of the MMO player base is not looking for more realistic, virtual worlds, they want to play MMO's with more casual game play mechanics, (fun for them) and that's what MMO's have largely become in response to their demands.

    I'm with you, I don't like it, and I keep hoping the market changes in tastes as they tire of the current model and start demanding more varied game play experiences.

    Until then, will have to keep hiding out in the last few refuges left to me until something better comes along.

    Edit: But hey, at least I'm still having fun.  image

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • SlampigSlampig Chantilly, VAPosts: 2,376Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by TheScavenger

    I remember old MMOs, they didn't focus on fun. There was no instances (at least in UO and Asheron's Call), no minigames (like in GW2)...they felt far more like worlds (at least the two I played back when). They didn't have a bunch of dailies, instead you just did whatever and made goals for yourself.

     

    I remember grinding for 16 hours in the same spot in Asheron's Call, and while it wasn't fun...I ended up making a lot of friends as we brought mobs back to the area. It was more of a world, more of a social experience, than what current MMOs offer.

     

    Is this why so many MMOs are failing? I know Vanguard was an attempt to not focus so much on fun (like dumb minigames and jumping puzzles, those don't belong in an MMO)...but more of a world and classic MMO experience. It is sad people didn't give it a chance, but was too buggy I guess and then updates stopped.

     

    Now, fun MMOs...sure they are fun for a month to a few months...but then it just gets boring and too unrealistic. But, old classic MMOs? While they didn't focus on fun, it was far more social. It is even proven that people stuck with the SAME MMO for years to decades, and people still play UO and AC and have for longer than most MMOs have been alive.

     

    I believe the reason for this is cause they don't do frivelous minigames, jumping puzzles, dailies and point a to b quests. But instead they bring players together to grind, socialize and be a part of the world.

     

    I think future MMOs could do really well if they took out all the "fun" (minigames and what not) and brought back the WORLD and socializing aspects of an MMO.

    Sorta TLDR

    (edit: to expand that thought. In new MMOs, people rush everywhere as they do minigames, puzzles, instances and quests. No chance to make friends, like in old MMOs where people stood in an area and talked as they killed stuff. Much better chances of making friends in that way, than the new way of MMOs and felt far more like a world)

    Because playing games for fun is just bad business. Work all day at a job or sit in a class all day and want to come home and play an MMO for fun? Time for you to start kicking bricks, you are doing it all wrong! 

    Had to check my calendar, make sure it wasn't April 1st all over again...

    That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

  • c0existc0exist Round Rock, TXPosts: 192Member
    As dumb as it sounds to many, yes they are.  Building a characters abilities was work, you worked on your character solo (farming, crafting etc.) and you grouped up to get the exp.  Do people farm anymore?  I havent seen much use in todays game, money and exp are handed out for everything now.
  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,317Member Uncommon

    No.

    They are focusing on entertainment.

    Why would any rational thinking person, ever, spend any significant time on anything done for entertainment... if it wasn't entertaining them.

    They should focus on entertainment.  Thats all they shoudl focus on.

    Focusing on anything other than entertainment will pull it out of the entertainment category.

    Farming is typically considered not entertaining to most people, therefore most companies don't do it.  They somehow think that farming the same instance is different.

    They are starting to realise it isn't.  It's still farming.  Farming is typically considered not entertaining to most people, therefore more companies will stop it.   

     

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • JaedorJaedor Denver, COPosts: 1,140Member Uncommon

    Wow, I did a double take on the title of this thread. I already work 50 hours a week so I'm one of the folks looking for fun out of a game rather than a grind.


    Having said that, "fun" is completely subjective so while your idea of fun is not my idea of fun, fun is a good thing to discuss.

  • karbonistakarbonista Berkeley, CAPosts: 78Member Uncommon
    On a related note, I think food these days is focusing way too much on being nutritious.  And gym clubs focus way too much on fitness.  It ruins the whole experience.
  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 13,680Member Uncommon

     "Are MMOs focusing too much on FUN?"

    This thread's title, combined with the fact that it was a serious post and not trolling, is a shining beacon, illuminating everything that is wrong with the massive pocket of crazy that goes on within these forum's digital walls.  image

     

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • IrishChaiIrishChai St Louis, MOPosts: 529Member Uncommon

    If you play games that aren't fun, you are doing it wrong. They aren't designed to be an easy way to attract friends just because there is nothing better to do in the game but talk to others.

     

    There isn't any barrier towards making friends in 'fun' games as is perfectly obvious from the friends people make in many healthy guilds or clans in any game. Some of the greatest social experiences I've had in MMOs were amid the fun of jumping puzzles, minigames, dungeon runs, or quests.

     

    Fun content is only a distraction from making friends if people have no interest in being your friend, and the solution to that is not to make all the content so boring or grindy that suddenly talking to you seems more interesting. Try developing enough social skills to befriend people while doing something fun instead of wanting everything else to be less appealing than socializing.

  • bcbullybcbully Westland, MIPosts: 8,284Member Uncommon

    "fun" level is = to frustration level.

     

    If it's alll "fun" (always winning) all the time the game will get boring quick.

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Stone Mountain, GAPosts: 13,680Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by bcbully

    "fun" level is = to frustration level.

    If it's alll "fun" (always winning) all the time the game will get boring quick.

    Do you really believe that 'fun' = 'always winning'? Of course you don't.

    /shameonyouforgoingthere

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • IrishChaiIrishChai St Louis, MOPosts: 529Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by bcbully

    "fun" level is = to frustration level.

     

    If it's alll "fun" (always winning) all the time the game will get boring quick.

     

    Are you just competing with the OP to say the most ridiculous thing possible?

  • funyahnsfunyahns michigan city, INPosts: 315Member
    Being challenged and working hard in a game is fun for me.  Breezing through with no effort is the opposite.
  • ComafComaf Chicago, ILPosts: 1,154Member Common
    Originally posted by TheScavenger

    I remember old MMOs, they didn't focus on fun. There was no instances (at least in UO and Asheron's Call), no minigames (like in GW2)...they felt far more like worlds (at least the two I played back when). They didn't have a bunch of dailies, instead you just did whatever and made goals for yourself.

     

    I remember grinding for 16 hours in the same spot in Asheron's Call, and while it wasn't fun...I ended up making a lot of friends as we brought mobs back to the area. It was more of a world, more of a social experience, than what current MMOs offer.

     

    Is this why so many MMOs are failing? I know Vanguard was an attempt to not focus so much on fun (like dumb minigames and jumping puzzles, those don't belong in an MMO)...but more of a world and classic MMO experience. It is sad people didn't give it a chance, but was too buggy I guess and then updates stopped.

     

    Now, fun MMOs...sure they are fun for a month to a few months...but then it just gets boring and too unrealistic. But, old classic MMOs? While they didn't focus on fun, it was far more social. It is even proven that people stuck with the SAME MMO for years to decades, and people still play UO and AC and have for longer than most MMOs have been alive.

     

    I believe the reason for this is cause they don't do frivelous minigames, jumping puzzles, dailies and point a to b quests. But instead they bring players together to grind, socialize and be a part of the world.

     

    I think future MMOs could do really well if they took out all the "fun" (minigames and what not) and brought back the WORLD and socializing aspects of an MMO.

    Sorta TLDR

    (edit: to expand that thought. In new MMOs, people rush everywhere as they do minigames, puzzles, instances and quests. No chance to make friends, like in old MMOs where people stood in an area and talked as they killed stuff. Much better chances of making friends in that way, than the new way of MMOs and felt far more like a world)

    Point of an mmorpg should be to get groups of people together for common goals.  But welcome to our day and age when the personality quality of a ...and see there I go.  I'll leave it at this.

    image
  • ZzadZzad Palma de MallorcaPosts: 1,316Member Uncommon

    Why would anybody play a game if it isn´t for fun?

    uh?  -.-

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 14,788Member Uncommon

    As opposed to what?  People who play games because it makes them miserable?  Why would any reasonable person do that?

    Of course games should be fun.  The hard part is figuring out what exactly people will think is fun and what they won't.

  • karbonistakarbonista Berkeley, CAPosts: 78Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by IrishChai

     content so boring or grindy that suddenly talking to you seems more interesting. 

     

    People forget that the only reason most of us did that very thing was because there weren't a bunch of alternatives that focused more on fun.  They get all nostalgic about the fun they had talking to people while waiting for hours on end.  F- that.  F- all of that nonsense.  It's like my dad claiming everything used to cost a nickel -- it was never true to start with.

  • maplestonemaplestone Ottawa, ONPosts: 3,099Member

    People don't want fun, they would rather have fun. 

    Our language fails us in this conversation becasue we don't have a full lexicon of words to describe and communicate the subtle textures of our personal gut reactions to different experiences and memories. 

     

  • TheHavokTheHavok San Jose, CAPosts: 2,399Member Uncommon

    OP reminds me of this dude. 

    'Back in my day, video games weren't fun!  And that's the way we liked it!'

    Maybe I should add a grumpy cat pic too.

  • worldalphaworldalpha Milton, ONPosts: 403Member
    MMOs need to be more drab and dreary, instead of being all the FUN stuff.

    Thanks,
    Mike
    Working on Social Strategy MMORTS (now Launched!) http://www.worldalpha.com

  • GorweGorwe Ald'RuhnPosts: 2,476Member Uncommon
    I would actually say it's quite opposite!

    Compared to Vanilla WoW/GW 1/Vanguard and such recreations of classics, all the modern games seem VERY shallow, drab and boring. Of course not all, but most. I think that they are focusing WAY too much on sth that MIGHT make SOMEONE Happy/have fun, but it sure as hell is not entertaining to me. I don't want to play the games whose whole game design was made on the calculator(or excel-take your pick! :P).

    Plus fun is subjective. The whole Warcraft universe is boring and senseless to me, while I find Warhammer awesome. To someone else, the inverse might be true(however twisted that may be :O). And I have nothing against that. Tastes differ eh?

    Oh and OP, if you really love Vanguard so much, why aren't you playing it? I know that I am and that it is...the Matchless Dragon(a reference OMG!) for the games of today. In other words: it is fun TO ME. And I don't give 2 flying damns what someone else Might think...
  • IrishChaiIrishChai St Louis, MOPosts: 529Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by TheHavok

    Maybe I should add a grumpy cat pic too.

     

    LOL!

     

  • GorweGorwe Ald'RuhnPosts: 2,476Member Uncommon
    Quick!

    Someone better post a picture of a grumpy Dwarf as well! 10x better if from Warhammer :D

    (This opportunity must not be missed!)
  • TheocritusTheocritus Gary, INPosts: 3,763Member Uncommon
    I think they are focusing more on entertaining us than anything......When MMOs are more about voice acting, cutscenes, and "the story" than anything else then you see where the genre is headed.
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