How the "I pay $15/mo like everyone, i should see everything" mentality has contributed to the curre

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  • DrolkinDrolkin Palio, NBMember UncommonPosts: 246
    Comparing MMOs to Disney world... awesome.
  • StanlyStankoStanlyStanko Stanksville, OHMember UncommonPosts: 270
    Originally posted by petrus4
      Originally posted by Slampig I don't know but for some reason this post totally pisses me off.

     

    Is it perhaps because it is drawing attention to an entitlement complex?

     

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  • PsychoticHamsterPsychoticHamster Brooklyn, NYMember UncommonPosts: 98
    I think a big part in the destruction of MMOs is leveling speed as well, or this mentality that "I must reach the top so I can do x". What people don't realize is that MMO developers really don't know at this point in time how to really make good endgame content. I cant blame them either, its hard to imagine, in a game where the ultimate goal is progress, how you can create something compelling after the progress part is over. Some people can stick to raiding and be satisfied but I'd bet a majority can't stand to repeat a small chunk of content over and over. So then there are people that end up leveling alts, because the path to the top is what really makes the experience for them, and you get whiners and complainers that cry about how the game sucks or there's not enough content. IMO both parties are to blame for the lack of quality in MMOs. Developers need to relax the exp gain, drastically, and most casual players need to rethink how they approach MMOs. Make getting to cap actually a respectable feat, but stuff the game with content  so that players can feel like they're really experiencing the game. Getting to cap shouldn't take 2 weeks, even for the most hardcore gamer. Its this immediate culture that has developed is what killed MMOs as we knew them.

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  • Bama1267Bama1267 Waterloo, NYMember UncommonPosts: 1,847

    "Personally i believe the mentality of many of the players that because they pay $15 they should have access to every bit of content in the mmo is both absurd, and heavily contributed to the current state of the genre."

     Maybe a little but I think the biggest thing is companies are tired of spending so much time and money that only 10% of its users can see.

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer ChairMember EpicPosts: 7,826
    Originally posted by Drolkin
    Comparing MMOs to Disney world... awesome.

    Is this the 1st time you have heard the term "Theme Park" used to reference a style of MMORPG?

     

  • SilenttankSilenttank Albert Lea, MNMember Posts: 18

    I think people need to think back to the last time they worked really hard at something, to the point where they went past your believed threshold and really worked towards something they really wanted. How long ago was that? Was it easy? Probably not, it probably took a while but the harder and more challenging it was the better you felt accomplishing it.

    So you pay $15 a month for a game that's ever growing, that's reasonable, we all gotta make money and you enjoy what they do so you support them. But people think that because they paid for their game (Like everyone else), they should get to play with the rest of the people who have achieved more and worked harder then them. Well, just because you try out for the football team and you train and practice and dedicate so much time to it, it doesn't mean you get a free pass onto the varsity team, only the best get to be on that team. That doesn't mean you'll never be able to be on that team, or get to run through those endgame dungeons and get the best raiding loot, but no one can just get a free ride to what's best, you gotta get good at what you wanna do and prove why you're better then everyone else. Competition is going to always be alive in something, no matter what it is, and honestly if you're not willing to put the time into something you really want, then maybe this isn't what's for you, maybe your time is better put towards something you really, really want. I'm sorry that everything in life can't be free, but in the long run it's much more rewarding that way.

  • jimmywolfjimmywolf henderson, NVMember UncommonPosts: 145

    well like it or not, it all comes down too $$$$. 1 player want too be elite for $15 a month, 5 want too be casual for $15 a month, both sides say they will leave if you don't cater to them, which side wins? the bigger $$$ amount

    their a reason  why pvp only, hardcore games are niche, low profit, no mater how loud you yell, complain or feel you deserve  better, $$$ talks.

    blizzard  has 5 million + subs because it not following trends you feel are best, but catering too casuals. yes every MMO is now following suit why? because blizzard proved casual sells not hardcore....




  • stormseekazstormseekaz STL, MOMember Posts: 168
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    With the recent post by Mark Kern regarding how the casualization or MMO's has essentially ruined the genre got me to thinking about what other aspects have contributed to the "ruining" of mmo's. Personally i believe the mentality of many of the players that because they pay $15 they should have access to every bit of content in the mmo is both absurd, and heavily contributed to the current state of the genre. We use the example of a gymnasium, but i think using an example of a themepark is a better idea. Lets take Disneyworld.  Most people schedule for multiple days when they vacation or visit.  They know that buying entrance for the themepark for one day is not enough time to experience all the things they want to do.  The average person knows that they're paying for ACCESS to all of the themeparks content, but that with their limited time, they are only able to partake in parts of it.   So, they know if they spend 2 hours watching the mickey mouse play with their kids, and then spend 2 hours on roller coaster, that they may not have time to go to the waterpark, etc. So, normal sane people understood in the early days of MMO's that it was the same way.  You didnt get to raid if you didnt want to spend 4-6 hours online at once.  Nobody begrudged the people who could.  They simply went on and did whatever else was available that was fun.  Whether that was crafting, running a dungeon, exploring, whatever.  Nobody begrudged the crafter who chose to spend his hours investing into crafting at the detriment of his character leveling, or raiding, etc. Instead, because of the influx of these content locusts casual players, who come in like a flock of squawking birds demanding that everything cater to them.  We have ourselves in our current situation. You complaining that leveling takes too long because you only have 2 hours a week to play is the same as expecting disney world to make their rollercoasters 1/3 of the length, so it only takes you 5 minutes to get through the rollercoaster instead of 15 minutes.  Or asking them to cut out important parts of the Mickey Mouse show, so its only 20 minutes instead of an hour long.  Its entitled and selfish, and it ruins the purity of the original material.  It dumbs it down, makes it worthless.  Its like trying to cram the entire lord of the rings into a 200 page book because you "dont have the time" to read the whole thing. So instead of being like normal, sane people, who take 2 or 3 months maybe to read through the whole lord of the rings, you instead feel like the author should be obligated to cut it down to make it more palatable for you.  In the process the thing is ruined.

     It has never been illustrated in such a perfect manner.  Thankyou for voicing my opinion perfectly.  Casuals ruining the genre.

  • PsychoticHamsterPsychoticHamster Brooklyn, NYMember UncommonPosts: 98
    I'd also like to add, this need for cutting edge graphics is really straining dev's budgets and takes up more time. IMO until artists figure out a way to cheaply create realistic settings in an acceptable amount of times most devs should stick with some sort of styleization. I think WoW has aged reasonably well, largely in part because they created a world that was aesthetically pleasing instead of pushing for cutting edge visuals, that and their lighting is wonderful.  

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  • AxehiltAxehilt Member RarePosts: 10,504
    Originally posted by Kyleran 
    You aren't using the correct analogy. Think more like paying for entrance to a national wilderness park. Sure, your 10.00 fee gets you in, and you are free to walk around, hike the trails, take pictures etc. But, if you want to zip line, or white water raft you'll probably have to pay extra, sometimes quite a bit more than the entrance fee to partake. Some activities, such as mountain climbing or rock wall rappelling are just going to be unavailable to you either due to physical limitations or the fact you don't have the time to climb to 14k foot mark on the mountain. So think of a MMO environment as one where there are multiple options for fun, however you might not get to experience all of it without some additional investments of either time or money, which you actually may never have. And that's OK, games do not have to be designed so that everyone may experience everything.

    It's more like a dynamic rock-climbing wall where the people who make it are able to offer, for the same price, various difficulties of rock climbing.  Everyone gets to experience "the wall".

    "What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver

  • BladestromBladestrom edinburghMember UncommonPosts: 5,001
    ^^ if blizzard owned that wall they would slowly build a ladder that got higher each week, until eventally there is no climb, but everyone has the transient buzz of getting to the top.

    rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar

    Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAMember RarePosts: 27,280
    Originally posted by stormseekaz
    Casuals ruining the genre.

    That is just a matter of perspective. Particularly not true if you are a casual.

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