Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Who wants camping back?

1246717

Comments

  • KBishopKBishop Member Posts: 205
    Originally posted by taus01

    Yes, need to bring back rare spawns hat take people a long time to figure out. Some Examples from FFXI:

    Mob spawns invisible and can only be claimed by linking with a visible mob in that area to draw him out.

    Mob spawns during certain weather/moon phase/daytime/season.

    Mob spawns from killing a certain type or multiple types of mobs in an area.

    Mob spawns by killing another rare spawn when using special abilities or use items on them.

    The list can go on...

    We need things like Absolute Virtue from FFXI again. The process of finding out how to spawn it, then how to defeat it was a huge community effort and is just showing how involved people can get in a game if you give them a real challenge not stupid quest grinds.

     

    If you meant experience party camps, then you get a resounding yes from me too. I hope FFX|V will deliver on that, seeing as it gives experience chain bonus, party bonus and from exploration i know there are areas that are just made to be camps.

    Cheers

    FFXI is one of the biggest offenders of camp spawns that I can even think of.

    The only thing on that list that I can get behind is Absolute Virtue. The rest were ridiculous time sinks with absurdly small rewards. There's a reason why most games don't bring in the type of spawning system they had.

  • KBishopKBishop Member Posts: 205
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

    Camping is evil, yes, i want rare spawns to return, but not the static spawnpoints, they should spawn at more random points in a zone, and at more random moments.

    Not only spawn at random points, but also wander, and not remain static. And add a "tracking" skill to the game. Add the feeling of the hunt. Make it more than just a 20 hour wait followed by "whack a rare mole".

    I could get behind this if either the spawn time was less than like 4 hours or the drop wasn't super amazing.

    It entirely reminds me of the Time Lost Proto Drake from WoW. That thing not only had like what, a 20 hour repop, but it also had some hideous window to spawn, AND it wandered around. The time it took just to even farm it was enough to deter 90% of the playerbase from even so much as attempting it once, much less multiple times. I think Devs would rather make something that people would fight multiple times.

  • DoogiehowserDoogiehowser Member Posts: 1,873

    I value my time too much these days to indulge in this camping nonsense. When i was in college i spent hour upon hours camping for my pistols in Anarchy Online (Adventures know what i am talking about). Time used to be plenty earlier but now it is a luxury.

    "The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
    -Jesse Schell

    "Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
    -Luke McKinney

    image

  • KBishopKBishop Member Posts: 205
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Originally posted by KBishop
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

    Camping is evil, yes, i want rare spawns to return, but not the static spawnpoints, they should spawn at more random points in a zone, and at more random moments.

    Not only spawn at random points, but also wander, and not remain static. And add a "tracking" skill to the game. Add the feeling of the hunt. Make it more than just a 20 hour wait followed by "whack a rare mole".

    I could get behind this if either the spawn time was less than like 4 hours or the drop wasn't super amazing.

    It entirely reminds me of the Time Lost Proto Drake from WoW. That thing not only had like what, a 20 hour repop, but it also had some hideous window to spawn, AND it wandered around. The time it took just to even farm it was enough to deter 90% of the playerbase from even so much as attempting it once, much less multiple times. I think Devs would rather make something that people would fight multiple times.

    That is horrible design, and the wandering was a fixed path too.

    completely agreed. I really never got behind the spawns that had a 20 hour repop and then a 1-20 hour window spawn time. At least in FFXI, it was somewhat justifiable because the drops were pretty amazing, but then you had a ridiculous cluster of people spending multiple hours going after 1 mob.

    What, in your opinion, would be a good design for a rare spawn?

  • RydesonRydeson Member UncommonPosts: 3,852

         This is almost funny listening to the PRO instance debate.. So ya'll think camping is boring, but you believe that farming an instance is better..  You log on.. queue up for a dungeon.. Immediately teleported to dungeon without even leaving the central city..  The group proceeds farming the dungeon picking off NON moving targets in order..   By the time I left WoW for example I had EVERY single dungeon memorized and could do it in my sleep..  Kill 3 on top of ramp, then move around corner and kill 2 more..  bypass that group but kill the next group of 2.. etc etc..  Each dungeon was a dance that everyone knew.. Even playing with complete strangers that I never met before could do the dungeon without saying ONE WORD to each other..  We all knew the routine.... Now that is BORING as shit..  I played a healing Pally and most of my time I was able to go thru dungeons in quick order NEVER losing more then 10% mana, Mage Bigquits, what's that?  LOL

         In your own private boring dungeons what are the chances of having a rare POP in the zone that rallies the player base to come together?  OH can we say NONE.. When you do instances you remove yourself from any open world activities.. Now if you had properly designed zones with camp locations, you can bring in surprises such as wondering mobs, ADDS and boss events..  From where I sit, open world zones is the better choice, NOT SOME simple carebear instance that can be beat while sleeping..

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Member RarePosts: 14,247
    Originally posted by Rydeson

         This is almost funny listening to the PRO instance debate.. So ya'll think camping is boring, but you believe that farming an instance is better..  You log on.. queue up for a dungeon.. Immediately teleported to dungeon without even leaving the central city..  The group proceeds farming the dungeon picking off NON moving targets in order..   By the time I left WoW for example I had EVERY single dungeon memorized and could do it in my sleep..  Kill 3 on top of ramp, then move around corner and kill 2 more..  bypass that group but kill the next group of 2.. etc etc..  Each dungeon was a dance that everyone knew.. Even playing with complete strangers that I never met before could do the dungeon without saying ONE WORD to each other..  We all knew the routine.... Now that is BORING as shit..  I played a healing Pally and most of my time I was able to go thru dungeons in quick order NEVER losing more then 10% mana, Mage Bigquits, what's that?  LOL

         In your own private boring dungeons what are the chances of having a rare POP in the zone that rallies the player base to come together?  OH can we say NONE.. When you do instances you remove yourself from any open world activities.. Now if you had properly designed zones with camp locations, you can bring in surprises such as wondering mobs, ADDS and boss events..  From where I sit, open world zones is the better choice, NOT SOME simple carebear instance that can be beat while sleeping..

    Whoa there. There's no "PRO instance debate".  You wrote,

    "OK peeps.. I have some news for you.. especially for the ones that are anti-camp posters...... LFG dungeon is the same thing as camping...... HELLO..  The only difference is that you have your own private camp that doesn't respawn vs. one that is in the open zone.."

     

    And people explained how they were different.

     

    You then use the arguments that previous posters had for why they like open world dungeons - irrelevant to your point -  to argue against people who were simply explaining to you how camping and instanced dungeons are different.

    Take a moment to re-read your posts. You're getting more and more defensive about this and you're not really even following the discussion anymore.

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • TheocritusTheocritus Member LegendaryPosts: 9,737
    I played EQ until 2005 and used to enjoy camping, especially if there was a chance of a good rare appearing.....The further the game went though, the harder it got to be to get enough people to group.....In 2013, I jsut dont see this way of playing ever happening again....people just don't want to commit that much time to playing anymore.....Games like WoW have spoiled them to where they now feel enititled and that they should get phat loots after just a few minutes of play.
  • ComanComan Member UncommonPosts: 2,177
    Originally posted by Wizardry

    A realistic quest in term of role play would be your King would send you on a quest to conquer some foreign land or in terms of Fantasy a quest to slay some giant dragon that has been menacing the local towns.You would not be embarking on a quest to bring some npc his beer mug or go kill 10 bears or rats.A famous Warrior would scoff at such nonsense,he would probably say "go kill the darn rats yourself".

    Indeed he would say "Go kill the darn rats yourself. I am going to kill some other creature until he drops the pant I always wanted!"

  • sirphobossirphobos Member UncommonPosts: 620
    Given the choice of camping or quest hub grinding, I'd take camping any day.
  • ThaneThane Member EpicPosts: 3,534

    random mob groups roaming the areas. 

     

    maybe they start of alone, and if they meet another familiar mob they start to roam together, when they are enough, they promote one of their kind to their boss......

     

    and where they get alot of kills in a certain area, or reach a certain ammount they start to build a camp.

    in this camp they would respawn on a certain rate then, untill destroyed or maybe no kills happened for some time.

     

     

    that's the camping i miss :P

    "I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  • MukeMuke Member RarePosts: 2,614
    Originally posted by Vigg
    Some of my fondest memories from EQ are of sitting at a rare mob camp spot with a good group, chatting while waiting for that shot at awesome loot.  I'm all for bringing it back.

    or running a macro, go to bed and come back the next day and see what Santa has dropped!

    "going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

  • XssivXssiv Member UncommonPosts: 359
    Originally posted by Vigg
    Some of my fondest memories from EQ are of sitting at a rare mob camp spot with a good group, chatting while waiting for that shot at awesome loot.  I'm all for bringing it back.

    Back in the day,  we used to setup camps in SWG and just hang out and chat for hours.   Not too long ago, a few buddies and I were talking about how much fun it was and asked ourselves why we don't do that anymore.

     

    The answer is simple, being online with other players was a new experience back then so even mundane activities were more fun for the simple fact that we could actually see and chat with other people. 

     

    Unfortunately, that novelty is long gone so I would venture to guess that spawn camping will never provide the same social experience that it once did.  

     

     

     

     

  • asdarasdar Member UncommonPosts: 662

    I think I played a different EQ than most people. I almost never camped, VL was a cuss word in my book. (I liked the slick ice though)

    I was a dungeon crawler all the way through. I'd check out places like VL or Guk and see where all the camps were, but I never sat around all day trying to level at a camp.

    That said I'm all for camps for other people. I like games that have something for everyone.

    Asdar

  • RydesonRydeson Member UncommonPosts: 3,852
    Originally posted by asdar

    I think I played a different EQ than most people. I almost never camped, VL was a cuss word in my book. (I liked the slick ice though)

    I was a dungeon crawler all the way through. I'd check out places like VL or Guk and see where all the camps were, but I never sat around all day trying to level at a camp.

    That said I'm all for camps for other people. I like games that have something for everyone.

    Same here..  except I would like to delete all forms of instancing.. LOL  I would like to see a game world in which both solo and groups can co-exist..  I sure do miss those old time dungeon crawls like upper and lower guk..

  • RydesonRydeson Member UncommonPosts: 3,852
    Originally posted by Loktofeit
    Originally posted by Rydeson

         This is almost funny listening to the PRO instance debate.. So ya'll think camping is boring, but you believe that farming an instance is better..  You log on.. queue up for a dungeon.. Immediately teleported to dungeon without even leaving the central city..  The group proceeds farming the dungeon picking off NON moving targets in order..   By the time I left WoW for example I had EVERY single dungeon memorized and could do it in my sleep..  Kill 3 on top of ramp, then move around corner and kill 2 more..  bypass that group but kill the next group of 2.. etc etc..  Each dungeon was a dance that everyone knew.. Even playing with complete strangers that I never met before could do the dungeon without saying ONE WORD to each other..  We all knew the routine.... Now that is BORING as shit..  I played a healing Pally and most of my time I was able to go thru dungeons in quick order NEVER losing more then 10% mana, Mage Bigquits, what's that?  LOL

         In your own private boring dungeons what are the chances of having a rare POP in the zone that rallies the player base to come together?  OH can we say NONE.. When you do instances you remove yourself from any open world activities.. Now if you had properly designed zones with camp locations, you can bring in surprises such as wondering mobs, ADDS and boss events..  From where I sit, open world zones is the better choice, NOT SOME simple carebear instance that can be beat while sleeping..

    Whoa there. There's no "PRO instance debate".  You wrote,

    "OK peeps.. I have some news for you.. especially for the ones that are anti-camp posters...... LFG dungeon is the same thing as camping...... HELLO..  The only difference is that you have your own private camp that doesn't respawn vs. one that is in the open zone.."

     

    And people explained how they were different.

     

    You then use the arguments that previous posters had for why they like open world dungeons - irrelevant to your point -  to argue against people who were simply explaining to you how camping and instanced dungeons are different.

    Take a moment to re-read your posts. You're getting more and more defensive about this and you're not really even following the discussion anymore.

    I think you are the one that might need to reread what is typed in multiple post.. not I..  :)  Have a nice day

  • JemcrystalJemcrystal Member UncommonPosts: 1,983
         =     


  • alakramalakram Member UncommonPosts: 2,301
    Originally posted by Chieftan

    I thought about the mechanics of spawn camping vs dungeoning on my feet for the past oh, about 10 years now, I'm kinda ready to just chill at a camp again.

     

    Think about it: you go to an area, group up, pick a campsite and just chill there pulling mobs to your spot. 

     

    Maybe change things up a little from the early days of EQ such as:

     

    1) Kill X mobs in X amount of time quests or "scalp" style turn-in quests

    2)Random boss/named spawns

    3)Random multi-mob spawns...think you've got the spawn broken?  Put in a random chance for 4 mobs to spawn where 1 normally does.

    4)Remember the cool places you used to camp in EQ?  It could be a kitchen, a throne room, a campfire, etc.  Developers could really liven it up with some visually interesting camp spots.

    5)"Hold the line" camps where you rain fire on a sea of orcs trying to cross the moat

    Honestly none of this would require a massive re-coding of any current MMO.  Pump up the spawns in a given area and let people have at it.  Unlike the days of EQ you could still have the normal quest-quest-quest for exp path of current MMOs; this would just give players another alternate way of gaining levels.

    It sounds to me like a new kind of OpenQuest or whatever it is called. The same that Warhammer did, the same that rift did, and it sounds good enought.



  • RydesonRydeson Member UncommonPosts: 3,852
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Originally posted by sirphobos
    Given the choice of camping or quest hub grinding, I'd take camping any day.

    I'd take a dynamic world with events that happen everywhere without having to talk to a NPC with a "!" over his head.

         True.. BUT..   In an earlier post you mention about people "getting a life".. And I'm unsure how camping as it was in EQ1 is relevant to time spent playing..  Anyways, I agree with the above that I'd rather have dynamic events  instead of NPC ? hubs, but.. and this is a HUGE but.. What GW2 does is only a slight difference then quest hubs.. The so called heart quest unlocks the NPC that you can spend rewards on..  You still have to follow the breadcrumbs and do the "kill 10 rats" to unlock him as a vendor..  So what GW2 did was only slightly upgrade the annoying quest hub formula, but it's only dressed differently.. 

         What I would of love to see is allow people to BUY any of the items from a smaller number of NPC without ever being forced to do a "kill 10 rants" task to unlock them..  As for the time issue.. I find it more annoying  and wasteful running around looking for events, then camping..... So technically wouldn't it be more productive time wise to sit and camp, then run and gun?

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by DavisFlight
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Rydeson
    Originally posted by nariusseldon

    nah .. i am glad those days are over.

    Camping is boring to me. I play a game for gameplay, not for waiting around doing nothing or chatting.

     

    If all you did was wait around and chat, that sounds like a personal problem...... I never had any problem finding a group or camp to enjoy.. and the PULLS were coming faster then we could kill em.... So many times we had to tell our puller to STOP because we needed some free time to rest.. LOL 

    You have never taken a number, and camp a boss with multiple groups?

    Nope, because I didn't play poorly designed games. I played DAoC.

     

    I agree EQ is very poorly designed.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by Chieftan

    We all know the easy-solo-quest formula has just about been beat into the ground.  Whether its camping or something else, developers better start coming up with some new ideas.

    They already did. Online ARPG with some MMO features, MOBAs, instanced pvp games, shared world shooters like Destiny.

    There is no reason to go back to a try and failed idea. There are plenty of new ideas .. just that some may not be traditional MMOs. Personally i really don't care about a definition if the game is fun.

  • DavisFlightDavisFlight Member CommonPosts: 2,556
    Originally posted by KBishop
    Originally posted by DavisFlight
    Originally posted by Fendel84M

    EQ and FFXI are still there actually. You can camp all you want, for the record :-p.

    Ah, the dumbest argument in the book...

     

    No, the games as we knew and loved them have long ago been patched away.

    For good reason. Have you actually played that game Pre WoTG?

    The OP is not talking about sitting and waiting for rare spawns, they're talking about sitting in a room with respawning mobs and pulling them over and over.

    I played DAoC where there was no silly waiting for boss mobs.

  • DavisFlightDavisFlight Member CommonPosts: 2,556
    Originally posted by BizkitNL
    Originally posted by Rydeson
      Now as for your response that instancing takes off the population pressure of having hundreds if not thousands of characters in the same zone...... OMFGGGGGGGGGG What game are you playing that ever came close to that?  I have never seen Rift, TOR and GW2 end zones or any zone have hundreds to thousands of people IN that zone fighting.. And don't even dare to tell me it's because they are all busy instancing..

    9 years ago (and before that), instancing was indeed a good way to let players enjoy content without lagging their socks off. I'm surprised it's hard to comprehend.....

    Except thats not true... There was zero lag in noninstanced dungeons in DAoC.

  • DavisFlightDavisFlight Member CommonPosts: 2,556
    Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
    Originally posted by DavisFlight
    Originally posted by BizkitNL
    Originally posted by Rydeson
      Now as for your response that instancing takes off the population pressure of having hundreds if not thousands of characters in the same zone...... OMFGGGGGGGGGG What game are you playing that ever came close to that?  I have never seen Rift, TOR and GW2 end zones or any zone have hundreds to thousands of people IN that zone fighting.. And don't even dare to tell me it's because they are all busy instancing..

    9 years ago (and before that), instancing was indeed a good way to let players enjoy content without lagging their socks off. I'm surprised it's hard to comprehend.....

    Except thats not true... There was zero lag in noninstanced dungeons in DAoC.

    You can't be serious.

    I am totally serious. DAoC didn't start to lag until you got about 200 people on creen at once.

    Instancing has never, EVER been about technical limitations. Especially not now. PS2 and Darkfall prove instancing is not needed for performance.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by DavisFlight
     

    The OP is not talking about sitting and waiting for rare spawns, they're talking about sitting in a room with respawning mobs and pulling them over and over.

    I played DAoC where there was no silly waiting for boss mobs.

    To be honest, when i first read this .. the impression is EQ camping, where waiting in queue is a large part of. That certainly turns me off.

    However, if you are talking about not moving, and just kill, kill, and kill, then it *may* work for me, as long as the combat is fun.

    The EQ model certainly will NOT work since you are fighting one-ies and two-ies and there is little tactical variations.

    Lastly, the down-side of this type of camping is the static nature of terrain. I would probably like a dungeon crawl better just because the terrain (or layout) is changing and if combat takes that into account, it is more fun.

     

  • DavisFlightDavisFlight Member CommonPosts: 2,556
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by DavisFlight
     

    The OP is not talking about sitting and waiting for rare spawns, they're talking about sitting in a room with respawning mobs and pulling them over and over.

    I played DAoC where there was no silly waiting for boss mobs.

    To be honest, when i first read this .. the impression is EQ camping, where waiting in queue is a large part of. That certainly turns me off.

    However, if you are talking about not moving, and just kill, kill, and kill, then it *may* work for me, as long as the combat is fun.

    The EQ model certainly will NOT work since you are fighting one-ies and two-ies and there is little tactical variations.

    Lastly, the down-side of this type of camping is the static nature of terrain. I would probably like a dungeon crawl better just because the terrain (or layout) is changing and if combat takes that into account, it is more fun.

     

    That's why I liked how DAoC encouraged you to move around. The longer a specific area had gone without anyone pulling from it, the more camp bonus xp it gave you.

Sign In or Register to comment.