What server are you on? It sounds cool...I get pissed on if I so much as have one green gearpiece.
Currently I play on both Greybriar and Shatterbone. I used to be on other, now defunct shards and never had any issues with getting griped at. I've been on a couple of teams where the group as a whole was undergeared but everyone was really cool about it and, although I haven't used the lfg nearly as often as I did in WoW, I have yet to see anyone rage-quit when things got tough (although I have seen a few people group quit - they were just nice about it.)
Oh - I'm also likely to try to get some community-type stuff going through my youtube channel once the free to play launches. It might be fun to get a bunch of people together through a google hangout and do a couple hours of instant adventures and such.
Why are you people complaining. Do you really think you should be able to freeload all the way to end game content and including end game content?
That's a ridiculous hope and dream. You realize (as you often say) that paying gamers is here to pay your way and now you complain when such a mechanic exists.
The (insert word) is thick with this place.
EDIT: My GF just explained it to me. They expect the same game experience being free while I'm paying. If that's true then you can stuff it.
If you're already currently paying for the game, then you wouldn't of needed your GF to explain this to you. You would understand what's going on.
The problem is, most of the people that have came here and actually explained why they irritated are paying subscribers. The game isn't free yet, and there's a handful of people on this thread with lifetime subscriptions. Like I said in an earlier reply, there were 3 lifestime subscriptions alone in my household.
I believe that reserves me the right to at least state an opinion on a product I paid box price + lifetime subscription x3.
And since you had to have your GF explain this to you, I doubt you play currently, so what ground do you have to question legitimate opinions of paying customers?
the solution to this is simple....DON'T buy the shit! You're basically casting a vote every time you make a purchase from these cash shops saying this is what you want in your MMO.
funny thing about this, no one wants to pay a monthly subscription anymore.... how do you people think they are going to make money then to pay developers and maintain the system?
I have heard people say " ftp is ok if they just sell fluff items and nothing that will effect game play" well my reply is you had to know it was only a matter of time before they started including items like this in game cash shops. If you didn't think this would ever happen you're an idiot.
you voted for it so now you have it......go eat your cake and stfu.
Originally posted by yueamyen the solution to this is simple....DON'T buy the shit! You're basically casting a vote every time you make a purchase from these cash shops saying this is what you want in your MMO. funny thing about this, no one wants to pay a monthly subscription anymore.... how do you people think they are going to make money then to pay developers and maintain the system? I have heard people say " ftp is ok if they just sell fluff items and nothing that will effect game play" well my reply is you had to know it was only a matter of time before they started including items like this in game cash shops. If you didn't think this would ever happen you're an idiot. you voted for it so now you have it......go eat your cake and stfu.
Not exactly my choice of words, but pretty much this.
I really feel advocating and cheering cash shops on, is an extremely slippery slope. It's only a matter of time before it's the only way ahead in games, it looks like.
You know.. in EQ2 you have to pay to be able to equip legendary and fabled items. In LOTRO, you have to pay to be able to use all your trait slots.
Now, that's PTW...
Putting character and item progression behind a cash wall. There is NO chance you can have those things without paying real money, or in LOTRO's case, grinding literally for weeks.
Rift doesn't do this. Plain and simple.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Why are you people complaining. Do you really think you should be able to freeload all the way to end game content and including end game content?
That's a ridiculous hope and dream. You realize (as you often say) that paying gamers is here to pay your way and now you complain when such a mechanic exists.
The (insert word) is thick with this place.
EDIT: My GF just explained it to me. They expect the same game experience being free while I'm paying. If that's true then you can stuff it.
If you're already currently paying for the game, then you wouldn't of needed your GF to explain this to you. You would understand what's going on.
The problem is, most of the people that have came here and actually explained why they irritated are paying subscribers. The game isn't free yet, and there's a handful of people on this thread with lifetime subscriptions. Like I said in an earlier reply, there were 3 lifestime subscriptions alone in my household.
I believe that reserves me the right to at least state an opinion on a product I paid box price + lifetime subscription x3.
And since you had to have your GF explain this to you, I doubt you play currently, so what ground do you have to question legitimate opinions of paying customers?
he doesn't , hes just a troll. He obviously didn't read any of the posts in this thread and skimmed them for a post count increase like half of what this sites posters do daily. If he did read anything at all other than skim he would see that what he said makes absolutely no sense at all to the topic at hand. Hes complaining about freeloaders getting what "he" pays for. This thread is about pay to win and the fact they are literally selling everything but the kitchen sink in the cash shop and trying to rationalize why they are doing it.
If he played Rift at any time during Storm Legion he would know
A selling expert gear is going to hurt expert queues because everyone will just head straight to raiding and this will become the new normal because all you get is 1 daily a day for marks since they took them away from boss drops in experts.
B this is opening the door for the next addon to the cash shop being high tiered pvp gear which will turn into the norm if you want to be able to pvp without getting destroyed at level 60.
C When you sell gear in game you destroy the economy for all crafters who make armor and bags dyes etc.
It's funny how some of you are trying to justify this, by dismissing the gear as a non issue, just because it's easy to get. I wouldn't call it "easy" though. I would call it earning it by trial and error. Buying the gear will just save time, but the overall playerbase will suffer because of this. Raiders will get players that won't know how to play their class properly, because that player could've just bought their entry-level gear, instead of actually acquiring the knowledge and experience of running expert dungeons.
You know.. in EQ2 you have to pay to be able to equip legendary and fabled items. In LOTRO, you have to pay to be able to use all your trait slots.
Now, that's PTW...
Putting character and item progression behind a cash wall. There is NO chance you can have those things without paying real money, or in LOTRO's case, grinding literally for weeks.
Rift doesn't do this. Plain and simple.
I agree. Those examples are P2W. But it's also a very subjective issue, as everyone looks upon it differently. For me, P2W is what Rift will do also. Potions to increase currency gains, potions to increase reputation gains, stat gear, and so on. It does not matter in my eyes, that the stat gear may "only" be entry level raiding gear. It's still P2W. You literally pay to skip an inconvenient part of the game. It's utter nonsense I feel, and nothing but pure moneygrabbing.
I get that a lot of people are also fine with it, and I truly hope they'll enjoy the game with it's cash shop. It's just not for everyone, me included.
Guess I won't be trying this when it goes F2P. This also makes me very wary of ArcheAge and what they do with it. When a company just suddenly becomes EA, there is something very wrong happening there.
Not overly thrilled with gear being sold. I expect more gear being off limits than just the top tiered raid gear.
But really I don't care anymore as all MMOs seem to be following this route that are F2P. DDO is a prime example and this seems to be a trend.
As long as they don't nickle and dime you on every aspect of the game that is not class or content related like NW with bags, enchants, professions, ect ect then I'll be content. It's F2P and will grind for what I need as long as the experience is fun. If anything the game should entertain me for the summer till Wildstar or ESO.
To me, it seems like this whole concept of cash shops is evolving. Slowly changing what is okay to sell in the shop, and people are fine with it, it seems.
You say that as if cash shops have been the norm and widely accepted in western mmo's since creation. Five to eight years ago the majority of people who post on these forums (and others) would of been up in arms over just the thought of playing a mmo with a cash shop. Which they were. Especially on top of a pay-to-play models. No where near as many discussions and outrage as there was years ago when these things first started popping up in p2p's. Very few would post in favor of them and there were countless threads daily on any given gamin forum talking about them.
Anymore it seems cash shops are now widely accepted in all pay models for the most part. Can't really blame the developers. Most can make more money nickel-and-diming customers than on subs. Or even better have them on top of the p2p model. Developers are just cashing in on peoples willingness to blow hundreds if not thousands a month.
I have known plenty over the years who were fairly open about how much they would spend. I knew even more who would deny all day long that they spend hundreds if not thousands a month. However it was pretty obvious. It was pretty shocking to me as I would of never thought there were that many people who would spend that much simply for a chance at getting a particular pixel.
What helped bring me to this realization was Rappelz to be specific. That companies model and the manipulation of taming percentages along side sales just amazed me. Yet people still dumped an absurd amount of money for a .01% chance at taming the highest tier pets.
I don't know why the company sold or whatever. However I know they had a crazy operation going. People who had been around for years knew what was going on and still they would spend large amounts of money. Then you had the rotational players who would come in spend a hundred or so and get burnt and leave.
Only cash shop in a pay-to-play i truly don't mind is Eve's even though I don't play the game currently. That's mainly because of how deep the games economy is and item destruction. Item destruction helps keep the economy stable. Which allows me to buy a Plex (30 day gtc) in game with minimal effort. However even then CCP was talking about p2w, that is until the customer base held the server hostage. Shut the major trade hubs down*
It what it is. As new gamers show up they become accustomed to cash shops in their current form. Which allows a developer to progress even further monetizing every aspect their games have.
Personally I am fine with one or the other. As far as free to play goes all items in the cash shop should be safely and easily traded on the player economy. If they aren't that's the only thing that irks me. However, I really have a thing against pay-to-plays with cash shops. I am paying a sub and with some titles the box prices for the base game and expansions.
Sorry didn't mean to derail. Was reading through and that comment which really caught my eye. Not bad or anything. I've done a lot of thinking about the average players acceptance of cash shops over the years, still do. Just amazing how accepting most have become of them when only a few years ago just the thought of cash shops would cause outrage. Which many others have witnessed, no doubt. Not trying to imply I'm the only one or anything.
I think they got a decent cash shop, if people want to buy gear then good more money for trion. I will earn mine cause the experience is what is fun, gear is a bonus to me. This f2p is infinitely better than swtor, and a much better game. I overlooked this game but now I really like it.
To me, it seems like this whole concept of cash shops is evolving. Slowly changing what is okay to sell in the shop, and people are fine with it, it seems.
You say that as if cash shops have been the norm and widely accepted in western mmo's since creation. Five to eight years ago the majority of people who post on these forums (and others) would of been up in arms over just the thought of playing a mmo with a cash shop. Which they were. Especially on top of a pay-to-play models. No where near as many discussions and outrage as there was years ago when these things first started popping up in p2p's. Very few would post in favor of them and there were countless threads daily on any given gamin forum talking about them.
Anymore it seems cash shops are now widely accepted in all pay models for the most part. Can't really blame the developers. Most can make more money nickel-and-diming customers than on subs. Or even better have them on top of the p2p model. Developers are just cashing in on peoples willingness to blow hundreds if not thousands a month.
I have known plenty over the years who were fairly open about how much they would spend. I knew even more who would deny all day long that they spend hundreds if not thousands a month. However it was pretty obvious. It was pretty shocking to me as I would of never thought there were that many people who would spend that much simply for a chance at getting a particular pixel.
What helped bring me to this realization was Rappelz to be specific. That companies model and the manipulation of taming percentages along side sales just amazed me. Yet people still dumped an absurd amount of money for a .01% chance at taming mid tier to the highest tier pets.
I don't know why the company sold or whatever. However I know they had a crazy operation going. People who had been around for years knew what was going on and still they would spend large amounts of money. Then you had the rotational players who would come in spend a hundred or so and get burnt and leave.
Only cash shop in a pay-to-play i truly don't mind is Eve's even though I don't play the game currently. That's mainly because of how deep the games economy is and how item destruction works. The economy is stable enough that I can with a small amount of effort buy a Plex (30 day gtc) which converts over to anything else cash shop related and that's simply because of item destruction. However even then CCP was talking about p2w, that is until the customer base held the server hostage. Shut the major trade hubs down*
It what it is. As new gamers show up they become accustomed to cash shops in their current form. Which allows a developer to progress even further monetizing every aspect their games have.
Personally I am fine with one or the other. As far as free to play goes all items in the cash shop should be safely and easily traded on the player economy. If they aren't that's the only thing that irks me. However, I really have a thing against pay-to-plays with cash shops. I am paying a sub and with some titles the box prices for the base game and expansions.
Sorry didn't mean to derail. Was reading through and that comment which really caught my eye. Not bad or anything. I've done a lot of thinking about the average players acceptance of cash shops over the years, still do. Just amazing how accepting most have become of them when only a few years ago just the thought of cash shops would cause outrage. Which many others have witnessed, no doubt. Not trying to imply I'm the only one or anything.
No, you are exactly right. It is a more recent thing, certainly. And I suppose what I was trying to point out, is essentially what you are saying. People were up in arms about it at first. But it's evolving. And the more and more "cash shop and free" gets thrown around, the more people are starting to dance and cheer about it, instead of the opposite. It's just a worrying trend, not to mention extremely short sighted, in my opinion.
Honestly, not really huge on the way they are going about it... but it at least is stuff that is relatively easy to get, and its NOT the best gear. I'd hope for like a 'secondary' tier, maybe .5 dungeon gear or something that can't be upgraded and acts as the lowest grade gear you can get.
I have played rift from day one till just now and loved it.I have a max level of all the classes The best pvp/pve gear on all my toons.
I have unsubed and quit Rift as of typing this up. Very sad day when one of the best dev teams sell gear like this.
As a guy that has played this game more then 8 hours a day from day 1 live till now this should say a lot I hope.The only voice I have is to speak with my $$.
Originally posted by kabitoshin I think they got a decent cash shop, if people want to buy gear then good more money for trion. I will earn mine cause the experience is what is fun, gear is a bonus to me. This f2p is infinitely better than swtor, and a much better game. I overlooked this game but now I really like it.
yeah you say that now , but if tons of people decide to buy gear and spend lots of money on the cash shop wait and see where all the dev resources go into for future patches , it wont be content. Go look at SWTOR right now and see what they did since the expansion released which wasnt even a expansion it was more like a 20 dollar paid patch that blizzard would release in wow every 2 months for free anyways.... Trion just laid off devs left and right , if you think that this cash shop is going to take a back burner to content you are sadly mistaken.
To me, it seems like this whole concept of cash shops is evolving. Slowly changing what is okay to sell in the shop, and people are fine with it, it seems.
You say that as if cash shops have been the norm and widely accepted in western mmo's since creation. Five to eight years ago the majority of people who post on these forums (and others) would of been up in arms over just the thought of playing a mmo with a cash shop. Which they were. Especially on top of a pay-to-play models. No where near as many discussions and outrage as there was years ago when these things first started popping up in p2p's. Very few would post in favor of them and there were countless threads daily on any given gamin forum talking about them.
Anymore it seems cash shops are now widely accepted in all pay models for the most part. Can't really blame the developers. Most can make more money nickel-and-diming customers than on subs. Or even better have them on top of the p2p model. Developers are just cashing in on peoples willingness to blow hundreds if not thousands a month.
I have known plenty over the years who were fairly open about how much they would spend. I knew even more who would deny all day long that they spend hundreds if not thousands a month. However it was pretty obvious. It was pretty shocking to me as I would of never thought there were that many people who would spend that much simply for a chance at getting a particular pixel.
What helped bring me to this realization was Rappelz to be specific. That companies model and the manipulation of taming percentages along side sales just amazed me. Yet people still dumped an absurd amount of money for a .01% chance at taming mid tier to the highest tier pets.
I don't know why the company sold or whatever. However I know they had a crazy operation going. People who had been around for years knew what was going on and still they would spend large amounts of money. Then you had the rotational players who would come in spend a hundred or so and get burnt and leave.
Only cash shop in a pay-to-play i truly don't mind is Eve's even though I don't play the game currently. That's mainly because of how deep the games economy is and how item destruction works. The economy is stable enough that I can with a small amount of effort buy a Plex (30 day gtc) which converts over to anything else cash shop related and that's simply because of item destruction. However even then CCP was talking about p2w, that is until the customer base held the server hostage. Shut the major trade hubs down*
It what it is. As new gamers show up they become accustomed to cash shops in their current form. Which allows a developer to progress even further monetizing every aspect their games have.
Personally I am fine with one or the other. As far as free to play goes all items in the cash shop should be safely and easily traded on the player economy. If they aren't that's the only thing that irks me. However, I really have a thing against pay-to-plays with cash shops. I am paying a sub and with some titles the box prices for the base game and expansions.
Sorry didn't mean to derail. Was reading through and that comment which really caught my eye. Not bad or anything. I've done a lot of thinking about the average players acceptance of cash shops over the years, still do. Just amazing how accepting most have become of them when only a few years ago just the thought of cash shops would cause outrage. Which many others have witnessed, no doubt. Not trying to imply I'm the only one or anything.
No, you are exactly right. It is a more recent thing, certainly. And I suppose what I was trying to point out, is essentially what you are saying. People were up in arms about it at first. But it's evolving. And the more and more "cash shop and free" gets thrown around, the more people are starting to dance and cheer about it, instead of the opposite. It's just a worrying trend, not to mention extremely short sighted, in my opinion.
Glad that made a little bit of sense it seems. Been up for 24 hours. Twelve of that was gaming through the night on my day off. Wouldn't believe how many times I reworded that cause my brains just not functioning correctly at the moment. Heck I was even rewording in an edit the Eve bit. Wasn't happy with the way I had worded it. Only to find out after finishing you already responded back. ^^ Figure I'll be reported for a derail but it's o.k. with me. Spent to long on that dam wall of text not to have posted it.
Cheers, I got what you were getting at. Just got me to thinking about the subject again. And out spewed a wall of text. Crazy how what is and is not acceptable has changed so much in such a short period of time.
To me, it seems like this whole concept of cash shops is evolving. Slowly changing what is okay to sell in the shop, and people are fine with it, it seems.
You say that as if cash shops have been the norm and widely accepted in western mmo's since creation. Five to eight years ago the majority of people who post on these forums (and others) would of been up in arms over just the thought of playing a mmo with a cash shop. Which they were. Especially on top of a pay-to-play models. No where near as many discussions and outrage as there was years ago when these things first started popping up in p2p's. Very few would post in favor of them and there were countless threads daily on any given gamin forum talking about them.
Anymore it seems cash shops are now widely accepted in all pay models for the most part. Can't really blame the developers. Most can make more money nickel-and-diming customers than on subs. Or even better have them on top of the p2p model. Developers are just cashing in on peoples willingness to blow hundreds if not thousands a month.
I have known plenty over the years who were fairly open about how much they would spend. I knew even more who would deny all day long that they spend hundreds if not thousands a month. However it was pretty obvious. It was pretty shocking to me as I would of never thought there were that many people who would spend that much simply for a chance at getting a particular pixel.
What helped bring me to this realization was Rappelz to be specific. That companies model and the manipulation of taming percentages along side sales just amazed me. Yet people still dumped an absurd amount of money for a .01% chance at taming mid tier to the highest tier pets.
I don't know why the company sold or whatever. However I know they had a crazy operation going. People who had been around for years knew what was going on and still they would spend large amounts of money. Then you had the rotational players who would come in spend a hundred or so and get burnt and leave.
Only cash shop in a pay-to-play i truly don't mind is Eve's even though I don't play the game currently. That's mainly because of how deep the games economy is and how item destruction works. The economy is stable enough that I can with a small amount of effort buy a Plex (30 day gtc) which converts over to anything else cash shop related and that's simply because of item destruction. However even then CCP was talking about p2w, that is until the customer base held the server hostage. Shut the major trade hubs down*
It what it is. As new gamers show up they become accustomed to cash shops in their current form. Which allows a developer to progress even further monetizing every aspect their games have.
Personally I am fine with one or the other. As far as free to play goes all items in the cash shop should be safely and easily traded on the player economy. If they aren't that's the only thing that irks me. However, I really have a thing against pay-to-plays with cash shops. I am paying a sub and with some titles the box prices for the base game and expansions.
Sorry didn't mean to derail. Was reading through and that comment which really caught my eye. Not bad or anything. I've done a lot of thinking about the average players acceptance of cash shops over the years, still do. Just amazing how accepting most have become of them when only a few years ago just the thought of cash shops would cause outrage. Which many others have witnessed, no doubt. Not trying to imply I'm the only one or anything.
No, you are exactly right. It is a more recent thing, certainly. And I suppose what I was trying to point out, is essentially what you are saying. People were up in arms about it at first. But it's evolving. And the more and more "cash shop and free" gets thrown around, the more people are starting to dance and cheer about it, instead of the opposite. It's just a worrying trend, not to mention extremely short sighted, in my opinion.
Glad that made a little bit of sense it seems. Been up for 24 hours. Twelve of that was gaming through the night on my day off. Wouldn't believe how many times I reworded that cause my brains just not functioning correctly at the moment. Heck I was even rewording in an edit the Eve bit. Wasn't happy with the way I had worded it. Only to find out after finishing you already responded back. ^^ Figure I'll be reported for a derail but it's o.k. with me. Spent to long on that dam wall of text not to have posted it.
Cheers, I got what you were getting at. Just got me to thinking about the subject again. And out spewed a wall of text. Crazy how what is and is not acceptable has changed so much in such a short period of time.
Yep. It goes extremely fast, it's crazy. But at the same time, it gives me a sliver of hope that the trend can be reversed, as is often the case with many other trends! And your post made decent sense, it was not hard at all to read or understand xD
What server are you on? It sounds cool...I get pissed on if I so much as have one green gearpiece.
Currently I play on both Greybriar and Shatterbone. I used to be on other, now defunct shards and never had any issues with getting griped at. I've been on a couple of teams where the group as a whole was undergeared but everyone was really cool about it and, although I haven't used the lfg nearly as often as I did in WoW, I have yet to see anyone rage-quit when things got tough (although I have seen a few people group quit - they were just nice about it.)
Oh - I'm also likely to try to get some community-type stuff going through my youtube channel once the free to play launches. It might be fun to get a bunch of people together through a google hangout and do a couple hours of instant adventures and such.
Cool. All of mine are on Faeblight which started off well and grouping was fun for various quests ...though I usually solo. However i wanted to break into dungeons (maybe RAIDs eventually) but first few times out was asked to leave or outright denied due to mostly PVE drop or special coin gear. Even the beginning dungeons..lol. Now I haven't played in a bit and they've made a lot of changes i believe so I'll probably start a new character when it goes free....then later once I get mechanics down again transfer my olds over . Probably Shatterbone..like the name...unless you suggest otherwise...maybe Greybriar is better?
I was playing some Neverwinter online which is great for jumping into skirmishes..pvp...or dungeons. The latter takes a bit of a wait though. The cash shop in Neverwinter......is ridiculous though....I can't see RIFTS as being much worse but since their model will allow me to play mostly with no need to buy anything ...I mean I'll have the game and expansion content for free since I bought the xpac but never got around to playing yet. Bags are easy enough to make as u level or get on AH. and that's really the only things I would.."need". I have no desire or intention of "keeping up with" the virtual "joneses" so gear in a cash shop doesn't intrigue me unless I love the appearance.
Anyway..enough rambling...perhaps I'll see you in game.
I understand the complaint about the cash shop. But I'm just going to say this, don't let it ruin your own fun. If people want to spend their money buying a helmet or whatever let them, just play the game they way you want to play it and enjoy yourself. If you don't want to support the cash shop I think that's fine, just don't cut yourself short by leaving something you enjoy because of ideals. I'm currently having fun with the game and will keep playing for now, when that fun stops I will leave. Perhaps if enough people do not support the cash shop it will be adjusted but if you simply boycott the game, you will lose out on your fun and the game will die. Kind of a lose/lose.
Originally posted by RollieJoe After Defiance and now this cash grab, looks like Trion has fallen very far as a studio.
Yup. I have totally written off TRION as studio. At least People now know what to expect from Archage.
Guess People are less happy now, seeing what has become from TRION.
It's like their HQ has been raided by a hostile Asian F2P Company take over. Like PWE or something. /shrug
Absolutely not interested in ArcheAge now. If TESO and Wildstar are like this as well, I'm done with mmorpgs.
It is really weird actually though. How can a company make this many mistakes in a row. They started out awesome, releasing an amazingly polished game that had consistant updates throughout its life that were incredibly large, and had one of the biggest expansions in an MMO, then released more content right after that. Then came defiance, which honestly wasn't THAT bad, but it was a cash grab based on how buggy and not polished it was when it came out, it showed what Trion started to focus on. Then they announced F2P Rift which made sense, it wasn't really flourishing it was just kind of a stagnant population and they wanted to bring more people in. They promised no pay to win and then they decided to put all kinds of gear in the cash shop? What the hell were they thinking. It just makes no sense that a company that great started making these really poor decisions. Did someone take it over or something? I didn't see any buyouts or any changes in the CEO or anyone that would have a big say in anything like this. It's like they went from being a gamers company to being EA.
They did take a turn for the darkside, I remember when Rift came out, it was a very fun game with a new idea that we never seen before. I have no idea whom told them this was a good idea but it is going to kill their games and company off o well was good while it lasted. Well lets hope wildstar, ESO, UC are going to be able to stay away from the power of the darkside aka corporations.
So Rift went pay to win. Could not play the game past level 34...I tried, but felt just disconnected at that level. It's a shame really, the game had so much potential. I liked exploring the mountain tops.
While I don't like the cash shop and I think no gear should be in it period, I think the "p2w" comments are a bit overboard.
This'll probably be dismissed but, that gear is pretty meh. It's expert dungeon vendor gear, which all you need to do is grind experts daily, get the marks from them, and buy them when done. They're not BiS pre-raid gear(although if you upgrade them with the cells, which are in the shop, some of them are).
It's not really a huge thing tbh, all it does is lower the amount of time you grind experts for their marks, they won't make you raid-ready, and it's not a huge effort to get them in game at all.
They won't make you ready for raids either as they're a very minor part of gear imho, the notoriety / cq grind is more influential than like 4 pieces of gear that may or may not be useful compared to dungeon dropped gear(chest, legs, boots, and gloves - helm and belt are crafted).
It does show how few people in the thread actually play Rift though if this is what they consider the "p2w" part of the shop.
Overpricing is one thing but being mad because you think someone buying something in a games cash shop will give them that much of an unfair advantage is like blaming Neiman Marcus for ruining your life because a guy that bought a $200 tie there got a job over you and your $5 thrift shop clip-on. Maybe he's just a better interviewer than you. Maybe he is better skilled. I'd guarantee you though....if you asked Human Resource why you weren't hired they wouldn't say it was because of your shitty tie.
There has never been any statted item that I have purchased from a cash shop that wasn't completely made useless by a quest reward or random drop 1-5 levels later.(and usually I just purchase them if it looks cool to me). That's why the most I spend in shops..like GW2's shop is on transmutation stones..which allow me to keep the weapon look I want with the stats I want. Wish more games had this type of customization..other shops just sell removable skins(love these)...others non-removable skins requiring another purchase of the same skin...etc.
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Currently I play on both Greybriar and Shatterbone. I used to be on other, now defunct shards and never had any issues with getting griped at. I've been on a couple of teams where the group as a whole was undergeared but everyone was really cool about it and, although I haven't used the lfg nearly as often as I did in WoW, I have yet to see anyone rage-quit when things got tough (although I have seen a few people group quit - they were just nice about it.)
Oh - I'm also likely to try to get some community-type stuff going through my youtube channel once the free to play launches. It might be fun to get a bunch of people together through a google hangout and do a couple hours of instant adventures and such.
http://www.youtube.com/flymolo
If you're already currently paying for the game, then you wouldn't of needed your GF to explain this to you. You would understand what's going on.
The problem is, most of the people that have came here and actually explained why they irritated are paying subscribers. The game isn't free yet, and there's a handful of people on this thread with lifetime subscriptions. Like I said in an earlier reply, there were 3 lifestime subscriptions alone in my household.
I believe that reserves me the right to at least state an opinion on a product I paid box price + lifetime subscription x3.
And since you had to have your GF explain this to you, I doubt you play currently, so what ground do you have to question legitimate opinions of paying customers?
funny thing about this, no one wants to pay a monthly subscription anymore.... how do you people think they are going to make money then to pay developers and maintain the system?
I have heard people say " ftp is ok if they just sell fluff items and nothing that will effect game play" well my reply is you had to know it was only a matter of time before they started including items like this in game cash shops. If you didn't think this would ever happen you're an idiot.
you voted for it so now you have it......go eat your cake and stfu.
Not exactly my choice of words, but pretty much this.
I really feel advocating and cheering cash shops on, is an extremely slippery slope. It's only a matter of time before it's the only way ahead in games, it looks like.
You know.. in EQ2 you have to pay to be able to equip legendary and fabled items. In LOTRO, you have to pay to be able to use all your trait slots.
Now, that's PTW...
Putting character and item progression behind a cash wall. There is NO chance you can have those things without paying real money, or in LOTRO's case, grinding literally for weeks.
Rift doesn't do this. Plain and simple.
he doesn't , hes just a troll. He obviously didn't read any of the posts in this thread and skimmed them for a post count increase like half of what this sites posters do daily. If he did read anything at all other than skim he would see that what he said makes absolutely no sense at all to the topic at hand. Hes complaining about freeloaders getting what "he" pays for. This thread is about pay to win and the fact they are literally selling everything but the kitchen sink in the cash shop and trying to rationalize why they are doing it.
If he played Rift at any time during Storm Legion he would know
A selling expert gear is going to hurt expert queues because everyone will just head straight to raiding and this will become the new normal because all you get is 1 daily a day for marks since they took them away from boss drops in experts.
B this is opening the door for the next addon to the cash shop being high tiered pvp gear which will turn into the norm if you want to be able to pvp without getting destroyed at level 60.
C When you sell gear in game you destroy the economy for all crafters who make armor and bags dyes etc.
I agree. Those examples are P2W. But it's also a very subjective issue, as everyone looks upon it differently. For me, P2W is what Rift will do also. Potions to increase currency gains, potions to increase reputation gains, stat gear, and so on. It does not matter in my eyes, that the stat gear may "only" be entry level raiding gear. It's still P2W. You literally pay to skip an inconvenient part of the game. It's utter nonsense I feel, and nothing but pure moneygrabbing.
I get that a lot of people are also fine with it, and I truly hope they'll enjoy the game with it's cash shop. It's just not for everyone, me included.
Not overly thrilled with gear being sold. I expect more gear being off limits than just the top tiered raid gear.
But really I don't care anymore as all MMOs seem to be following this route that are F2P. DDO is a prime example and this seems to be a trend.
As long as they don't nickle and dime you on every aspect of the game that is not class or content related like NW with bags, enchants, professions, ect ect then I'll be content. It's F2P and will grind for what I need as long as the experience is fun. If anything the game should entertain me for the summer till Wildstar or ESO.
You say that as if cash shops have been the norm and widely accepted in western mmo's since creation. Five to eight years ago the majority of people who post on these forums (and others) would of been up in arms over just the thought of playing a mmo with a cash shop. Which they were. Especially on top of a pay-to-play models. No where near as many discussions and outrage as there was years ago when these things first started popping up in p2p's. Very few would post in favor of them and there were countless threads daily on any given gamin forum talking about them.
Anymore it seems cash shops are now widely accepted in all pay models for the most part. Can't really blame the developers. Most can make more money nickel-and-diming customers than on subs. Or even better have them on top of the p2p model. Developers are just cashing in on peoples willingness to blow hundreds if not thousands a month.
I have known plenty over the years who were fairly open about how much they would spend. I knew even more who would deny all day long that they spend hundreds if not thousands a month. However it was pretty obvious. It was pretty shocking to me as I would of never thought there were that many people who would spend that much simply for a chance at getting a particular pixel.
What helped bring me to this realization was Rappelz to be specific. That companies model and the manipulation of taming percentages along side sales just amazed me. Yet people still dumped an absurd amount of money for a .01% chance at taming the highest tier pets.
I don't know why the company sold or whatever. However I know they had a crazy operation going. People who had been around for years knew what was going on and still they would spend large amounts of money. Then you had the rotational players who would come in spend a hundred or so and get burnt and leave.
Only cash shop in a pay-to-play i truly don't mind is Eve's even though I don't play the game currently. That's mainly because of how deep the games economy is and item destruction. Item destruction helps keep the economy stable. Which allows me to buy a Plex (30 day gtc) in game with minimal effort. However even then CCP was talking about p2w, that is until the customer base held the server hostage. Shut the major trade hubs down*
It what it is. As new gamers show up they become accustomed to cash shops in their current form. Which allows a developer to progress even further monetizing every aspect their games have.
Personally I am fine with one or the other. As far as free to play goes all items in the cash shop should be safely and easily traded on the player economy. If they aren't that's the only thing that irks me. However, I really have a thing against pay-to-plays with cash shops. I am paying a sub and with some titles the box prices for the base game and expansions.
Sorry didn't mean to derail. Was reading through and that comment which really caught my eye. Not bad or anything. I've done a lot of thinking about the average players acceptance of cash shops over the years, still do. Just amazing how accepting most have become of them when only a few years ago just the thought of cash shops would cause outrage. Which many others have witnessed, no doubt. Not trying to imply I'm the only one or anything.
No, you are exactly right. It is a more recent thing, certainly. And I suppose what I was trying to point out, is essentially what you are saying. People were up in arms about it at first. But it's evolving. And the more and more "cash shop and free" gets thrown around, the more people are starting to dance and cheer about it, instead of the opposite. It's just a worrying trend, not to mention extremely short sighted, in my opinion.
I have played rift from day one till just now and loved it.I have a max level of all the classes The best pvp/pve gear on all my toons.
I have unsubed and quit Rift as of typing this up. Very sad day when one of the best dev teams sell gear like this.
As a guy that has played this game more then 8 hours a day from day 1 live till now this should say a lot I hope.The only voice I have is to speak with my $$.
yeah you say that now , but if tons of people decide to buy gear and spend lots of money on the cash shop wait and see where all the dev resources go into for future patches , it wont be content. Go look at SWTOR right now and see what they did since the expansion released which wasnt even a expansion it was more like a 20 dollar paid patch that blizzard would release in wow every 2 months for free anyways.... Trion just laid off devs left and right , if you think that this cash shop is going to take a back burner to content you are sadly mistaken.
Glad that made a little bit of sense it seems. Been up for 24 hours. Twelve of that was gaming through the night on my day off. Wouldn't believe how many times I reworded that cause my brains just not functioning correctly at the moment. Heck I was even rewording in an edit the Eve bit. Wasn't happy with the way I had worded it. Only to find out after finishing you already responded back. ^^ Figure I'll be reported for a derail but it's o.k. with me. Spent to long on that dam wall of text not to have posted it.
Cheers, I got what you were getting at. Just got me to thinking about the subject again. And out spewed a wall of text. Crazy how what is and is not acceptable has changed so much in such a short period of time.
Yep. It goes extremely fast, it's crazy. But at the same time, it gives me a sliver of hope that the trend can be reversed, as is often the case with many other trends! And your post made decent sense, it was not hard at all to read or understand xD
Cool. All of mine are on Faeblight which started off well and grouping was fun for various quests ...though I usually solo. However i wanted to break into dungeons (maybe RAIDs eventually) but first few times out was asked to leave or outright denied due to mostly PVE drop or special coin gear. Even the beginning dungeons..lol. Now I haven't played in a bit and they've made a lot of changes i believe so I'll probably start a new character when it goes free....then later once I get mechanics down again transfer my olds over . Probably Shatterbone..like the name...unless you suggest otherwise...maybe Greybriar is better?
I was playing some Neverwinter online which is great for jumping into skirmishes..pvp...or dungeons. The latter takes a bit of a wait though. The cash shop in Neverwinter......is ridiculous though....I can't see RIFTS as being much worse but since their model will allow me to play mostly with no need to buy anything ...I mean I'll have the game and expansion content for free since I bought the xpac but never got around to playing yet. Bags are easy enough to make as u level or get on AH. and that's really the only things I would.."need". I have no desire or intention of "keeping up with" the virtual "joneses" so gear in a cash shop doesn't intrigue me unless I love the appearance.
Anyway..enough rambling...perhaps I'll see you in game.
They did take a turn for the darkside, I remember when Rift came out, it was a very fun game with a new idea that we never seen before. I have no idea whom told them this was a good idea but it is going to kill their games and company off o well was good while it lasted. Well lets hope wildstar, ESO, UC are going to be able to stay away from the power of the darkside aka corporations.
While I don't like the cash shop and I think no gear should be in it period, I think the "p2w" comments are a bit overboard.
This'll probably be dismissed but, that gear is pretty meh. It's expert dungeon vendor gear, which all you need to do is grind experts daily, get the marks from them, and buy them when done. They're not BiS pre-raid gear(although if you upgrade them with the cells, which are in the shop, some of them are).
It's not really a huge thing tbh, all it does is lower the amount of time you grind experts for their marks, they won't make you raid-ready, and it's not a huge effort to get them in game at all.
They won't make you ready for raids either as they're a very minor part of gear imho, the notoriety / cq grind is more influential than like 4 pieces of gear that may or may not be useful compared to dungeon dropped gear(chest, legs, boots, and gloves - helm and belt are crafted).
It does show how few people in the thread actually play Rift though if this is what they consider the "p2w" part of the shop.
Overpricing is one thing but being mad because you think someone buying something in a games cash shop will give them that much of an unfair advantage is like blaming Neiman Marcus for ruining your life because a guy that bought a $200 tie there got a job over you and your $5 thrift shop clip-on. Maybe he's just a better interviewer than you. Maybe he is better skilled. I'd guarantee you though....if you asked Human Resource why you weren't hired they wouldn't say it was because of your shitty tie.
There has never been any statted item that I have purchased from a cash shop that wasn't completely made useless by a quest reward or random drop 1-5 levels later.(and usually I just purchase them if it looks cool to me). That's why the most I spend in shops..like GW2's shop is on transmutation stones..which allow me to keep the weapon look I want with the stats I want. Wish more games had this type of customization..other shops just sell removable skins(love these)...others non-removable skins requiring another purchase of the same skin...etc.